以下采访笔记由竹丽，可路和雷彩整理
The following content was transcribed by Julia, Chloe, and Cait
采访者：我们对您的家庭很感兴趣。您小时候，您父母做什么工作？您有兄弟姐妹吗？
Interviewer：We are very interested in learning about your family. When you were little, what did your parents do for work? Do you have any siblings?
沈蓓：中国是一个宗族社会。中国是对一个家庭的体系特别重视的一个国家。以家庭为单位是中国的特色。我这个家庭是很特别的。这个家庭有一个大的家庭。（给我们看他的家谱）由于年代久远和战乱等原因，我家这样完整的家谱能够流传下来的很少。我们的家谱是在皇宫里找到的。宫廷里找到的，留下来的。由于我的一个婶婶在北京图书馆工作，从那里找出来的。从这个家谱上，你们知不知道中国历史的周朝？我们家是周朝周文王的一个兄弟战争中，打仗胜利立下大功，所以给他一块地方封地，这个地方叫沈，家庭就姓沈。传到我，已经是一百零三代，从中国的历史看, 我觉得我这个家族很值得你们研究。我们家有两个最有名的人。一个叫沈括。是中国很少的著名的科学家。中国诗人，老子， 孔子，这些很多。但是中国科学家很少。这是说明一个问题。还有一个最有名的人叫沈万山，他是是中国最有名的商人。我们家在浙江的时期是专门做冶炼的。
我的祖父是中国第一批到国外留学的。一百多年前我的祖父就到比利时和, 法国留学，我的父亲和姑妈在美国麻省、康奈尔等名校留学。可以看出一个很大的特点, 代表了中国最早的工业的和现代的资本社会的萌芽。所以我们家成为中国最早具有科学民主思想的家庭, 和中国一般的的家庭很不一样。我的父亲是铁路工程师。我的大姑妈是一位非常有名的翻译家，是她最早的把《小妇人》和《金银岛》这些书翻译介绍到中国。我的爸爸的第二个姐姐是中国有名的科学家，她也是美国留学的。和居里夫人一样，都是著名的女性科学家。我的爸爸的第三个姐姐是著名的医生，她学习了妇女和儿童的医学知识，为没有钱的人看病。所以就是说他们都是中国不多的最早引进西方民主自由，科学思想的科学家。这是我们家的一个特点。
Shen Pei: China is known for its emphasis on the family system, making it a clan society. My family is particularly unique, as we possess a large family tree that was discovered in the palace and later found in a library by my cousin's wife. This genealogy reveals our connection to the Zhou Dynasty in Chinese history. Specifically, we are descendants of King Wen of Zhou's brother, who played a significant role in a major battle and was rewarded with land in a place called Shen, hence our family name. Over the course of 103 generations, this heritage has been passed down to me. When considering genealogy in the context of Chinese history, it is essential to acknowledge the significance of one's family background. I believe my family is worthy of research due to two notable individuals within our lineage. One is Shen Kuo, a renowned scientist in China, a rare distinction in a country known more for its poets like Lao Tzu and Confucius. The other is Shen Wanshan, the most famous businessman in China, particularly known for our family's involvement in smelting during our time in Zhejiang.
My grandfather was part of the first group of Chinese students to study abroad. Over a hundred years ago, my grandfather went to Belgium and France for his studies. My father and aunt studied at prestigious American universities such as Massachusetts and Cornell. This highlights a significant characteristic, representing the emergence of China's earliest industrial and modern capitalist society. As a result, our family became one of the earliest in China to embrace scientific and democratic ideologies, setting us apart from typical Chinese families. My father worked as a railway engineer. My eldest aunt is a highly renowned translator, credited with introducing books like "Little Women" and "Treasure Island" to China. My father's second sister is a famous scientist in China who also studied in the United States. Similar to Madame Curie, she is a renowned female scientist. My father's third sister is a renowned doctor who specialized in women's and children's medical care, providing treatment to those without financial means. Hence, they all represent a rare group of Chinese scientists who introduced Western democratic freedom and scientific ideas. This is a distinctive characteristic of our family.
采访者：您的原生家庭对您今天的艺术成就有什么样的影响？您可以举一个例子吗？
Interviewer：We heard that you experienced the war when you were little, what impact did this have on you and your family?
