interviews_borknagar

Music Interview: BORKNAGAR

BORKNAGAR

English Version:

BORKNAGAR

- Exclusive interview with BORKNAGAR

by Demogorgon with Jens Fredrik Ryland

Done in Jan. 2001

Published on the 5th issue of Extreme Music Magazine

1. When you first got into the band, did you have a pre-determined sound you wanted? Or did it just follow the last one?

-My entry was somewhat special; I was supposed to only be session for liveplaying. But the tour in -98 with In Flames worked so well that I was invited to be a permanent member. But I was (still am) focusing on the administrative part of the band that was turning into such a big job that Osten couldn't handle both that and the songwriting. I entered as playing manager to use a footbal- term! Anyway, by entering this band I forced my way into a music- scene I was not quite a part of. Osten was already a veteran and I still think the way he works on the songs as so good and professional that I haven't found it necessary to interfere. Of course I had a picture of what The Archaic Course would sound like when we entered Woodhouse, but I was mostly focused on the guitar. We talked a lot about this before the recording and the meaning was always to continue the path the two first ones started. You might say I had a pre- determined sound- feeling based on the already presented sound.

2. After reading all your available interviews, I notice that praise Nature and the desire to keep harmony with it is always one of the band's main topics. Like many musicians, if I am not completely wrong, nature is always the strongest thing. But is this so-called "Nature" the whole world? Personally I do not like each and every parts of nature; not all of them fit one person's inner world. Maybe one cannot go against it, for when he or she goes against it, it is a part of nature too... Is BORKNAGAR's nature only BORKNAGAR's nature if you know what I mean? Do you agree that everything existing has its own reason to exist? By this means, I do consider nature the only cause of my tragedy life. As a human (despite how much I do not want), I cannot stand to be completely controlled by this ubiquitous and almighty deity. What's your opinion about some "unnatural" music, such as... ABRUPTUM?

-Borknagar nature is mainly the Norwegian nature, the surrounding that each and every one of us grew up in. That means that it's different for each of us since we grew up in different places in Norway. It is so because the nature influences people and Borknagar can't make music about a desert when we have hardly seen a desert.

I am a great fan of nature- laws. I find much arround me a cause of coincidens, but I agree that when something exist it than has it's own reason.

Abruptum is not known to me!

3. Please tell me which non-metal music categories you like the most, since Extreme Music #3 will feature THE YOUNG GODS as well, I would like to know your opinion about their new album, The Second Nature. Does it have something the same with Brun's imagination? I think their philosophy much similar to the conception of one Chinese ancient thinker Zhuang Zi and the five elements of Chinese philosophies of nature.

-Sadly I'm not familiar with The Young Gods either, can't help with that. I do like to state out that I'm not a metal- fanatic. I listen to straight pop- music also, but only on the radio. I buy only metal!

4. A long journey to a noble palace, high and mighty alone and you command the winds and storms. Can I describe BORKNAGAR's music so?

-Yes, I like that. We have always been called Epic, and Majestic is a word we use internaly when we discuss music. We call Hammerfall and Helloween Knight- metal, which is a negative term.

5. To me, there are some parts can bring me to the battlefield or take part in the sea raids, although this feeling is not very clear. Could you tell me when you participate in creating the songs, what's your the initial idea? Have BORKNAGAR drawn influences from some US bands, such as MANOWAR?

-I see Manowar as a 80's battle- metal, today there is Marduk and Enslaved. Borknagar is not battle- metal. Though a true epic band must fare through battle to undermine the dynamics, Borknagar's music takes you out of there as soon as it starts.

A picture that can easily be conected with almost every part of our music is  the granduosity of the Norwegian nature, the majestic mountains, vast forests and neverending thundra. I think the parts that you connect to battle, I connect to a raging storm that makes you take shelter somewhere safe.

6. I think there are many different viewpoints about Electronic and doing concert between BORKNAGAR and ARCTURUS, although both two bands are deeming nature to be awesome. Can you explain it in a little more detail? Beside this, there are both many line-up change in you two bands, how do the band deal with it?

-Arcturus has never playd live, so it's hard to say really. The connection between Arcturus and Borky is based on Garm and Vortex that contribute both places and the similarity in basic ideologi, but I really don't find these bands so similar. Two very different ways to present a similar idea!

About the lineup- problems: In borknagar we are so used to this, it's more annoying than dissapointing. We work now with the fourth drummer, the fourth bassplayer  and so on. At this point everything is so proffessionaly coordinated that it actually looses some of the fun that I remember from the days when the band was also my closest friends. Than it gains it back when we make musical progression in a tempo that is almost unbelieveing.

