Embedded Files
Deres Majestæt!
Kære Kirkeminister Bertel Haarder
Kære Biskopper, provster og præster i Danmark
Kære Folkebladet Lemvig
The English Translation is mixed in between the Danish.
Folkebladet Lemvig fordrejer ud til offentligheden direkte hvad der foregik i retten 13 maj 2013. The Folkebladet Lemvig twists to the public what happened in the court. Den frie presses opgave! The assignment of the free press! English translation of press board case "sagsnr. 16-70-00934"
Hermed videresender vi vores bemærkninger til Chefredaktør Erik Bjerager, Kristeligt Dagblads svar på vores klage til Pressenævnet.
Der er en passage, som vi ikke har skrevet korrekt. Denne rettelse kommer her:
Det stykke, vi vil rette:
We hereby send our statements to the answer from Chief Editor, Christ-Like Daily Newspaper's answer to our complaint to the Press Board.
There is a passage, which we did not write correctly. Here comes the correction:
The passage we wish to correct :
Det faktum at vi ikke har indgivet en klage til udgiverne af disse artikler for deres indhold bestyrker Erik Bjerager i antagelsen af, at de forhold Jonas Serner-Pedersen har fortalt om, virkelig har fundet sted. – Ja, vi bestrider slet ikke, at vi har henvendt os til Jonas Serner-Pedersen i det beskrevne omfang, op til tilholdet samt at vi har overtrådt tilholdet nogle gange. Men det gør vel ikke, at vi skal være fredløse og at vi ikke kan forvente, en journalist vil være interesseret i at høre vores side af sagen.
The fact that we have not filed a complaint to the publishers of these articles about their contents strengthen Erik Bjerager in his assumption that the events told by Jonas Serner- Pedersen really did take place.
Yes we do not argue at all that we did contact Jonas Serner-Pedersen in the measure described, up until the police restraint, and that we did violate the restraint some times.
But should this be a reason for us to be considered outlaws, and that we cannot expect of a journalist to listen to our side of the matter?
IN CASE ANYONE SHOULD WONDER HOW DID THIS PASSAGE COME ABOUT: WELL WHAT WE AGREE TO IS THAT WE DID CONTACT JS-P through cell phone calls , and text messages and emails. The means of contact and it was on a daily basis. So far we have no problem to agree. On a daily basis for months.
In order to get our paper work done ! Which would take him a good 15-20 minutes AND HE NEVER SAID ONE TIME TO US THAT HE DID NOT WANT TO DO SO- + THE DOCUMENT WAS IN HIS ASSIGNMENT AS A PASTOR IN KOLDING TO BE TAKEN CARE OF. ‼🇩🇰
Yes we do not argue at all that we did contact Jonas Serner-Pedersen in the measure described, up until the police restraint, and that we did violate the restraint some times! "
Regards , Lars Skov Krøgholt and Daniela Skov , Kolding, Denmark
Den korrekte formulering:
THE CORRECT WORDING:
Det faktum at vi ikke har indgivet en klage til udgiverne af disse artikler for deres indhold bestyrker Erik Bjerager i antagelsen af, at de forhold Jonas Serner-Pedersen har fortalt om, virkelig har fundet sted. – Ja, vi bestrider slet ikke, at vi har henvendt os til Jonas Serner-Pedersen. Men absolut ikke i det beskrevne omfang. Det er ikke menneskeligt muligt, op til tilholdet, og heller ikke i årene efter. Og vi har ikke nogen interesse i at have den kontakt med Jonas Serner-Pedersen. Hvorfor har han brug for, at folk skal tro det? Vi aner ikke, hvem han er i virkeligheden. I Kolding lod han os alle i menigheden tro, at han var en ven. Vi bestrider ikke, at vi har overtrådt tilholdet en tid. Vi var chokerede og forstod først ikke, at det var ham, vores ven og præst, som gjorde de her ting mod os. Men det gør vel ikke, at vi skal være fredløse og at vi ikke kan forvente, en journalist vil være interesseret i at høre vores side af sagen.
The fact that we have not filed a complaint to the publishers of these articles over their contents strengthens Erik Bjerager in his assumption, that the events Jonas Serner-Pedersen told have really taken place.
Yes, we do not deny, that we have contacted Jonas Serner-Pedersen. But absolute not in the measure he has described. It is not even humanely possible. Neither leading up to the police restraint, nor in the years following. And we do not have any interest in having that kind of contact with Jonas Serner-Pedersen. Why does he need of people to believe so?
We do not know who he really is. In Kolding he lead all of us in the congregation to believe, he was a friend. We do not argue, that we violated the restraint for a season. We were shocked and we did not understand at first, that it was really he, our friend and pastor, who did this to us.
But should this be a reason for us to be considered outlaws, and that we cannot expect of a journalist to listen to our side of the matter?
Now first comes something about the Free Press. Then later comes our comments to Editor in Chief Erik Bjerager’s answer to our complaint to the Press Board.
Af Jacob Mchangama, Justitia 12. april 2013
I Danmark er alle partier enige om vigtigheden af en fri presse, der uhindret kan dække væsentlige emner of offentlig interesse og fungere som en slags kontrolinstans i forhold til magthavere. Læs blot disse højstemte ord fra landets justitsminister fremsat under forhandlingerne af denne uges forespørgselsdebat om ytringsfrihed i Folketinget: Pressen har en helt central rolle som offentlighedens informations- og kontrolorgan og nyder selvfølgelig også derfor en særlig vidtgående beskyttelse mod indgreb i ytringsfriheden. Det er i den grad et sundhedstegn, at vi i Danmark har en presse med fri adgang til at se kritisk på regeringen, politiske grupper og private virksomheder, ja faktisk på hvem som helst. Sådan skal det være i et demokratisk samfund som vores….Det er naturligvis en helt central opgave for den til enhver tid siddende regering at sikre, at rammerne for fri meningsudveksling fortsat vil være til stede. Vi må som sagt aldrig tage ytringsfriheden for givet Justitsministeren lagde også vægt på, at ”den frie meningsudveksling skaber…grundlaget for en dybere og jo også mere nuanceret indsigt i væsentlige samfundsforhold” og ”er derfor en nødvendig og selvfølgelig forudsætning for ethvert demokratisk samfund”. Folketinget vedtog endda et forslag fremsat af Socialdemokraterne, SF, Radikale Venstre og Enhedslisten, hvorefter regeringen opfordres til at ”fastholde fokus på, at ytringsfrihed er en fundamental frihedsrettighed, der skal gælde for alle”. Men én ting er indholdet af politikeres uforpligtende vedtagelser og skåltaler. Noget andet og langt mere interessant er de love og regler som selvsamme politikere vedtager. Og de fine udtalelser om vigtigheden af ytringsfrihed og den frie presse står i skarp kontrast til to lovforslag, der indskrænker hhv. ytringsfriheden og informationsfriheden, og som nyligt har været til første behandling i Folketingssalen. Der er tale om henholdsvis Forslag til lov om ændring af lov om radio- og fjernsynsvirksomhed, og Forslag til lov om offentlighed i forvaltningen (offentlighedsloven). (Vor kursivering).
(BY JACOB MCHANGAMA, JUSTITIA 12. APRIL 2013 16) ‼‼
Denmark all (political) parties agree to the importance of a free press, that can cover substantial topics of public interest without hindrance, and act as a sort of Supervisory in connection to the those who hold power in authority.
Take a look at these High-flown words from the Minister of Justice in the nation expressed during the negotiations of this weeks Parliamentary debate ( query?) about freedom of speech in Parliament :
The Press has a substantial central role as the publics information -and Supervisory organ thus of course enjoying a particularly extensive protection against interference with freedom of expression.
It is indeed a sign of health, that we in Denmark have a Press with free access to looking critically at the Government, political groups and private companies,
yes actually at each and everyone. This is how it must be in a democratic society as ours. .....obviously this is a core task for the incumbent Government to ensure, that the framework for the freedom to exchange opinions will continue to be present. We must as I have said never take freedom of speech for granted.
The Minister of Justice emphasised as well that " the free expression of views creates ......the foundation of a deeper as well as an even more nuanced insight in significantly conditions concerning societies and "therefore a necessary and obvious prerequisite for any democratic society."
Parliament in Denmark even adopted a proposal made by Social democrats (A), SF Socialistic Folkparty, Radical Left, and UnityList, then Government is encouraged to "maintain focus at FREEDOM of Speech is a fundamental right of freedom, such as to apply to all."
But the content of politicians noncommittal toasting is one thing. But the laws and regulations the very same politicians adopt are something else, and far more interesting. And the neat statements about the importance of freedom of speech and the free Press are in sharp contrast to the two bills, that respectively restrict freedom of expression and freedom of information, and have recently been to the first hearing in the Hall of Parliament.
