Embedded Files
Johnson/Johnston Y-DNA Project - Olive Group
The Olive Group is part of the Johnson Project at Family Tree DNA
It is now listed as "Hap`group R1b-Family ZZE (Olive)"
FamilyTreeDNA - Johnson/Johnston/Johnstone DNA Test Results
The Group's Modal Results:
R-M269 13 24 15 10 12-14 12 12 12 14 13 30 17 09-10 11 11 25 14 20 30 12-16-17-17 10 11 19-23 16 14 18 18 36-36 11 12 11 09 15-16
Kit # (number) - (# markers) * Number of mutations FF indicates FamilyFinder Results
Big Y - Terminal SNP: R-FT65340
Olive Group Members & Detailed Lines of Descent
Early Virginia
Benjamin Johnson and his wife Margery along with John Johnson and his wife Elizabeth (Massie?) all first appeared in the Henrico Monthly Meeting in 1721/1722. They were neighbors and their family members attended the marriages and other events for the other family. It is likely that they were either siblings or very close cousins.
John Johnson married Elizabeth Massie
Benjamin Johnson that married Mary Moorman is their son
James "Seneca" Johnson that married Millie Moorman in 1779 is the son of their son James Johnson & Lucy M.
Unattached Lines
Comments & Corrections please contact me at jeffbockman@gmail.com
HELP WANTED
Looking for Y-DNA test results of additional descendants of Benjamin Johnson and Margery
I am trying to correct some of the publications & claims of Lorand Johnson.
While they are not part of Olive Group I would like to know of any kits that are the descendants of
William Johnson & Sarah Massie
Benjamin Johnson & Agnes Clark (son of Wm & Sarah)
Johnson Presidents
What is New
9 June 2023
It appears as if there was another John Johnson in St Peter's Parish, New Kent, VA. He had sons Robert, Thomas, and John. He was probably the contractor listed in the Vestry.
Wikitree entry John Johnson Sr. (abt.1680-aft.1736) | WikiTree FREE Family Tree appears to have them both intermingled. There would not be two sons names John unless the first one had died.
There are no known Y-DNA descendants from Robert or Thomas.
The Thomas that married Constantina may not have been the son of "our" John & Elizabeth. They were not the parents of Robert baptised 2 Apr 1708.
January 2023 - Status Report
The four proven lines in the group go back to John & Elizabeth and Benjamin & Margery. They were living in the part of New Kent that became Hanover.
I am looking to find their parents and where they came from. I am working on learning more about the Johnsons in Virginia in the mid to late 1600s and early 1700s.
Only one kit in the Olive Group has taken a Big-Y test. It shows that they came from eastern England a bit north of London. I am hoping to better understand how the locations are determined by the SNP Tracker SNP Tracker (scaledinnovation.com) before encouraging additional testing.
I am hoping to make some progress on the unattached members of the group.
It is frustrating looking at FamilySearch FamilyTree and WikiTree for these families since there is so much incorrect data that is still being repeated and treated as fact and merges make it almost impossible to correct them. I can only post links back to this site.
July 26, 2022
Kit # 983330 (37 markers) matched into the Olive Group. He is a descendant of Charles Johnson & Sarah Crew via their son Tarlton. Charles is a son of John Johnson & Elizabeth Massie. The matching Y-DNA does not disprove the claim.
Four of John's children were baptised including the son John. In the Quaker records it mentions Charles & his brother John. They both moved to Amelia co, VA.
March 26, 2022
I found connections to several 5th Cousins Once Removed of Jane Stevenson, a descendant of James "Seneca" and several daughters of James and Lucy at Ancestry Thrulines.
Mary married Edward Terrell - 6 connections: 21 cm, 18 cm, 13 cm + *
Agnes married James Candler: 35 cm and 28* cm.
Suzanna/Laurana married Micajah Clark: 12 cm, 11 cm, and 11 cm. *distant
Elizabeth married Zachariah Moorman: 17 cm *
*These lines have multiple paths of connections
January 24, 2022
Found an 1807 Power of Attorney from James Johnson in Campbell County, VA to his son Zachariah M Johnson to try and recover property from Micajah Johnson given to them by his father James Johnson of Louisa County, VA. [Campbell Co, Deed Book 8, pages 81 and 82]
This proves that James "Seneca" was the son of James and Lucy. He was very young when he married Millie but this document verifies the connection.
Olive Group Members & Lines of Descent Updated and moved to a separate page
December 31, 2021
A Y111-DNA kit was just ordered for the 2nd cousin of the Caskieben tester.
November 29, 2021
Virginia Personal Property Tax Records giveth
Campbell County Personal Property Tax records shows that James "Seneca" had 16 year old males to support the four lines found with DNA.