7. There are many idiots who consider all Norsemen who deal with Thor hammer as Nazi, can you tell me your idea about those non-musical activities?

-Splitting with the stately religion and presenting a heden religion is looked upon as very nationalistic, I think everywhere. It doesn't help that the neo- nazi groups in Norway has adopted the heden symbols as a part of the -splitting-with-society- campain. If you are to join the true heden organizations in Norway you have to prove that you have no connection with nazi- groups. When it comes to Borknagar we are a non- political and non- religious band, if you ask me any question conserning such matters I only answer on personal basis! I don't even know what the other guys vote in the elections, I know non of them are religious (christian), but no more than that.

When it comes to this connection between nazism and Aasatru (Odin and his world) I think people should read more history before jumping the conclutions, based on the heden traditions I cannot see the conection at all! This is a problem we have faced several times in different agendas, and I have a impression that some people see all Norwegians as nazi/ fascist because of an arrogant attitude and protectionist gouvernment, too bad!

Going along with LAIBACH's claim, I do not consider that wipe Christian dogma out of China is as difficult as in other countries. But people here who are caught up with being normal and do not have their own minds are just the same. There are also many things we should do...

Chinese  Version:

怒涛掀起狂暴有力   飓风飞舞压制汪洋

雷霆电闪刺透苍穹   神圣权威无人可抗

BORKNAGAR

——BORKNAGAR独家专访

文/Demogorgon

    面前是排空的浊浪，翻腾裂岸，永不停息。立于山巅崖顶，即便是空气也已在恐惧中战栗着幻化为雪片纷飞，目力所及，唯见乌云群起，狂风怒号。不知从何处生成的雷电，举着它发光的矛尖，刺进愈发黑暗的天空中最为黑暗的未知一点；源自斯堪的那维亚极端金属界黑暗的中心，挪威史诗金属乐团BORKNAGAR轻而易举地将这种感觉注入我们心田。

    回到1995年，MOLESTED（受搅扰）在发表两张专辑后解散，吉它手Øystein Garnes Brun聚集起“全明星”的队型：主唱是ULVER和ARCTURUS的Garm；鼓手Grim从前在IMMORTAL，后来去了GORGOROTH和ANCIENT；键盘手是从前在ENSLAVED的Ivar Bjornson；贝司手则来自GORGOROTH的Infernus！首张同名作品发表于Malicious（恶毒）唱片公司，那时他们甚至还没有小样！然而，从连绵的吉它，怒涛般的鼓点，黑暗金属的刺耳尖叫和恢弘的键盘中的伟岸气势而推断出乐团的锦绣前程绝非难事——我们踏上战船，涉足海上突击。Century Media（世纪传媒）唱片公司推出了录制于“木屋”（Woodhouse）录音室的《过去的领土》（The Olden Domain），他们在延续发展乐团理念的同时拓宽了表现手法。BORKNAGAR脱离黑暗金属的决定就此做出，包括原声吉它和钢琴的紧凑器乐加之合唱皆为见证。紧接着就在那一瞬间，咆哮的群风使我们得以征服：《古老的路线》（The Archaic Course）直通一座辉煌的高空大殿。我们在殿前石阶上凝眸于光刃下现出的百万种不同形状的白石墙壁——皆由云彩造就，灰蓝之下，云海碧天。惆怅良久，莫名的使命感驱策我策马扬鞭，继续征程。

    这时，BORKNAGAR的主唱已经换成了Simen Hestnæs——在ARCTURUS的《地狱化装舞会》（La Masquerade Infernale）和DIMMU BORGIR中间都露过面的ICS Vortrex。同时到来的还有第二吉它手Jens Fredrik Ryland，他和Øystein的合作将《古老的路线》铺砌得更为辉煌，这也就是《吉它世界》（Guitar World）为BORKNAGAR和他们史诗一样的音乐专门撰写了一篇文章的原因。

    BORKNAGAR去年年初的第四张专辑《第五元素》（Quintessence）获得极大好评，Jens曾透露给我他加入乐团的过程，还有对Borknagar独特声音的想法。

    “我的加入过程有些特别，本来只打算做个现场表演的临时成员。但由于1998年和In Flames的巡演完成得很好，我被邀请成为一名固定成员。而我那时（现在也是如此）一直致力于乐团的管理部分，那时它正转变成为一项巨大艰深的工作，Øystein不可能同时掌管，因为它还有创作。于是我加入成为一支足球队的演出经理！不管怎样，加入这支乐团后，我迫使自己进入原先并不怎么熟悉、并不属于我的音乐界。Øystein已经是名老手，我至今依然觉得他创作歌曲的方法是那么合适而且熟练，我没有必要去妨碍他。当然在我们进入‘木屋’录音室时，我对《古老的路线》该是什么声音也有自己的构想，可我更关注于吉它。录音前我们就此谈论过许多。意义总在于继续最先开始的两条道路。你或者可以说我在已经呈现出的声音的基础上有一个预先定下的声音感觉。”