It is respectively about Suggestions to law of amending Law of radio-and television business, and Suggestions to Law of publicity in Administration. ( Publicity law)
Den frie og kritiske presse er vigtig for regeringen – på papiret og i skåltaler
Jeg, Lars kan ikke glemme ordene på soklen af statuen af Rigsdagsmand og Redaktør Christen Berg (1870’erne) ved biblioteket i Kolding: ”Gå aldrig på akkord med uretten”.
I, Lars can not forget the words on the base of the statue of 19th century MP and Editor Christen Berg: “Never compromise with the injustice”.
Christen Berg statue på Banegårdspladsen i Kolding.
http://folkebladetlemvig.dk/struer/mand-og-kvinde-idoemt-boeder-for-praestechikane
Hvis vi ikke kan kommentere på hvad nogle blade har skrevet om os, bliver vi gjort til dem, der er skyldige og vi oplever at det er virkelig uhyggeligt, at blive dømt i en landsdækkende avis samt i provinsaviser. Ligeså har Udfordringens redaktør Henri Nissen talt med mange borgere og kommet til os med besked i årevis, at vi er syge i hovedet, og Kr. Dagblad redaktør diagnosticerer os som sindsforvirrede. Dømt af de kristne avisers redaktører. Erik Bjerager, du skriver rigtig hånende om det at vi betaler bøder. Tror du det er sjovt for mennesker på kontanthjælp og førtidspension, at betale bøder på baggrund af en betjent, der skjuler sin IDENTITET? Og en præst der var vor ven i årevis pludselig OPTRÆDER og stadig udtaler sig som om ‼️HAN IKKE KENDER OS‼️‼️‼️‼️ Det har været vildt skræmmende at være udsat for.
Erik Bjerager, du skriver på en uvenlig og hånlig måde om os, da du kommenterer Lemvig bladets overfladiske og totalt ensidige vinklen. I har råd til at TJENE PENGE på at VI ER TO PÅ OVERFØRSELSINDKOMSTER, SOM SKAL BETALE 5500 i bøde. DET ER IKKE ET NEUTRALT ELLER IKKE JURIDISK BINDENDE DOKUMENT. VI KONTAKTER OG BEDER JONAS OM AT GÅ TILBAGE. JA OG OM AT HAN SKAL TAGE ANSVAR ADMINISTRATIVT OG TALE MED OS OM DET! VI BETALER BØDER FORDI VI BER HAM GØRE SIT ARBEJDE, som han blev betalt af os som menighed for at udføre. Vi (=menigheden) betalte alle vores præst 300.000 kr i årsløn gennem månedlige gavebidrag til kirken. For nogen var det 10% hver måned af deres løn, der blev indbetalt som en gave til vores kirke. I stedet er han løbet, og efter eget udsagn PÅ SKRIFT ENDDA: "nu er jeg ude af systemet!"
Efter FYRING OG I AL HANS SORG OG BITTERHED DEROVER så ville han bare VÆK fra alt det hele og han LAGDE KOLDING BAG SIG MED DE ORD, PÅ TRODS AF HAN IKKE TOG VARE PÅ ADMINISTRATIV OPGAVE. DET VAR SOM HAN BETROEDE DANIELA, HANS FORHOLD TIL ADMINISTRATIVT ARBEJDE, DER VAR LEDERSKABETS VIGTIGE KLAGE I DERES FYRING FRA DEN ENE DAG TIL DEN ANDEN TILSYNELADENDE AF HAM. DE FORTALTE HAM EFTER EN GUDSTJENESTE, BETROEDE HAN DANIELA AT "PÅ TIRSDAG BLIR DU FYRET!" Det kan Erling Hybschmann og Bo Christensen samt Frank Toldam og flere i lederskabet DOKUMENTERE SÅ I MANGLER BLOT AT RESEARCHE TIL JERES ONDE SLADDER ARTIKEL VINKEL. HVORFOR HAR I SLET IKKE DE OPLYSNINGER MED I JERES ARTIKLER??
Er det FORDI de bryder jeres VIGTIGE tematiske opgave.
Er det ikke strafbart at smæde borgere og sætte en hel stor gruppe i samfundet op imod borgere?????
Vi forstår på ingen mulig måde, hvorfor vi i årevis er blevet hængt ud og stemplet med SYGE I HOVEDET, Henri Nissen? Og åbenbart osse SINDSFORSTYRRET, af dig Erik Bjerager NÅR VI IKKE VIL AT JONAS SERNER- PEDERSEN GØR MED VORE PAPIRER MED HANS HÅNDSKREVNE UNDERSKRIFT PÅ OG VORE PERSONLIGE CPR - NUMRE, LIGE SOM DET PASSER HAM - OG VI BETALER KIRKESKAT I 2 HELE ÅR FORDI HAN IKKE ÆRLIGT TALER MED OS, SOM EN REPRÆSENTANT FOR ET EMBEDE OG VIDEN OM RESPEKTERET TJENESTEMANDSANSÆTTELSE AF STATEN. Kirkeskat går til aflønning af deres tjenestemænd i embede. OG HAN OVERSKRED 100 PROCENT OG MOD BEDRE VIDEN VOR DÅBS TRO OG RELIGION. Og det er så underligt AT en præst der er i voksen alder LEGER med os og fremstiller os som ondsindede forfølgere - at vi ikke er nogen han kender og SAGDE TING TIL OS I VORT ÅBNE ANSIGT, OG PÅ SKRIFT SÅ VI DA IKKE ANEDE HAN ER SÅDAN EN MAND.
NEJ, DET ER et dokument som var i hans besiddelse og PÅTRYKT at menighedsmedlemmer skulle udfylde det og levere dokumentet med vore personlige CPR NUMRE PÅ TIL KIRKENS PRÆST, HER JONAS SERNER-PEDERSEN. Han var kirkens præst. HAN BRØD LOVEN OG DET VIL I IKKE SKRIVE OM, FOR I TROR I VED ALT, HVAD DER ER AT FORTÆLLE, TILSYNELADENDE. OG I PÅSTÅR, VI SKULLE BETALE SAGENS OMKOSTNINGER SAMT I VED NOGET VI IKKE VED, HVORDAN BØDESTRAFFEN ER REGNET UD.
DET ER PISSE UHYGGELIGT. SIMPELTHEN SOM EN HORROR FILM. I - PRESSEN - VAR JO IKKE TILSTEDE SYNLIGT IHVERTFALD OG I SKILDRER RETSSAGEN PÅ EN MÅDE, SOM OM I LEGER ØJENVIDNER. DET ER SÅ SÅ SÅ SÅ UHYGGELIGT.
Jonas bruger vore CPR- numre OG ER SLUPPET AFSTED MED DET INDTIL VIDERE. Vi betalte bøder og KIRKESKAT PÅ GRUND AF HAM I 2 ÅR.
TRODS RELIGIONSFRIHED EFTER GRUNDLOVEN‼️‼️‼️ .OG HAN SKJULTE DET FOR OS GENNEM POLITITILHOLD.
HVORFOR FORTÆLLER I IKKE DET I JERES FRIE PRESSE DÆKNING FRIT EFTER FANTASIEN PRESSEDÆKNING
I HAR RÅD TIL IKKE AT TALE MED OS , MEN I FÅR PENGE FOR JERES ARTIKLER.
BISKOPPEN OG PROVSTEN HAR RÅD TIL IKKE AT TALE MED OS.
‼️‼️‼️‼️
Vi er borgere i Danmark, og det er uhyggeligt at opleve, at være som i en ond thriller, hvor at alle ikke er lige for loven.
Endog TIL VORT LANDS FORFATNING, GRUNDLOVEN.
Den afgørende ting i hvad I gør er at lade som om i ER ØJENVIDNER TIL RETSMØDET: I AT PLUKKE I DELE AF INFORMATIONERNE, SOM I UDELADER!!!! FRA OFFENTLIGHEDENS ØJE ER RETTEN SELV BESKREVET PÅ EN MÅDE SOM OM DEN ER KORRUPT OG BØJET, SÅDAN AT ALT ER I FULD OVERENSSTEMMELSE MED DEN STATSANSATTE PRÆST.
Du udelader MEGET VIGTIG INFORMATION, og bedrager derved enhver læser. Lige såvel som du bagtaler os på den mest løgnagtige og onde måde. Vi oplevede hverken retsmødet eller den kvinde, som skrev mødeudskriften som bedragerisk – og hun sagde til mig i telefonen at ”hun var der og hun hørte og hun forstod hvad der skete”, og hun bad mig om at være opmærksom på HVAD hun skrev; hun gentog det for mig på forskellige måder og det trøstede mig virkelig, og fik mig til at føle og vide, at hvad VI SÅ I DERES REAKTIONER ved retsmødet – at de var MISBRUGT I JONAS’ INTRIGER, LIGE SÅVEL SOM VI VAR, OG DET FØLTE DE UBEHAG VED.
