AtariCommunity forums : Carbon Copy page 32

Quote:

Originally Posted by xinfe (Post 11437880)

See in the quote.

Hi Xinfe,

both Add-on and Special tracks installer install the new, final Object_Classes.txt. Your tracks and some other Special tracks require the changes in the Object_Classes.txt.

Forget the idea of the buggy Object_Classes.txt. The Object_Classes.txt (as installed by Add-on and Special Tracks installer) is okay.

It crashed on your computer because you added some unavailable objects (numbers) manually, via text editor. So it was not a fault of the game. If you use the internal Supreme Editor to add objects, you will find the available objects only, and so the game cannot crash. So there is no bug in the Object_Classes.txt. There are some useless lines in the Object_Classes.txt, which isn't a bug. There a thousands of files in the game with useless lines.

However, I ask you again to not change this file.

Quote:

Originally Posted by michael.tk (Post 11437877)

What do you think: Why am I working at "Practice by Dejogg"? Why do I post a new Object_Data.txt for "Practice by Dejogg" at http://ssb.bplaced.net/update.htm?

Strange but downloading any file from the update page gives error 404.

I would like to know if the latest version of DeJogg is the final version.

I propose not to replace Practice in Special tracks #1 by the new track, but collect tracks for Special Tracks #4.

Matt's Village: Michael, I propose that you change the landscape, so that you could race without fall. Then you (or we all together) will be able to record AI paths. By the way, there are only 3x2 = 6 "normal" routes to go, so 5-6 races on every route is needed.

I don't understand why we need to record all 33 AI paths. Can we just change the number of AI paths needed?

Quote:

Originally Posted by OlegM (Post 11437890)

Strange but downloading any file from the update page gives error 404. ...

Oops, that was my fault. Thank you for your information and sorry to Matt! Please try again.

There are many more routes at "Special by Matt Village" than only 6! Obviously you have seen only a small part of the track. :-)

I will contact Matt because of your changes.

The original Village Easy has 33 AI paths. "Special by Matt Village" replaces Village Easy, and so we need 33 new AI paths. Or 11, if we take 3 of each (3 x 11 = 33).

Special tracks #4: Good idea. I'll think about it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by michael.tk (Post 11437888)

It crashed on your computer because you added some unavailable objects (numbers) manually, via text editor. So it was not a fault of the game.

No, that's wrong ! I have created my test_map using only and exclusively the ingame editor. No third party software have been used. The game is 100% faulty !

Quote:

Originally Posted by xinfe (Post 11437923)

No, that's wrong ! I have created my test_map using only and exclusively the ingame editor.

There was a fault in your Supreme Editor file \Data\Levels\Alpine\Tracks\Easy\Object_Data.txt:

Fence {

name = "Unnamed fence";

material_flags = 1;

height = 1;

width = 1;

depth = 1;

height_random_multiplier = 0;

width_random_multiplier = 0;

depth_random_multiplier = 0;

location_offset = {0,0,0};

trimesh_idx_list = "51,52,53,54,55,56,57,58,59,60,61,62,63,64,65,66,67, 68,69,70,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,2,";

transparent = 0;

safety_spline = 0;

control_points = {

{306.393,0,2615.69},

{312.763,0,2612.75},

{324.213,0,2610.5},

{384.452,-28.3353,2607.88},

{444.035,-2.60425,2581.9},

{511.38,0,2590.63},

{564.821,52.403,2600.7}

};

};

The numbers above in red caused the crashes. I had to remove the numbers, because I did not want to use a new Object_Classes.txt. Because the people have either the original Object_Classes.txt, or the Object_Classes.txt from the Add-on and Special Tracks installer.

I said: You created this line "51,52,53,54,55,56,57,58 ... " manually, outside of the game.

You said: You made it with the Supreme Editor.

Who is right and who is wrong? Perhaps you can show me how you can create this line with the Supreme Editor. In this case I would think about changing the file Object_Classes.txt.

AJA E > Edit fence > Keypad

Here, you can type values, corresponding to different meshs and textures. You can type 54, 2432 or even nothing. The game crashes for broken links but not inexistant ones.

Quote:

Originally Posted by xinfe (Post 11438570)

AJA E > Edit fence > Keypad

Here, you can type values, corresponding to different meshs and textures. You can type 54, 2432 or even nothing. The game crashes for broken links but not inexistant ones.

My game crashes immediately if I change the fence to one of the numbers 53, 54, 55.

Did you do it manually?

Tomorrow there will be a new, improved version of "Special Village by Matt".