    是通向某处高贵殿堂的长途旅行，高高在上，神圣孤独，而你们却支配着群风和暴雨。我能否这样形容BORKNAGAR的音乐？你们是否也从MANOWAR的乐团身上吸收了影响？

    “是的，我喜欢这样的感觉。我们总是被称为史诗（金属），而我们在内部讨论音乐时会使用宏伟（Majestic）这个词。我们称HAMMERFALL和HELLOWEEN为骑士金属（Knight Metal），那是个否定性的称呼。”

    “我把MANOWAR看作八十年代的战斗金属（Battle Metal），今天那是MARDUK和ENSLAVED。BORKNAGAR不是战斗金属。尽管一支真正的史诗乐团历经战斗而摧毁王朝，但它一开始，BORKNAGAR的音乐就会很快地把你带出来。”

    “几乎能和我们音乐的每一部分都轻易联系上的是挪威无处不在的自然，伟岸的群山，绵延的森林与不息的雷鸣。你联系到战争的那些部分，也许我会联系到是一场让你寻找安全庇护所的肆虐风暴。”

    在通读过所有你们接受过的采访后，我注意到赞颂自然以及与其保持和谐的愿望总是乐团的主题之一。如果我没有彻底搞错的话，和许多音乐家的想法一样，自然是那最为强大的事物。但这所谓的“自然”是不是等同于整个世界？个人而言我并不喜欢自然的所有部分，因为它并不能够完全契合于个人的内心。当然一个人是不可以反对自然的，因为他（或她）对自然的反抗，依然是自然的一部分……我想每件事情的存在都有其存在的理由。如果你明白我的意思，BORKNAGAR的自然是否只是BORKNAGAR的自然？对一些“非自然”的音乐你有什么看法，就像……ABRUPTUM？

    “BORKNAGAR的自然主要是挪威的自然，我们之中每个人成长的环境。那意思是，我们并不一样，因为我们长在挪威的不同地方。自然必然要对人产生影响。所以BORKNAGAR不可能写出关于沙漠的音乐，因为我们尚未看到过沙漠。”

    “我对自然规律十分着迷。在我身边我常常能找到很多一致的原因，但我同意某样事物存在时有着自己的理由。”

    “至于ABRUPTUM，我不知道！”

    这样，乐团用四张专辑创造出的世界已经比现实更为迷人。严寒与冰霜，文化与传说都是维京人音乐理念的永恒来源。由于我的家乡是更北方的天津（银河渡口），或许对BORKNAGAR的自然我有几分灵犀；我也十分清楚冬天意味着什么，一个我喜欢的季节。

    如果是在斯堪的那维亚，冬季定是更为多雪漫长。严酷的冬夜，大雪纷飞，那些天生的战士与水手曾在火堆旁饮酒作乐，在变幻莫测的极光下用音乐助兴。他们忆旧怀故，歌唱自然。他们有自己的家园与生活，家族辉煌，祖先显赫。维京人虽然曾以黑暗金属在世界骤然获得了赫赫声名，但只有到了紧随其后民族性的维京金属后，才真正受到更为长久的关注——不单把歌唱主题从撒旦换成自己民族的神祗，他们还向作品里加入了更多的辉煌与荣耀。史诗一般高昂的基调、冻土一样庄严的结构在BORKNAGAR的史诗金属音乐中间愈演愈烈而渐至颠峰。《第五元素》能于去年跻身于年度十佳专辑中，绝非浪得虚名。看看这些现场照，金属得自然的阳刚之气一览无遗。Jens还多次和我提及是否有可能到中国巡回演出，“带乐团到大多数成员从没想过的地方去的感觉，真是振奋人心……我真的渴望面对人群展示给他们真正‘现场’的东西，没有人能翻版这个！！”关于这个，我们当然会尽全力帮忙，这不单单是我们的愿望，相信广大乐迷也定是渴望已久！金属现场可以等同于活力！

    但是，再多问一句。我觉得BORKNAGAR与ARCTURUS对于电子和现场演出的观点颇为不同，虽然两支乐团同样地敬畏自然。你能否解释得更清楚一些？而除此之外，你们两支乐团都发生过很多队型变动，通常是怎么应付的呢？

