Viet Kieu

Việt Kiều

Dear all,

In response to and to continue off of Peter Hansen's question on the

evolution of the term Việt Kiều, a Google "site:" search brought up four

past VSG threads about the term. It must be quite a blast to the past when

one realizes that in 2001 diacritics were inserted directly the old-school

way...Regardless, this is a good way to see how "academic" perceptions of

the term have changed over the years!

The first two of these threads date back to 2001, beginning with Professor

Caroline Kieu-Linh Valverde's inquiry into the origin of the term.

<http://www.lib.washington.edu/SouthEastAsia/vsg/elist_2001/Vietkieu.html>

In terms of linguistic origins, you can see that my previous remarks on

*hoaqiao* was already explored and confirmed by Dr. Regina M. Abrami and

expanded on by Greg Pringle. I would also pay close attention to the terms

for Chinese people with foreign nationalities in his second paragraph.

In terms of "semantics" (which many from the Asian American/ethnic/gender

studies crowd like myself believe *matter*, and as such "don't call me what

I don't want to be called"), I most closely associate with the views of

(and suggest reading) Professor Nhung Tuyết Trần's email on "8 Jan 2001",

especially the second half of the second paragraph through the fourth

paragraph ("Overseas Vietnamese certainly...")

Upon David Marr's return from Việt Nam a few months later, he continued the

topic, although most of the discussion was on the tiered pricing system

present in Việt Nam (super interesting, and perhaps many changes with the

advent of the internet).

<http://www.lib.washington.edu/SouthEastAsia/vsg/elist_2001/Vietkieu2.html>

Conversation

on the use of the term was restarted in earnest with this comment by

Professor Thu-Hương Nguyễn-võ

<https://www.lib.washington.edu/SouthEastAsia/vsg/elist_2009/Vietnamese%20American%20radio%20show_%20Song%20That_%20Speaks%20Out%20vs.%20Homophobia.html>,

which expanded into its own thread here

<https://www.lib.washington.edu/SouthEastAsia/vsg/elist_2009/Usuage%20of%20the%20Word%20Viet%20Kieu.html>

.

​

I find my father's definition of Việt Kiều to be very interesting. For

context, we are both American citizens, my father by naturalization, me by *jus

soli*. He was born in 1947, to give context to his "place" in the

Vietnamese American community. I will trace how he adapted his definition

over the course of three days as we read through the 4 VSG topics linked

above.

On the first day, his definition essentially labels anyone "sent by" (i.e.

has a Visa approved by and can be tracked by) the current Vietnamese

government to work and/or study abroad *and has plans to return to Việt Nam* as

Việt Kiều. This definition was further strengthened by the frequent use of

the term "G.I." in both Vietnamese and American newspapers (e.g. *Newsweek*

, *The Times, Ngôn Luận,* etc.). Upon learning from his boss (U.S. Army

captain) that these initials stood for "Government Issue" (among other

things), he came to perceive U.S. troops as "Mỹ Kiều" in that war-time

context. [This blows my mind esp. because I did not know the meaning of

G.I. until he told me.] He does not see the term Việt Kiều as "pejorative",

but a case of "misuse" of the term.

On Day 2, my dad realized that based on his definition which places

emphasis the idea of "government issue" and having a Vietnamese passport,

that he, too, is Việt Kiều, along with anyone that "was given permission

by" the current Vietnamese government to "go away" (such as the H.O./O.D.P.

folks). "Buts" coming up on day 3...

On Day 3, my dad added this caveat to his "government issue" definition. He

argues that even though H.O./O.D.P. folks were provided a passport to leave

by the current Vietnamese government (and therefore "government issue"), he

notes the status of these folks *as they entered* the United States. For

those that have the American government give them a stamp of "refugee" on

their I-94 form (primarily H.O. folks), he believes that it is extremely

reasonable for these folks to refuse to be identified as Việt Kiều. For

those that have an I-94 but not a "refugee" stamp, then he believes they

have a right to accept or refuse the term Việt Kiều as they wish.