HUN skrev om de ulovlige ting der foregik i kirken, og Jonas nægtede at være åben og fremvise de ting han vidste. Til jeres INFORMATION, VIDSTE HAN OM SVINDEL MED PENGEGAVER GIVET I KIRKEN, SOM ER GRUNDEN TIL AT EN STATSADVOKAT I VIBORG RÅDEDE OS INDTRÆNGENDE TIL AT POLITIANMELDE SÅ MANGE PRÆSTER OG LEDERE, SOM VAR INVOLVERET OG ANSVARLIGE SOM MULIGT. I GØR EN VITTIGHED UD AF AT ANMELDE ULOVLIGE FORHOLD TIL POLITIET. HVIS DET ER DEN FRIE PRESSES ROLLE AT RÆKKE UD TIL OFFENTLIGHEDEN MED DIPLOMATISK IMMUNITET TIL PRÆSTER OG ANBEFALE BISKOPPER SOM SNYDER PRÆSTER OG STATEN OG ALLE BORGERE TIL AT TRO, DE ER UNDER DE SAMME LOVE SOM VORES DRONNING TIL IKKE AT TAGE POLITISK STANDPUNKT OG INVOLVERE KIRKEN I AT VÆRE EN LEVENDE ANSVARLIG, TJENDENDE, ELSKENDE DEL AF NATIONEN, SOM ENDOG BETALER DEN, - STATSKIRKEN, SOM ER HER VED POLITISK, DEMOKRATISK BESLUTNING! HVOR ENDER VI SOM BORGERE??
MUSLIMSKE MINORITETSMENIGHEDER UNDERVISER på måder som vores stat nu siger nej til. Men statskirken nægter ærlighed og åbenhed. Jonas underviser og lever ud fra sin udtalelse: vi skal beskytte kirken. Nye troende må ikke vide, hvad der sker her, for så vil de ikke komme her. OG GENNEM HANS HANDLING IMOD OS FOR AT FORHINDRE AT VI VISER TIL POLITIET OG BLIVER TROET AF POLITIET LIGE SÅ VEL SOM SKJULE OVER FOR OFFENTLIGHEDEN ULOVLIGE TING, HAN KLART VIDSTE OM …. LÆS RETSUDSKRIFTEN?
Det er dobbeltmoralsk at straffe muslimske imamer så vel som deres menigheder for at være parallelsamfund, når kirken er en subkultur, et sted med regler og måder at omgå ting for at beskytte DEN VIRKELIGE RELIGION som er KIRKEN. Reformationen og Luther levede det modsatte budskab ud lige så vel som Grundtvig gjorde det.
Hvor mange mennesker ville bryde sig om at der verserer en historie om deres liv i nogle aviser imod deres vidende og samtykke? JA VI HAR samtidig BETALT kirkeskat i to år uden vores vidende og samtykke. Fællesnævner for de to ligninger i beretningen om os, er ”uden vores vidende og samtykke”, og det er Jonas Serner-Pedersen sammen med statskirken.
Vi erfarer NU, hvor det går op for os, AT FOLKEBLADET LEMVIGS ARTIKEL JO DATERER TILBAGE TIL DEN DAG, VOR DOM BLEV OFFENTLIGGJORT OM MORGENEN, NEMLIG DEN 20-06-2013. Journalisten giver en HELT FORKVAKLET BESKRIVELSE AF EN RETSLIG AFGØRELSE, NEMLIG SOM OM RETTEN I HOLSTEBRO GODTAGER OG IKKE FORTÆLLER ÅBENT BEVIDST, AT JONAS SERNER- PEDERSEN BEVIDST DÆKKER OVER ULOVLIGHEDER I DANSK OASE OG KIRKEN! FX ANGÅENDE PENGENE DER BLEV STUKKET I LOMMEN PÅ og af LONE INGRID AMBÆK, NU SKJOLDHOLM, i KOLDING, PENGE FRA MENNESKER I 4 KIRKER I KOLDINGS GAVEBIDRAG OG Folkebladet Lemvig GØR TIL NAR OG LATTERLIGGØR os i AT VI FØLGER LOVEN, FOR VI POLITIANMELDER PÅ OPFORDRING AF STATSADVOKATEN I VIBORG ALLEREDE I 2013 - FOLKEBLADET LEMVIG LATTERLIGGØR OS OG PYNTER PÅ ALT OMKRING JONAS SERNER- PEDERSENS DIREKTE ANLIGGENDE AT BESKYTTE KIRKEN - UD TIL LÆSERNE I DANMARK. Muslimske Imamer må IKKE beskytte moskeerne for dansk lovgivning. Biskop Henrik Stubkjær og hans bispekollegaer står sammen i at beskytte kirke , Jonas Serner- Pedersen i hans spin med politi mod afsløring der hindrer ham i " at beskytte kirken!" Osse sammen med Henri Nissen, Samt Kristelig Dagblad December 2015, DAGBLADET HOLSTEBRO -STRUER 20 juni 2013 , FOLKEBLADET LEMVIG 13 december 2015 Jonas TAKNEMMELIGHED OVER DEN STØTTE HAN HAR FÅET FRA SIT SOGN EFTER EN MAND OG KVINDE, DER HAR FORFULGT HAM I ÅREVIS, NU ER BEGYNDT AT KONTAKTE VILKÅRLIGE ..." DAGBLADET HOLSTEBRO-STRUER HINDRER OFFENTLIGHEDEN I AT VIDE, AT STATSADVOKAT I VIBORG, Som er SENIORANKLAGER, bad POLITIET OM AT TAGE OS IND TIL PARTSHØRING MODSAT TVMIDT- VEST DER GAV FULD MULIGHED I DERES UDGIVELSES FORM, så vi ku kommentere nedenunder.
If we are unable to comment at what some magazines have written about us, it is us who are not it's really creepy to be sentenced in nationwide and provincial newspapers, we are citizens of Denmark, and it is creepy to see that not everyone is equal before the law. How many people would break it to pending a story about their lives in some newspapers against their knowing and consent? As well as that we have been enrolled in two State churches, and we have paid the church tax in two years without our knowledge and consent. Common denominator for the two equations in the report about us, is "without our knowledge and consent", Jonas Serner-Pedersen and State Church
Do you Think it is fun to people on welfare as well as early pension
‼‼‼If we are unable to comment on what some local provincial magazines have written about us, we are claimed to be the guilty party, and we experience how it is really CREEPY and scary to be judged in a nationwide paper as well as 2 provincial newspapers. This is on top of the " entire church's Weekly Magazine: The Challenge!" their editor Henri Nissen has been communicating a lot to many people and returned to us frequently during a period of, i believe, 2 years with messages that we are INSANE (in our heads) and the editor at Christ- Like (Kristeligt Dagblad) diagnoses us to be Insane or lunatics. DISTURBED mental state.
That is the verdict given to us and over our lives from editors at Christian Magazines who are the IMPACT HIGHLY on CHURCH PEOPLE THROUGHOUT DENMARK.
The free Press of the Church.
Erik Bjerager you write in an unkind and mocking way about us, when you comment on Lemvig newspaper's SUPERFICIAL and entirely one-sided coverage. AND LEMVIG EDITOR YOU JUST WRITE MAKING A PLOT SO SPOOKY PRETENDING YOU ARE EYEWITNES TO THE COURT HEARING. LEAVING OUT IMPORTANT DETAILS FROM THE JURIDICIAL VERDICT TRANSCRIPT‼‼‼‼ GOSSIP - IT IS CALLED WHEN SOMEONE TELL ANOTHER HUMAN BEING A STORY IN THIS FASHION
You can afford to MAKE MONEY ON the fact that WE ARE 2 CITIZENS IN DENMARK ON WELFARE AND EARLY RETIREMENT PENSION WHO HAD TO PAY A FINE OF 5500 KRONER!
IT IS NOT A NEUTRAL DOCUMENT OR A NOT LEGALLY BINDING DOCUMENT. WE ARE CONTACTING AND BEGGING ‼‼‼ JONAS TO RETURN TO US.
YES, AS WELL AS BEGGING HIM TO TAKE RESPONSIBILITY ADMINISTRATIVELY AND TALK TO US ABOUT THIS.
WE ARE PAYING FINES BECAUSE WE TRY TO HAVE HIM DO THE ADMINISTRATIVE DUTY HE WAS PAID ALSO BY US AS CONGREGATION TO CARRY OUT. WE = (THE CONGREGATION) PAID ALL OUR PASTORS 300.000 KRONER ANNUAL WAGES THROUGH MONTHLY GIFT CONTRIBUTIONS TO THE CHURCH. FOR SOME IT WAS 10 PERCENT EVERY MONTH OF THEIR SALARY PAID AS A GIFT TO OUR CHURCH.
WE EXPECT FAITHFUL SERVICE INTO ALL AREAS OF HIS WORK ASSIGNMENT ALSO ADMINISTRATIVE DUTIES HE AGREED TO WHEN THE LEADERSHIP EMPLOYED JONAS SERNER- PEDERSEN.
