Henke 2022ks

Additional Comments on Miracles and Natural and Human Behaviors Not Being Fully Predictable

Kevin R. Henke

November 16, 2022

In Henke (2022ga) and Henke (2022kr), I discussed how natural and human behavior were not easily predictable. There are simply too many possibilities interacting with each other in complex ways. This is why meteorologists have difficulty predicting the weather beyond two or three days or so in many places in the world. Now, this is what I said in Henke (2022ga):

“Lundahl (2022q) then proceeds to Henke (2022z), which is entitled: “The Bible Claims that with Jesus Around, Nature was Unpredictable.” Lundahl (2022q) responds by simply stating:

“Nature wasn't unpredictable. Miraculous events were. Nature was the routine between them, just as it is the routine between any other unpredicted events now. We never, ever, predict all of our existence. We never, ever, predict all events. A few months ago, Ukraine was not predicted capable of pushing Russia back.”

What I was saying is that with Jesus around, supposedly his companions could never know when a miracle might interrupt the natural status quo. Simple events in nature, such as calculating the speed of a rock falling to the ground, certainly can be done with the laws of physics. However, nature and human activities are often too complex to fully predict. There are too many variables. This is why meteorologists have difficulty predicting the weather in many parts of the world beyond a couple of days or why the best experts back in February 2022 failed to predict how Ukraine has survived the Russian onslaught. Nevertheless, there’s no evidence that anything miraculous is occurring in nature or in human activities. If miracles occur, they would certainly be unpredictable because they would, by my and most people’s definitions (Henke 2022a), violate the laws of chemistry and physics. You can’t use F=ma to describe a miracle, but the equation works fine for a rocket launch.” [my emphasis]

Lundahl (2022w) then comments on my bolded statements, which are followed by my additional comments:

“Henke (2022ga): ‘What I was saying is that with Jesus around, supposedly his companions could never know when a miracle might interrupt the natural status quo.’

Lundahl (2022w): ‘The only status quo they would be dealing with is the one of habits. Miracles would be like other surprises - things that break the habitual.’

Natural and human activities certainly are often unpredictable without any miracles being involved. However, miracles, if they occur, would be something far more than just another “surprise.” To be identified as such, miracles would need to go far beyond the variations that we would normally see with natural and human behaviors. In August, we might expect sunshine and heat in Paris, France, or perhaps rain. However, we would not expect three meters of snow. If it snowed in Paris, France in August that would be highly unusual and something far more than just “breaking the habitual.” In summary, I am saying that if Jesus had actually performed miracles and if the apostles knew that, then the apostles rationally could not expect the normal natural status quo to occur from one moment to the next as long as Jesus was on Earth.

Henke (2022ga): ‘However, nature and human activities are often too complex to fully predict. There are too many variables.’

Lundahl (2022w): ‘Natural and human events are simply not predictable. Some are very predictably there as to their kind, like spring or like Pharisees sneering at Our Lord with faked problems submitted (I'm taking the routine they were experiencing), but that doesn't predict where you will see the next flower or what the next problem of a Pharisee would be or when a Pharisee would break the routine by asking for a miracle.’

Here, I basically agree with Mr. Lundahl. Some broad processes, like the cycling of the seasons, are pretty predictable. Again, we don’t expect snow in Paris, France, in August. However, how humans might behave in a given circumstance is often far more difficult to predict. As for what the 1^st century AD Pharisees may or may not have done, we can’t trust the Gospels to provide a fair and balanced perspective of who the Pharisees actually were and how they might have interacted with Jesus.

Henke (2022ga): ‘You can’t use F=ma to describe a miracle, but the equation works fine for a rocket launch.’

Lundahl (2022w): ‘F=ma does not tell you whether a rocket will have been launched from Göbekli Tepe by Nimrod or from Cape Canaveral by President Kennedy. It only describes one of the factors involved in the rocket launch and at that one overridden by other factors. Precisely as when it is overridden miraculously too.’”

Certainly, like any natural law, F=ma would not apply in every circumstance. A force must be present for the law to apply. If Mr. Lundahl wants to claim that there are miraculously forces where F=ma would not apply, then again, he has the burden of evidence to demonstrate that. If miracles occur and if there are forces involved, then I might expect these forces to violate F=ma.