The final note from him is that he absolutely refuses that his son is

called a Việt Kiều as I am "U.S. born and bred". As you can see, a very

technical definition for Việt Kiều by my father based on government, laws

and specific circumstances (for now of course!).

And now for something completely different... For my personal rejection of

the term, I essentially echo the arguments made in 2001 and 2009 above and

only wish to add a few personal notes. First, this passage from Jennifer 8.

Lee's (New York Times bestseller) *The Fortune Cookie Chronicles

*which particularly

struck me the first time I read it and promptly recorded it into my notes.

Feel free to replace "China/Chinatown/*hoaqiao*" with "Vietnamese

equivalents".

*---*

There is no consistent name for "Chinatown" in Chinese. Other languages

around the world have coalesced around names: *le quartier chinois* in

French, *el barrio chino *in Spanish, *chukagai* in Japanese and *Chinatown* in

English, Russian, German and Korean.

But in Chinese, the names vary. Newspapers use one name, popular speech

uses others. In the Chinatown subway station in New York City, the chosen

modern translation is delicately pixeled together with colorful tiles:

*huabu*. I never knew what this meant until the Chinese characters appeared

on the wall after a subway renovation, but it struck me. The *hua* in

*huabu* means "Chinese," but with a sense that transcends the nation-state

*. *After all, New York City's Chinatown has lived through the fall of two

governments, a split, and a reunification just in the last century of

Chinese history. *Hua* is an encompassing term, free of the fissures caused

by military détentes and colonization. It is the distilled essence of being

Chinese.

It is the link that ties together the Chinese I met while circling the

world, where we are known as *huaqiao*, "Chinese sojourners."

With a worldwide diaspora that began in earnest two centuries ago, you can

be *hua* even if you hold a passport from Singapore, the United States, or

Peru. You can be *hua* even if you have never set foot in China and don't

speak a single word of Chinese. The *huaqiao* label sticks, *albeit

technically inaccurate in many cases, as though one day we all might

return, as though the departure from the homeland is only temporary, even

if it may last for generations upon generations. Such is the presumption of

the long, muscular tentacles of Chineseness.*

[...]

Sociologists have noted that a sense of national and cultural identity is

often built on a triumvirate: blood, language and culture, and citizenship.

In some countries, such as Japan, you need all three to be considered

Japanese—anything less, and you're incomplete. The Japanese even

call Japanese-Brazilians who return *gaijin*, foreigners.

In America, there is no blood requirement. With the Chinese, there is only

a blood requirement.

---

[See Collet and Furuya's article "Enclave, Place, or Nation?" if you are

wondering what word could replace "Chinatown" for a Vietnamese "enclave".

Like in Chinese, the names for these enclaves in Vietnamese vary.]

That "technical inaccuracy" is precisely what matters to me. My sense of

discomfort with the term Việt Kiều does not lie in whether it is a

"Communist" term or not, rather it is the fact that I am being claimed by

these "long muscular tentacles" (of the current Vietnamese government, or

any) to "come home" (and bring my education/skills/money; to a place I have

never called home) that is a bit off-puting. Let me have that

self-determination, please.

Andrew Wells-Dang in 2009 wrote that "The point that I see everyone making

in these discussions is that a group should be able to decide for itself

what terms it is called by". Unfortunately, I do not really see that point

being made by too many people in that thread, rather I see quite a

few teleological linguistic arguments that reduce and see

definitions/meanings of words/terms (symbols) as "ended" and unchangeable

(see "An End to History" by Mario Savio for more of what I am subtly

hinting at). In the same way that "Chinatown" has multiple names in Chinese

(according to Jennifer 8. Lee), the Vietnamese American community

identifies itself in the same myriad amount of ways, just as we have seen

the "LGB community" "expand/redefine" itself to become the LGBT community

and even the LGBTQIA community when certain members of that community felt

mis- or unrepresented (interesting side-note, my LGBT-identifying friends

in Việt Nam use the term "cộng đồng LGBT" to refer to themselves as a

group). Then again, in the self-reflective nature that pervades academia

today, my views are just a result of my training in the ethnic studies in a

post-linguistic turn, post-'60s movements world.