I have tried each idx. For every crash, I have fixed the Objects_Classes, so there are far less risks of crashes when editing a track (and loosing unsaved work)

(EDIT:Pages 28-31 are saved on my site)

Quote:

Originally Posted by xinfe (Post 11438821)

I have tried each idx. For every crash, I have fixed the Objects_Classes, so there are far less risks of crashes when editing a track (and loosing unsaved work)

But my question was: Did you add the numbers 53, 54, 55 manually to the Object_Data.txt?

Again: Don't change the file Object_Classes.txt. Try to make it simple and based on the existing Object_Classes.txt, because this is what the people have. Don't offer big packages with lots of changed files - nobody can understand what you are doing. I already had to invest many hours to understand YOU, while I still do not understand the Supreme Editor.

You tried to add the objects 53, 54, 55 to your test track, which is not possible by default. Accept that these numbers are not available due to a bug of the game or to whatever, and that you don't have to change the file Object_Classes.txt. Others install the original game, and perhaps the Add-on, or perhaps not, and then they want to start. To make new tracks you need a) the original game and b) a good manual, but not a package with a lot of new files.

Special by Matt Village

I offer an improved version of "Special by Matt Village" at http://ssb.bplaced.net/update.htm

The changed files are Object_Data.txt and height_delta.bin.

The most important changes/bug-fixes are:

- safety splines!

- one area in the middle of the track changed completely (before this area was a Mogul Slope)

Minor changes:

- several objects improved, moved, deleted, added

- reduced size of all orange fences (50 %)

I have also added a Guide Rider, but still have to add AI Paths.

Also new: Map.tga by Xinfe, color change by myself.

Later I will make an installer, but we are still far away from a new installer. I expect some more major and minor changes in this track. And so we still don't have to compete for best times, because before the track has to be finished. Today I would say it is 98 percent finished.

Quote:

Originally Posted by michael.tk (Post 11439500)

But my question was: Did you add the numbers 53, 54, 55 manually to the Object_Data.txt?

No, I have used exclusively the aja editor. For each crash, I have manually fixed the right file. For there idx, it was Object_Classes

Again: Don't change the file Object_Classes.txt. Try to make it simple and based on the existing Object_Classes.txt, because this is what the people have. Don't offer big packages with lots of changed files - nobody can understand what you are doing. I already had to invest many hours to understand YOU, while I still do not understand the Supreme Editor.

When designing a track, you are looking for the right fence. So, you have to try every single idx, and also wrong ones, making you loose your work. I just have disabled this source or crashes.

Also, do you have to understand the ssee internals ? It's intended to a be special version developed to reduce the risks of crashes. It does.

You tried to add the objects 53, 54, 55 to your test track, which is not possible by default. Accept that these numbers are not available due to a bug of the game or to whatever, and that you don't have to change the file Object_Classes.txt. Others install the original game, and perhaps the Add-on, or perhaps not, and then they want to start. To make new tracks you need a) the original game and b) a good manual, but not a package with a lot of new files.

Why don't you simply include my fix ? It will prevent crashes for everyone. On a finished track, unlinked idx shouldn't be used because it loads the idx=1. Using idx=53 will do the same thing as idx=1 or even idx=(null).

My test track tries to crash the game. If the game don't crashes, it's great. If it crashes, it's a risk of loosing work. It has happened often when editing tracks, so I have fixed that.

If someone install Xinfe-duo with the original game, it will crash for several reasons : unknown banners and railroad_bridge. So you already provide a modified Object_Classes. Why don't you provide a newer version. You just need it once : in the addon. Also, I don't understand why your special tracks installer replace Supreme.exe each time : the addon has already changed it.

See quote.

EDIT:On the track I'm building, I will NOT include splines : it's a way to increase the reality. You will be free to do whatever you want. So, mk, please don't add ones when I will release it.

Thanks

Hey Guys,

I bring ideas to the table:

To Xinfe:

In the folder where the fence meshes are saved, can't you just copy one of them and rename the 53? If not, most of the track makers are aware of this, and crashes are unlikely if you avoid this situation. Basically, save before you change meshes, it hasn't been an issue for myself, and I'm amateur.

To Michael,

A while ago Oleg mentioned making a #4 special track installer. If you make an add-on that puts the track in Data/levels/SPECIAL/Village by Matt and change the recourse file, we should be right, after all, we are the only ones using this, and if anyone wants the full thing they can download it from your site.

Also, with the demo, the demo replays are read from Data/levels/alpine/tracks/easy, what if when you install the objects, it adds all of the special tracks to Data/levels/SPECIAL/Village by Matt and the Demo Replay read location from this area too, so we don't have to keep swapping around replays in Alpine Easy location.

