Our humble adventurers discuss the Anthropocene, a term that might be the name of the current period of time we live in, in the first of what eventually may be a series of side quests.

Link to the presentation on Google Slides.

Episode Breakdown:

• We jump right into the main subject - the Anthropocene. Here are the main parts in today’s talk:

• The Anthropocene - an Introduction (00:02:50).

• The Geological Time Scale (00:04:54).

• Humanity and the Global System (00:13:10).

• Suggested Starting Points (00:22:23).

• Should it be Formalized? (00:28:26).

• Current Status (00:32:40).

• Personal Thoughts (00:34:20).

• Once the presentation is over, we move on to a discussion about all the questions that popped in our heads (00:35:35).

• We summarize our feelings (01:05:09).

• We talk about where the idea for this side-quest came from and about future side-quests (01:07:50).

• We then preview the subject of our next episode - Joss Whedon’s Firefly and Serenity (01:11:45).

• Stick around and listen to a promo clip for the awesome It's Murder Up North Podcast (@murderupnorth), an amazing true crime podcast that focuses on the northern parts of England (01:14:38).

The episode was recorded on April 3rd, and originally released on May 3rd, 2020.

Episode Transcript

This has been automatically generated, please forgive any mistakes.

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[Music]

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hello and welcome to the culture quest

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we are but humble adventurers and today

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we are going on a side quest with me as

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always our Peter hello and Baryo hi hi

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and I am Ynon thank you the listeners

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at home for taking part in our noble

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quest so before we get into this let me

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explain what we're going to be doing

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today usually we all watch a movie or

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read a book or listen to an album and

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then we discuss it on the episode this

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time I've been reading up on this

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subject that I was very interested in

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and I'm gonna tell you guys all about it

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it's important mentioned that I've

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prepared a presentation to go along with

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this episode now you should be just fine

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without it

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if you just want to listen but it might

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be fun to follow along so in the show

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notes you'll find a link to the

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presentation both on Google slides and

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on YouTube both of the versions should

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be accessible from any device that you

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may have any way I try to make this both

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interesting and fun so let's get right

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into it yeah yeah okay so um my

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presentation is called the Anthropocene

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or the aid of man I'm going to introduce

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to you this very interesting subject

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that touches you know mainly geology and

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some environmental and earth sciences

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feel free to stop me and ask questions

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whenever you want and let's get into it

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so here's what we're gonna be talking

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about today I'll start by introducing

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the idea of the Anthropocene now what it

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stands for where it came from and if

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you've heard the term before you might

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know that it's a term that was suggested

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as a name for the geological time period

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in which we are currently living it as

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you will see the term is still not

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formal in the scientific world it's

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still just a suggestion because it has a

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lot to do with geology we'll talk for a

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short while about the geological

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timescale in Earth's history then to

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understand why the Anthropocene is even

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an idea we'll talk about the

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interactions between humanity in the

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global system if the term is ever

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formalized then the time period of the

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Anthropocene has to have a starting

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point so I'll present a few suggested

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possibilities

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then after I've introduced all of these

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aspects we'll talk about whether it

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should be formalized or not I'll present

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a few pros and cons and then to end the

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presentation I'll share a few personal

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thoughts about the infra passing and

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then we'll discuss it

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so as I've briefly mentioned before the

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Anthropocene is a term that is proposed

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to be used for the name of the

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geological epoch that we currently live

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in now it seems today that humanity it's

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such a major factor in the global system

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that we influence it on every level so

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much so that there's evidence that our

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impact is taking us out of the Earth's

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system typical of the Holocene epoch

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we'll talk about the Holocene in just a

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second I'll explain what it is but the

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main idea is that humanity has caused

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changes to the world there are not

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natural if you will and so it has been

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suggested to name the current epoch

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after us the intrapersonal ette stalk

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about the terms etymology the terms made

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of two words anthropo which in ancient

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greek means human we've talked about

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that word a while back I think in our

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trivia episode we weren't sure if

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anthropology 'men or maybe it's bigger

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than that maybe it's something else so

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now we know and through PO is

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specifically for humans it's also used

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in anthropology the study of humans the

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second part of the word scene so the

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scene comes from the ancient Greek word

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knose meaning new or recent also used in

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the Holocene which again I'll talk about

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in a second so the term Anthropocene was

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first suggested by now Paul Crutzen

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and Nobel Prize laureate in a paper

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called simply the entropy scene which

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came out in the year 2000 before his

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suggestion of the term other terms were

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suggested some examples are the newest

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fear which means the sphere of Reason

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the entropy zoic era or the anthracene

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but basically it is accepted that these

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suggestions are based on specific

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aspects of humanity's impact on the

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global system it's also believed that

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these terms were suggested before we

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could really understand all the aspects

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of our impact on the global system so

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I'm going to try and show that the

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Anthropocene is meant as an

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all-encompassing term which puts it in a

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of a different level than the other

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terms let's talk about geology and

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figure out what the geological timescale

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is the geological timescale is a system

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of chronological dating that is used to

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describe the timing and relationships of

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events in Earth's history the basic time

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units are Eon era period epoch and age

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if you're looking at the presentation on

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the right side of the screen you'll see

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the Earth's history in the geological

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time scale format and it's important to

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note that like the definition mentions

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each of these time periods was not just

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arbitrarily chosen they were defined

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based on evidence that was left usually

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by a major event I'll go over the time

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scale a little bit specifically in a bit

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so who decides what counts as a period

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of its own and when it begins and ends

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so let me introduce to you the

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International Commission on stratigraphy

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or the ICS stratigraphy is the branch of

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geology concerned with the order and

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relative positions of the layers of

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sediment and the relationship to the

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geological time scale the ICS is primary

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objective is to define global units of