Denying the right of self-identification brings up the idea of the

subaltern (who are subject to aforementioned categorization by other groups

and power entities), but also Stuart Hill's articulation theory. That is to

say, while Steve Maxner (in 2009) claims that Việt Kiều is a term "is

purely Vietnamese, created by Vietnamese, to describe a group of fellow

Vietnamese who all seemed to accept and adopt it voluntarily – until now",

we must realize that "Vietnamese" have already had many divergent paths of

history. As Steve implied, there are different groups of Vietnamese... and

to use the words "fellow" Vietnamese in this case may not accurately

reflect the relationship between these groups. Other groups surely have

developed/coined derogatory/pejorative terms for smaller groups subsumed

within the larger.

My own time at SEASSI gave me the great pleasure of interviewing various

members of the Vietnamese American community in Madison. The majority that

we interviewed came to the United States pre-1975, and were mostly situated

at Fort Chaffee before being dispersed to Madison. The question we

specifically asked our interlocutors was whether my classmate Kim and

myself (two American born people of "full" Vietnamese heritage) were "Việt

Kiều". The tally is as follows.

Kim and Khiêm (Alvin) are Việt kiêu *while in* Việt Nam: 9

Kim and Khiêm (Alvin) are not Việt kiêu: 4

Không phân biệt: 2

I provide this merely for more quantitative evidence of the pervasiveness

of the use of the term Việt Kiều by Vietnamese in Việt Nam (cf. use by

those of Vietnamese descent with American nationality). One interviewee in

particular had this notable quote that touches on various concepts (X is a

placeholder for their name): "X nhắc tới chỗ cái nà y…là X dùng chữ “đi

Việt Nam.” Má»™t cái là đi, má»™t cái là về, X phân biệt rõ lấm. Mặc dù VN lÃ

nơi X sanh, cái chữ X nghĩ là xà i đúng nhất là chữ đi VN và về Mỹ, bởi vì

Mỹ là nơi mà nuôi sống X, đất nước thứ hai nuôi sống X, và X ở đây suốt

đời, nên Mỹ là quê hương của mình… Phải nghĩ và nói cho nó chính xác. Sao

lại dùng chữ mình đi VN? Mình đi VN vì đó là nơi mình sinh ra mà mình không

có ở đó..."

I also have this gem: an excerpt from the University of California

Education Abroad Program's program guide for the Việt Nam program in the

year 2012-2013, back when the program was held in HÃ Ná»™i.

Students of Vietnamese Origin

Being Viet Kieu (“Overseas Vietnamese”) is often difficult for students,

especially if they do not speak Vietnamese well. Relating to local

Vietnamese while feeling American is a very common sentiment, and it may

take some time to assimilate the differences...

There have been problems with U.S. consular access to American citizens.

Frequently the embassy or consulate general is not immediately notified

when U.S. citizens are arrested or detained. *The Vietnamese government

considers **all people born in Vietnam or born to Vietnamese parents to be

Vietnamese **citizens unless they have formally renounced their Vietnamese

citizenship **with the Vietnamese government. For this reason, Vietnamese

officials may **treat U.S. citizens of Vietnamese origin differently from

other U.S. citizens.* *Vietnamese citizens are subject to laws and

restrictions that may be applied differently to foreigners*. For example,

the investigative detention law enables the government to detain Vietnamese

citizens for longer periods of time while alleged criminal activities are

under investigation.

I believe the bold references the laws that Tạ Văn Tà i stated in 2009 to

have been recently changed then (at least, I hope so). The part I put in

bold cannot be found in the program guide for the year I went (2013-2014,

when the program relocated to Cần Thơ, for reasons one can surely

guess), or this year's program guide. Nevertheless, a good example of the

"tentacles" as characterized by Jennifer 8. Lee by which I do not wish to

be bound.

