*This interview project conducted under the Office of Senator Ellen Tong is dedicated to accurately reflecting the professor's own voice and perspectives as shared in the interview. Thank you to all the professors who agreed to be interviewed and shared their thoughts!
Cam Nguyen (Nguyễn Nguyệt Cầm)
Lecturer—Vietnamese
Department of South & Southeast Asian Studies
I received my B.A. from Hanoi University (now Vietnam National University, Hanoi), then my Masters degree at Berkeley.
What do you teach now at Berkeley?
I’m currently teaching Advanced Vietnamese here.
I went to Hanoi University from 1987 to 1992. It was a 5-year program that trained students to become translators and interpreters as part of the foreign languages department, and I would attend classes with the same 17 students, 6 days a week. I learned English literature, English geography, history and other stuff like Vietnamese history. I studied English, but others studied languages like Russian and French.
Back in my days, we started learning foreign languages in middle school. I couldn’t study Chinese because of the tension between Vietnam and China. Most people studied Russian, but my father told me to study English, so I did and ended up doing well, thanks to my energetic and fun English teachers. I fell in love with the English language and continued to study it throughout middle and high school.
Deciding on universities was different in Vietnam back then: you could only choose one school in one area of study to take the entrance exam for and you get one chance per year to get in. I had three possible schools for my area of choice and I chose to attend Hanoi University because it was one of the oldest universities.
I wrote my B.A. honor thesis on E. B. White—the author of classic American children’s books like Charlotte’s Web, The Trumpet of the Swan, and Stuart Little. I loved the books so much that I translated them into Vietnamese and two of the translations got published. I later came to the US in 1995 and attended UC Berkeley for my M.A. in Asian Studies. I wrote my thesis on Southern Vietnamese spy fiction. In South Vietnam between 1954 and 1975—it was a different country called Republic of Vietnam—there was a popular writer who wrote a series of spy fiction with a main character named Z28. He is more handsome, much better than James Bond 007.
Why did you embark on a journey studying abroad?
How did such an international experience impact you? Did you experience any cultural differences?
I didn’t come here to study as an international student—I graduated in 1992 and in 1994 married an American who got a job at Berkeley’s history department, so I followed him here. I spent my first years in the US reading and attending Chinese extension courses before applying for a Master’s degree in 1998 because I really loved the environment.
In 1995 when I came, there were not that many Americans in Hanoi—most of those who I knew were grad-students, professors, journalists, etc—so I experienced a lot of culture shock. I remember looking out the window at the Honolulu airport and seeing Americans doing manual labor—being young, I was shocked because I’d always thought that all Americans had office jobs. Afterward, I came to Berkeley and on Telegraph, I saw people with colorful dyed hair for the first time, which you never saw in Vietnam back then. Ten days later, I went to Castro in San Francisco for Halloween—it was a very eye-opening and fun experience.
I’ve loved literature since a young age. Before learning how to read and write, I already knew a lot of Vietnamese poems by heart, so my love for the Vietnamese language has been inside me all along. As mentioned, I translated the works that I completed my honor thesis on, and that was my first experience with translation, which was a huge success because a lot of people read it and told me they loved it. As a student in Hanoi back then, we were all poor, so receiving money for my translation work was great. Since then, I’ve started translating short stories and academic papers from Vietnamese to English and vice versa—and I’m still doing it!
As an educator, my translation work helps a lot with close reading. In my classes, I always encourage close reading of texts, and one way to do this is through translation because you must stop at every sentence and understand its meaning beforehand. I hope to inspire my students with that goal.
Because I’ve been doing translation for more or less 30 years, my philosophy has changed. It’s very hard to be completely accurate [to the original]. But sometimes, when you are completely accurate, you lose some of the stuff, like the beauty. For example, if you concentrate on trying to convey the exact meaning then your translation is going to be very stiff. But at the beginning, that was my most important goal.
Now, I think that translation is for those who can’t read the original language. So what’s important is making the text accessible and resonate with that audience. Then, you don’t care too much about [complete accuracy]—of course that doesn’t mean you can do whatever you want—but if you lose one meaning from the original work and gain a different kind of meaning in the translation, then that's good to me.
The key is, for any reader, they are not turned off by the book. If you care too much about being so accurate and you turn the reader off, then you fail. All the beautiful things in the original language are for the people who can speak that language.