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the International and chrono

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stratigraphic chart that in turn are the

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basis of the International geologic time

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scale so after Kristen's suggestion

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gained traction

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in 2008 the Anthropocene working group

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was established as an ICS sub unit the

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Anthropocene working group or the AWG

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their role is to advise on the frontal

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ization of the term and suggest clear

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markers that can signify possible

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starting points to the Anthropocene

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let's quickly go over Earth's history

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and see basically how it works I'm going

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to go through it without really going

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too deep there's a lot more to say about

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each bit of it but not all of it is

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relevant to the intrapersonal so between

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four and a half billion to four billion

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years ago the earth was in the Hadean

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Eon obviously a lot was different back

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then

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the atmosphere was rich in carbon

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dioxide the atmospheric pressure was

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very high

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and it was very hot the average surface

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temperature on the earth was 230 Celsius

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or 446 Fahrenheit the earth was covered

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by liquid oceans and if you're wondering

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how liquid oceans were possible in such

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a hot environment well the answer is

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that the atmospheric pressure was 27

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times higher than it is today and that

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affects the boiling temperature of the

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water the Hadean Eon is named after

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Hades the Greek god of the underworld

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that's a just a nice little tidbit there

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how all the researchers realized that

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that time was I mean is this according

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to like layers within the earth or

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definitely all of these eons all of

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these time periods were determined by

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layers in the strata the oldest stones

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oldest rocks that we can find on the

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earth have markers that kind of point to

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that being the case you can see specific

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minerals that are they occur in nature

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only in these types of conditions okay

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yeah I get what you mean I guess it's

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also a function of how deep you can dig

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right definitely this is based on the

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best knowledge we can find so

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essentially like you can find for

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instance minerals which could only exist

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if for certain conditions and those

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conditions obviously they can use to

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sort of deduce other facts about the

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world at this time so that's how they

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would get sort of these probably more

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more definite sort of outcomes such as

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liquid water oceans covering the earth

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and stuff it's it's a big leap to go

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straight there but obviously there's

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probably a lot of precise measurements

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that come along the way yeah this is the

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because of the the sediments and

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everything keeps moving so a lot of the

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evidence gets recycled back into the

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middle of the earth so this is the part

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in Earth's history that we have the

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least amount of data on so maybe this is

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has a bit of guessing in it as well you

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can only really get the data on stuff

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that you can reverse-engineer you know

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if it's being washed out too many times

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and it's sort of lost isn't it no

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exactly

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so after the Hadean Eon we have

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archaean eon which started four billion

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years ago and it ended 2.5 billion years

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ago in the Archaean life on earth began

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there is evidence of the first organic

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molecules and in this neon bacteria have

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ruled the planet an interesting side

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note is stromatolites and these rock

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formations in the shallow waters are

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layered columns formed by the growth of

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layer upon layer of cyanobacteria

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fossilized stromatolite surround the

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world are the records of the ancient

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life on Earth so basically you know a

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few bacteria settled down and generation

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after generation they built on top of

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each other until we have these

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stromatolites we can still find some of

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these fossilized all around I think we

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have some in the Caribbean some in

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Australia but there are places we can

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still find these bacteria and growing in

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this type of form do you know much more

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about the prokaryotic cells is a that is

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before the eukaryotic did you say

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exactly prokaryotic they're the basic

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type of cells they're one celled life

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forms basically they don't have

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organelles eukaryotic life forms which

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comes a little bit later they're more

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complex they have organelles that have

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specific functions within the cell but

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anyway that's not a bacteria I mentioned

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with forming these from analytes they've

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also started harvesting

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solar energy and atmospheric carbon in a

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process known as photosynthesis that

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process for the synthesis is still

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widely used today the products of

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photosynthesis is you know our sugar

0:10:44.760,0:10:50.120

which is used to store energy and dye

0:10:47.070,0:10:52.160

oxygen or o2 the oxygen that we breathe

0:10:50.120,0:10:55.709

which is released into the atmosphere

0:10:52.160,0:10:57.390

it's a byproduct of photosynthesis the

0:10:55.709,0:10:59.310

oxygen released by the santa bacteria

0:10:57.390,0:11:01.110

started accumulating in the waters and

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then it was released into the atmosphere

0:11:01.110,0:11:06.450

and that caused the atmosphere to change

0:11:04.529,0:11:08.880

from a weakly reducing atmosphere to an

0:11:06.450,0:11:10.770

oxidizing atmosphere basically in the

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accumulation of oxygen in the atmosphere

0:11:10.770,0:11:15.990

has led to the extinction of almost all

0:11:13.740,0:11:18.540

life on Earth in what is known as the

0:11:15.990,0:11:21.720

great oxygenation event Wow yeah that

0:11:18.540,0:11:25.170

was a huge mass extinction which has led

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into the proterozoic eon that occurred

0:11:25.170,0:11:32.100

2.5 billion years ago and point 5 4

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billion years ago or 540 million years

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ago in the Proterozoic more complex and

0:11:35.339,0:11:40.769

multicellular life forms began to evolve

0:11:37.290,0:11:44.129

and the ozone layer stabilized we see

0:11:40.769,0:11:46.889

the rise of invertebrates fish fungi

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land plants reptiles conifers dinosaurs

0:11:46.889,0:11:52.110

and birds and during the Proterozoic a

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few mass extinctions have happened as

0:11:52.110,0:11:57.149

well these mass extinctions kind of

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separate the Proterozoic into subunits

0:11:57.149,0:12:02.250

which I'm not going to mention right now

0:11:58.610,0:12:04.439

but you can find that information after

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the Proterozoic we have the phanerozoic