On a final note, there was also a claim by Thạch Nguyễn in 2009 that those

that do not accept the term "Việt Kiều" "do not want to recognize their

roots". I respond to this *ad hominem* by asking simply to look at the word

"gốc" in "người Mỹ gốc Việt". I will even gladly use the long-winded

"American of Vietnamese/Asian descent" rather than "Vietnamese American" if

the need to recognize my roots must be so stressed. But I was hoping that

my commitment to studying Vietnamese (and Vietnamese American) history,

language and culture would solve that. Of course, "recognizing one's roots"

can be conceived of in many different ways, in the same way as the term

diaspora, in the same way some of my friends who do spoken word (roughly

"ngâm thơ kiểu Mỹ") interpret "về nước" as returning literally to the water

out of which their refugee family emerged out, rather than a return to that

country. Such is the fluidity of words.

I hope this adds fresh perspectives to the already large pot. Welcome to

Technicality Club (!?)

<http://www.smbc-comics.com/index.php?db=comics&id=3470>

Embracing the Path of Peace,

Alvin Khiêm Bùi

University of California, Los Angeles | History | Asian American Studies |

Asian Languages minor | academia.edu profile

<https://ucla.academia.edu/AlvinBui>

Dear Alvin,

Such a long, thoughtful, and insightful post. Thank you!

There are so many bits I would like to respond to, such as the linguistic

troubles an Irish-American, adult Vietnamese-language-learner, spouse of an

Vietnamese-American woman has when navigating the grammar/propriety of "di

Viet Nam" vs. "ve Viet Nam" - both when in Vietnam and when in the US...

But my more interesting (to me) question is the whole idea of "identity,"

so I make the following statements as a kind of inquiry, not as "fact":

This question of Viet Kieu-ness is in part a symptom of a moment of huge

cultural shift, both in the diaspora and in the homeland. What I am

referring to is the cultural move from a collective identity --

nation-village-family -- to a private, individual identity. This is, in my

perception, an inevitable shift under advanced capitalism, as well as under

the massive tidal forces of globalization on cultural transformations.

My thinking is that if one' s identity is first and foremost to the family

(ho hang) and village, then one's connection to the homeland is eternally

intact. The homeland is the source of one's ancestors, the well-spring of

one's life, the ultimate que huong (no matter where one happens to be

born). One "returns" home to the homeland, even if one has never been there

before.

On the other hand, if one is an individual (who just happens to have a

family) like I feel myself to be, then my identity is self-created. I can

decide who and what I am. My identity is not ascribed, it is discovered,

manufactured, and changed as an act of will. This can be in conjunction

with family, nation, ancestry, etc., or despite these. Therefore, as an

individual, one "goes to" the ancestral home from one's place of current

residence as one would "go to" any foreign country.

(In the American context, a huge complicating factor in this idea is the

issue of "race." One's ability to construct one's identity can be

circumscribed by society's built-in structures for ascribing traits and

one's "place" through individual and structural racism.)

I have been increasingly interested in the "nuclearization" of the

Vietnamese family over time, particularly "overseas" but also in large

cities in Vietnam such as Saigon. Just anecdotally, I think there may be

more and more 1-generation families with weaker links to their ho hang or

home village. I think the idea of identity is shifting under the influence

of similar forces.

What are your thoughts?

Joe Hannah

Alvin's post made me think of issues of citizenship/nationality,

positionality and place of origin (big words, I know, and I apologize).

Whether or not one considers oneself a Vietnamese-American (Nguoi My goc

Viet), a Viet Kieu or an overseas Vietnamese or part of some community thus

labelled surely depends on whether one privileges ethnicity over

nationality and current position/location. As the holder of a passport

issued by a now defunct government but with the intention of returning to

Vietnam, I used to consider myself as a Vietnamese temporarily sojourning

abroad. No doubt this is true of many Vietnamese who have recently come to

the US to study or engage in short-term occupations.