沈蓓：我是一个异类，因为我们家都是学科学的, 没有人搞艺术。我只能说我母亲对中国传统文化有很深的学问，她受过新的教育，是金陵女大毕业的。她年纪很轻就被地方派去参加不同地方的书法的比赛。她可以在一个墙上用笔写很大的字，还代表地方拿到了第一名的奖。所以他在中国文化方面给了我很深的影响。我很可惜的是并没有能够把她所有的东西都学到。但是我觉得主要的还是父母他们身上的品格对我的影响。像我父亲，在抗日战争中，三十八岁为国家牺牲自己的生命。所以他的那种精神，以及母亲的那个教养影响了我。这种东西都在很小的地方表现出来的。对一些事情的看法，待人处事的一种态度。这个方面有很多很多的细节。我想我的女儿，他们都会感受到。
我常常现在觉得年纪越大，回忆起来越感到他们的品德的高尚。比方说举个例子，这个跟我留到这儿直接有关系。我来的时候就是为了我的孙子出生了，我来了，所以我已经买好飞机票回去。然后这边迫切希望我留下，我很犹豫，最主要的就是我妈妈已经八十多岁了。母亲那么大了，应该在她身边伺候她，所以我心里很不能做决定。我就打一个电话给她，告诉她有这么一件事情。我妈妈在电话里，马上就说 “你的哥哥，你的弟弟都是非常的有才华，但是他们没有得到报效国家，报效人类的机会。今天有人需要你，那里需要你，你就应该待在那儿，不要想到我。” 这个回答，让我下了决心，而且成为以后巨大的动力，当我想到妈妈的这些话，什么困难都努力去克服。
Shen Pei: I am an outlier in my family, as everyone pursued studies in science, with no involvement in the arts. However, I must mention that my mother possesses profound knowledge of traditional Chinese culture. At a young age, she was selected by the local government to participate in calligraphy competitions in various locations. She had the ability to write large characters on walls with a brush and even won first prize. It is regrettable that I was unable to learn everything from her, but I believe that the most significant influence on me comes from the character of my parents. Similarly, my father, like many others during the Anti-Japanese War, made the ultimate sacrifice for our country at the age of thirty-eight. His selfless spirit and the values instilled by my mother have had a profound impact on me. These influences reveal themselves in subtle ways, shaping my perception of people and various aspects of life.
As I grow older, I increasingly appreciate the nobility and integrity of their character in retrospect. For example, I can recall a situation directly related to my decision to stay in the United States. For instance, when I was asked to come here, it was because the birth of my grandson, and I had already purchased a plane ticket to return home. However, at that time, I found myself facing a difficult decision. My mother, already in her eighties, needed me by her side, and I couldn't bear the thought of being away from her during her final years. I called her to discuss the situation, and without hesitation, she said, "Your brothers, your younger siblings, are all talented individuals, but they haven't had the opportunity to serve the country and humanity. Someone needs you today, and you should stay where you are needed. Don't worry about me." Her response solidified my determination and became a tremendous source of motivation. Whenever faced with difficulties, I think of her words and strive to overcome any obstacles in my path.
采访者：在您成长的过程中，您的父母给您提供了哪些有用的建议？
Interviewer：What impact did your family growing up have on your current art achievements? Can you give an example?
沈蓓：因为我父亲很早去世离开了，我只能以他的精神为榜样。那么我的母亲对我的影响更大。从具体来讲，我母亲对我的业务，这是我艺术和舞蹈的专业，她干涉的相当少。我们这个家是一个很开放和包容的家庭。基本的态度就是对方的努力非常的支持。你们好幸福，现在在大学。我是没读大学的，我十四岁开始从事舞蹈。相对于我们这个家庭，都是博士啊，留学啊。从这个角度来看起来，其实我妈妈也觉得遗憾。但是，她从来没有来干涉。她去世以后，收她的遗物的时候，从她天天在看的书里面，掉出来一张报纸，很旧的报纸。一看，原来上面有我的舞蹈照片。她一直留在那里，还在我的旁边，打了一个圈。她的爱，就是这样的深沉。
我还应该说我的先生，我的先生对我，不管是什么决定，比如搬到美国来，或者我做的哪一个项目。他都是积极支持的态度，因为我的生活会搞得很忙啊，有的先生就会不高兴啊，但是我很幸福，因为我的先生从来没有抱怨，包括我的子女。现在我到这里来讲课，也都是她在帮我安排。所以我这一生，能够做一点事，有一些贡献，和全家对我的支持是绝对分不开的。
Shen Pei：Since my father passed away early in my life, I can only look up to his spirit as a role model. Therefore, my mother had a greater influence on me. Specifically, when it comes to my profession in art and dance, she rarely interfered. Our family is open-minded and accepting, with a fundamental attitude of wholehearted support for each other's endeavors. You are fortunate to be in university now. I didn't attend university myself; I started dancing at the age of fourteen. Compared to my family, where everyone has a doctoral degree or studied abroad, my mother, too, felt a sense of regret. However, she never intervened. After her passing, when we were going through her belongings, a very old newspaper fell out of one of the books. To my surprise, there was a photo of me dancing on it. She had kept it there all this time, with a circle around it. Her love was profoundly deep in that way.