Louisa County Personal Property Tax record of 1786 shows that James & Lucy's sons Micajah was 21 (born abt 1765) and the June 1787 and May 1788 records show that James was 20. He was born between 28 May and 19 June 1767. He was not listed in the 1789 tax records.
September 29, 2021 - Connections Found
Louisa County, VA Deeds and Probate records and Quaker marriage records have helped to show that the Benjamin that married Mary Moorman is the brother of James that married Lucy Moorman and they are sons of John & Elizabeth.
August 2021 - New Website
Google discontinued their old "classic" website design, so the entire site had to be converted and edited. It forced or gave me the opportunity to make some major edits. A few things are for the better. It works on phones, tablets, and computers. Let me know if some links do not work or something does not make sense.
5 May 2021 - Lorand Johnson's Caskieben Connections Proven False
The 37 marker Y-DNA test (Kit #954415) for a verified descendant of the Caskieben Johnston line does not match with any of the descendants of the early Virginia Johnsons that Lorand V. Johnson claimed were descendants of that line in his various publications. This kit was upgraded to a Big Y.
The John that married Elizabeth was not the son of James the "Litster" Immigrant, the son of Thomas of Craig.
Read the full report
April 2001 - Kit # 951619 is a descendant of Benjamin Conrad Johnson
Benjamin was born in Surry, NC between 1827 and 1833. Lots of conflicting information. Could be a descendant of either John or Benjamin since both had descendants that moved to NC in that period.
Sept 2019 - Finding Connections
Ancestry's ThruLines has helped to show connections between the four sons of James Seneca and Millie Moorman. It has also connected four of the children of their son James.
There are also connections to other descendants of Zachariah Moorman and Henry Terrell.
Unfortunately the connections to some of the other Olive subgroups is impossible to tell if it is via the Johnson or Moorman side.
Participate in the Project:
If you are sure of your connection to the family - then take a test to verify it and help others.
Not sure where your family fits in - take a test and see what group you belong to
Help find direct male descents from your ancestor and encourage them to be tested.
Join the Project and then Order a Y-DNA kit from Family Tree DNA
OLIVE Group Members
Johnson Project page for a little history & Research Issues
Go to the Johnson DNA Project & Changing the Project Administrative privileges
Upgrade with a FamilyFinder Test
Transfer at-DNA from Ancestry, MyHeritage, or 23andme
Autosomal or at-DNA test results are helping to tie the various family groups together.
If you, a relative, or someone you know is descended from any of the lines in the Olive Group please get tested or if already tested then transfer the results to FTDNA and then join the Johnson Project.
Order or Transfer Your at-DNA to FTDNA
These kits can also Join the Johnson DNA Project.
Many of the connections are through the Moorman family which is heavily intermarried with the Johnsons.
See the Moorman Family descendant chart. Not 100% guaranteed correct, but a start.
Understanding the Y-DNA Results
Mutation Happens - a change can occur between generations at any time. Slight differences between 5th or 6th cousins do not necessarily disprove a connection. Some markers mutate much slower than others. I have also learned about several mutations occurring between a father and his two sons.
Indiscretions Happened - The family tree may be correct but the actual father was not the husband.
The age and health of the father can also change the results if the children's births are years apart.
Within the Olive Group any differences in results appear to be more from random mutations rather than helping to define a specific line. Additional participants are needed and increasing the tests to 67 or 111 markers may eventually provide unique markers.
The majority of the mutations have occurred in the more rapidly changing markers. The results so far have not proven or disproven any of the researched or claimed lines. (10/28/17)
This just proves that research and Y-DNA need to be used together along with at-DNA to help verify relationships and help to determine the closeness.
Hopefully using a combination of Y-DNA testing and the numerous research resources that are now available a more accurate family tree can eventually be constructed.
Research Comments
Questionable Johnson History
Many of the participants are claiming descent from the family written about in 1972 by Lorand V. Johnson in "The Ancestry of William and John Johnson."
Please Review the Discussion on Dr. Lorand V. Johnson & his Caskieben claims
Hopefully using a combination of Y-DNA testing and the research resources that are now available a more accurate family tree can be constructed.
Within the Olive Group any differences in results appear to be more from random mutations rather than helping to define a specific line. Additional participants are needed and increasing the tests to 67 or 111 markers may eventually provide unique markers.
The majority of the mutations have occurred in the more rapidly changing markers. The results so far have not proven or disproven any of the researched or claimed lines. (10/28/17)
Research Articles
Discussion of James "Seneca" and James "Gov" - Jeff Bockman
Johnson Reports - interesting discussions
2002 New Findings in Johnson Family Research - Suzanne Johnson
Page updated
Google Sites
Report abuse