INSTEAD he ran off, and in his own words EVEN IN WRITING:" NOW I AM OUT OF THE SYSTEM!"
After being sacked from his job and in his grieving and bitterness because of that, now all he wanted was to get away from all of that. He put Kolding behind him with those words, despite he had not accomplished an administrative duty.
As he confided to Daniela that his dealing with administrative work was A MAJOR COMPLAINT FROM THE LEADERSHIP TEAM IN GIVING THEM THE reason to fire him from one day to the next seemingly.
THEY just let him know one Sunday after church service that Tuesday you will be fired, lose your job.
Erling Hybschmann , Bo Christensen, Frank Toldam as well as more people in that leadership team can confirm this. YOU JUST NEED TO RESEARCH TO YOUR EVIL GOSSIP ARTICLE TALE.
HOW COME YOU 2 NEWSMAGAZINES DO NOT BRING THIS INFORMATION?
IS IT BECAUSE IT DISRUPTS YOUR VERY IMPORTANT THEMATICAL ASSIGNMENT???
Is it not in any way a criminal offense to defame by lies about them and ISOLATE citizens (here we ask Henri Nissen as well!) out of a fellowship and belonging in our society. Here CHURCH FELLOWSHIP!?? DESTROYING our credibility, by emphasizing the office of a PASTOR EMPLOYED BY THE DANISH STATE???? Even Through POLICE AND LIES and I had PTSD because of him and police and you endorse him nationwide despite all his sneaky deeds. We do not in any way understand why we for years have been exposed and stamped with SICK IN THE HEAD, Henri Nissen? And apparently also DERANGED, by you Erik Bjerager, WHEN WE DO NOT WANT THAT JONAS SERNER-PEDERSEN DOES WITH OUR PAPERS WITH HIS HANDWRITTEN SIGNATURE ON IT AND OUR PERSONAL CPR-NUMBERS (civil registration numbers) EXACTLY AS IT FITS. AND WE PAY CHURCH TAX FOR TWO WHOLE YEARS BECAUSE HE DOES NOT HONESTLY SPEAK WITH US, AS A REPRESENTATIVE OF AN OFFICE AND KNOWLEDGE ABOUT RESPECTED STATE OFFICIAL. Church tax pays the wages of the State officials in office. And HE EXCEEDED 100 PERCENT AND AGAINST BETTER KNOWLEDGE OUR BAPTISM’S FAITH AND RELIGION. And it is so strange that a pastor who is an adult play with us and portrays us as evil persecutors – that we are someone he does not know. HE SAID THINGS IN OUR FACE AND IN WRITING SO WE REALLY DID NOT KNOW HE IS SUCH A MAN.
‼‼NO, it is a document which was in his possession and PRINTED ON IT SAID members of congregation were to fill it in and return the documents WITH OUR PERSONAL identification (IN DENMARK CPR- NUMBERS) to the pastor in the church. Here Jonas Serner- Pedersen. HE was our church pastor. He broke the law and you refuse to write this, believing you know every detail seemingly.
You even claim we were to pay the cost of the court meeting. AND YOU EVEN KNOW MORE THAT WE DO NOT KNOW EITHER: how they decide the cost of the fine!
It is xxxxx SCARY. SIMPLY LIKE A HORROR MOVIE. You, the Press - we did NOT see you in there in the court up in HOLSTEBRO. YOU WERE NOT THERE VISIBLY TO US. AND THE WAY YOU WRITE YOUR ARTICLE IS TO GIVE A CLEAR IMPRESSION AS IF YOU ARE PLAYING ROLE PLAY AS EYE WITNESSES. IT IS SO SO SCARY AND SPOOKY.
JONAS WAS USING OUR PERSONAL CPR- numbers and he is getting away with what he did, so far. We PAID FINES OF 5500 kroner AS WELL AS CHURCH TAXES FOR 2 YEARS WHICH WE DID NOT EXPECT TO CHECK IN OUR PAPERS FOR. WE DO NOT BELONG TO STATE CHURCH BY FREE CHOICE OF BAPTISM YEARS AGO.
DESPITE FREEDOM OF RELIGION HE VIOLATED OUR CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS AND HID IT TO US THROUGH PREVENTING US TO COMMUNICATE VIA A POLICE RESTRAINT.
WHY DO YOU NOT BRING ALL THESE FACTUAL INFORMATION IN YOUR ARTICLES IN YOUR FREE PRESS COVERAGE?
Freely according to imaginations press coverage.
You can afford not to communicate WITH us - WHY?
But you are being paid and you ACCEPT MONEY for your articles, journalists!!
Maybe even STATE FINANCES TO YOUR NEWSPAPERS????
THE BISHOP AND THE DEAN CAN AFFORD NOT TO TALK WITH US. YET YOU ALLOW THE STATE TO TAX US SO THAT WE ARE CONTRIBUTING TO PAY WAGES TO STATE EMPLOYED PASTORS ‼‼‼‼
We are citizens in Denmark, and it is scary to experience, as if we are in an evil thriller, where not everyone are equal to the LAW ‼
EVEN TO OUR CONSTITUTION?
THE CRUCIAL THING IN WHAT YOU DO PRETENDING TO BE EYEWITNESSES TO THE COURT HEARING: IN PICKING WHAT INFORMATION YOU LEAVE OUT ‼‼‼ FROM THE PUBLIC's EYE COURT ITSELF ARE DESCRIBED IN A WAY AS IF THEY ARE CORRUPT AND BEND SO ONLY ALL IS IN FULL AGREEMENT WITH THE STATE EMPLOYEED PASTOR.
You LEAVE out very IMPORTANT information thus DECEIVE every reader. As well as you slander us in a most LYING and evil way. We DID not experience neither court hearing or the woman who wrote the Transcript to be DECEITFUL- and she said to me on the Phone that she "was there and she heard and she understood what happened, and she urged me to pay attention to WHAT she wrote, she repeated to me in different ways and it truly comforted and made me feel and know what WE SAW IN THEIR REACTIONS at the court hearing That they were ABUSED IN JONAS's SCHEMES, AS WELL AS WE WERE, AND THEY DID NOT FEEL AT EASE.
SHE wrote then about illegal stuff going on in Church and Jonas refused to be open and reveal things he knew. To your INFORMATION HE KNOWS ABOUT FRAUD WITH CHURCH FINANCIEL GIFT CONTRIBUTIONS AS IN THE REASON WHY A STATE ATTORNEY UP IN VIBORG ADVICED US STRONGLY TO REPORT AS MANY PASTORS AND LEADERS INVOLVED AND RESPONSIBLE AS POSSIBLE TO THE POLICE. YOU MAKE A JOKE OF REPORTING ILLEGAL ISSUES TO THE POLICE. IF THAT IS THE ROLE OF THE FREE PRESS REACHING OUT TO THE PUBLIC HANDING OUT DIPLOMATIC IMMUNITY TO PASTORS AND ENDORSING BISHOPS WHO CON PASTORS AND STATE AND ALL CITIZENS INTO BELIEVING, THEY ARE UNDER SAME LAWS AS OUR QUEEN NOT TO TAKE POLITICAL STANDS AND INVOLVE CHURCH TO BE A LIVING RESPONSIBLE SERVING LOVING RELEVANT PART OF THE NATION THAT EVEN PAY THEM, - POLTICALLY DEMOCRATICALLY DECIDED STATE CHURCH!
WHERE DO WE END AS CITIZENS?????
Muslim minority congregation TEACH in ways our State now says no to. BUT STATE CHURCH REFUSES HONESTY AND OPENNESS. JONAS TEACHES AND LIVES FROM HIS STATEMENT: we must protect church. New believers must not know what happens here then they will not come here. AND THROUGH HIS ACTING AGAINST US TO PREVENT US REVEALNG TO THE POLICE AND BE BELIEVED BY POLICE AS WELL AS HIDING TO THE PUBLIC ILLEGAL THINGS HE CLEARLY KNEW OF .... READ THE COURTS VERDICT TRANSCRIPT?
It is double standard to punish Muslim imams as well as their congregations to be parallel societies
When CHURCH IS A SUBCULTURE
a place with rules and ways to go about things to protect THE REAL RELIGION: Which is church. Reformation and Luther lived the OPPOSITE MESSAGE OUT AS WELL AS GRUNDTVIG DID.
HOW MANY citizens in Denmark would want to experience that there is a tale going on about their lives in some newspapers against their consent and against their knowing. Our royal young family have tales written about their lives which must be painful to them. How many of you Danish citizens would want to be signed in to 2 State churches in your hometown, BUT without your written CONSENT AND WITHOUT YOU KNOWING ABOUT IT?
IN ADDITION TO THAT WE PAID CHURCH TAXES FOR 2 YEARS WITHOUT OUR PERMISSION AND CONSENT AT ALL AND WITHOUT OUR KNOWING AT ALL!!!
The common denominator to the equation of the tale told about us is
" WITHOUT OUR WRITTEN CONSENT AND WITHOUT OUR KNOWING" as well as Jonas Serner-Pedersen and STATE Church.