0:12:04.439,0:12:10.500

which started 540 million years ago and

0:12:07.829,0:12:13.079

it's still going today this is the

0:12:10.500,0:12:14.939

current Eon we live in so I'll go into

0:12:13.079,0:12:17.879

smaller units of time until we get to

0:12:14.939,0:12:21.899

current time so the phanerozoic eon has

0:12:17.879,0:12:23.939

seen much animal in plant life 66

0:12:21.899,0:12:25.920

million years ago there was the last

0:12:23.939,0:12:28.829

mass extinction which marks the

0:12:25.920,0:12:31.399

beginning of the Cenozoic era since then

0:12:28.829,0:12:35.129

mammals have diversified and grew larger

0:12:31.399,0:12:37.649

the last 2.5 million years or so are

0:12:35.129,0:12:39.720

known as the Pleistocene epoch which is

0:12:37.649,0:12:44.100

defined by alternating ice and dry

0:12:39.720,0:12:47.160

periods around 11,000 and 700 years ago

0:12:44.100,0:12:48.980

the last ice age ended which marks the

0:12:47.160,0:12:51.480

starting point of the Holocene epoch

0:12:48.980,0:12:54.569

which is a time period we officially

0:12:51.480,0:12:57.209

live in today in the Holocene mankind

0:12:54.569,0:12:59.430

has started farming mining expanding and

0:12:57.209,0:13:03.899

creating new technologies which brings

0:12:59.430,0:13:05.730

us to today let's talk about humanity in

0:13:03.899,0:13:08.610

the global system about the interactions

0:13:05.730,0:13:10.259

between us in the world earlier I

0:13:08.610,0:13:13.050

mentioned the great oxygenation event

0:13:10.259,0:13:15.180

never since that event has one species

0:13:13.050,0:13:18.209

had such an impact on the global system

0:13:15.180,0:13:19.800

if you remember almost all life on Earth

0:13:18.209,0:13:22.800

was extinct

0:13:19.800,0:13:24.959

anyway humanity might not cause the

0:13:22.800,0:13:27.720

extinction of almost all life-forms on

0:13:24.959,0:13:30.630

earth but so far our impact on the earth

0:13:27.720,0:13:32.670

has definitely been global the main

0:13:30.630,0:13:35.580

reasons are the exponential growth in

0:13:32.670,0:13:38.520

human population and the fact that our

0:13:35.580,0:13:40.370

technology advances in leaps and the

0:13:38.520,0:13:43.890

amount of resources we require is

0:13:40.370,0:13:45.720

ever-expanding until very recently we've

0:13:43.890,0:13:47.430

been burning fossil fuels using up

0:13:45.720,0:13:49.560

resources without considering any

0:13:47.430,0:13:52.260

externalities as if our energy

0:13:49.560,0:13:55.080

consumption is clean and these resources

0:13:52.260,0:13:56.820

are unlimited but now we believe that

0:13:55.080,0:13:59.070

some of the global changes to the

0:13:56.820,0:14:00.990

environment will be in place for you

0:13:59.070,0:14:03.810

know on millennia or more some of these

0:14:00.990,0:14:05.550

effects may be permanent let me go over

0:14:03.810,0:14:07.530

a few examples of changes in the global

0:14:05.550,0:14:10.650

system the war brought on by humanity

0:14:07.530,0:14:12.570

I'm not gonna go over a lot of these

0:14:10.650,0:14:15.660

examples but if you're interested you

0:14:12.570,0:14:17.610

can go on the aw geez website the

0:14:15.660,0:14:21.210

Anthropocene working group they have a

0:14:17.610,0:14:22.560

lot of information there the first thing

0:14:21.210,0:14:24.570

that comes to mind when discussing

0:14:22.560,0:14:27.180

Humanity in the environment is climate

0:14:24.570,0:14:29.700

change it's caused mainly by fossil fuel

0:14:27.180,0:14:31.790

burning and gas emissions that have

0:14:29.700,0:14:34.650

occurred in the last two centuries or so

0:14:31.790,0:14:36.540

the changes in climate patterns caused

0:14:34.650,0:14:39.750

animals to change migration patterns

0:14:36.540,0:14:41.300

invade new habitats which makes a lot of

0:14:39.750,0:14:45.090

ecological systems lose their balance

0:14:41.300,0:14:47.010

this may all seem kind of distant and

0:14:45.090,0:14:48.660

tolerable but the breakdown of

0:14:47.010,0:14:51.030

ecological systems may have far-reaching

0:14:48.660,0:14:53.640

effects such as extinctions and droughts

0:14:51.030,0:14:55.560

of course it's worth preserving these

0:14:53.640,0:14:56.940

psychological systems just for the sake

0:14:55.560,0:14:59.100

of not destroying everything we touch

0:14:56.940,0:15:00.540

but I can't want to emphasize the fact

0:14:59.100,0:15:03.600

that it will eventually come back to

0:15:00.540,0:15:05.130

bite us we rely on these ecosystems and

0:15:03.600,0:15:08.160

food change for all kinds of resources

0:15:05.130,0:15:09.810

and natural services a great example for

0:15:08.160,0:15:11.780

that is the fact that climate change is

0:15:09.810,0:15:14.280

connected with ocean acidification which

0:15:11.780,0:15:17.070

directly leads to the decline of coral

0:15:14.280,0:15:19.140

and algae communities these are at the

0:15:17.070,0:15:21.120

base of very important ecosystems that

0:15:19.140,0:15:24.300

will be affected these ecosystems

0:15:21.120,0:15:25.830

produce massive amounts of oxygen while

0:15:24.300,0:15:28.890

also responsible for carbon dioxide

0:15:25.830,0:15:31.740

fixation which is basically removing co2