    “ARCTURUS从没做过现场演出，所以这个真的很难说。ARCTURUS和BORKNAGAR之间的联系，仅仅基于Garm和Vortex在各自位置上的贡献还有基本的近似，可我的确不觉得这两支乐团十分相近。他们只是用两种十分不同的方法表现一种近似的想法而已！”

    “关于队型问题：在BORKNAGAR里我们已经很习惯了，现在和我们合作的是第四任鼓手，第四任贝司手等等。一切都是那么熟悉而平等，但它实际上已丧失了我记忆里关于乐团，也是我最亲密的朋友们的一些乐趣。但随着我们取得音乐进展时它又重新获得了，这简直令人难以置信。”

    但音乐之外呢？由于在过去的年头里，挪威，甚至整个斯堪的那维亚都有那么多音乐以外的活动，最近似乎就有很多蠢人无知地把所有和Thor之锤有关的北欧人都视为纳粹。关于这个你有什么看法吗？

    “从国家宗教中分离出去而展示出一种异族宗教，看起来非常民族化，我想到处都是这样。挪威的新纳粹团体采用异教标志作为“从社会分离出去的斗争”的一部分，这并没有什么帮助，因为如果你想加入挪威真正的异教组织，你就得证明自己和纳粹团体毫无关系。牵涉到BORKNAGAR，我们是一支非政治、非宗教的乐团，如果你问到涉及此类的问题，我只能就个人观点回答！我甚至不知道其他成员在选举中的投票，我只知道他们中间是没人有宗教信仰（基督教）的。”

    “而关于纳粹主义和Aasatru（Odin和他的世界）的关系，我想人们该在跳出来下结论前多读一点历史，基于异教传统我压根儿看不到联系！这是一个我面临过多次的问题，我就有了个印象，某些人把所有挪威人看作纳粹法西斯，全是因为傲慢的态度和贸易保护的政府，真是太糟了！”

    是的，只因为流淌在他们身上的是不可更改的维京血统——而如果一个中国人赞美自己的民族，是无论如何都沾不上纳粹的边儿的。处在弱势的，或是曾经处在弱势的，至少是看起来处在弱势的群体，赞美自己的民族怎么都不会受到重视；而处在强势的却总是引人注目。对这样的事我不知道该说些什么……斯堪的那维亚又是那么盛产“个人主义”，除了形式以外，基督教在那里的职能也被极大地削弱了——即便在一向标榜“自由”，“独立”的美国人看来也难以接受，甚至有时用“大逆不道”来加以形容！似乎BORKNAGAR这个名字也有很深的特别含义？对它无尽无休的猜测简直随处可见。

    “关于名字：Øystein曾经这样解释，他和他父亲在苏格兰渡假时穿过了一座湖，它曾经有个名字，他采用了那个名字而稍作变化，使其听起来更像古体的挪威语。挪威语里后缀‘-gar’意思是农场，在现代写作‘-gard’。因此很多人就推测BORKNAGAR（Borkna-农场）就是同名专辑封面上的那个，是挪威群山中一个神秘的小农场。然而并不是！Øystein一直说之所以使用一个臆造词汇（Borkna在挪威语中没有意思），是想在读者或听者中间创造出一种反作用，一旦他们听到这个名字却不能把它和任何东西联系起来，就必须自己制造出关于它的图画！相同的主意还用在制作《古老的路线》的封套上：Øystein照下一棵树，扫描后歪曲扭转直到你几乎看不出它是什么。因此，人们使用他们自己的想象力‘看到’了各种各样的东西。而很多人觉得它看起来像一条龙！”

    是的！非常像——虽然我见过的龙也只是在图画上。

    “在很多方面这就是BORKNAGAR整个音乐的基本主张：文本看起来也算不上明白，它们描绘的图画对每个听者都不相同。这音乐激发听者使用他（或她）的想象力而塑造出和他们自己的想法有关的东西。我们希望能让人们如此，而不是总觉得‘这应该意味着什么’！！”

    一个十分精彩的主意，只是我们翻译这个名字是个很大的难题——音译是唯一的办法……

    4月份，Jens刚刚成功地运作了“地狱”（Infernal）音乐节——向世人展现挪威新一代乐团的整体风貌；BORKNAGAR也开始录制新专辑。它会一如既往地保持“宏伟庄重”的风格，充满源源不断的的活力与能量，我对此深信不疑。因为有一个问题虽然我只问了Jens，相信乐团任何其他成员的回答也应该基于相同的核心：

    除开金属，你还喜欢什么音乐类型？

    “我要声明自己并非一个金属狂热者。我也听直接的流行音乐，但只是在电台里面。我只买金属！”

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