Remaining Mysteries

Much is still unknown about the early generations of the Seeber family in the Mohawk Valley.  Here are some of the unresolved issues and unanswered questions about which research should continue:

1. Who were the other children of Anna Maria (Weber) Seeber?  When she died in 1789, Anna Maria Seeber's death/burial record in the Ft. Plain Reformed Church mentioned that she was survived by eight children, 28 grandchildren, and 13 great-grandchildren.  Currently we can account for only six children born to her and Johann Wilhelm Seeber, two in Bischwiller and four in America.  Three of her sons -- Jacob W., Severinus/Saffrenes, and James -- did not survive her because they died during or soon after the Battle of Oriskany in 1777.  Therefore, it is likely that she had other children not yet linked to her and her husband. 

2. Who was Gottfried Seiber/Seibert/Seiver?  He was married to Elisabeth Laux/Loucks on 16 November 1769, as recorded in the Stone Arabia Reformed Church. He was a Loyalist. In testimony given in 1787, supporting a claim to the British government for his house and barn that were burned in the 1780 raids, he said that: he had owned 50 acres on the Mohawk River including his house and barn; he had been jailed almost 17 months for his Loyalist views; in 1781 he made his way to New York City where he lived and worked as an engineer; in the summer of 1783 he evacuated to Sorel in Quebec, where he still lived.  In subsequent years he received several land grants, and he died in Sorel in January 1826.  There are no known connections between him and the members of the Seeber family discussed on this website, but it is possible that he was a son of Johann Wilhelm Seeber born 1695 or of Johann Jacob Seeber born 1722

3. Was Anna Maria (Seeber) Pickle/Bickle related to the Bischwiller Seebers?  Anna Maria Seeber married John Pickle/Bickle, probably by 1755, and had several children with him from about 1756 to about 1764.  She is usually assumed to be a daughter of Johann Martin Seibert, the Palatine.  This assumption is based principally on two deeds first mentioned, to the best of my knowledge, in an article by Frederick Phillips appearing in the St. Johnsville Enterprise and News on 4 February 1931.  According to this article, and other published reports, these deeds transferred two lots in the Stone Arabia Patent acquired by Johann Martin Seibert in 1723; the grantors were "Jacob Syber and Anna Marie, wife to John Bickles (Pickles), said Martin Sybert daughter."  I have not been able to find the deeds, or copies or transcripts of them, in the official Albany County records and in libraries and archives.  If the deeds do not exist, or do not say what they are alleged to say, then there is little or no evidence to link Anna Maria Seeber to Johann Martin Seibert.  Alternatively, she may have been related to the Seeber family that came from Bischwiller.

4. Are the "Madison County Seebers" related to the family?  There is a Seeber family that has lived in Madison County, New York, since about 1800.  Some researchers believe that they are descendants of Johann Martin Seibert, the Palatine; others claim they are linked to the Seeber family discussed on this website.  The descendant of this family tested during the DNA project was NOT a match to the other men in the project, suggesting but not proving that there is no relationship to the Bischwiller Seebers.  Despite the DNA test, I think it is possible that the Madison County Seebers are descended from Jacob Seeber born in 1751, the son of Johann William Seeber (1721-1777) and his first wife. Additional research and DNA testing would be helpful to resolve this question.

5. Who was the first wife of Johann Wilhelm Seeber born 1721?  According to the Seeber family Bible, the first wife of Johann Wilhelm Seeber was Maria Catharina Wallradt, born 7 April 1729, and they were married on 13 July 1746.  This information is inconsistent with a marriage record in the Schoharie Reformed Church which indicates that Johann Wilhelm Seeber and Maria Catharina Ecker, both living in Schoharie, were married in that church on 13 July 1746.  Seeber researchers have struggled to come up with an explanation for the conflicting maiden names of the wife, sometimes suggesting that Johann Wilhelm may have had an earlier marriage that was not documented in the Bible.  That is highly unlikely, as discussed more fully in the webpage dealing with Myth #3 about Johann Wilhelm Seeber (1721-1777).  Rather, I believe that the author of the information in the family Bible simply made a mistake and recorded the wrong maiden name for Johann Wilhelm's first wife.  The Bible information was recorded after Johann Wilhelm died in 1777, which means that the first wife had been deceased for at least twenty years, and probably more.  It is likely that the author of the Bible information had incorrect memory or knowledge of the first wife's maiden name. 