Eventually, I acquired American citizenship. I therefore regard myself as

a Vietnamese-American. But I have no problem considering myself as

Vietnamese as any Vietnamese who has just stepped off the plane. When I am

in Vietnam, I am considered as a Viet Kieu; I don't mind. It puts me in the

same category as Vietnamese who are based abroad, whether Australia, France

or North America (or even Israel or Finalnd). This categorization is based

on both ethnicity and location rather than politics or even nationality. To

me, being called Viet Kieu underscores the fact that I am based not in the

city of my birth but in the city of my current residence. However, when I

am back in Cambridge, MA, I am definitely an American citizen with the

rights and obligations this entails.

Perhaps it is a generational issue. Those of Vietnamese origin but born in

the US may feel differently about the labels applied or applicable to them.

Hue-Tam Ho Tai

Hi Alvin,

Please be assured I wasn't challenging your explanation of the term's

etymology, which I'm sure is correct. I am simply noting a trend in

current usage (at least as far as I've observed, though I do a lot of

observing) amongst Vietnamese Australians, and hence perhaps, an evolution

in definition.

BTW, I think there's a consensus that it applies to Vietnamese-born only.

I doubt any Australian-born Vietnamese would refer to themselves as Viet

Kieu, and if they did, it would not be an accepted usage.

Best,

Peter Hansen

Re Peter's comment

"BTW, I think there's a consensus that it applies to Vietnamese-born only. I doubt any Australian-born Vietnamese would refer to themselves as Viet Kieu, and if they did, it would not be an accepted usage"

I agree

In interviews I carried out in the 90s for a film about Vietnamese people immigrating and settling in Oz, young people around 13 to 25 who were born in Australia tended to think of themselves as Vietnamese Australians and some older one's born in Vietnam thought of themselves as Australian Vietnamese - they would argue about this among themselves but they didn't like the term Vk being applied. Some people felt the Vietnamese way would work no matter where you were while others felt you had to be Australian to succeed in Australia. We explored the tension between Vietnamese and Australian way. I think the term Vk is problematic for many people with Vietnamese ancestry - I don't know what it is but it seems to always threaten to organise in ways that draw focus back to Vietnam - rather than where people are

Brett

One point I tried to make is that in Vietnam everybody who is of Vietnamese

descent is a Viet Kieu.

Hue Tam Ho Tai

Hi guys,

> One point I tried to make is that in Vietnam everybody who is of

Vietnamese descent is a Viet Kieu.

I'm not sure if that is true anymore. I've been corrected multiple times by

Vietnamese people when I introduce myself as a Viet Kieu. Vietnamese people

in the countryside and in Ho Chi Minh city will correct me and say that I

am "Nguoi My Goc Viet". At the same time, in casual conversation, I will

still be referred to as Viet Kieu because it's simply easier to say. Nguoi

My Goc Viet is a mouthful.

Cheers,

Minh

Minh, I suspect that's the main reason why Vietnamese-born Australians use

the term as well; convenient and easy usage. I'm no scholar of

linguistics, but isn't that one of the most common reasons language evolves

and meanings shift?

Peter H

Dear all,

Sorry for being late in this discussion,… and I may have missed many great points.

I concur that "anyone who carries Vietnamese blood in their veins" (há»… ai mang ding

máu Việt Nam…) from many respected elders… are considered Vietnamese.

Between the late 1980's and the early 1990's I had a privilege of sitting in discussion

in Ban Việt kiều (Trung ương, Tp HCM, …, which later was renamed as Uỷ ban về

Người Việt Nam ở Nước Ngoà i, as the results of these discussions. During the US

embargo, the amount of trade, important imports, gift packages, and family money

transfer was huge. And Ban Việt kiều became important -- yet, it could not change

any law in favor of Việt kiều.

The discussion is more on a policy level. Ban Việt kiều has the role of "protecting

the interests of Việt kiều" in the state policies. After a lot of these discussions, when

Ban Việt kiều, actually has no power in the state policies or laws, most of "Việt kiều"

wanted to be considered as "foreigners" -- because then they would know what do

and had the laws protecting them.

