20131120_C4
Source: Channel 4 News
URL: http://www.channel4.com/news/climate-change-warsaw-talks-loss-damage-naderev-yeb-sano
Date: 20/11/2013
Event: Ed Davey: optimistic that governments will "go to Paris in 2015 and get that deal"
Attribution: Channel 4 News
People:
- Tom Clarke: Channel 4 Science Editor
- Ed Davey: Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change in the UK
- Lord Deben: John Gummer, Chairman of the Committee on Climate Change (UK)
- Caroline Flint: UK Labour Party MP, Shadow Energy Secretary
- Jon Snow: Presenter, Channel 4 News
Jon Snow: It all sounds very green. The Environment [sic] Secretary Ed Davey has been urging other countries to get serious about tackling climate change. At the UN's climate talks in Warsaw, Mr Davey said Britain would push for a deal cutting carbon emissions by 50% across Europe, but back home it's all very different. The Conservatives are trying to get rid of green energy levies, to the dismay of campaigners. We'll be talking with the Environment [sic] Secretary in just a moment. But first, here's our Science Editor, Tom Clarke.
Tom Clarke: There's lots of ways of making electricity. But here in Britain, like the rest of the world, most of it comes from burning planet-warming fossil fuels. Today ministers assemble at global climate talks in Warsaw, to continue trying to thrash out a deal on reducing carbon emissions.
Our government has gone to Warsaw as one of the more progressive nations, telling others to reduce their emissions to the environment. But back home it's a very different story - we've got Conservative politicians saying they're going to get rid of green energy initiatives, and an electricity sector in virtual chaos. Take this modern gas-fired power station - hardly being used because it's more profitable for power companies to burn far dirtier coal.
As well as making better use of the plants we've got, like Barking Power Station, we need to build a lot more energy infrastructure. A report this week from Ernst & Young found there are plenty of investors queueing up to build it. But they won't spend any money until they know whether the government wants green energy, more fossil fuels or cheaper bills.
Caroline Flint: I think the promise of David Cameron to be the "greenest government ever" is - has been a bit more of a greenwash than something that really stands up to scrutiny. What we've seen in the last few years are emissions going up, investment in clean energy halved, but also it hasn't helped our country and I don't think it helps our reputation on the world stage, when we witness every day the bickering that's going on within the Coalition government.
[Video footage of an elderly pensioner lighting a gas fire in his living room.]
Tom Clarke: As an issue, energy pushes all sorts of buttons - economic, environmental and social. And the cost of bills versus the cost of climate disaster makes it a messy political battleground. In the last three months alone, the Labour Party has said they want to freeze energy bills for consumers, the Conservative Party has said they want to scrap some of those green energy tariffs - meanwhile, the Liberal Democrats say they'll leave things pretty much the way they are.
Anyone trying to win an election knows voters worried about keeping warm through winter don't necessarily have the future of the Earth's climate system at the front of their minds. It's why the UK has a Climate Change Act, that forces successive governments to reduce emissions.
Lord Deben: Whatever the government is, the pressures are always to do things which are immediately necessary, and that's why we passed the Climate Change Act, because it ensures that you can't do that. Countries like China are actually, practically doing more than we're doing - Mexico, South Africa is doing remarkably...
[Video footage of UN Secretary General Ban Ki-moon riding a bamboo bicycle at the COP19 summit in Warsaw.]
Tom Clarke: You can tell it's a climate summit - here comes Ban Ki-moon on a bamboo bike. But the smiles today in Warsaw conceal the fact it's not going well. Japan, Canada, Australia are bailing on their commitments to cut carbon. And it only makes our Environment [sic] Secretary's job harder, selling a green Britain to the rest of the world, while back home, many voters worry they're paying too much already.
* * *
Jon Snow: Well, now Ed Davey, Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change, joins us live from the conference in Warsaw. Ed Davey, it's grim, isn't it. If you look at the top ten polluters, only one, Germany, is really seriously doing anything about limiting emissions. International discussions like this are really descending into farce, aren't they.
Ed Davey: I couldn't disagree with you more. There's a lot of optimism here and there's two very good reasons, and they're called the United States of America and China, with President Obama making climate change a key part of his second term, with his Secretary of State Kerry, who's been one of the big champions in America of action on climate change. We're seeing the United States in a much more positive position, taking real action at home, being a leader in the climate change talks, which frankly hasn't happened in this level before. And in China we've got the new Chinese leadership, coming to power in December last year, talking about building an "ecological civilisation", investing now in more renewables than any other country in the world, talking about capping the coal-powered stations because of the air pollution it's causing in their big cities. So, these big changes from the big nations is [sic] actually giving a lot of people here a lot more hope than you've described.
Jon Snow: But if what you say is true, then Conservative MPs calling for green levies to be removed from electricity bills - and with the great hope that they'll get them abolished altogether - is going in the exactly opposite direction.
Ed Davey: Jon, you shouldn't believe all you read in the papers. We're absolutely clear that the support for renewables and for low-carbon will continue. And it's because it's been so successful - we've seen £31 billion of investment in the low-carbon electricity infrastructure since 2010, that's a massive increase. We've now nearly doubled the amount of electricity coming from renewable sources - it's nearly at 16%. So there's been a really big advance, and the setup in the Energy Bill to create the world's first ever low-carbon electricity market - that is on track, with a huge pipeline of new investment coming. Only this year we've consented seven new big low-carbon plants, with an investment that's going to come of £20 billion. So I don't recognise the picture that you and your reporter were showing. We are making big strides on low-carbon in the UK. About time, too - the last Labour government didn't do anywhere near enough. And with Liberal Democrats working with our Coalition colleagues, we're making real progress.
Jon Snow: Okay - there's the grand scenario, so let's get tight, let's look at coal in our country and a brief answer to this: are we going to close the loophole that allows coal-fired power stations to go on pumping carbon emissions out into the atmosphere?
Ed Davey: Well, our projections in DECC suggest that there will be no coal-powered stations by the end of the next decade.
Jon Snow: Let me ask you another one, then. George Osborne says "We're not going to save the planet by putting our country out of business." And that is, I think, what he suspects the LibDems want to do.
Ed Davey: Well, I agree with the Chancellor on that. It's absolutely vital that we ensure that there is a level playing field, that every country is treated fairly. And one of the reasons why we're in the European Union is to make sure we can get that deal. So, for example, I'm engaged with my European colleagues to reform the carbon market, to make sure that the costs that UK companies pay are the same as other European companies. That's the way to ensure that we can tackle climate change and keep competitive.
Jon Snow: Okay, very briefly then, when Paris comes next year - and that is, after all, the successor to Copenhagen, which was such a disastrous failure - are you predicting the world will come together, will have a deal and will severely assault carbon emissions?
Ed Davey: Well, Paris isn't next year, it's in 2015 - next year's in Peru. And that's the difference from what happened in Copenhagen. An agreement reached just two years ago in Durban basically said that we had four years to work to get that climate change deal that's been so elusive, that previous governments have failed to achieve. And I think the work we're doing in Warsaw, the work we'll do next year in Peru, will enable us to go to Paris in 2015 and get that deal. And that's because of the changed positions in Washington and Beijing and elsewhere. I'm very optimistic.
Jon Snow: Secretary of State, Secretary of State, thank you very much indeed for talking with us.