6. Where were the Seebers living in the 1740s and 1750s?  There are many records about the Seeber family from the 1760s and 1770s, primarily church records from the Stone Arabia Reformed Church, and military records from the French and Indian War and Revolutionary War.  They indicate that the Seeber family was living during these decades in what is now Montgomery County, New York, at Sand Hill near the current village of Fort Plain. However, there are relatively few records about the family from the 1740s and 1750s, and it is less certain that they were at Sand Hill during these earlier decades.  Indeed, one descendant discussed in Edward Seeber's research notes said that the family spent some time in Columbia County and Schoharie County before settling in what is now Montgomery County; another claimed that the Seebers settled initially in an area called Oak Ridge in Schoharie County.

The following is a summary of the available evidence, which is somewhat inconsistent, about where the family lived in the 1740s and 1750s:

• When Henry Seeber died in 1845, his death record in the Herkimer Reformed Church mentioned that he had been born in 1741 at "the Indian Castle."  Most researchers have assumed that "Indian Castle" refers to the place in Herkimer County, New York, that is currently known by that name.  It is a small hamlet with an historic Indian mission church and a few houses; the name is familiar to many people because a nearby New York State Thruway rest area also bears the name.  I think it is very unlikely that Henry Seeber was born at this location in Herkimer County.  Instead, I believe he was born near another Indian village at Prospect Hill outside the current village of Fort Plain in Montgomery County. There were three Mohawk Indian "castles" or villages during the first half of the eighteenth century: the Upper Castle near the place now called Indian Castle in Herkimer County; the Middle Castle at Prospect Hill in Montgomery County; and the Lower Castle near the current hamlet of Fort Hunter in Montgomery County.  The Middle Castle, called Tarajorees, was flourishing from about 1700 to about 1755, when it was abandoned. I think Tarajorees was probably "the Indian Castle" to which reference was made in Henry Seeber's death record. 

• Published histories of Montgomery County and the Town of Minden generally agree that William Seeber was operating a store at Sand Hill by 1750.

• The 1746 marriage record of Johann Wilhelm Seeber and Maria Catharina Ecker in the Schoharie Reformed Church mentions that both bride and groom were living in Schoharie.  However, Johann Wilhelm did not become a member of the Schoharie church until after the marriage, which suggests that he had not been a long-time resident of that community.

• The first child of Georg Wabel and Maria Esther Seeber, born in 1757, was baptized in the Stone Arabia Lutheran Church, and their subsequent children were baptized in the Stone Arabia Reformed Church.

The bulk of this evidence suggests that the Seebers lived at Sand Hill during the 1740s and 1750s, but it is possible that they lived elsewhere for a while -- perhaps in Schoharie County, New York.

7. Are the Seebers related to Johann Martin Seibert, the Palatine?  There is persistent speculation by researchers that the Seeber family of Montgomery County is somehow related to the family of Johann Martin Seibert, who came to America during the Palatine emigration of 1709-10 and lived initially in the Hudson River settlements and after 1714 in Schoharie County.  Elsewhere on this website, I have shown that Johann Martin Seibert could not have been the father of Johann Wilhelm Seeber (1721-1777), as is sometimes suggested (see the Myth #2 page).  And the DNA Testing page describes a Y-chromosome project a few years back that suggests there is no relationship between the Seibert and Seeber families.   However, the DNA results are not conclusive and the possibility remains that the Seiberts were related to the Seebers in some other way.