I should also mention my husband. Regardless of the decisions I made, such as moving to the United States or pursuing certain projects, he has always shown a positive and supportive attitude. My life can be quite busy, and some husbands might become unhappy with that, but I feel fortunate because my husband has never complained, and the same goes for my children. Even now, when I come here to give lectures, it's my daughter who helps me with the arrangements. So, in my life, being able to make a difference and contribute, it is absolutely inseparable from the support of my entire family.
采访者：作为女性，您在职业生涯中遇到过哪些挑战？
Interviewer：As a woman, what challenges have you faced in your professional life?
沈蓓: 这又是一个很大题目。我们这个家庭很早就有民主、自由、独立的思想，再加上我的学校中西女中。我们学校的校训就是要做一个自立自爱的、独立的女性。我的祖母，你想想看，一百五十多年前的人了，在中国她就是那个最早的反对裹小脚的人。中国清朝的时候，女人得裹小脚，认为越小就越好看，其实就是把女人变成玩物，你就失去了你自己的独立的人格，对不对？家里很有钱，没有小脚好像是农民， 不能见人。那是很痛苦的，不让那个脚长大，骨头都断了。我的祖母就出生在那个时代，家人抓住她，把她脚裹起来，用很长的布啊这样绕起来，然后用缝针线缝住，你的脚掌非常痛苦。但我的祖母有强烈的独立自由的反抗精神，那些裹脚的人一走开，她就爬到桌子上去，从桌子上跳下来，再爬上去跳下来，直到把这个线全部弄断为止，如此反复好多次，最后都没有包上。这在中国是很少的。她还上街去参加游行，号召大众觉醒，用中国自己的东西，反对日货。日本人的东西都进来，让中国的民族工业没有办法发展。我的祖母就这样。
我的母亲也是的，我的母亲已经跟我父亲订婚了，我父亲得到了机会要到美国留学。我的祖母就说，我们可以让你到美国来陪读，陪读懂吗? 就是我父亲读书，她没有事情她就在美国陪他。我母亲说不要，我有能力，我相信我自己。她后来去学校教书做校长。就是说她们的这种独立的精神对我是有很大影响。当然对于一个女性来讲，家庭和事业中间有矛盾是肯定的。因为你还要生孩子，你也不能不管孩子，你不能不管家务，是吧。我很会烧菜哦，我的中国菜烧得很好啊，我觉得我不能说做得很好，有很多时候这个要问他们（指女儿）了啊，觉得怎么样？我这个妈妈啊我自己来讲，我说我觉得我是两方面都尽力了，但是比方说我那个时候留下来, 就是一个问题。我女儿就在中国，我就不能在她身边了。等于我在这方面就有很多的亏欠，我在这里做得这么好，但是我把我的love都给了这里的学生。那我家里我也不能照顾到母亲，也不能够照顾到孩子，这就是作为一个女性的牺牲。你就有的时候是尽可能，但是也不能两全。
Shen Pei：This is another big question. Our family has had democratic, liberal, and independent thoughts from an early age, and combined with my school, Zhong Xi Women's Middle School, the motto is to be a self-reliant and independent woman. My grandmother, think about it, she lived over 150 years ago in China and was one of the earliest opponents of foot-binding. During the Qing Dynasty in China, women were expected to bind their feet, believing that the smaller the feet, the more beautiful they would be. But in reality, it turned women into playthings, and they lost their independent personalities, don't you think? If you didn't have bound feet, even if you were wealthy, you were considered a peasant and not presentable. It was very painful, as they wouldn't let your feet grow, and even broke the bones. My grandmother was born in that era, and her family tried to bind her feet by wrapping them tightly with long strips of cloth and sewing them with needles and thread. It caused her feet immense pain. However, my grandmother had a strong spirit of independence and resistance. Whenever the foot-binding people were away, she would climb onto the table and jump off, over and over again, until she broke all the bindings. This was very rare in China. She even participated in street demonstrations, calling for mass awakening and advocating the use of Chinese products to oppose Japanese goods. The influx of Japanese products prevented the development of China's national industry. That's my grandmother's story.