Concerning my Village special track:

When you've finished, I have a couple of things to do with the track, objects, landscape and to fix and that ice thing, I THINK I know how to change it, I did it once before. So when you guys have finished your editing, or now if you've stopped, could I change the track around then run it through you?

Concerning my NEW 'Survivor' special track:

My track is no where near finished, but I'm willing for beta-testers for feedback. I have configured most of the safety splines, AI paths need re-doing but that's something for the end and objects need to be moved around and added. So if anyone wants to try my beta special track, download it here

Just looking for feedback, not finished product.

Thanks Guys :D

Re:

To Xinfe: Whatever I add to for example the Add-on, I have to understand it before. But I don't understand what you are doing. By the way: Bold text in your quotes is hard to read.

We have not decided so far if there will be a new Special tracks installer. But I will never publish a track without safety splines (error-free, of course), that's for sure.

To all: So far I made all safety splines for all Special tracks. Hard work!

There is an new, simple installer "Forest Air by DeJogg" on my updates pages:

http://ssb.bplaced.net/update.htm

You cannot do anything wrong with the installer. "Forest Air by DeJogg" replaces the original Forest Air. If you want to see the content before you install it, extract to C:\TEMP or whatever.

I will also make an installer for "Practice by DeJogg", it should be available later this day.

Hi Matt,

your Rapidshare link is a link to delete the file. Shall I delete it?

Your track "Special by Matt Village version August 23, 2009" is now on my updates page http://ssb.bplaced.net/update.htm. Do you think it is not yet finished? Then you can take it now to change it. And I will wait for your changes.

Quote:

Originally Posted by michael.tk (Post 11440511)

"Forest Air by DeJogg"

Is this going to be a point competition? It is an idea...

Quote:

Originally Posted by michael.tk (Post 11440524)

your Rapidshare link is a link to delete the file. Shall I delete it?

Sorry Michael,

The REAL link is here

Quote:

Originally Posted by michael.tk (Post 11440524)

Your track "Special by Matt Village version August 23, 2009" is now on my updates page http://ssb.bplaced.net/update.htm. Do you think it is not yet finished? Then you can take it now to change it. And I will wait for your changes.

Ok, I'll take a quick look at it now, I'll get back to you in 2-3 days with the finished product, if editing is necessary.

Quote:

Originally Posted by michael.tk (Post 11440511)

Whatever I add to for example the Add-on, I have to understand it before. But I don't understand what you are doing.

[...]

To all: So far I made all safety splines for all Special tracks. Hard work!

There is nothing hard to understand : I have simply removed the wrong idx from Object_Classes.txt

I don't see why splines must be present. It's sure they are useful for tracks with gaps or so on, but a fully ridable track obviously don't needs it.

Also, I don't know how you create splines, but it's probably the fastest thing to do, about 5-15min for a whole track.

Quote:

Originally Posted by xinfe (Post 11440557)

There is nothing hard to understand : I have simply removed the wrong idx from Object_Classes.txt.

You deleted them from Object_Classes.txt (which looks totally different now, so I cannot see and check the changes) and then added them to the Object_Data.txt? I still understand what you are doing, and why.

Quote:

Originally Posted by xinfe (Post 11440557)

I don't see why splines must be present. It's sure they are useful for tracks with gaps or so on, but a fully ridable track obviously don't needs it.

Also, I don't know how you create splines, but it's probably the fastest thing to do, about 5-15min for a whole track.

Of course they have to be present, because you can fall. And you could also fall into holes or off the track. So you need the safety splines which put you back on the right route.

And that's what I do before I post a track. It is necessary and part of my quality control.

I needed half a day to make the safety spline for "Special by Matt Village" and 2 hours for "Practice by DeJogg". It is a time-intensive procedure, because I have to simulate falls on every part of the track.

Quote:

Originally Posted by xinfe (Post 11440557)

I don't know how you create splines, but it's probably the fastest thing to do, about 5-15min for a whole track.

My time to shine! I know how to do this!

Create a fence

Edit it

Set it down the middle of a route on your track (this is when you crash you will come up there)

Press F8 when finished setting the fence, it will turn invisible

This is in the case of a fall, the player will begin on that fence.

It doesn't take 5-15min, you should be able to do it under that time.

A suggestion:

If you have a jump, make two safety splines on either side so the player doesn't get a nasty shock and find themselves in a middle of a valley that is impossible to get out of!

If your good enough you can try recording AI paths... you'll have to get Michael to teach you that, I know the basics but not all.