We are citizens in Denmark, and it is scary to experience, as if we are in an evil thriller, where not everyone is equal to the LAW ‼
EVEN TO OUR CONSTITUTION?
THE CRUCIAL THING IN WHAT YOU DO PRETENDING TO BE EYEWITNESSES TO THE COURT HEARING: IN PICKING WHAT INFORMATION YOU LEAVE OUT ‼‼‼FROM THE PUBLIC's EYE COURT ITSELF ARE DESCRIBED IN A WAY AS IF THEY ARE CORRUPT AND BEND SO ONLY ALL IS IN FULL AGREEMENT WITH THE STATE EMPLOYEED PASTOR.
You LEAVE out very IMPORTANT information thus DECEIVE every reader. As well as you slander us in a most LYING and evil way. We DID not experience neither court hearing or the woman who wrote the Transcript to be DECEITFUL- and she said to me on the Phone that she "was there and she heard and she understood what happened, and she urged me to pay attention to WHAT she wrote, she repeated to me in different ways and it truly comforted and made me feel and know what WE SAW IN THEIR REACTIONS at the court hearing That they were ABUSED IN JONAS's SCHEMES, AS WELL AS WE WERE, AND THEY DID NOT FEEL AT EASE.
SHE wrote then about illegal stuff going on in Church and Jonas refused to be open and reveal things he knew. To your INFORMATION HE KNOWS ABOUT FRAUD WITH CHURCH FINANCIEL GIFT CONTRIBUTIONS AS IN THE REASON WHY A STATE ATTORNEY UP IN VIBORG ADVICED US STRONGLY TO REPORT AS MANY PASTORS AND LEADERS INVOLVED AND RESPONSIBLE AS POSSIBLE TO THE POLICE. YOU MAKE A JOKE OF REPORTING ILLEGAL ISSUES TO THE POLICE. IF THAT IS THE ROLE OF THE FREE PRESS REACHING OUT TO THE PUBLIC HANDING OUT DIPLOMATIC IMMUNITY TO PASTORS AND ENDORSING BISHOPS WHO CON PASTORS AND STATE AND ALL CITIZENS INTO BELIEVING, THEY ARE UNDER SAME LAWS AS OUR QUEEN NOT TO TAKE POLITICAL STANDS AND INVOLVE CHURCH TO BE A LIVING RESPONSIBLE SERVING LOVING RELEVANT PART OF THE NATION THAT EVEN PAY THEM, - POLTICALLY DEMOCRATICALLY DECIDED STATE CHURCH!
WHERE DO WE END AS CITIZENS?????
Muslim minority congregation TEACH in ways our State now says no to. BUT STATE CHURCH REFUSES HONESTY AND OPENNESS. JONAS TEACHES AND LIVES FROM HIS STATEMENT: we must protect church. New believers must not know what happens here then they will not come here. AND THROUGH HIS ACTING AGAINST US TO PREVENT US REVEALNG TO THE POLICE AND BE BELIEVED BY POLICE AS WELL AS HIDING TO THE PUBLIC ILLEGAL THINGS HE CLEARLY KNEW OF .... READ THE COURTS VERDICT TRANSCRIPT,
It is double standard to punish Muslim imams as well as their congregations to be parallel societies
When CHURCH IS A SUBCULTURE
a place with rules and ways to go about things to protect THE REAL RELIGION: Which is church. Reformation and Luther lived the OPPOSITE MESSAGE OUT AS WELL AS GRUNDTVIG DID.
HOW MANY citizens in Denmark would want to experience that there is a tale going on about their lives in some newspapers against their consent and against their knowing. Our royal young family have tales written about their lives which must be painful to them. How many of you Danish citizens would want to be signed in to 2 State churches in your hometown , BUT without your written CONSENT AND WITHOUT YOU KNOWING ABOUT IT?
IN ADDITION TO THAT WE PAID CHURCH TAXES FOR 2 YEARS WITHOUT OUR PERMISSION AND CONSENT AT ALL AND WITHOUT OUR KNOWING AT ALL !!!
The common denominator to the equation of the tale told about us is
" WITHOUT OUR WRITTEN CONSENT AND WITHOUT OUR KNOWING" as well as Jonas Serner-Pedersen and STATE Church.
Biskop Henrik Stubkjær udtaler sig i Kristeligt Dagblad om sagen om vores henvendelser til Jonas Serner-Pedersen. Der, hvor filmen knækker, er, at han på Facebook beklager sig over, at Kristeligt Dagblad fokuserer alt for meget på præstesager. Men han bruger Kristeligt Dagblad som organ til at fremstille sig som offer. Han kunne have taget initiativ til at løse selve konflikten ved at snakke med Jonas Serner-Pedersen og os om indholdet i vores henvendelser, og ikke blot nøjes med at se på omfang og polititilhold.
Bishop Henry Stubkjær expresses himself in Kristeligt Dagblad on the case of our enquiries to Jonas Serner-Pedersen. Things get out of sync, when he on Facebook complains that Kristeligt Dagblad focuses too much on the pastoral cases (public problems with pastors). But he uses the Kristeligt Dagblad as a channel to make himself the victim. He could have taken the initiative to resolve the conflict by himself talking with Jonas Serner-Pedersen and with us about the contents of our submissions, and not just confine himself to look at the extent and the police restraint.
In this Facebook post Bishop Henrik Stubkjær writes:
When Viborg Diocese through more than seven years has had a theologian co-worker employed, it has nothing to do with “pastoral cases”, and no competence has been transferred from the Office of Bishop, as Kristeligt Dagblad manufactures it. The reason is solely that it is useful for the bishop as well as the Diocese to have theological competences in the Diocese administration. The new thing is just that the bishops propose that up to half of the position may be financed by the Community Fund and this way relieve the Dioceses’ grants for pastors and the Dioceses’ budget. “Pastoral cases” luckily does not fill up as much on the bishops’ desk as they do in Kristeligt Dagblad.
The text below the picture:
Vicar Jonas Serner-Pedersen is grateful of the support he has received from his parish, after a man and a woman, who have chased him for years, now have begun to contact random citizens in Hjerm and surroundings.
Haarder: Jeg vil gerne have endnu mere uenighed i folkekirken
BERTEL HAARDER, KULTUR- OG KIRKEMINISTER (V)
26. januar 2016 12:15
Kulturudvalget har torsdag den 17 december 2015 kaldt kulturminister
Bertel Haarder (V) i åbent samråd om ...
De ”dorske” og de ”herskesyge”, som vil have staten til at holde
orden, må finde sig i, at folkekirken er en fri kampplads, mener
kirkeminister Bertel Haarder
Stridighederne om reinkarnation, flygtninge og forholdet til islam er
livgivende, mener kirkeministeren
Reinkarnation, forholdet til islam, åbenhed over for flygtninge –
eller ej? Der er jævnlig og hård kritik af folkekirken for tiden.
Mange beklager, at folkekirkens tolerance, åbenhed og rummelighed har
nået et omfang, hvor det er svært at forstå, at det er kristendom, der
forkyndes. De savner passion i folkekirken. Det nytter ikke, at
præster er imødekommende over for islam, og hvordan kan man som
kristen kirke være åben for reinkarnation? Folkekirken afmonterer sig
selv i ren behagesyge, lyder kritikken.
Læs også: De her 10 sager dominerede kirkedebatten i 2015
Gode spørgsmål. Men det er jo den enkelte, der skal tage kampen.
Kirken som institution må nødvendigvis have en vis rummelighed, hvis
den fortsat vil være kirke for det store flertal. Og det er den jo
faktisk i Danmark – knap 80 procent af befolkningen er medlemmer,
selvom de nemt kunne slippe for både medlemskab og kirkeskat.
Kirken kan godt være åben uden at være præget af tandløshed. I ”Den
danske statskirke upartisk betragtet” pointerer Grundtvig igen og
igen, at tro forudsætter frihed, gensidig frihed. Derfor muligheden
for sognebåndsløsning, valgmenigheder med videre.
Læs også: Præstesager skal håndteres mere åbent og ensartet
Kirken skal være en fri kampplads, så ”striden kan holdes vedlige, om
muligt til verdens ende!”. Det tilfredsstiller ganske vist ikke de
”dorske” og de ”herskesyge” (som vil have staten til at holde orden),
men det er kun godt, at de dorske og herskesyge befinder sig ilde i
kirken, siger Grundtvig.
Også jeg ser gerne mere passion, diskussion og uenighed i folkekirken.
Det er livgivende. Lad os bruge ordets magt, sådan som en del
kritikere heldigvis gør.
http://www.kristeligt-dagblad.dk/debat/haarder-jeg-vil-gerne-have-endnu-mere-uenighed-i-folkekirken
To The Press Council.
At December 13-2015 we were approached by Television Midwest, which we reproduce at bottom of this email.