In the meantime, it had become more obvious for Vietnamese overseas to take up

citizenship where they lived and made a living, esp. the US, than keeping the

Vietnamese citizenship (which Ban Việt kiều could not do).

In the late 1990's when Vietnam began to sign immigration agreements with the

US, it only accepts back only those who travel with the current Vietnamese

passports (not those who left in 1975, 1989, … or with the HO, Amerasians…).

The term "Việt kiều" has been redefined as just "those Vietnamese

citizens with Vietnamese passports". Many Vietnamese Americans who have

not naturalized quietly enjoy this and use the argument in their legal strategy

against deportation (3 strikes rule, as well as Nguyen vs Ascroft after 2001 which

redefines a strike, at least 1 year in prison, or $10,000 US in damage).

Uỷ ban về Người Việt Nam ở Nước Ngoà i is now a branch of the Foreign Ministry…

which is more logical.

Best,

Nhà n

I need a little help with this -- how so, every one in Viet Nam of

Vietnamese descent is Viet Kieu --- overseas from the Yueh in China?

Something else?

thanks in advance (cam on truoc) for clarification,

Diane

That is precisely why Viet Kieu is more commonlly used. I also think it is

useful to distinguish between formal and informal usage.

Interestingly the state uses the term Vietnamese residing overseas when

discussing such issues as five year visas

Hue Tam Ho Tai

Hi guys,

> One point I tried to make is that in Vietnam everybody who is of

Vietnamese descent is a Viet Kieu.

I'm not sure if that is true anymore. I've been corrected multiple times

by Vietnamese people when I introduce myself as a Viet Kieu. Vietnamese

people in the countryside and in Ho Chi Minh city will correct me and say

that I am "Nguoi My Goc Viet". At the same time, in casual conversation, I

will still be referred to as Viet Kieu because it's simply easier to say.

Nguoi My Goc Viet is a mouthful.

Cheers,

Minh

Nothing to do with the Yueh in China. Persons of Vietnamese descent

residing abroad are called VIet Kieu in VIetnam--at least informally. The

issue is what to call them in their country of residence. Some object to

being called Viet Kieu. Younger people might prefer to be called XXX of

Vietnamese descent; their parents might prefer Overseas Vietnamese on the

grounds that Viet Kieu has specific political overtones.

There are even more complicated cases. For instance, in Vietnam, David

Tran, whose grandfather settled in Vietnam at the beginning of the 20th

century, would be called Nguoi Viet goc Hoa. But in the US? By Vietnamese?

Non-Vietnamese? And what about children of mixed marriages?

Hue Tam Ho Tai

Aha -- I was mis-reading. I thought you were making a distinction of

people residing in Vietnam -- Kinh versus other. This explanation, of

course, makes more sense!

thanks,

Diane

Children of mixed marriages? I've never been corrected when I refer to my

kids as người Mỹ lai Việt.

David Brown

Fresno, CA

Dear all,

Thank you all for carrying on a wonderful discussion and CCing my Gmail

along. I apologize for that as I simply forgot to send my initial email

from my UCLA email, which is subscribed to the VSG list. I tried to keep it

short but I cannot help reply to all of you!

Peter Hansen: No worries! I did not mean to subtly imply that you did

challenge my explanation. At that point in time I was not 100% sure myself

of the terms’ etymology, though looking at these old VSG topics certainly

helped in that regard.