0:15:28.890,0:15:33.140

from the atmosphere they provide plenty

0:15:31.740,0:15:36.000

of nutrients to a lot of species

0:15:33.140,0:15:38.370

eventually some of them with fish and

0:15:36.000,0:15:41.010

rely on its food sources another thing

0:15:38.370,0:15:43.890

is that briefs built by corals provided

0:15:41.010,0:15:46.740

us with coastal protection and also they

0:15:43.890,0:15:48.690

have immense economical values mostly in

0:15:46.740,0:15:49.510

the form of tourism all of that would

0:15:48.690,0:15:52.029

just vanish

0:15:49.510,0:15:54.100

with them basically these coral reefs

0:15:52.029,0:15:56.110

have have a bunch of stuff that they

0:15:54.100,0:15:59.680

provide us with a bunch of natural

0:15:56.110,0:16:02.500

services that we would just not have if

0:15:59.680,0:16:04.269

they all died another impact we have on

0:16:02.500,0:16:07.630

the world is sediment erosion and

0:16:04.269,0:16:10.300

transport like sediment is always eroded

0:16:07.630,0:16:13.060

by rain and weather and it's always

0:16:10.300,0:16:15.010

transported by rivers and stuff but it's

0:16:13.060,0:16:16.750

estimated that the rates of sediment

0:16:15.010,0:16:18.370

erosion and transport have increased by

0:16:16.750,0:16:20.740

an order of magnitude due to

0:16:18.370,0:16:23.019

urbanization and agriculture these

0:16:20.740,0:16:24.910

heightened processes cause surface water

0:16:23.019,0:16:27.370

pollution and reservoirs siltation

0:16:24.910,0:16:30.279

and changes in river morphology which

0:16:27.370,0:16:32.139

all directly affects people who rely on

0:16:30.279,0:16:35.350

these water sources for drinking and

0:16:32.139,0:16:37.630

agriculture it also causes muddy floods

0:16:35.350,0:16:40.089

which can damage roads clogged sewers

0:16:37.630,0:16:42.279

and destroy private property that's

0:16:40.089,0:16:45.430

again something that is caused directly

0:16:42.279,0:16:47.980

by human activity our impact is also

0:16:45.430,0:16:50.019

noticed in aspects that are less

0:16:47.980,0:16:52.870

noticeable to the naked eye there are

0:16:50.019,0:16:55.480

many biogeochemical cycles of elements

0:16:52.870,0:16:57.399

that are disturbed in nature elements

0:16:55.480,0:16:59.410

and compounds basically go through a

0:16:57.399,0:17:01.329

cycle in which they appear and are used

0:16:59.410,0:17:03.970

in different forms in the ecosystem a

0:17:01.329,0:17:06.850

very simplified example is the water

0:17:03.970,0:17:08.730

cycle so basically you have the oceans

0:17:06.850,0:17:11.829

and rivers which are reservoirs of water

0:17:08.730,0:17:14.309

the Sun provides energy that drives its

0:17:11.829,0:17:16.780

cycle and the water in the reservoir

0:17:14.309,0:17:19.540

evaporates into the atmosphere condenses

0:17:16.780,0:17:22.150

into clouds precipitates as rain snow or

0:17:19.540,0:17:25.929

hail and flows back into the reservoirs

0:17:22.150,0:17:28.690

so a lot of compounds go through similar

0:17:25.929,0:17:32.049

cycles which a lot of systems rely on

0:17:28.690,0:17:34.090

these cycles and today we know that many

0:17:32.049,0:17:36.100

of these cycles are disturbed by

0:17:34.090,0:17:38.770

anthropogenic influence and basically a

0:17:36.100,0:17:41.080

human activity an example for that is

0:17:38.770,0:17:45.280

the carbon cycle we he used to have

0:17:41.080,0:17:47.169

between 260 to 280 five parts per

0:17:45.280,0:17:50.440

million of carbon dioxide in the

0:17:47.169,0:17:53.620

atmosphere and that was fairly stable

0:17:50.440,0:17:54.960

between 7,000 years ago until the the

0:17:53.620,0:17:57.490

beginning of the Industrial Revolution

0:17:54.960,0:18:01.030

since the Industrial Revolution till

0:17:57.490,0:18:02.090

today over 400 parts per million in the

0:18:01.030,0:18:06.050

atmosphere

0:18:02.090,0:18:09.320

basically it used to be around 260 280

0:18:06.050,0:18:12.080

for 7,000 years until we started using

0:18:09.320,0:18:14.510

engines and steam engines and all kinds

0:18:12.080,0:18:18.380

of technology and its rising since then

0:18:14.510,0:18:20.240

and carbon is known to be a greenhouse

0:18:18.380,0:18:20.570

gas sorry I'll just I'll just cut you

0:18:20.240,0:18:22.730

off

0:18:20.570,0:18:25.570

back when we're in what back when I was

0:18:22.730,0:18:28.370

in high school we got on the young one

0:18:25.570,0:18:30.320

basically every day was like the teacher

0:18:28.370,0:18:33.230

trying to prove climate change to us and

0:18:30.320,0:18:35.240

by the end of like year 12 which is the

0:18:33.230,0:18:37.970

second year upper school in Australia it

0:18:35.240,0:18:40.040

was like everyone was sort of on board

0:18:37.970,0:18:42.740

at that point it was just undeniable and

0:18:40.040,0:18:45.350

we'd always check the parts per million

0:18:42.740,0:18:48.560

for the carbon dioxide and stuff and I

0:18:45.350,0:18:51.890

think I'm not sure the exact date but I

0:18:48.560,0:18:54.200

remember like it was during my learning

0:18:51.890,0:18:56.240

that it went over 400 parts per million

0:18:54.200,0:18:58.400

it was a bit of a car milestone bad

0:18:56.240,0:19:00.800

