Carolyn: I am remedial project manager here at EPA, so I'm charged with overseeing the Commencement Bay nearshore tide flats SFC site. As remedial project manager for Commencement Bay overseeing the entire site, I'm making sure all remedial site goals are met and really interacting with the different communities in the area and the responsible parties that we have on site. 

Rafi: I am community involvement coordinator, so I work on the public affairs side of things. So, within the law that gives us the authority to do the work that we do is a section that mandates community involvement and outreach. That's where I fit in; organizing meetings, notifying the public of work that’s going to be performed or has been performed, that kind of thing.

Rafi: We try and do our best to notify the community of any site work that's going on or any potential for hazardous material exposure. We have an email list that we try to keep updated as much as we can. Anytime that there will be site activity going on, I coordinate with Carolyn and the team to put in any public outreach that we need to do ahead of time. So, we’re plugged in at various levels within the community more broadly; everything from the city level, to private organizations, to the Parks and Recreation Department, and people who live in the area. There are various pools that we tap into in order to do extensive outreach. So, I like to think that our job is never 100% done because we're trying to get as much information as possible to people's hands. We’re always trying to do the best we can. 

Rafi: Yes it can be like that. Especially if there’s a specific land owner there with tenants or a business, its often easier to facilitate those conversations with one institution or group who can then disseminate the information. At the same time, we can also use our mailing lists that people can opt into when we have a public meetings, and then we do a mass mailer. We also do something called “every door direct,” which is a system used by the USPS where you can target paper mailers to people by address or by zip code. 

Carolyn: I think it depends on what part of the site you’re talking about. Commencement Bay is a very old site and was one of the first listed on the national priority list. It spans from the Port of Tacoma area with all the different waterways, all the way up to the Point Defiance area. I would say, I think there's more of a historical knowledge of all the cleanup that's been done in that port area and all the waterways because there are certain responsible parties for that area. Moving up the shoreline into north Tacoma and the point rusten development or dune part of the site, that area is kind of our residential area with people moving in and out all the time. Because of the turnover, it’s a constant effort to do our best to keep people informed about the cleanup that’s happened. 

Carolyn: In the 2000's when a large part of the cleanup was happening, I think Communities for Healthy Bay was very involved.

Rafi: There have been various community groups that have been involved at the site, but it kind of comes in waves. Our work and local advocacy group work often intersects when there's a specific project or something going to happen on the site, so they want to have a say in how it's done or learn more about it. We don't interface with other advocacy groups on a regular schedule, but that isn’t to say other people aren’t working on cleanup or public health in the area. 

Rafi: It doesn’t have to, but community involvement is always a very important part of superfund cleanups and is definitely a viable avenue to do initial investigation work and explore contamination levels. We always take community input seriously, and it’s often been important to superfund site creation. Like love Canal, where there was community advocacy that manifested in that way. 

Carolyn: I think community involvement is an important part of the superfund process, and there are a bunch of different factors for listing a site. 

Rafi: But it’s an important one. 

Carolyn: I think it is in a way. That's how it became a superfund site, and that pertains to how a lot of industries historically operated. So really what we’re dealing with now at Commencement Bay and a lot of superfund sites is the result of those old operations, and we're really addressing the legacy pollution and contamination. I think that we do things differently now and there are certain mechanisms in place like permits or other regulations that curb that longstanding pollution that we saw previously, but we’re still dealing with some sites now. 

Rafi: But there will be extensive monitoring of this site for- 

Carolyn: Ever.

Rafi: Yeah. It’s almost impossible to put a timestamp on it. I couldn't tell you what date it’ll stop being monitored or maintained. 

Carolyn: In general, Commencement Bay is an important feature of the economy because of access to different navigation routes. Obviously, the port of Tacoma is there, so really important for that reason. A lot of superfund sites have that nexus with economic needs, which is a result of that industry and is why we [the EPA] end up being there. I think it’s location in the Puget Sound near all those different navigation routes and channels make it a really important access point to different areas. 

Rafi: The smelter was historically a large source of employment. However, it had, I think it's safe to say, considerable environmental impact to the area. There were a lot of waves of cleanup of certain parts of Commencement Bay, and there's been a lot of development of that land that previously wasn’t developed. So, there’s a lot of condos, a lot of businesses along point Rustin on the Tacoma side, and the city of Rustin is really eager to get development underway in the rest of that site so there can be some tax revenue coming in. It's important to put that kind of thing in context, that a lot of the future economic growth depends on having an environment safe and sound locale on which to do business and live. I like to think that a lot of folks have larger ideas about the fact that business and commerce have shifted, in the sense that industry doesn’t have to be extractive and destructive, but rather we need to maintain a healthy environment in order to advance economically. 

Carolyn: In general I would, and that's what makes it so cool to work at EPA working in these large projects for the protection of human health and the environment. It’s really cool to be working on this side and being able to see tangible products happening. 

Carolyn: I think you said you haven't been to Point Rustin or Dune peninsula part, but that's the most northern end of the SP site, so I see that area as our asarco impacted area because that’s where the old smelter stack used to be. If you look at old photos compared to what it is now, I think it’s really cool. EPA helped clean up the dune peninsula, which is made out of slag, a waste byproduct of the smelting industry, and they poured it directly into the bay almost like the Hawaiian islands are made. It’s an award winning, gorgeous park now. EPA partnered with Parks Tacoma, where EPA did the cleanup and then parks Tacoma was able to do the park development on top of it.