My mother was also independent. My mother was already engaged to my father when he had the opportunity to study in the United States. My grandmother said they could let her accompany him as a dependent. Do you understand what "accompany" means? It means that my father would study while she had nothing to do but be there with him in the United States. But my mother said no, she had the ability and believed in herself. She later went to school to teach and became a principal. So their spirit of independence had a great impact on me. Of course, for a woman, there are definitely conflicts between family and career. Because you still have to have children, you can't neglect your children, you can't neglect household chores, right? I'm very good at cooking, oh, I cook Chinese food very well. I can't say it's excellent, but most of the time, I have to ask them (pointing to her daughters), what do they think? As a mother, I think I've done my best in both aspects, but for example, when I decided to stay here, it was a problem. My daughter was in China, and I couldn't be with her. I owe her in this aspect. I'm doing so well here, but I've given all my love to my students here. So I couldn't take care of my mother and children. That's the sacrifice as a woman. Sometimes you try your best, but you can't have it all.
采访者：如果时光倒流，你会給少年时的自己什么忠告或鼓励的話？
Interviewer：If you could go back in time, what advice or words of encouragement would you give to your teenage self?
沈蓓：少年的时候，我是一个大大咧咧的人，很糊涂的人。做过很多的蠢事，希望少做一点。不过呢, 话又说回来，我觉得年纪轻的时候完全不做蠢事也不大可能，这也是很正常。我觉得我还是很幸运，刚才我不是说我先生对我一直支持嘛, 就是我有一个很好的家庭，我觉得家庭的support是非常重要的，特别是作为女性。
你去看文革啊，你们当然没有经历过。你去看那个文革，很多人在外面啊被人家什么斗啊、骂什么的都还能承受。但是如果家庭出了问题，这个人的精神就崩溃了。崩溃懂吗？这就从客观上证明了这个家庭的重要。我可以讲我亲身的一个例子。就是我的舅妈，非常非常好的一个人，非常非常聪明的一个人。文革当中就挨斗，斗得很厉害，把头发都剃掉，大家对她吐口水什么，她都很坚强。他们没有办法把她弄下来，就去找她的儿子，叫她儿子在一个地方写骂共产党的话，然后去说，这个是他妈妈写的。他们跟他讲，你要是这样讲了以后，你妈妈就好了，没事儿了。叫你妈妈承认这个是她写的，妈妈就没事儿了。他不懂啊！才十岁。他就在别人斗他妈妈的时候到台上去说，哎那边有一个很不好的东西是我妈妈写的。我这个舅妈，第二天就上吊死了。你懂啊，作为一个女性，就是说有一个家庭的support是非常重要的。她前面可以那么坚强，人家怎么打她、骂她，她都（不放弃），因为她还有家庭，还有爱，她能挺住。但是她的儿子出来说，这个坏事是我妈妈做的，她就彻底崩溃，失望了。我是举个例子，这是我的亲身体会，所以我觉得我很有运气，我一直得到家庭的支持。刚刚我已经讲了，我的母亲啊、我的先生，包括我的女儿，她们都能够理解。当然这个中间不是没有矛盾的啊，但是总体来讲，我虽然经历了很大的压力，我们的家庭还是完整保持了。所以这个我觉得对女性很重要。
Shen Pei: When I was young, I was a carefree and clueless person. I did a lot of foolish things and hoped to do fewer. However, on the other hand, I believe it's quite normal for young people to make mistakes. I consider myself fortunate. As I mentioned earlier, my husband has always supported me, and I have a good family. I believe family support is crucial, especially for women.
You didn't experience the Cultural Revolution, of course. During that time, many people could endure being criticized and verbally attacked by others outside. But if there were problems within their families, their spirits would collapse. Do you understand what "collapse" means? This objectively proves the importance of the family. I can share a personal example. My aunt, a very good and intelligent person, went through a lot of struggles during the Cultural Revolution. She had her hair shaved off and endured spitting from others, but she remained strong. They couldn't bring her down, so they went to her son and asked him to write and denounce the Communist Party, saying that his mother wrote it. They told him that if he spoke that way, his mother would be fine and nothing would happen to her. He didn't understand, he was only ten years old. When others were attacking his mother, he went on stage and said, "Hey, that bad thing over there was written by my mom." The next day, my aunt hung herself. You see, as a woman, having family support is crucial. She could be strong in front of all the physical attacks and verbal insults because she had a family and love, which helped her withstand it. But when her son came out and said that his mother did the bad thing, she completely collapsed and felt disappointed. This is just an example, based on my personal experience.
So I consider myself lucky to have always had family support. As I mentioned before, my mother, my husband, and even my daughter understand. Of course, there were conflicts sometimes, but overall, despite experiencing great pressure, our family has remained intact. So I believe this is very important for women.