We simply do not understand that Chief Editor Erik Bjerager from Kristeligt Dagblad (Christian DailyNewspaper) has excluded all possible dialogue with us.He is defiling us to be deranged. " The email appears to be written by a person." He attributes to us that the reason why, we do not deny that we have a police restraint, then it is definite that something wrong with us.
We have a juridical Verdict Transcript from the Court in Holstebro, which he overrules the existing of. In 2012 the former Minister of Church in Government Manu Sareen told the former Bishop Karsten Nissen to solve the situation, we were faced with concerning Pastor in Hjerm, Jonas Serner-Pedersen. Bishop Karsten Nissen refused to take responsibility referring the situation to the (now late ) Bishop Niels Henrik Arendt in Haderslev, Denmark.
We are not two Danish citizens stalking Pastor Jonas Serner-Pedersen. His superiors, Bishop Karsten Nissen and later on Bishop Henrik Stubkjær are both responsible to conduct supervision. They are EMPLOYEED to do so and they are paid their annual salary for doing this.
We are whistle-blowers in Denmark, not deranged citizens.
We are not obliged to take on Chief Editor at Christian Daily Newspaper, Erik Bjerager's verbal defiling as our true identity.
Kolding is not a big city, so we are easily recognizable to many.
In the Court in Holstebro in 2013, we were told, we were supposed to be in the City Court to complain within the 14 days after we were given the Police Restraint. They advised us this acknowledging we were not provided with any assistance when we received the police restraints. They were genuinely shaken when they realized they had not been told by Pastor Jonas Serner-Pedersen, that we had been contacting him asking him over and over about IMPORTANT DOCUMENTS.
We believe we can expect and demand, from the Christian Daily Newspaper to relate to a Juridical Verdict Transcript, since they just like we are a part of the Danish democracy, and that it is a STATE EMPLOYEED Pastor they are writing about. We are 2 citizens in Kolding, to whom our Pastor, Jonas Serner-Pedersen has avoided to do a minor piece of administrative paper work for. He had our DOCUMENTS with our personal identification numbers (according to Danish system) and after 2 years we discover by chance that we are signed in to 2 Danish State Churches in Kolding, without our knowing and without our consent !!!!dating back to the time in spring 2012 Jonas Serner-Pedersen got our documents and we have been paying CHURCH TAXES for 2 years against our knowing and consent.
Our DOCUMENTS were at the very latest in Jonas Serner-Pedersen's possession, before we got signed in and registered to the 2 State Churches.
In Denmark we have FREEDOM of religion, even though our State has chosen a version of the World religion Christianity to be approved as the accepted State Religion.
It is highly offensive, an act of abuse, that a State Employed Official Pastor can circumvent our DOCUMENTS as he sees fit, and that we are registered for 2 years in to 2 State Churches and been paying Church Taxes for 2 years - taxes that are for the wages of Pastors in State churches. Behind our backs. And Pastor Jonas Serner-Pedersen has avoided all communication with us concerning these crucial matters by giving us a police restraint.
We have written to Minister of Church Bertel Haarder, the following:
Dear Minister of Church Bertel Haarder please help us. Try to read this defaming of us, chosen by Kristeligt Dagblad. "Mentally disturbed person" Chief Editor Erik Bjerager is defining Lars or I and he relates to us from a position that we do not deny , that there is a police restraint on us.
There is no dialogue made possible, we learn. Instead we are being forced to accept we or one of us are mentally disturbed in a nationwide newspaper of that size and of an impact and influence as specifically Christ- Like Daily Newspaper's (Kristeligt Dagblad)
It is extremely gross and subjective on behalf of Kr.Dagblad. They are even granted an award for their way they deal with church issues. But does this entitle them to one sidet take side for the pastor and even mock the Juridicial Verdict Transscript , we have from the Court in Holstebro ?????
It is without decent RESEARCH and Press ethical will to KNOW, and COMMUNICATE what is really taking place other that from the mouth of Jonas Serner-Pedersen.
When Jonas Serner-Pedersen approached Tv MidWest they contacted us IMIDIATELY before they published Jonas' video and then we were also able to comment FREELY , when it was published.
Erik Bjerager here on Kr. Dagblad has JUDGED us without TRIAL EXACTLY the same manner that Jonas along with former Bishop Karsten Nissen, Viborg, did to us in liason with Mid- and West Jutland Police .
We are sentenced- we got police RESTRAINT and we were FINED without ANY PART HEARING AND POLICE INTERROGATION AND WITHOUT COURT TRIAL BEFORE THE POLICE RESTRAINT AT ALL .
DESPITE the Principle of Legality,
The worthiest IDENTITY of a STATE OF LAW and JUSTICE .
. ‼️‼️‼️‼️‼️‼️‼️‼️‼️‼️‼️‼️‼️‼️‼️‼️‼️‼️‼️‼️
" We have received the following from Tv Midwest on December 13-2015 - they have treated us respectfully, and as we can expect Press ethically correct, they do not publish anything before they know our version.
We received the following from TV Midtvest the 13.12.2015 - they have treated us respectfully, and as we expect press ethically correct. They didn't send anything out before they had heard our version.
Hi Lars Krøgholt and Daniela Skov
I have tried to call to you throughout the day via the numbers found in the phone directories on the internet, but it has not been possible for me to get through to you. Therefore, I am writing this mail.
TV MIDTVEST today has made an interview with vicar Jonas Serner-Pedersen from Hjerm, who feels himself harassed by the numerous messages you send to, among others, the Church's staff, bishops, and the like, where you discredit him. He is especially upset at the fact that you now have started also to send mails/Facebook messages to random citizens in Hjerm.
We would like to hear your side of the case, and therefore, you may contact me as soon as possible on the phone: 29 69 12 84 .
With best regards
Svend-Wilhelm Mikkelsen
[Journalist]
[Tel: 96 12 12 84, svmi@tvmidtvest.dk ]
Erik Bjerager is pointing his fingers at us, but the four are pointing back at himself. The newspaper is pandering for the pastor and the restraining order he has received, whereas he does not take into account the reasons we had to contact him. When, therefore, there is a lack of research, the newspaper loses credibility, and you cannot avoid thinking about how their other articles are researched.
Comments on specific points in Erik Bjerager's manufacturing :
We are unable to see how it can be an act of " unreasonable and lacking objectivity pruning of the actual possibilities of the Press to shed light to this publicly relevant problem, " for the journalist to contact the 2 persons concerned in the article, in order to hear our version. We would not demand or expect the article to be angled differently, or it should be our decision how many lines our version should occupy in the article.
Erik Bjerager writes "that it would be an unreasonable and subjective pruning of Pastor Jonas Serner-Pedersen's options of speech, ...... if he does not have the right to tell his story in a public media. No, we are not arguing against his right to tell his story, but there is always to the very least 2 sides to a story, and even though we received our police restraints because we contacted Jonas Serner-Pedersen frequently, OUR motives and intensions to contact Pastor Jonas Serner-Pedersen are still not told. That makes the entire story a lie and a gossip as well as a tale. THEATER.
WITHOUT OUR STATEMENTS CHRISTIAN DAILY NEWSPAPER IS WRITING SOLELY THE ENTIRE STORY - JONAS' PLOT!!!! A LIE OR CONCOTED TALE, MERELY GOSSIP OR YOU COULD CALL IT HIS PART IN THE MANUSCRIPT OF THIS FARCE.
IT CAN NEVER BE JONAS's TRUE STORY, BUT MERELY A TYPE OF THEATER, WHEN HE IS INVOLVING ANYBODY ELSE ANONYMOUSLY AND WITHOUT OUR APPROVAL AND RECOGNITION OF THE EVENTS CONCERNING OUR ROLES AND PARTS DEPICTED IN THE ARTICLE.
If nothing else we want to tell our version to the journalist before he takes our lives to the public, even if it was still up to him how to handle our information.
Erik Bjerager adheres to that we have not complaint earlier to former articles, apparently written about Pastor in Hjerm, Jonas Serner-Pedersen's police restraint towards us. WHICH ARTICLES?
Erik Bjerager LINKS to articles WE NEVER KNEW EXISTED . Local papers fx Lemvig newspaper - we see here! and we would never even consider the existence of such articles. They too never contacted us.
Links to articles we ONLY are able to see now, because of Erik Bjerager revealing their existence to us.
Jonas Serner-Pedersen wearing his T-shirt : " I make my own stunts!" Indeed he does!
The fact that we have not filed a complaint to the publishers of these articles for their content strengthens Erik Bjerager presumption, that what Jonas Serner-Pedersen has told really has taken place. Based on the unsubstantiated prejudices of the Chief Editor Erik Bjerager only.