milestone but still last night these

0:18:58.400,0:19:03.530

measurements were taken in maan Aloha in

0:19:00.800,0:19:06.730

Hawaii I think they started in 1957 and

0:19:03.530,0:19:10.160

they noticed the rise of carbon dioxide

0:19:06.730,0:19:12.970

concentration the evidence for the 7000

0:19:10.160,0:19:16.280

years of basically stable carbon

0:19:12.970,0:19:18.200

concentrations are from ice cores from

0:19:16.280,0:19:20.060

Antarctic and stuff yeah because you can

0:19:18.200,0:19:22.160

just dig down and then you pretty much

0:19:20.060,0:19:24.950

have a time capsule second for exactly

0:19:22.160,0:19:27.110

you want basically have it frozen do we

0:19:24.950,0:19:28.850

know what happened before 7000 or is

0:19:27.110,0:19:30.980

that just the way we can get it from the

0:19:28.850,0:19:34.490

ice I think there's evidence that goes

0:19:30.980,0:19:37.760

back and we know that there is a cycle

0:19:34.490,0:19:40.250

that goes up and down in terms of carbon

0:19:37.760,0:19:43.460

dioxide concentrations like I think peak

0:19:40.250,0:19:46.040

levels were 1200 ppm Wow

0:19:43.460,0:19:48.320

but the thing is that by looking at

0:19:46.040,0:19:50.720

these evidence you can see how much time

0:19:48.320,0:19:54.050

it takes for the carbon to build up in a

0:19:50.720,0:19:55.940

natural way and the rate of carbon

0:19:54.050,0:19:59.570

dioxide accumulation in our atmosphere

0:19:55.940,0:20:01.520

is is nothing natural it's wild it's so

0:19:59.570,0:20:03.740

much faster than it would be naturally

0:20:01.520,0:20:06.440

hypothetically if you were to map this

0:20:03.740,0:20:08.510

on a graph every day would just be it

0:20:06.440,0:20:12.890

should be almost the same like it would

0:20:08.510,0:20:15.779

be 350 351 351 for like a million days

0:20:12.890,0:20:18.479

and then you would go up by one more and

0:20:15.779,0:20:21.359

another million days but us it's going

0:20:18.479,0:20:23.099

up like significantly like in a hundred

0:20:21.359,0:20:26.580

years it's going up like you would never

0:20:23.099,0:20:29.039

get in before the Industrial Revolution

0:20:26.580,0:20:31.409

you'd never have any period where we got

0:20:29.039,0:20:33.299

this this quickly and it's basically

0:20:31.409,0:20:35.399

like if you zoom out on this graph and

0:20:33.299,0:20:38.099

you look at the last few million years

0:20:35.399,0:20:39.719

or so it'll look like Hills you know it

0:20:38.099,0:20:42.479

goes up it goes down it goes up it goes

0:20:39.719,0:20:44.669

down but then you reach the Industrial

0:20:42.479,0:20:46.529

Revolution and there's a spike by almost

0:20:44.669,0:20:48.330

immediately as well exactly well pretty

0:20:46.529,0:20:51.089

much immediately because a hundred years

0:20:48.330,0:20:53.219

unlike a time scale applies nothing is

0:20:51.089,0:20:56.389

really nothing yet another interesting

0:20:53.219,0:20:59.070

cycle that we've interrupted is the

0:20:56.389,0:21:00.899

nitrogen cycle the concentration of

0:20:59.070,0:21:02.849

reactive nitrogen in the atmosphere has

0:21:00.899,0:21:05.759

risen by a hundred and twenty percent

0:21:02.849,0:21:07.349

since 1913 the year in which we have

0:21:05.759,0:21:10.409

started to use the haber-bosch process

0:21:07.349,0:21:12.059

as a nitrogen fixation process which

0:21:10.409,0:21:14.129

provides us with ammonia which is used

0:21:12.059,0:21:16.200

in many industries it's basically a

0:21:14.129,0:21:20.070

process that allows us to fix nitrogen

0:21:16.200,0:21:21.899

from all kinds of sources and we use

0:21:20.070,0:21:24.149

this nitrogen for a bunch of different

0:21:21.899,0:21:26.099

purposes and another interesting thing

0:21:24.149,0:21:28.200

is a concentration of phosphorous in

0:21:26.099,0:21:31.889

soils which has doubled due to

0:21:28.200,0:21:33.869

fertilizer use now both the nitrogen and

0:21:31.889,0:21:36.899

phosphorus that are used in fertilizers

0:21:33.869,0:21:38.849

and in different industries they end up

0:21:36.899,0:21:40.739

in bodies of water you know you put them

0:21:38.849,0:21:43.019

in the earth you put too much fertilizer

0:21:40.739,0:21:45.629

and everything that's not used up by

0:21:43.019,0:21:49.529

nature which is bodies of water which is

0:21:45.629,0:21:52.739

a cause of unification a state of being

0:21:49.529,0:21:55.349

overly rich in nutrients that causes

0:21:52.739,0:21:57.450

algae blooms and oxygen deficiencies

0:21:55.349,0:21:59.580

which affect the microbiota in the body

0:21:57.450,0:22:02.399

of water sometimes in extreme cases it

0:21:59.580,0:22:05.070

even affects the microbiota basically

0:22:02.399,0:22:07.229

the things we take for granted like

0:22:05.070,0:22:09.739

fertilizer use and you know buying

0:22:07.229,0:22:12.539

bleach and ammonia for home use

0:22:09.739,0:22:15.730

eventually just causes changes that can

0:22:12.539,0:22:18.280

really topple ecological systems

0:22:15.730,0:22:21.580

I gave you three interactions between

0:22:18.280,0:22:23.650

humanity and and the world around us I

0:22:21.580,0:22:25.030

tried to basically establish a

0:22:23.650,0:22:27.940

connection between humanity and the

