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Information about this bayonet
This bayonet has a smooth ribbed brass hilt that is 119 mm long and has 16 ribs. The muzzle ring is flush to the hilt flat and the inside diameter is 22.9 mm. There is a forward swept round finial on the bottom of the guard and no finial on top of the muzzle ring. There is no steel rivet in the center of the cross guard.
Even though the style of this bayonet is very similar to those produced by Collins and Ames, the overall quality is well below. The hilt ribs are not always straight and of uniform thickness. The hilt flat is frequently cast at an angle leaving the right side higher than the left when looking down the hilt to the muzzle ring. The lug slot is frequently off center being cut closer to the left side of the hilt.
The lug slot is chamfered around the top edge and there is no guide slot. A couple of examples have numbers on their muzzle rings and one is numbered on the hilt flat.
The 42 mm long press stud spring is usually wider at the lug end then it is at the end with the retaining screw. Plus the spring retaining screw is very proud (2 to 3 mm) on the side of the bayonet.
The press stud is not cylindrical as normally seen for other manufacturers. It tapers in diameter leaving a larger width at the spring side of the stud.
The top edge of the blade is frequently almost flat with sharp corners. The yataghan blade is ~510 mm long and has unstopped fullers.
Information from other sources
One online source has identified the rifle for this bayonet as the Confederate J.P. Murray Rifle from Columbus Georgia but it gives very little detail to support the claim. https://www.invaluable.com/auction-lot/rare-civil-war-confederate-saber-bayonet-251-c-4234deca28 The rifle apparently used a ring-type bayonet stud adapter that was installed on the barrel to support the bayonet.
Speculation and questions
Four examples of this bayonet have been recorded and others examined so it appears to be fairly common. It may be the same bayonet listed as number 118 in Albert Hardin’s book The American Bayonet 1776-1964.
While similar to bayonets made by Collins and Ames, this bayonet is different enough to believe it was made by another unknown manufacturer. The crude workmanship of the hilt makes one believe that it could be an early Confederate production. Possibly produced for the US Model 1841 rifles stored in southern arsenals at the beginning of the war or other Confederate produced rifles such as the JP Murray Rifle.
Example Reference # 1837
Example Reference # 1837
Note! All measurements are in millimeters
Note! All measurements are in millimeters
Muzzle Ring Diameter --------- 22.9
Overall Length ----------------- 630
Hilt Length -------------------- 119
Blade Length ------------------ 511
Blade Width ------------------- 27.1
Blade Thickness --------------- 7.9
Lock to Muzzle Length ------- 99
Press Stud Spring Length ----- 42
Guide Slot Length ------------- None
Lug to Stop Length ----------- 12.4
Lug Slot Width --------------- 4.8
Lug Width -------------------- 8.7
Lug Thickness ---------------- 2.2
Lug Depth -------------------- 6.7
This example is not marked in any manner. The press stud is notched like those made by Ames Mfg. The press stud spring is noticeably wider at the press stud end. The condition of blade on this example is very good so its overall and blade lengths are used as the general standard.
Example Reference # 1769
Example Reference # 1769
Note! All measurements are in millimeters
Note! All measurements are in millimeters
Muzzle Ring Diameter --------- 22.9
Overall Length ----------------- 610*
Hilt Length -------------------- 118
Blade Length ------------------ 492*
Blade Width ------------------- 28.0
Blade Thickness --------------- 7.9
Lock to Muzzle Length ------- 99
Press Stud Spring Length ----- 42
Guide Slot Length ------------- None
Lug to Stop Length ----------- 12.8
Lug Slot Width --------------- 4.6
Lug Width -------------------- 8.8
Lug Thickness ---------------- 2.5
Lug Depth -------------------- 6.5
*Blade tip has been rounded and possibly reworked.
This example is stamped 61 to top of muzzle ring in very small numbers. The press stud spring is close to parallel from end to end. The blade is unmarked.
Example Reference # 1815
Example Reference # 1815
Note! All measurements are in millimeters
Note! All measurements are in millimeters
Muzzle Ring Diameter --------- 22.8
Overall Length ----------------- 623*
Hilt Length -------------------- 118
Blade Length ------------------ 505*
Blade Width ------------------- 27.9
Blade Thickness --------------- 7.8
Lock to Muzzle Length ------- 100
Press Stud Spring Length ----- 43
Guide Slot Length ------------- None
Lug to Stop Length ----------- 13.4
Lug Slot Width --------------- 4.9
Lug Width -------------------- 8.7
Lug Thickness ---------------- 2.3
Lug Depth -------------------- 6.4
*A few millimeters of the blade tip are missing.
This example is stamped 105 to top of muzzle ring in very small numbers. The press stud spring is noticeably wider at the press stud end. The blade is unmarked. This example was found with a piece of a scabbard and a buff white frog.
Example Reference # 1733
Example Reference # 1733
Note! All measurements are in millimeters
Note! All measurements are in millimeters
Muzzle Ring Diameter --------- 22.8
Overall Length ----------------- 624*
Hilt Length -------------------- 119
Blade Length ------------------ 505*
Blade Width ------------------- 27.8
Blade Thickness --------------- 7.8
Lock to Muzzle Length ------- 100
Press Stud Spring Length ----- 42
Guide Slot Length ------------- None
Lug to Stop Length ----------- 13.4
Lug Slot Width --------------- 4.8
Lug Width -------------------- 8.7
Lug Thickness ---------------- 2.4
Lug Depth -------------------- 6.3
*Sharpening to the blade tip has reduced the overall and blade lengths.
This example is vertically stamped 75 on the hilt flat between the muzzle ring and the lug slot in a large 8 mm font. There is also a large dot stamped on the flat close to the muzzle ring. The blade is unmarked.
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