Eliminating all research that could be expected of a professional , and of a nationwide newspaper who promotes themselves of being CHRISTLIKE. CHRISTLIKE DAILY NEWSPAPER IS THE TRANSLATION OF KRISTELIGT‼KRIST-LIGT‼‼‼
"Kristeligt Dagblad must reject that the newspaper has spoken badly about the complainants in public to which they claim. Since they do not appear in the article, they may not have been spoken badly about. And even if they had been identified in the article, there would have been no denigration of any kind, since the article's information about the causes of the police restraint are factual circumstances. "
The Christian Newspaper Editor in Chief claims here that we "do not appear in the article!" WHO THEN ARE THE TWO FROM KOLDING AT ALL?
Does PASTOR JONAS SERNER-Pedersen thus have a police restraining order on TWO OTHER CITIZENS FROM HIS FORMER CHURCH IN KOLDING?????? LIKEWISE THE FACTUAL INFORMATION HE IS TALKING ABOUT: IT IS NOT INDICATIVE OF OUR HISTORY AND WE ARE NOT IN THE ROLE WHICH HERE BECOMES ASCRIBED TO US.
WE DECLINE ON THE MOST ABSOLUTE TO "APPEAR IN THE NEWSPAPER'S THEMATIC SESSION ON HARASSED PASTORS".
THAT ROLE IS NOT SOMETHING WE RECOGNIZE.
WE ARE UNDER NO OBLIGATION AS DANISH CITIZENS TO KNOW ALL THE ARTICLES IN THE COUNTRY'S SMALL OR LARGE NEWSPAPERS TO WHICH THE VICAR JONAS SERNER-PEDERSEN MAY HAVE WIDESPREAD HIS PROBLEMS TO. THAT HE SPEAKS WITH LEMVIG FOLKEBLAD ABOUT SOMEONE WHO WITHOUT BEING IDENTIFIED, IS GOING TO BE US; THAT DOES NOT GIVE ERIK BJERAGER DOCUMENTATION TO PUBLISH "AN ARTICLE WHICH IN THEMATIC FORM DESCRIBES A GROWING PHENOMENON, CONSISTING IN THAT PASTORS ARE SUBJECTED TO THREATS AND HARASSMENT". We do not experience that Jonas Serner-Pedersen is such an interesting writer or narrator, so we that we Google away to find all sorts of publications, he must have in the country's newspapers and magazines. It has always been the plan for us, that from 2012 just to resign us from the church in Kolding and then travel to each our place in England. I asked specifically Jonas about a NOTICE RECEIPT so I could be sure that he was responsible for his administrative work and had resigned me. I in no way wanted my name to be set in connection with a church where the leadership under Chairman Erling Hybschmann had bullied my pastor, Jonas Serner-Pedersen in secret for a year and a half.
How he has got it made about why we should go and call him a "sinister" person-I asked just now a friend, if she connects the word SINISTER with me and my use of language? No.
Nor does LARS use that word and it has no relevance to our subjective need for a receipt of resignation and a REFERENCE to the CHURCH in England, at that time Academy in then Abundant Life Church, now LIFE CHURCH in Bradford. Jonas Serner-Pedersen tied us to him via Police restraining order and it is deeply stressful. I've got an American fiancé two years ago and I have the restraining order which ties me .... I cannot travel to the United States with a restraining order in my papers. Jonas could in 15-20 minutes max have done that administrative task. It was his task to resign us from the church in Kolding. Instead we find two years later that we had been resigned, BUT THEN ALSO ENROLLED and REGISTERED in the TWO FOLK CHURCHES in KOLDING on the BASIS of OUR documents WHICH HE HAD. With our SOCIAL SECURITY numbers. Against our wishes and knowledge - and the baptism WE BELIEVE in is NOT infant christening. And we have paid church tax for 2 years without OUR OWN CONSENT. And we have received summonses and fines without interrogation at all. SO WE ARE IN THE WHOLE MATTER WITH POLICE AND WITH EDITOR HENRI NISSEN, THE WHOLE CHURCH'S WEEKLY NEWSPAPER CALLED SICK IN THE HEAD AND STAMPED GUILTY UNTIL THE OPPOSITE IS PROVEN. IT'S SO SAME with BISHOPS and SO OBVIOUSLY with YOU KRISTELIGT DAGBLAD: here we are "DERANGED" and we are guilty in the light of police restraint and articles in two magazines, about which we have not complained in your optics-but in our optics the articles are unknown to us until yesterday, when I click on the ENCLOSED LINK.
It is almost tiresome that you should hear much before your ears fall off. For I could really well do without hearing all the lies and attempts to defend journalism of so poor a quality. I am shocked, because I once thought that precisely a newspaper that calls itself Christian = CHRIST-LIKE is of a high standard. You are selling precisely on that name! Instead it is just a beneficial Trade mark and citizens can be used by you without research in advance, when you determine you to do a so-called THEMATIC ... or something that does not make sense to me. AS you are just using us, and we, mysteriously enough, in addition get the message that we "do not appear in the article" because we "have not been identified. "
WE DO NOT APPEAR IN THE ARTICLE, IT'S TRUE. ‼ ️ ‼ ️ ️ ️ ️ ‼ ‼ ‼ BECAUSE it is NOT OUR LIFE and OUR STORY WHATSOEVER, JONAS SERNER-PEDERSEN TELLS and which YOUR JOURNALIST is PAID FOR. ‼️‼️‼️‼️‼️‼️‼️‼️‼️‼️‼️
WE ARE NOT OBLIGED TO LET US USE IN THE NEWSPAPER'S CHOICE OF STORIES. THAT IS NO CITIZEN IN DENMARK. ‼ ‼ ‼ ‼ ‼ ‼ ‼ ‼ ‼. IF WE BECOME "made inhuman" so that "we don't appear in ..." then it is the only an expression of what we already have tried to establish, that the newspaper has sunk down on a gossip magazine's level of untruth. ‼ ️ ‼ ‼ ‼ ‼ ️ JUDGING citizens of DENMARK UNTIL PROVEN OTHERWISE. ‼ ️‼️‼️‼️‼️‼️‼️‼️
The fact that we have not filed a complaint with the publishers of these articles for their content reinforces Erik Bjerager in acceptance of the fact that what Jonas Serner-Pedersen has told about, really has taken place. – Yes, we certainly do not dispute that we have approached us to Jonas Serner-Pedersen in the described scope, up to the police restraint as well as that we have violated the police restraint some times. But that does not mean that we should be outlawed, and that we cannot expect a journalist to be interested in hearing our side of the case.
The newspaper has not approached us, and Erik Bjerager argues that since it is only within a very narrow circle, that we are recognizable, Kristeligt Dagblad had no reason to submit the details for the complaintants.
It is possible that the newspaper has no reason for it, but now we draw attention to that we are ordinary people, and not stalking monsters, which you have to keep at arms distance.
Erik Bjerager provides what could be called "a legal statement" over what he should do, and what is required and not required, perhaps in order to aid his journalist. However, we wish that the journalist even took a position on our complaint and concern specifically and personally.
Erik Bjerager explains how the newspaper did not know our identity before we even contacted the newspaper with a number of mails. However, this is unimportant in this context, for the journalist could just as well, like the journalist on TV Midtvest did, have asked Jonas Serner-Pedersen of our names.
We cannot understand why Erik Bjerager draws attention to the fact that we do everything we can to draw attention to the fact that we "stand behind the harassment of vicar Jonas Serner-Pedersen", and that it is outside of the Christian Newspaper control? It falls in line with his comments that we are not disputing the fact that we've got police restraint for a wide range of approaches to the vicar. Such facts would then only a deranged person find to contest! The problem then is that Erik Bjerager cannot get the psychological profile of us, as he tries to build up in his head, to come right. For he has settled with himself that we or one of us is deranged: "The mail reminiscent of being written by a deranged person". Bjeragers problem then is, after our assessment, that such deranged person would not admit that the police is right, when they give a police restraint on the basis of a wide range of inquiries, called harassment. That he thus stamps us as deranged, distorts the whole matter, for such deranged persons may one at most feel sorry for. One can certainly not enter into dialogue with them or let them have an influence on one's journalism.
I Lars experience that your behavior, Erik Bjerager, is to protect your journalist, and that you do a lot of contortions to defend him and not lose face.
Fortunately, we have a Minister of Church, Bertel Haarder, who is not in favor of closing the discussion, but would like to take the debates about the Church of Denmark. He thinks it is life giving not to just be satisfied with Status Quo.
Haarder: I want to have even more disagreements in the State church.
Bertel Haarder is the Minister of Culture and of Church in government.
BERTEL HAARDER, KULTUR- OG KIRKEMINISTER (V)
( V= VENSTRE = Left , Liberals)
BERTEL HAARDER, CULTUR AND CHURCH MEMBER OF PARLAMENT.
26. January 2016 12:15
Thursday December 17- 2015, Cultural Affairs has summoned Minister of Culture Bertel Haarder (V) to open consultation about....
The "dull" and the "domineering" who wants the State to keep up order, will have to get used to the fact that the State church is a free combat zone, says Minister of Church MP. Bertel Haarder.