Joe and (Cô) Huệ-Tâm, I would say it is generational, but for a different

reason. Huệ-Tâm, you leaned on the generational argument for the Thầy Quyên

Di stuff and I would have to say I see both that and this a bit

differently. I think that (and I am about to generalize based on my

personal experience) the majority of my generation of American-born

Vietnamese heritage students are not in disagreement with the “Bút Xuân

Trần Đình Ngọc” types because of difference in what we want to learn,

rather many struggle to learn Vietnamese as a language to begin with. As

such, the term Việt Kiều means next to nothing to my generation who may be

able to understand Vietnamese (and perhaps only their parent’s Vietnamese)

but cannot respond with much more more than “dạ” or a few broken sentences

riddled with code switching. Like pretty much every ethnic group to come to

the United States, fluency in the “mother tongue” will be gone by the

“second” or “third” generation. However, I do not think that people like

“Bút Xuân” have resigned themselves to such a fact. We could learn

Vietnamese “history and geography” all we want but it will not really do us

any good if 80%+ of my friends cannot properly pronounce or read the names

of the 63 tỉnh of Việt Nam. Actually “Bút Xuân” probably wants our poor

souls to memorize the tỉnh’s as they were trước ‘75…unfortunately it is

high time to wake up and smell the cà phê sữa đá.

For myself, I thought that I, too could step off the plane and with two of

the triumvirate of national and cultural identity (blood and language

fluency), be as Vietnamese as any other Vietnamese. True, to some extent.

It turns out that my Bắc ‘54 dialect infused with southern vocabulary was

too northern for the southeners and too southern for the northeners (I even

got a “chuẩn Nam” designation once!). Việt Nam may be the “motherland” or

“fatherland” in the sense that it is the quê hương of my parents, but

otherwise, a place whose people cannot accept me (someone who has worked

quite hard to attain said language fluency) fully as “one of them” could

never be my “homeland”. But this could be a retroactive argument I am

making and a case of my expectations being mismatched. As for now, I would

say your idea regarding Viet Kieu-ness, connection to the motherland and

nuclearization in these economic milieux is very interesting and I lean

towards it being true, maybe I will have a more extended correspondence in

the future.

Minh, it is certainly encouraging to hear that those corrections occurring.

For myself, I do remember a particular incident in either Đà Nẵng or Huế

where a man carrying and selling sunglasses called my general group “Việt

Kiềus” after about 5 seconds of soliciting sales and us promptly ignoring

him. At which point I proceeded to yell at him (I am not bình tỉnh in these

situations).

Nhà n, I was wondering if you could expand on the use of non-naturalization

status in the Nguyá»…n v. Ascroft case. I read through a brief of the case

and am unsure of how Nguyễn’s status as a permanent resident (alien) was

used to support his appeal. A few elders in the community always refer to

“the Vietnamese gangster who drove the car in a drive-by and went to jail”

as an example of “bad Vietnamese” (assuming a language of bifurcation) and

now I think I know where that example comes from…

Regardless, your story about the name changes and departmental shifts is

fascinating. One of the Vietnamese administrators at the university and I

got into an argument when he called me “Việt Kiều”... to which he said

something to the effect of “the official government term for folks like you

is ‘Việt Kiều’ based off of term kiều bà o and the name of the governmental

department”.

Also, when you write “The term ‘Việt kiều’ has been redefined as just

‘those Vietnamese citizens with Vietnamese passports’,” do you mean to say

with the current Vietnamese passports as based on your previous sentence

(e.g. “not those who left in 1975, 1989, … or with the HO, Amerasians…”)? I

have critiqued wrongly in the past because of lack of clarity, so I just

want to be sure.

And finally back to Peter in regards to language: certainly. Although I

would look more towards how immigration/refugee settlement patterns

differed between receiving nations. Maybe this “allergy” to the term Việt

Kiều is nested in certain types of Vietnamese diasporic communities. I

would venture to say that a small number of your friends may be using the

term facetiously as well. Maybe there was a fluctuation over time as per

Brett’s interviews in the ‘90s. Though I know that my father and I would

probably have a good laugh at anyone with non-Vietnamese citizenship that

vehemently tried to assert that they were “Việt Kiều” and promptly move on.

Yay a few more emails! Huệ-Tâm, your point about formal and informal use is

well taken, however, I think it all goes back to not being called something

we do not wish to be called—even in an informal setting, even while in VN

(after all, my aunt who resides in Sà i Gòn calls me Việt Kiều against my

will)—a feeling that I am sure transcends any and all inherent generation

gaps.