Delete contents of Levels/Your Track/AI Paths without deleting Summary

Enter Supreme Snowbaording

Type aja

Press F8 at any stage in Time Attack

Depending on the track, you should do however many runs necessary to cover all the routs, in race this is the path the other players will follow.

After this you will notice the file that contains all of the AI replays will be full of your replays you had done.

NOTE:

You will have to exit the game to stop AI Record Mode.

EDIT:

My special track has changed locations to here due to an error

Hope this helps

I don't want to appear as the "self-declared great master", but I have created Xinfe-duo alone : it's 99% my work, from the first rock to the latest spline and AI path.

mk has just changed the positioning of some objects near the finish of the path #1

I have said 5-15 minutes because I have to check as mk said :

Quote:

I have to simulate falls on every tricky part of the track.

Matt, if you check carefully my tracks, you will notice that my splines already take care of your suggestion : I have created 2 fences before and after a jump, so you aren't blocked somewhere.

To mk:To sumarize my work, when I have created my test map, I have used every single resource available in the aja editor. For each crash, I have fixed the right files. As a result, you will find a more reliable editor, even with wrong references.

If you want to check the changes between two text files, you can use jEdit with the jDiff plugin (cross-platform) : it highlights differences (modifications, additions or removals).

Quote:

Originally Posted by xinfe (Post 11440586)

Matt, if you check carefully my tracks, you will notice that my splines already take care of your suggestion

One problem. I don't have your track...

Could you email it to me@mattmail.tk?

I'll take a quick look for any errors but by the sound of things, it's pretty good.

Quick Question:

I know I've asked this before, but I didn't understand, how do I make a map? I don't want to edit the .tga game file so is there some other way around it?

They are available in the Special Tracks Installer (under a obscure name) or in my tracks pack.

So you have 2 solutions : install the rights tracks by hand or find the right ones from mk's installer.

EDIT:For the map, I can't explain it in details. You have to create a new snow land texture, load your track, paint your new land material, save it. Remove the land material, edit the new tga file with The GIMP for example and finally rename it map.tga.

What are the names of all of your tracks according to the package?

I think they are called Special by Xinfe et Special 7 by Xinfe.

They are in Michael's installers anyway.

New Ideas to the table:

I really like what you did with the buttons on your 'Xinfe Package', it is really cool. I have done it myself. Michael, when you next make your installer, could you make the buttons included? I sent you my buttons myself, it really helps remember and Special Tracks are our very own anyway.

Also at mk:

Your Installer for Practice by Dejogg is down, an error pops up, but the others are fine.

I don't really understand what do you mean :

Quote:

I really like what you did with the buttons on your 'Xinfe Package', it is really cool

Quote:

Originally Posted by xinfe (Post 11442649)

I don't really understand what do you mean

When you are choosing a track, you have a choice of Environment and Level, on that level there is a picture, a custom one created by you and is really cool, so as I said before, we should include that in the installers. :D

EDIT:

An update for my Special Village track is available. It is at Special by Matt. Enjoy!

Another EDIT:

The Final update for Survivor by Matt is up for grabs, I will have completely finished off the track by the weekend if not before.

Final EDIT:

Special Village by Matt is also up for grabs, it is the last update and I'm awaiting confirmation from mk, but it's soon to be an official Special Track. Any last feedback or possible ideas?

mattslee.tk

Re:

Quote:

Originally Posted by mattrocks_slee (Post 11442546)

Michael, when you next make your installer, could you make the buttons included?

Sorry, no. But you can do what you want. :-)

Quote:

Originally Posted by mattrocks_slee (Post 11442546)

Your Installer for Practice by Dejogg is down, an error pops up, but the others are fine.

Right. The fault was blanks in the file name. I had to replace the blanks with _, now you can try again:

http://ssb.bplaced.net/update.htm

Quote:

Originally Posted by mattrocks_slee (Post 11442654)

Special Village by Matt is also up for grabs, it is the last update and I'm awaiting confirmation from mk, but it's soon to be an official Special Track. Any last feedback or possible ideas?

Matt, your Village track is quite okay. But the clipping errors are very disturbing!

But I found a solution:

- change the material_binary_map parameter in the file Resource_Config.txt:

material_binary_map = "Data/Levels/Village/Tracks/Easy/Material_Map.bin";

- delete the 4 files Material_Map.bin* in the folder Matt_Village

So, the damaged Material_Map.bin* files are the reason for the clipping errors. With the Material_Map.bin* files from the original Village Easy I saw no difference on the track, except the missing clipping errors! Without the clipping errors it is going to be a nice track for the Special tracks #4 installer.

