What are "they" not telling us? We'll find out, figure out, and, when all else fails, make up the missing pieces to some of the most scandalous conspiracies, unexplained phenomena, and true crime affecting our world today. Join comedian Dwayne Perkins, writer Koji Steven Sakai, and comedian/actor/writer Cat Alvarado on The Unofficial Official Story Podcast every month, and by the end of each episode, we'll tell you what's really...maybe...happening.

CREDITS

The intro and outro song was created by Brian "Deep" Watters. You can hear his music at 

Hosts: Cat Alvarado, Dwayne Perkins, and Koji Steven Sakai

Written by Koji Steven Sakai

Edited and Produced by Koji Steven Sakai

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Jennifer Field: [00:00:27] So this is a podcast where we're going to tell you the official story. We look at paranormal conspiracies, unexplained phenomena, cryptids true crime. And by the end of the episode, we're going to tell you what really maybe happened. So in this episode, we're asking the question, is rapper Cardi B an industry plant? But first, we're going to introduce our very special guest, Zell Williams. Zell is an award-winning playwright and TV producer whose work has been developed and performed at the Public Theater in New York, Interact Theater in Philadelphia and the Royal Court in London. And as a TV writer, he's worked on such shows as the Fox drama. Next, NBC's Law and Order Special Victims Unit, BET's American Soul and Freeform's Good Trouble. He's currently a writer for season two of AMC's critically acclaimed interview with a Vampire series. His play, Diversity, will have its world premiere on Broadway from the producers of Haiti's Hound and the Piano Lesson with Samuel L Jackson. So Zell is also a podcaster. He is the co-host of the Inner Cities podcast with author and attorney Toshi Onyebuchi for Highway Citizen Productions.

Zell Williams: [00:01:41] Great to be here. Honestly, I'm a I'm a fan of you guys a show. I'm a huge fan of Jennifer Field, who we went to school together. And yeah, I also, oddly enough, I have actually written a play about industry plants. As I was doing the research for this, I was like, Oh shit, that was the theme of that thing.

Zell Williams: [00:02:00] So the play is called the Urban Retreat, and it is about a unpublished, middle aged, divorced public school teacher in Chicago who thinks he's about to have a chance to write his hit book. But actually he's been hired to help ghostwrite the memoir of a hip hop megastar name. Trench de Trench also used to be one of his students. And it's this huge conversation about black masculinity, black art, and what is what counts as selling out or not. The thing about conspiracy theory is that involve black communities is that we've had so many actual conspiracies against us that things sometimes things sound crazy, but actually they are rooted in truth. And like if you listen to you, by the way, I'm not the first person to do this. You go back and you watch August Wilson's piano lesson, like, put that on Netflix with Viola Davis and friggen Chadwick. You watch it. That's a play about an industry. That's a movie about industry in the 1920s, like trying to sell his music to to these white men to get in it. And so anyway, as I went down this rabbit hole, I was just like, My God, I thought I was afraid I was going to have anything to say. But I I'm really touched by this topic.

Zell Williams: [00:03:09] Absolutely not. And this is the honest to God truth. I grew up in Fresno, California, in the Central Valley, and I, until I was nine years old, wanted to be a Ghostbuster. That was my high aspiration. I thought, you just have to move to New York because there is literally no place in America less like New York than Fresno, California. No disrespect to my hometown, but finally somebody was like, Oh, that's not real. You're not watching a documentary about busting, making them feel good. I basically I did I felt people I was like, What? What are these people do? And it's like, well, one of the one of these people is a comedian. One of these people is a writer. One of these people is a director. And so for a long time and trust me, I have let these aspirations go. Don't hate on me. I thought I wanted to be a comedian and I was too scared to do like comedy. And then I felt like, well, I guess I want to be an actor. And then I started acting and I was like, Well, I really don't. I'm not finding any plays that tell the kind of stories I want to tell. So I thought I'd be a director. And then I was like, Well, that's still directing other people's stuff. And I finally just started right before I met Jen in college. I started writing plays in Stockton when I was going to a community college up there, and I went across the street to a Barnes and Noble, and there was this brand new play that had been published and they don't publish plays. I don't know if you guys know this plays are not profitable at all, so they don't publish them that often unless you win a Pulitzer. And I go across the street and there's this brand new play that on the cover had the cast was mos def and Don Cheadle and I was like, What the fuck is this? Like Black Star of Mos Def? And I read it and it's Top Dog Underdog and it's by Suzan-Lori Parks, and it just really solidified like, Oh shit, you can write about black people today. It doesn't just have to be like, No and no disrespect, it doesn't just have to be August Wilson writing about like my parents and my grandparents. It doesn't just have to be like, you know, Lorraine Hansberry doing Raisin in the Sun. There is there are stories to be told about what I am going.