As per your questions, I can share how my retention project at UCLA

(mission: 100% retention/graduation of students of Southeast Asian descent)

categorizes/tracks students. We do not turn anyone away, so we do have

students of Chinese, Japanese, Pacific Islander, “Other Asian” descent etc.

We also have a category called Southeast Asian Chinese, which I presume

would be used for students of Chinese heritage whose families came from a

Southeast Asian country. Within my family, người (Mỹ gốc) Hoa has come to

mean Chinese who came from VN while người Mỹ gốc Trung Quốc means Chinese

American and người Mỹ gốc Đà i Loan (although these terms may not always

accurate because of the novelty of these nation-states and the latter does

not distinguish between native Taiwanese and those that escaped to there

from the mainland). Oh the joys of categorization!

Finally,. having collaborated with the mixed student community at UCLA, I

find that there is a general promotion of “mixed race” as a term of

identification in and of itself rather than “compartmentalizing” into “half

this, half that”. But then again that is a concept conceived of and created

in a certain milieu.

Until next time,

Embracing the Path of Peace,

Alvin Khiêm Bùi

University of California, Los Angeles | History | Asian American Studies |

Asian Languages minor | academia.edu profile

<https://ucla.academia.edu/AlvinBui>

Southeast Asian Campus Learning Education and Retention

<http://www.vsubruins.com/about/seaclear/> | Transfer Coordinator | Peer

Counselor

Dear List

I would like to invite you to consider publication in a special number of Central and East European Migration Review Journal. The number, entitled "The global Vietnamese diaspora: transnational ties, cultural flows, political entanglements", will contain papers submitted by scholars dealing with the issue of Vietnamese communities residing with various countries. Detailed information about the number can be found in attachment.

The special number is an outcome of the conference "Global Vietnamese Diaspora", organized in Warsaw in March 2014: http://www.is.uw.edu.pl/pl/badania-i-konferencje/konferencje/2014-2/the-global-vietnamese-diaspora/. Scholars from Germany, United States, Czech Republic, Slovakia and Poland, who participated in the conference, have already submitted the articles, which are now peer-reviewed. However, still more papers, especially offering comparative perspective towards particular migrant groups, are welcomed. In case you are willing to submit a paper coping with the problematics of this community, we would be honored to consider your submission.

Central and East European Migration Review is a peer-reviewed, online, open-access journal, published by the Centre of Migration Research, University of Warsaw and Polish Academy of Sciences. Detailed information can be found at the website: http://www.ceemr.uw.edu.pl/

http://ceemr.uw.edu.pl/sites/default/files/Instructions_to_authors_5.07.2013_final_2.pdf

Best

Le Thanh Hai, PhD, researcher at Institute of Philosophy and Sociology, Polish Academy of Science.

Hi --

This regular program on VTC 10 television might be of interest to some in

this conversation: a series of stories about people who have come back to

VN from other places, and their work.

with thanks to the friend who sent this to me -- a friend who embraces and

transcends all the categories

Diane

Hi Alvin.,

Why don't you like being called Viet kieu? I used to hear objections from

students who disliked being charged a higher rate than locals because they

were poor students and also they thought of themselves as being just as

Vietnamese as locals, even when they did not speak fluently. But your

objections seem to be on different grounds.

Hue Tam Ho Tai

I just returned from five weeks in Vietnam and am catching up on office email. This discussion of `Viet Kieu’ et al is especially interesting. But it would be nice to put in some comparative perspective.

As a boy in Cleveland in the late 1940s I had my ethnicity baptism among Polish classmates. Their parents wanted to be called `Polish Americans’, not `American Poles’. But I’m afraid behind their backs we called them `Polaks’ and laughed at a host of Polak jokes.

Joe Hannah (3/9) says “my identity is self-created”. But this ignores how other people and institutions identify us. The most tragic example: those who saw themselves as Jewish Germans in the 1930s. Since 1975 my impression is that Vietnamese migrants have navigated the ethnicity shoals better than most.

David Marr

ANU

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