But I still miss some tracks for the Special tracks #4 installer. Here is a list of today:

Alpine tracks: Practice by DeJogg / ? / ?

Forest tracks: Rooftops by DeJogg / ? / Mogul Slope (the original, very difficult)

Village tracks: Village by Matt / Survivor by Matt / ?

I am a fan of the three high-speed tracks, especially of the two high-speed tracks from Xinfe. What about one or two more high-speed tracks?

Quote:

Originally Posted by michael.tk (Post 11444098)

Sorry, no. But you can do what you want. :-)

Ok, If anyone else wants them I'll pass across the files, I will have finished most by the end of the month

Quote:

Originally Posted by michael.tk (Post 11444098)

Right. The fault was blanks in the file name. I had to replace the blanks with _, now you can try again:

Nope, still nothing, can you email me the file?

Quote:

Originally Posted by michael.tk (Post 11444098)

Matt, your Village track is quite okay. But the clipping errors are very disturbing!

But I found a solution

Without the clipping errors it is going to be a nice track for the Special tracks #4 installer.

Awesome.

Quote:

Originally Posted by michael.tk (Post 11444098)

But I still miss some tracks for the Special tracks #4 installer. Here is a list of today:

Alpine tracks: Practice by DeJogg / ? / ?

Forest tracks: Rooftops by DeJogg / ? / Mogul Slope (the original, very difficult)

Village tracks: Village by Matt / Survivor by Matt / ?

What about Forest Easy v2 and Alpine Easy v2?

Quote:

Originally Posted by michael.tk (Post 11444098)

I am a fan of the three high-speed tracks, especially of the two high-speed tracks from Xinfe. What about one or two more high-speed tracks?

I'll see what I can do, no promises, I need to beat Dom's new found record first! (he told me not to tell you anything, so I'll tell you MY time when I beat it).

Survivor by Matt is inches (should be centimetres) away from being finished, I just need the final touches, thanks to Michael for the feedback! :up:

Have fun!

Quote:

Originally Posted by mattrocks_slee (Post 11445321)

Ok, If anyone else wants them I'll pass across the files, I will have finished most by the end of the month.

I won't use any modified Menu_Texture_Normal.tga and Menu_Texture_Down.tga for my installers. It is not possible to make these tga files looking like original, and they are not important for me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mattrocks_slee (Post 11445321)

Nope, still nothing, can you email me the file?

Usually I check my links. Don't know why I did not notice that the link was still wrong. Tip: If a link is wrong, you also look here.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mattrocks_slee (Post 11445321)

What about Forest Easy v2 and Alpine Easy v2?

Alpine Easy v2: Nope. Not this horrible track. And I picked Practice by DeJogg for the position of Alpine Easy. Forest Easy v2 is too similar to Forest Snowboard Park, but I have an idea: A track combining DeJogg's Forest Easy track (so called "Rooftops by DeJogg") with Forest Easy v2. Wait for the the result, I will post it on my updates page later today.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mattrocks_slee (Post 11445321)

I need to beat Dom's new found record first!

You don't allow Dom to be faster on any track? :-)

Quote:

Originally Posted by mattrocks_slee (Post 11445321)

Survivor by Matt is inches (should be centimetres) away from being finished, I just need the final touches

I have some time only today, then I'll be back in 10 or 14 days.

Quote:

Originally Posted by michael.tk (Post 11445425)

I won't use any modified Menu_Texture_Normal.tga and Menu_Texture_Down.tga for my installers. It is not possible to make these tga files looking like original, and they are not important for me.

Ok, fair point. Oleg or Xinfe, do you know how to make installers? If one of you were interested I would be willing to spare some precious time making these .tga files. Otherwise, can someone tell me how to make an installer? Do I need a program of some sort?

Quote:

Originally Posted by michael.tk (Post 11445425)

Usually I check my links. Don't know why I did not notice that the link was still wrong. Tip: If a link is wrong, you also look here.

Yes, it doesn't exist, it might be because it is blocked in my area or something weird like that. Now can you email me?

Quote:

Originally Posted by michael.tk (Post 11445425)

Alpine Easy v2: Nope.

Fair point, I haven't tried it myself.

Quote:

Originally Posted by michael.tk (Post 11445425)

You don't allow Dom to be faster on any track? :-)

Nope, it is my responsibility as an older brother.

Quote:

Originally Posted by michael.tk (Post 11445425)

I have some time only today, then I'll be back in 10 or 14 days.

Ok, I won't be able to finish it by the end of today, I have my head buried in homework. By the weekend it will be finished, so I'll give Oleg and anyone else a head start!