Disputes about reincarnation, refugees and the relating to Islam is life giving, according to the Minister of Church MP.
Reincarnation, relations to Islam, openness to refugees / or no openness? There is frequent and harsh criticism of the State Church going forth.
Many complain that the tolerance, openness and roominess has reached a level, where it’s difficult to get that preaching is about Christianity.
They lack passion in the State Church. It does not help that pastors are welcoming towards Islam, and how is it possible as a Christian Church to open up to reincarnation?
The State Church is dismantling itself in sheer coquettish, critiques say.
Foto: Sophia Juliane Lydolph / Scanpix Denmark
Good questions. But it is the individual, that has to fight the battle. Church being an institution, necessity demands a certain roominess, if meant to continue being Church to the large majority. And it actually is in Denmark- about 80 percent of the population are members, although they could easily free themselves from both membership and paying taxes to the Church.
Church can easily be open without being characterized by edentulousness.
In "The Danish state church impartially considered" Grundtvig emphasizes again and again that faith requires freedom, mutual freedom.
Hence this the opportunity to untie yourself from your own parish, different types of congregational ...
The church shall be a combat zone, in order" to sustain the dispute, if possible, to the end of the world!". It satisfies admittedly not the "dull" and "domineering" (who wants the state to maintain order ), but it's just as well that the dull and the domineering are amiss in church, said Grundtvig.
I too would like see more passion, debate and disagreement in the State church. It is life giving. Let us use the power of the word, such as some critiques fortunately do.
http://www.kristeligt-dagblad.dk/debat/haarder-jeg-vil-gerne-have-endnu-mere-uenighed-i-folkekirken
Here are the documents to which what we write above is a reaction – sent within the seven days deadline.
---------- Videresendte meddelelser ----------
Fra: $Pressenævnet (955Sekr) <sekr@pressenaevnet.dk>
Dato: 4. marts 2016 kl. 13.12
Emne: Pressenævnets sag nr. 16-70-00934
Til: "lkrogholt@gmail.com" <lkrogholt@gmail.com>
Cc: "bjerager@k.dk" <bjerager@k.dk>
Dear Daniela Skov and Lars Skov Krøgholt
Attached is sent copy of mail of 3. March 2016 from Kristeligt Dagblad.
If you have further remarks to this or to the case, please forward these to this office within seven days from today.
It is to be noted that the case will be settled on the present basis, if the board has not heard from you
before this deadline.
Copy of this mail has been sent to Kristeligt Dagblad.
Venlig hilsen
Mette Pedersen Kontorfuldmægtig Press board sekretariat Adelgade 13 • 1304 København K Telefon 7266 1492 E-mail mpe@pressenaevnet.dk • sekr@pressenaevnet.dk
---------- Videresendt meddelelse ----------
From: Lone Bendtsen <Bendtsen@k.dk>
To: "$Pressenævnet (955Sekr)" <sekr@pressenaevnet.dk>
Cc:
Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2016 16:51:01 +0000
Subject: Sag nr. 16-70-00934
For the Press Board
Dear Christina Molin
With this opinion from the Kristeligt Dagblad on Press Board case No. 16-70-00934
Daniela Skov and Lars Skov Krøgholt have the 25. February 2016 complained to the Press Board of the article "Harassing pastors missing help", which was published on the Christian Newspaper website k.dk on 15. December 2015 and in the newspaper's print edition on 16. December 2015:
http://www.kristeligt-dagblad.dk/kirke-faith/harassed-praester-missing-means
Kristeligt Dagblad has these notes to the complaint:
The article describes in a thematic form a growing phenomenon consisting in the fact that pastors are subjected to threats and harassment. As an example of the problem the article refers vicar Jonas Serner-Pedersen's personal experiences with being subjected to telephone harassment by two people whose names do not appear in the article, and who alone are described with the following words:
” (…) two people from his previous church in Kolding ".
Basically it is important that the press as part of its social task can illuminate different legal conditions – including how occupational groups, in this case, the pastors, experience and handle harassment. If a media in such a context in a matter-of-fact and sober form cannot describe
· What a parish pastor in practical terms has been exposed to
· When the party who is behind the harassment, is not identified in the description
it shall result in an unreasonable and arbitrary cropping of the actual possibilities for the press to illuminate this socially relevant phenomenon.
It will also be an unfair and arbitrary cropping of vicar Jonas Serner-Pedersen’s options of uttering himself– and thus in principle of any harassment victim's options of utterance– if he is not entitled to in a media to tell his story about how he himself experienced a case that has so much gravity that it has sparked a police restraining order intended to protect his person and property, and later financial penalties for violation of this police restraining order.
Kristeligt Dagblad notes that the existence of the police estrangement measures is not contested by the complainants. The police estrangement measures are due to the fact that the complainants have exercised a harassment against parish priest Jonas Serner-Pedersen, who among other things made up in the "100 unpleasant calls a day" and in the "12 hours of harassment on the answering machine", as the article mentions. In 2013, two persons, who by all accounts are identical with the complainants, sentenced to fines for having violated their summonses by despite the estrangement measures to harass vicar Jonas Serner-Pedersen:
http://folkebladetlemvig.dk/struer/mand-and-woman-rely-fines-for-praestechikane-0
That these forms of harassment are among the reasons why there have been claims that the summonses against the two complainants, nor are disputed – to the extent Kristeligt Dagblad may suggest the complaint. In any case, vicar Jonas Serner-Pedersen describes factual circumstances.
These conditions have also been featured in other media before the Kristeligt Dagblad brought its article. The Kristeligt Dagblad in its formulation of the article has not given it any weight, but the fact that the complainants have not complained to the Press Board over these prior articles, corroborates the public in that the mentioned forms of harassment have taken place and are included in the basis for the police restraining order. See for example these mentions of the case from other media before the date of the Kristeligt Dagblad article:
http://www.tvmidtvest.dk/artikel/sognepraest-exposed-gross-harassment
The complainants also argue that "we never got a letter from you", which must be understood as a complaint that the article's information about the police restraint and the harassment were not presented to them by Kristeligt Dagblad, as per the guidelines for good press usage point (A) – 3.
Since the complainants ' names are not mentioned in the article, and since the article does not otherwise make it possible to recognize their identity outside of a very narrow group, the Kristeligt Dagblad had no reason to submit the details for the complainants.
This corresponds to the fact that the media in reference to a different type of legal relationship, of course, can refer to charges that have been raised against a person without that medium is obliged to present the contents of the charges for the charged person for the purpose of an opinion, as long as the person does not appear by name in the references or otherwise is immediately recognizable for a larger group.
Presentation – or at least particulars of the two persons’ – those who are charged - position to the charge– is only required if those charged are identified by the media. It is not the case, as mentioned in the Kristeligt Dagblad’s article.
Actually Kristeligt Dagblad did not know of the two persons – the identity of the complainants – before they eventually turned to Kristeligt Dagblad, with a series of e-mails, the purpose of which appears to put it mildly, unclear, and of which the recipient group includes addresses of hundreds of individuals or organizations whose relevance or interest in this case seems questionable.
That the two complainants have done everything they can to publicize that they stand behind the harassment of vicar Jonas Serner-Pedersen, in fact by circulating their numerous e-mails on the case for a quantity of recipients – from the Royal family to various religious communities – are outside of the Kristeligt Dagblad’s control.
Kristeligt Dagblad must reject that the newspaper has spoken badly in public about the complaints of which they claim. Since they do not appear in the article, they may not have been spoken badly of. And even if they had been identified in the article, there would have been no denigration of any kind, since the article's information about the causes of the police restraining order are factual circumstances.
The complainants ' comments to the press board must also be understood in such a way that they are upset that they have not received a reply in the form of an apology from the newspaper on an email by 4. January 2016.
The message carries the mark of being written by a deranged person and was impossible to decode as a complaint for Kristeligt Dagblad. It is preceded by the following words, where the Kristeligt Dagblad newspaper's journalist is not included:
"Your Majesty!
Dear Prime minister Lars Løkke Rasmussen
Dear Culture and Ecclesiastical Affairs Bertel Haarder
Dear ex. Minister rapporteur and heritage Britta Schall Holberg
Dear policy spokesman for Venstre Jakob Ellemann-Jensen
Dear Justice minister Søren Pind
Dear Finance minister Claus Hjort Frederiksen
Dear Integration minister Inger Støjbjerg "
In the "to" field of the message appearing hundreds of recipients, and the Christian Newspaper employee, Christian Birk, appearing at number three.
There is neither further down in the striking long and incoherent text something that only fairly clearly indicates that this should be a letter, as Kristeligt Dagblad should or could respond to. Kristeligt Dagblad must therefore refuse to have been neglect of guiding rules for good press usage or other rules by not having replied to the message of 4. January 2016.
With best regards
Erik Bjerager
Editor-in-Chief and Managing Director
Med venlig hilsen / Kind regards Daniela Skov and Lars Skov Krøgholt
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Skype: lars.krogholt
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