Here's an example, in Dumb Luck (Số đỏ) there's a character called Mr TYPN—short in Vietnamese for “I Love Women”—he signs every one of his works “TYPN”. It’s very funny in Vietnamese because you can't really say the word, but when you translate “TYPN” then it doesn't really mean anything in English. So instead of “I Love Women” we change it into I Love Lady—so “ILL”. He becomes Mr ILL in English. It's different, but we kind of played with the words in English. In that way, we lose the consonants in Vietnamese but we gain something in English, and that's how I approach translation now.
I’ve been at Berkeley for 29 years, next year will be 30 years.
After being here for a long time, what about Berkeley stands out the most to you, and what is one thing that you would like to change?
I love Berkeley. I didn’t recognize how lucky I was at the beginning because Berkeley was the first place I stopped at when I came to the US. I thought every place was the same, but it wasn’t. I love the weather at Berkeley—it is just so gorgeous all year round. I love the food—it’s so diverse, you can find so many different country’s good food in Berkeley. And I love the diversity of people. In Berkeley, especially in UC Berkeley, people are very friendly and supportive. Going out, I don't feel stood-out at all. Sometimes, when I travel to other places in the US, I'd be the only Asian around. Here, I feel so at home, not just because the Asian community is large but there are also many other groups of people and everybody seems to be at ease. The longer I stay, the more I love it.
Well…one thing that I would like to change is the homelessness situation around Berkeley. I wish we had more money to help them. You know, to provide a system—because when you drive around Berkeley and Oakland, you see them and try to help a little bit, but it's inadequate. So if I could do something then I'd wish Berkeley had more money to help them.
What piece(s) of literary work from Vietnam would you recommend? And why?
I have a lot, but off the top of my head, the most important work of literature for me is the Tale of Kieu (Truyện Kiều) by Nguyễn Du. It has been translated into English many times, but the best translation is by Huỳnh Sanh Thông. But again, Tale of Kieu is a story in verse, it's poetry, so there is no best, no perfect translation. For poetry, you’ve got to read in the original language, but that is the most important work of Vietnamese literature, of all time.
Tale of Kieu is the single book that Vietnamese critics and people have written about so much that no one can collect all of [the documents]. Throughout the 20th century, there are so many books, articles, films, operas, whatever you can think of, [based on it]. In 1924, a famous culturalist made a famous speech about the Tale of Kieu in which he said
“As long as the Tale of Kieu survives, our language survives. As long as our Viet language survives, our country survives.”
The novel is elevated to the same level of the nation. Why? Because of its language. The plot is not as important, but the language of the Tale of Kieu is basically seen as the Vietnamese language at its most beautiful. Before the 20th century, the majority of Vietnamese were illiterate, but because Tale of Kieu was so popular, many can recite it entirely without knowing how to read and write. Then, people would teach one another verbally, so the tradition and the importance of the Tale of Kieu [existed] even before modernization. Then, with modernization, the vernacular language becomes so important in the making of a nation.
Personally, my father taught me the Tale of Kieu even before I learned how to read and write, I started learning the Tale of Kieu maybe at the age 1 and a half. I also knew the whole 3254 lines by heart before I learned how to read and write, so naturally it became very important in my life.
Then after the Tale of Kieu, in the colonial period, Dumb Luck (Số đỏ) by Vũ Trọng Phụng would be very important. Of course, I'm biased, I think my translation is very good. Dumb Luck is very popular in Vietnam and, I think, the most important colonial work.
For the war time, there are many novels in the Republic of Vietnam (South Vietnam) but they haven't been translated to English. I'd recommend the works of Nhã Ca, Phan Nhật Nam, Dương Nghiễm Mậu, Thanh Tâm Tuyền, Mai Thảo, Duyên Anh, Nguyễn Thị Hoàng; there are so many I could go on and on.
After the war, in the late 1980s—early 1990s (the ‘Renovation’ period), the most important work in Vietnamese literature was The Sorrow of War (Nỗi buồn chiến tranh) by Bảo Ninh. It has been translated into English and is a Vietnamese work that is read a lot by foreigners. Again, I wouldn’t compare The Sorrow of War in English to the Vietnamese version—it's very beautiful, it's like a poem even though it's a novel in prose. In a lot of the pages, even though it's about the brutality of war, there is some superb language.
I love reading. I spend most of my time reading.
I also love listening to Vietnamese music. As I mentioned earlier, I love the weather in Berkeley—for most of the year it's beautiful. So, I love to put on my headphones, put on Vietnamese music, and walk around to look at the flowers and houses.
Interviewers: Celina Wang, Phuong Nhi Tran
Transcript: Celina Wang, Phuong Nhi Tran, Sophie Luk
Design: Phuong Nhi Tran, Sophie Luk
Special thanks to Professor Cam Nguyen!