20140703_W1

Source: BBC Radio 4, The World at One

URL: N/A

Date: 03/07/2014

Event: Charles Perry warns of UK drinking water contamination by fiery "poison" caused by fracking

Credit: BBC Radio 4

People:

• Shaun Ley: BBC journalist
• Charles Perry: Co-founder, SecondNature and former Director, BP Green Energy

Shaun Ley: Well, Charles Perry was Director of BP Green Energy, the division of that major energy company which looked at future investment options outside of traditional oil and gas - he went on to co-found a consultancy called SecondNature. Charles Perry, what do you make of this?

Charles Perry: Yes, it's unconventional for a reason, which means it's difficult to extract. And fracking is not just about gas, it's also about oil. So as Rob says, you know, 650 metres or 800 metres - is that close enough for comfort, when Britain's aquifers provide 70% of the drinking water in the southeast? So if we were to poison our drinking water - I mean, clearly, being an island, um, we would, you know, have a huge risk on our hands.

Shaun Ley: Indeed, I mean, the use of the word "poisoned" is quite loaded - I mean, talking to David, he was saying that for example, with gas, the big concern is about methane. Methane isn't poisonous per se, but there could be a - what's regarded as a risk from - a potential risk from explosions.

Charles Perry: Well, we know from what's going on in America that I don't think "poison" is too strong a word, because in some cases you can actually light the water. Now I don't think you would want to drink water which you can actually set alight.

Shaun Ley: Those are big, big operations. Do you think - are you concerned, then, that there isn't, in your judgement, a safe way of extracting this gas? Given the argument that was being advanced, that actually the gaps are quite wide in quite large parts of the area, particularly in the north of England, where the aquifer - the gap between the aquifer and the rock that the companies might want to get to, is at least 800 metres.

Charles Perry: Yes, I mean, well, this is the thing about the government subsidisation for fracking all across the country, regardless of what the risks are and what the aquifer landscape looks like. So I think, you know, the government's taken some bad advice on just carte-blanche subsidising the fossil fuel industry. And - as you know Lord Browne, my old boss at BP, would say - they don't need subsidies in the fossil fuel industry, they've been subsidised for hundreds of years, and in fact the G20 is committed to abolishing fossil-fuel subsidies. And the other point is: Britain's engineering and innovation talent is highly valued but it's in short supply. So should we absorb Britain's engineering talent in trying to get our difficult oil and gas from shale, or should we be incentivising the low-carbon economy and, you know, clean energy?

Shaun Ley: Charles Perry, thank you very much.

[To be continued.]