Zell Williams: [00:05:08] I Grew up and then I realized, Oh my God, the Ghostbusters are really conservative. They aren't listening to the DEA. They don't give a fuck about you. They only care about their small business. Like the Ghostbusters had some problems.

Zell Williams: [00:05:24] Oh, misconception that it's fun no. You know, it's funny. So I am a playwright originally, and back when I was a baby playwright, I was it was the start of like the golden age of television. And it was the tail end of people being like, Oh, you write for TV, you're a sellout. And like. And then it was just people, Let's see who Jason Grote wrote for Mad Men and frickin I can't think of I can't. Rajiv Joseph was writing for like, Nurse Jackie, all of these playwrights who have, like, careers and Pulitzers just for like, yeah, no, we like to have health care and eventually pay off these student loans we paid to get good at this shit and maybe a child and that. So the biggest misconception I guess I was sort of used to be is that like if you were a playwright writing in TV that you had sold out, which again, that's just us all. Like, I feel like every playwright is kind of like an industry plant in that way because we have this story of like, you know, oh, we came from the streets in New York or doing storefront theater in Chicago, and nobody came out. And then I got discovered by, I don't know, Ron Howard, let's say, and now I work in TV. Yeah. So that's that would be the biggest misconception. Also, I would say the other misconception is so like I said, I, I've known Jen since we were in college together. I don't know. I don't I won't give away how old we are. But it was a minute, it was a while ago. And I think that the other big misconception about like we're so next year when the play goes up, one of the things I'm already freaking out about is people being like this TV writer coming to write plays and it's like, No, no, no, that's not what it is. I was lentils and rice. I can't tell you how often that was dinner because that was what I could afford. And I think the misconception there is that the path of how you get to where you are when people start to notice you is how they define you, I would say. And to that point, I you know, I'm straight with you. I did not respect Cardi B as much as I now currently do. Before researching for this podcast, she didn't get where she is the quote unquote conventional way. But you know what? Mad respect for for where she is and how she did it and what it takes. Because you know what she did? She she sacrificed her body in some situations. She sacrificed her her her goals and like, changed all that.

Jennifer Field: [00:07:50] Imagine a rapper writing lyrics in their basement for years. He makes his own songs in his garage. He gains he or she gains a small but intense following. And after a lot of hard work and maybe a little bit of good luck, the right music executive hears their song and then bam, they have a song playing on every radio station and every Spotify playlist. Great story, right? This is like the music's version of the Hollywood dream. But what if it was all fake? This rapper is not writing lyrics in their basement or their garage for years coming from the ground up. What if? What if their success was preordained? In other words, what if they were industry plants?

Dwayne Perkins: [00:08:35] Yes, people do. The short answer is yes, It's because people are not in an industry like Derrick Lu, the actor. Right. Or is it Luke? I always forget his last name, but like his back story, they say Denzel discovered him in like a drugstore or some some store on a lot. And it's like, if you don't know, you don't know, right? You know what I mean? And that's the hardest thing, is once you have any access to the industry, you don't want to shatter regular people's civilians sort of dreams and how they perceive things, you know, like,

Dwayne Perkins: [00:09:28] But what is an industry plan? We're referencing it. We need to, I guess, define it. According to an article we found on Complex, the link is in the show notes. They explain the industry plant in this way. An artist who is being groomed and developed away from the public eye by a label only to be placed in a spotlight inorganically with a hit song or a moment. Here's another definition we found on the YouTube video titled The Real Truth About Industry Plants also link in the show notes an artist who presents themselves as independent or self-made, but actually has the resources of some larger power, i.e. a label backing them. The Real Truth video broke down two of the most common criteria for identifying an industry plan, and they are someone with the backing of a label, someone who had preexisting connections or money through their family. The key part to know is that an artist's artist fame success is not authentic and discredits any talent or hard work and insinuates that the artist in question is fake and merely a product of a highly successful marketing machine. 152ee80cbc

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