Amanda Kramer
Written by Nico Romero
Amanda Kramer is an up and coming, independent, feminist filmmaker whose writing and choice of imagery is provocative and unnerving at times yet distinctly relevant and relatable. Her film Bark (2016), which explores the themes such as power dynamics, manipulation and control between two women, has been featured in film festivals such as Monster Fest, Fantastic Fest, and Toronto After Dark.
This interview was documented in November 2017 via google chat.
Nico Romero: What do the terms “experimental” and “feminist” mean to you? Do you identify with those terms? Why or why not?
Amanda Kramer: Experimental is a tough word. I think it is often used as a dirty word, though I guess both words seem dirty to some people. I need to use the term “experimental” sometimes just to place myself amongst my peers and the industry. I don't think it truly describes my work (as any actual experimental filmmaker will tell you - my work is very narrative and linear), but as far as the commercial side of storytelling,I'm certainly experimenting I feel like all the best film work is experimenting somehow, but the experimental genre is something wholly other. I’d be laughed out of an experimental filmmaking workshop/panel/fest, but I'd be laughed out of a comicon too.
As for feminist, of course i stand behind that word and feel very strongly about it. my work is feminist because it questions how women are typically written about, portrayed, and viewed.I wonder if lately i haven't become more subversive than even feminist!
NR: Okay cool. Yeah, labels are weird. What do you mean by “not becoming more subversive than feminist”?
AK: I used to think of myself as feminist, now I think maybe a better term would be subversive.Though I definitely feel like a feminist, it just seems like that goes without saying, as being a female filmmaker who writes, directs, and produces is inherently feminist
In the work though, I play with feminist themes in a more subversive way. I like when women are complicated assholes, sad/funny jerks.
NR: Oh yeah I get that. I like that term. Anyway, I'm 21 and I'm not entirely sure what happens after graduation. Sure, I've got all these little steps I plan to take, but really I don't know anything. What were you doing at 21? what kinds of jobs did you have? What people did you know/work with?
AK: Wow, 21. I graduated Emerson at 20. I thought for sure I'd be a playwright in New York and life got lifey. I moved back to LA, started working as a vintage clothing buyer, and writing writing writing. I didn't even imagine filmmaking back then. it seemed like a wild fantasy. I was in the city for it, and everyone around me seemed to be talking about it, but I just wanted to be a writer and a thinker. Movies sounded annoying. My friends were musicians and short story writers. Now they're all filmmakers, editors and actors.
NR: So when did you first think films weren't so annoying and you wanted to try one out? How did that happen?
AK: As a playwright i'd get very wrapped up in scenes, creating characters purely through dialogue not much action on stage, but so much talking. And after writing so much talking, I started to miss watching actors act out my words: my favorite part! when I started seeking out actors they were encouraging me to write a screenplay. Suddenly it was like PDFs were hurtling out of me
NR: After you wrote the screenplays who helped you make films? How do you fund your films? How have you met the people who have helped you and pushed you to develop your work?
AK: First thing first - I started writing to filmmakers I admired: fearless. I'd just write them an email, soulful and straightforward, and tell them I was a fan and that I loved their work. From there began friendships and connections I still have to this day, including Cam Archer. Filmmakers I'd reach out to would introduce me to people - casting directors, producers, actors. From there a web begins! I started to meet and connect with tons of people looking to make art, to be a part of the process, to find like-minded aesthetes.
I've paid for work. I’ve had producers pay for work. I've had a couple of investors, but mostly I pay - especially if it's a small project and I want to be quick and dirty about it: immediate rewards. I also have a great agent who's very encouraging and gets people on the phone and tells them I'm an auteur.
NR: Connections are key. How personal is the work you create? What points in your life do you find that you draw from the most and how does that enrich your filmmaking process?
AK: Work has to be personal. That doesn't mean it has to be about the person writing it, but personal is necessary. I write myself into everything somehow. I think ultimately you want to get to a point where you feel like the character's deciding what to do on his/her own - but that's just a feeling you've created by sustaining a really close, personal relationship with your own writing.
Feeling sad at your own words or laughing at them is a high point in the process - it means you’re still surprising yourself or delighting yourself. It's an amazing moment when you become your own audience.
I think the people of my life are my characters. I borrow their words, steal their vibes, reimagine their impact on me. my own feelings of outsider-ness or subversiveness or alienation all make it into my work. all the random things i think are accidentally funny, or impossible, or iconic, or depressing - all of that makes it into my work. When I can hit those notes, my films are the best they can be. While I wouldn't say really liking one of my films is really liking me - i would say really hating one of my films is probably really just hating me.