0:22:25.030,0:22:30.400

global system so let's move and talk

0:22:27.940,0:22:32.070

about a few practicalities when

0:22:30.400,0:22:35.110

considering the idea of the Anthropocene

0:22:32.070,0:22:37.000

so when you define a time period you

0:22:35.110,0:22:38.980

have to have a starting point to it you

0:22:37.000,0:22:41.380

can't just say okay now we're living in

0:22:38.980,0:22:43.060

the intrapersonal right and due to the

0:22:41.380,0:22:46.150

fact that time periods are connected by

0:22:43.060,0:22:48.190

major events usually extinctions being

0:22:46.150,0:22:49.510

the most common ones I think it kind of

0:22:48.190,0:22:51.220

puts in proposition in a weird

0:22:49.510,0:22:53.590

perspective you know we're comparing our

0:22:51.220,0:22:55.600

impact on the earth to major extinction

0:22:53.590,0:22:58.060

events now I'm not saying that this is

0:22:55.600,0:23:01.900

not a good comparison I just wanted to

0:22:58.060,0:23:04.300

emphasize that point so when defining a

0:23:01.900,0:23:07.360

new time period basically we're looking

0:23:04.300,0:23:09.970

for a golden spike in a golden spike is

0:23:07.360,0:23:12.820

a geologic marker created by a global

0:23:09.970,0:23:14.620

event that leads to long lasting global

0:23:12.820,0:23:16.770

changes that can be used to indicate a

0:23:14.620,0:23:19.660

change in a geologic time division

0:23:16.770,0:23:21.220

basically now a golden spike is

0:23:19.660,0:23:23.500

something that we can relate to a

0:23:21.220,0:23:25.750

specific time period and it's

0:23:23.500,0:23:27.370

geologically evident like we can see it

0:23:25.750,0:23:30.100

in the strata like I said earlier it's

0:23:27.370,0:23:31.330

not an arbitrary choice so when it comes

0:23:30.100,0:23:32.140

to the improper scene there are two

0:23:31.330,0:23:35.200

schools of thought

0:23:32.140,0:23:37.540

the first stands for choosing a point

0:23:35.200,0:23:39.640

that is in humanity's recent or earlier

0:23:37.540,0:23:42.220

past this is the starting point of the

0:23:39.640,0:23:43.900

infer person and the second stands for

0:23:42.220,0:23:46.570

choosing a point that is in the future

0:23:43.900,0:23:49.060

like one that we can point to is an

0:23:46.570,0:23:52.240

absolute point of no return but the

0:23:49.060,0:23:54.460

first one is much more popular it's much

0:23:52.240,0:23:57.100

more likely to be chosen out of the two

0:23:54.460,0:23:58.600

so I'll focus on that one so let's

0:23:57.100,0:24:00.520

discuss potential starting points and

0:23:58.600,0:24:02.590

markers or golden spikes for the

0:24:00.520,0:24:05.290

Anthropocene so a very popular

0:24:02.590,0:24:07.120

suggestion in the year 1950 there are

0:24:05.290,0:24:08.800

quite a few candidate markers for human

0:24:07.120,0:24:13.180

activity that stands for that time

0:24:08.800,0:24:16.510

period one big one is plastic it's been

0:24:13.180,0:24:18.910

mass-produced since around the 1950s it

0:24:16.510,0:24:21.430

is found now in almost every environment

0:24:18.910,0:24:24.280

on earth including the deepest parts of

0:24:21.430,0:24:26.380

the ocean there's this guy Victor Vasco

0:24:24.280,0:24:29.539

Bo he went down to Mariana Trench in

0:24:26.380,0:24:31.609

submersible vehicle and Mariana Trench

0:24:29.539,0:24:33.979

no that's the deepest point in the

0:24:31.609,0:24:35.570

world's ocean it's just under 11

0:24:33.979,0:24:37.519

kilometers

0:24:35.570,0:24:40.369

he claims that when he went down there

0:24:37.519,0:24:42.619

he found a plastic bag there and I think

0:24:40.369,0:24:44.869

that's the third report of plastic in

0:24:42.619,0:24:47.359

Mariana Trench basically we find plastic

0:24:44.869,0:24:49.519

everywhere and due to the fact that

0:24:47.359,0:24:51.590

plastic is an artificial product which

0:24:49.519,0:24:54.229

has a considerable effect on the

0:24:51.590,0:24:55.940

environment and it is long-lasting in

0:24:54.229,0:24:59.239

the environment so it's a very popular

0:24:55.940,0:25:02.749

potential marker no other possible

0:24:59.239,0:25:05.119

markers are aluminum and concrete both

0:25:02.749,0:25:07.669

are widely used the aluminum that we use

0:25:05.119,0:25:10.549

industrially is not naturally occurring

0:25:07.669,0:25:12.710

which makes it as artificial as plastic

0:25:10.549,0:25:14.479

and ninety-eight percent of the

0:25:12.710,0:25:18.080

production of aluminum took place after

0:25:14.479,0:25:20.269

the year 1950 concrete while invented by

0:25:18.080,0:25:22.940

the Romans sites uprise only after a

0:25:20.269,0:25:24.349

World War two both are suggested as

0:25:22.940,0:25:27.979

markers for the intrapersonal

0:25:24.349,0:25:29.929

- as techno fossils and one other very

0:25:27.979,0:25:32.629

interesting suggestion is nuclear

0:25:29.929,0:25:34.960

processes byproducts nuclear weapon

0:25:32.629,0:25:38.179

testing began in July of 1945

0:25:34.960,0:25:40.309

since then artificial radionuclides are

0:25:38.179,0:25:43.159

spread and detected in significantly

0:25:40.309,0:25:45.409

higher rates than before some of these

0:25:43.159,0:25:48.649

originating nuclear explosion testings

