The false claims of Impersonalists and others

OVERVIEW:

• The false claims of Impersonalists and others
• Krishna in the Primary Vedas
• Rama in the Primary Vedas

The False Claims of Impersonalists and others

The Impersonalists to support their Mayavada Vedanta, speculates that Krishna is not mentioned in the primary Vedas anywhere. However, such speculations of them are faulty just like they're all theories, because Lord Krishna and Rama are mentioned in the Primary Vedas. However, it has become a habit by the impersonaliststo belittle the importance of Smriti texts by saying they are composed by humans and not eternal Vedic texts. But, The Shruti itself confirms the following:

Shukla Yajurveda: Madhyandina-sruti, Brhad-aranyaka Upanisad 2.4.10

asya mahato bhutasya nihsvasitam etad yad rg-vedo yajur-vedah sama

vedo’tharvangirasa itihasah puranam ityadina

“O Maitreya, the Rg, Yajur, Sama and Atharva Vedas as well as the Itihasas and the Puranas all manifest from the breathing of the Lord.”

Atharva Veda: Gopatha Brahmana, purva 2.10

evam ime sarva veda nirmitah sa-kalpah sa-rahasyah sa-brahmanah sopanisatkah setihasah sanvakhyatah sa-puranan

“In this way, all the Vedas were manifested along with the Kalpas, Rahasyas, Brahmanas, Upanisads, Itihasas, Anvakhyatas and the Puranas.”

Atharva Veda 15.6.10–12

sa brhatim disam anu vyacalat tam itihasas ca puranam ca gathas ca itihasasya ca sa vai puranasya ca gathanam ca narasamsinam ca priyam dhama bhavati ya evam veda

“He approached the brhati meter, and thus the Itihasas, Puranas, GathasandNarasamsis became favorable to him. One who knows this verily becomes the beloved abode of the Itihasas, Puranas, Gathas and Narasamsis.”

Puranas and Itihasa are fifth veda : Kauthumiya Chandogya Upanisad 7.1.4

nama va rg-vedo yajur-vedah sama-veda atharvanas caturtha itihasa-puranah pancamo vedanam vedah

“Indeed, Rg, Yajur, Sama and Atharva are the names of the fourVedas.The Itihasasand Puranas are the fifth Veda.”

Smriti texts too confirms the same:

Srimad Bhagavatam 3.12.39:

itihāsa-purāṇāni pañcamaṁ vedam īśvaraḥ

“Itihasa and Puranas are Fifth Veda.”

Mahabharata (Adi Parva 1.267) and Manu Samhita –

itihasa puranabhyam vedam samupabrmhayet

“One must complement one’s study of the Vedas with the Itihasas and the Puranas.”

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Thus, be it Rig, Yajur, Sam, Atharva, Itihasa and Puranas, all the Vedic texts are eternal and they all together appeared from the Supreme Person. The Fifth Veda is as good as Primary 4 Vedas. Also, the Puranas is known as ‘Puranas’ is because they make the Vedas complete (puranat puranam iti canyatra). This is not to suggest that the Vedas are incomplete. It simply means that the Puranas are explanatory supplements which aid one to understand the concise and ambiguous passages in the Vedas. If the Puranascomplete the Vedas, it is only logical that they must be Vedic in nature.

Still, some ask for a mention of Rama and Krishna in Primary Vedas. It is like why there is no mention of Krishna in Valmiki Ramayana or Why there is no clear mention of Rama as Vishnu incarnation in the Valmiki Ramayana. The actual meaning can be understood by studying all the Vedic texts and not just one particular type of the Vedic text (like impersonalists say first 4 Primary Vedas), because some Vedic texts do not reveal anysecret truths to put some principles in front of general people for their (people’s) good.

Valmiki Ramayana mainly describes Rama as a perfect ideal man. The Valmiki Ramayana begins with the seminal question asked by Valmiki to Narada: who is an ideal human being? Narada replies that it is Rama and the Ramayana narrative depicts how it is so. If Rama were depicted as God, then his divinity would make him a model too lofty for humanity to emulate. So Valmiki Ramayan is largely silent about Rama’s divinity, though it is a background understanding throughout and becomes a foreground understanding occasionally. However, that is not the case with Lord Krishna’s pastime as we know. But, in cases of both, there are indeed many mentions of Rama and Krishna in the primary Vedas even though the primary Vedas are Karma Kanda Vedic texts which mainly focus on rituals or how to attain the materialistic fruits which are temporary.

Krishna in the Primary Vedas

Krishna and Vishnu are the same person, but exists simultaneously in the two forms. Indeed, every form or Avatar exists eternally in the Spiritual World. The Primary Vedas Glorify Vishnu as Supreme Lord. However, The same Vedas mentions Krishna too. The Krishna Upanishada, Narayana Upanishada, Gopala Tapani Upanishada, Chandogya Upanishada and some other Upanishads mentions Lord Krishna.

References:

Rig Veda 1.164.31

apasyam gopam anipadyamana ma ca para ca pathibhis carantam

sa sadhricih sa visucir vasana avatirvati bhuvanesv antah

“I saw a Gopala (Gopa). He never falls from his position; sometimes he is near, and sometimes far, wandering on various paths. He is a friend, decorated with a variety of clothes. He comes again and again to the material world.”

//The above verse describe Krishna, the foremost of all the Gopas (cowherd men). It also describes Krishna as Avatari Purusha and ultimately as Supreme Lord.

Narayana Upanishada:

brahmanyo devki putra

“The son of Devki i.e. Sri Krishna is Supreme Brahman.

The name “Krishna” is mentioned in Rig Veda 1.116.23 , 8.74.3,4 etc.

Chandogya Upanishada 3.17:

Krishnaya Devakiputra

“Sri Krishna, the divine son of Devki”.

Rigveda 1.22.18:

(Krishna is mentioned as) “Vishnorgopa” means Vishnu is Gopala (Sri Krishna).

Chandogya Upanishada 8.13.1, The Name “Shyam” is mentioned.

In Taittiriya Upanishad (2.7.1) it is said:

raso vai sah

“The Supreme Personality of Godhead is the reservoir of transcendental mellows.”

//Lord Krishna’s one name is “Rasikashekhara” which has the same meaning.

Gopala Tapani Upanishada of Atharva veda:

om namah sac-cid-ananda-rupaya krishnayaklista-karine

namo vedanta-vedyaya gurave buddhi-saksine

“Om namah. I offer my respectful obeisances to Sri Krsna, whose form is eternal and full of knowledge and bliss, who is the rescuer from distress, who is understood by Vedanta, who is the supreme spiritual master, and who is the witness in everyone’s heart.”

Lord Krishna’s abode in the Rig Veda 1.154.6

ta vam vastuny usmasi gamadhyai

yatra gavo bhuri-srnga ayasah

atraha tad urugayasya krsnah

paramam padam avabhati bhuri

“We wish to go to Your [Radha’s and Krsna’s] beautiful houses, about which cows with large, excellent horns are wandering. Yet distinctly shining on this earth is that supreme abode of Yours that showers joy on all, O Urugaya [Krsna, who is much praised].”

All the References are taken from Jaiva Dharma book by Gaudiya Vaishnava Acharya Bhaktivinoda Thakura and from Srimad Bhagavatam commentary by Gaudiya Vaishnava Acharya Srila Prabhupada.

Lord Krishna and Rama in the Primary Vedas

Hare Krishna!