NR: Well, one of your films that I actually found myself thinking about for a very long time is Bark. I think this film is very smart and feels like I’m on the edge about to fall backwards. That feeling as a viewer where you want more and once you get it, you are shocked. I don't know if I’m explaining myself right but I really enjoy that film! The film explores a relationship between two young women, can you talk about how this dynamic might represent women as whole/ how it might represent the relationships you have had or seen with other women?
AK: Thank you for saying that sarah!
I struggle to find female relationships I relate to on screen. I don't often relate. especially when adults write about teen friendship - half of the time it's very dark with a pure bully/bullied dynamic and the other half it's this best friends for life we'd do anything for each other and our friendship is the most important thing in the world to save type of mentality. I didn't have either of those experiences and i'm always looking for work that explores something far more complex: manipulation, dishonesty, fear, hope, ownership, jealousy, but–most importantly–acting out in ways that aren't logical or rational.
So in Bark the idea was that age old "hell is other people" / Sartre/ locked in repetition / Beckett type relationship. I wanted the audience to stop asking typical questions of female relationships (who's the weaker/stronger, who's the nice one/mean one) and i wanted them to see the irrational, fear-based longing most young women feel for one another at very desperate times in their lives.it's certainly surrealism but i think a very relatable surrealism for many of us.
NR: Wow, yeah I agree. Also another cool thing you did was that you you recently curated an event at a feminist community space known as Junior High in Hollywood. The event was a short film series featuring work by other femme filmmakers. Spaces like these are so important to me and these events inspire me to do the same in my own community. How did you put this together/find femme filmmakers? What did this event mean to you and will you do something like this again?
AK: I feel like our industry is very very self-congratulatory. everyone who's already been honored continues to be honored. The idea of an outsider finding a place within that system is scary for the old guard. I wanted to become a film activist - not just a filmmaker - because I believe good work is being made that isn't being applauded or appreciated and if we want to preserve the art in film we have a job to seek that good work out and invite others to watch/enjoy.
I don't like to separate men from women, masc from femme, because I think humanity will move toward a gender blur in the next few generations. but I do think marginalized voices and unheard peoples are important to champion in visual art. We've had a lot of iconic imagery from white men and it's shaped our past art world. I think it's time to respectfully put those images to bed so new ones can shape our future art world.
At junior high I had the opportunity to choose work by women who are at all levels of their career, with all levels of film education. Their work is bizarre, personal, memorable, experimental, Dada, cinematic -- and deserves an audience.
I don't think you deserve fans if you aren't a fan yourself. Curatorial work is true power in the arts. It's not just the making, it's even more so the supporting.
NR: Fantastic. At any point in your career, whether it was on the first projects you created or your current project now, did you find yourself being repetitive, dull, or stagnant, and if so, what did you do to push yourself to move forward, be productive, create something exciting to you again?
AK: This might sound crazy, but I refuse to be stagnant. Every project of mine is different from the last. I try to make films that are totemic, solid marble pillars that stand alone. That keeps me fresh, wanting, yearning, but when I get stuck or caught in the writing phase - which is inevitable - I have conversations. conversations for me are art drugs, the adderall of making. trading ideas, complaining, telling stories, all of it. after a week of constant conversations with interesting people, i'm ready to write again.
NR: I don't think that sounds crazy, but rather productive for yourself and for your art. Can you talk at all about your most recent project? How is it different from the ones you have done before? What are you in the process of learning right now?
AK: I recently finished a short called Requests. It’s totally different from anything I've ever done because I chose to eliminate location sound. All of it was ADR and subtitles and sound design. I got to flex a new muscle which was talking through production and guiding actors consistently with my voice and direction, but that also meant the post process was more arduous.
The short series i'm shooting next week will be different again. I'm shooting a fake sitcom - so I’ll be using multiple cameras, staged lighting, a new style of editing for me, a laugh track: all aesthetic choices I need to account for going into production.
I'm always learning how best to talk to actors. and I'm always learning what I can make for cheap or free. and I'm always always, always learning how to refine my specific look/tone/aesthetic. I don't like to think about an artist's legend because that's sort of a fucked view of what being a human means (which is, essentially nothing), but I do think one has to think of their "body of work," as in, what does an amanda kramer film feel like or mean? How does it resonate when played before or after another Amanda Kramer film? A very bloated artist approach, but i think the bloat is to be expected.
NR: Yeah, I'm really excited to hopefully see what you have been working on eventually. Okay, last question. What was the last "good" film you have seen? What are you into right now?
AK: Killing of a Sacred Deer: It was totally transcendent for me and I really love Schitt's Creek. I think it's brilliantly written, acted, and probably one of the most soulful sitcoms I've ever seen.
You can find more stills, films, trailers and contact info at http://www.afilmbyamandakramer.com/