0:25:45.409,0:25:50.929

in 1952 others come from nuclear energy

0:25:48.649,0:25:53.539

production methods and other artificial

0:25:50.929,0:25:55.220

processes a suggestion for another

0:25:53.539,0:25:56.749

starting point is the beginning of the

0:25:55.220,0:26:00.109

Industrial Revolution and the invention

0:25:56.749,0:26:01.580

of the steam engine it's considered to

0:26:00.109,0:26:03.639

be the point at which our technologies

0:26:01.580,0:26:06.529

started developing at an increased rate

0:26:03.639,0:26:08.869

the very first interference with the

0:26:06.529,0:26:11.330

greenhouse gases balance started at this

0:26:08.869,0:26:13.580

point in time which ties it tightly with

0:26:11.330,0:26:17.090

global warming a staple of the entropies

0:26:13.580,0:26:18.799

him there are a few specific dates in

0:26:17.090,0:26:22.099

consideration all in the 18th century

0:26:18.799,0:26:23.539

and another third suggestion is setting

0:26:22.099,0:26:26.869

the starting of the entropies in

0:26:23.539,0:26:29.090

eight to twelve thousand years ago this

0:26:26.869,0:26:31.970

suggestion is based on the time period

0:26:29.090,0:26:34.489

in which farming became widely used by

0:26:31.970,0:26:36.619

the suggested starting point around

0:26:34.489,0:26:38.480

eight thousand years ago humans have

0:26:36.619,0:26:40.879

reached every habitable continent

0:26:38.480,0:26:43.950

farming and agricultural techniques have

0:26:40.879,0:26:46.020

began to make their impact on the earth

0:26:43.950,0:26:48.900

the main example is clearing of land for

0:26:46.020,0:26:51.090

agriculture and animal husbandry which

0:26:48.900,0:26:53.610

both have influenced habitats and

0:26:51.090,0:26:57.020

biodiversity and basically have led to

0:26:53.610,0:27:00.480

extinctions science shows that around

0:26:57.020,0:27:03.180

83% of wild mammals have disappeared

0:27:00.480,0:27:04.980

since the beginning of civilization both

0:27:03.180,0:27:07.380

due to decreased populations after the

0:27:04.980,0:27:10.560

recent Ice Age and also pressure from

0:27:07.380,0:27:12.810

hunting so remember the Anthropocene is

0:27:10.560,0:27:15.780

based on our impact on the global system

0:27:12.810,0:27:17.940

and an example of an extinction that

0:27:15.780,0:27:21.030

these ancient humans caused that had

0:27:17.940,0:27:23.370

far-reaching impacts is the de proton or

0:27:21.030,0:27:26.940

the giant wombat Peter have you ever

0:27:23.370,0:27:29.670

heard of it I think I have it was in

0:27:26.940,0:27:31.650

Australia yep I just looked up the de

0:27:29.670,0:27:34.950

protozoan you know it's like the size of

0:27:31.650,0:27:37.410

a mammoth maybe tiny bit smaller smidge

0:27:34.950,0:27:40.230

more so why isn't giant one that same

0:27:37.410,0:27:43.560

size very very big great though very

0:27:40.230,0:27:45.330

cute it's a species that is believed to

0:27:43.560,0:27:48.210

have kept the biomass levels in

0:27:45.330,0:27:50.250

Australia's Bush under control after it

0:27:48.210,0:27:52.050

was driven to extinction the wild flora

0:27:50.250,0:27:54.570

is believed to have grown uncontrollably

0:27:52.050,0:27:56.640

leading to a series of widespread bush

0:27:54.570,0:27:59.520

fires that have caused degradation of

0:27:56.640,0:28:00.960

habitats and further extinctions and I

0:27:59.520,0:28:02.960

think like you know you sometimes hear

0:28:00.960,0:28:05.700

about the an idea that stands for

0:28:02.960,0:28:07.650

returning to our roots or returning to

0:28:05.700,0:28:10.230

nature as if back then we lived in

0:28:07.650,0:28:12.810

harmony with nature and if that balance

0:28:10.230,0:28:14.550

was only recently interrupted but our

0:28:12.810,0:28:17.520

influence on nature is apparent for

0:28:14.550,0:28:20.250

thousands of years back for better for

0:28:17.520,0:28:21.840

worse let's move along and talk about

0:28:20.250,0:28:24.930

the formalization of the intrapersonal

0:28:21.840,0:28:26.970

so it goes without saying but there is

0:28:24.930,0:28:29.070

some opposition to the formalization of

0:28:26.970,0:28:30.990

the term you know some geologists claim

0:28:29.070,0:28:33.870

that there isn't enough evidence for

0:28:30.990,0:28:36.300

humanity's impact on nature basically

0:28:33.870,0:28:38.070

other time periods having easily had

0:28:36.300,0:28:40.410

hundreds of thousands or even millions

0:28:38.070,0:28:43.980

of years to accumulate markers in

0:28:40.410,0:28:47.310

comparison the Anthropocene is basically

0:28:43.980,0:28:49.920

still very young some say and rightly so

0:28:47.310,0:28:52.350

the the time periods were always named

0:28:49.920,0:28:54.420

retro actively and that has advantages

0:28:52.350,0:28:56.690

like we might still be only taking the

0:28:54.420,0:28:59.060

first few steps in a new age in

0:28:56.690,0:29:00.530

me guess how things will break out and

0:28:59.060,0:29:03.650

what will be the defining features of

0:29:00.530,0:29:06.470

this time period and some even claim

0:29:03.650,0:29:08.960

that the Holocene is in a way already

0:29:06.470,0:29:11.000

the age of men the Holocene like I

0:29:08.960,0:29:13.760

mentioned earlier is started when the

0:29:11.000,0:29:16.040

last ice age ended but nothing sets it

0:29:13.760,0:29:17.840

apart from earlier interglacial periods

0:29:16.040,0:29:20.390

except the propagation of humanity in

0:29:17.840,0:29:22.790

the spread of Agriculture so basically

0:29:20.390,0:29:26.780

the only thing that separates the

0:29:22.790,0:29:28.580

Holocene from other dry periods is us so

0:29:26.780,0:29:30.980

why not call the Holocene the age of men

0:29:28.580,0:29:33.290

but well Anthropocene supporters claims

0:29:30.980,0:29:34.910

that the difference is that the Holocene

0:29:33.290,0:29:38.390

starting point wasn't directly

0:29:34.910,0:29:41.030

influenced by humanity and another

0:29:38.390,0:29:43.340

interesting claim is that talking about

0:29:41.030,0:29:43.880

the Anthropocene is a waste of time and

0:29:43.340,0:29:46.910

resources

0:29:43.880,0:29:48.680

basically naming this time period won't

0:29:46.910,0:29:51.830

change the way we do science you know

0:29:48.680,0:29:53.900

it's just a name we are already using

0:29:51.830,0:29:56.360

the suggested markers as measurements of

0:29:53.900,0:29:58.460

environmental factors another thing

0:29:56.360,0:30:00.680

about this term is that it basically

0:29:58.460,0:30:02.720

outgrew its roots in the field of

0:30:00.680,0:30:05.300

geology and which might be a bit of a

0:30:02.720,0:30:08.000

problem the term became somewhat popular

0:30:05.300,0:30:09.410

in the scientific world I myself you

0:30:08.000,0:30:12.020

know as an environmental and Earth

0:30:09.410,0:30:14.240

Sciences students I see the term pop up

0:30:12.020,0:30:17.180

in scientific papers like every once in

0:30:14.240,0:30:20.210

a while and you know it's used as if

0:30:17.180,0:30:22.790

it's already a formal thing in the AWG

0:30:20.210,0:30:24.890

is made up of geologists who think in

0:30:22.790,0:30:26.780

geological terms and some claim that

0:30:24.890,0:30:29.420

they don't represent the scientific

0:30:26.780,0:30:31.700

community as a whole and in addition the

0:30:29.420,0:30:34.220

term is mostly used in Europe and

0:30:31.700,0:30:37.100

America and so there's a fear that it's

0:30:34.220,0:30:38.990

becoming this western term and some

0:30:37.100,0:30:41.420

aspects of non-western societies might

0:30:38.990,0:30:43.880

be overlooked by it but on the other

0:30:41.420,0:30:45.970

hand some say that you know it's a good

0:30:43.880,0:30:48.890

thing that the term outgrew its roots

0:30:45.970,0:30:50.810

it's considered to be this single word

0:30:48.890,0:30:53.570

that stands for all of your managers

0:30:50.810,0:30:55.670

interactions with the earth you know the

0:30:53.570,0:30:58.130

term sparks conversations that touch

0:30:55.670,0:31:01.880

geology environmental and earth sciences

0:30:58.130,0:31:03.800

it considers local and global factors it

0:31:01.880,0:31:06.410

contemplates both the past the present

0:31:03.800,0:31:08.990

and the future and so it's it's become

0:31:06.410,0:31:10.730

this all-encompassing term that includes

0:31:08.990,0:31:13.100

a number of ideas

0:31:10.730,0:31:14.690

a number of concepts something that puts

0:31:13.100,0:31:16.790

it apart from previous suggestions to

0:31:14.690,0:31:18.919

renaming the current time period as I

0:31:16.790,0:31:20.990

mentioned earlier another thing another

0:31:18.919,0:31:23.360

Pro is that the effect that this term

0:31:20.990,0:31:25.820

has will probably be strengthened by

0:31:23.360,0:31:27.410

formalizing it you know official support

0:31:25.820,0:31:29.750

from the scientific community may raise

0:31:27.410,0:31:32.630

public awareness to more aspects of our

0:31:29.750,0:31:34.070

existence there's more than just climate

0:31:32.630,0:31:36.470

change which everyone's talking about

0:31:34.070,0:31:38.840

today like we can't just solve climate

0:31:36.470,0:31:41.120

change and we've done our orbit and

0:31:38.840,0:31:43.460

let's go home there's there's more than

0:31:41.120,0:31:45.530

that and well this is why some

0:31:43.460,0:31:46.940

scientists want to avoid setting the

0:31:45.530,0:31:49.220

starting point of the intrapersonal

0:31:46.940,0:31:51.230

years ago because it might make it

0:31:49.220,0:31:53.570

easier to live with the consequences of

0:31:51.230,0:31:58.070

actions that took place in the distant

0:31:53.570,0:32:00.679

past okay let's talk about the question

0:31:58.070,0:32:02.660

should it be formalized obviously it's

0:32:00.679,0:32:05.540

up to you to form your own opinion on

0:32:02.660,0:32:08.540

the matter but I think that this

0:32:05.540,0:32:10.880

question sort of became this side issue

0:32:08.540,0:32:14.059

to some people like the fact that the

0:32:10.880,0:32:16.640

term has is already evident at least in

0:32:14.059,0:32:19.070

the scientific world including the

0:32:16.640,0:32:21.320

intrapersonal discussions helps raise

0:32:19.070,0:32:23.900

questions about our existence and future

0:32:21.320,0:32:25.460

challenges that we may face I also think

0:32:23.900,0:32:27.770

that you know even if it ends up not

0:32:25.460,0:32:29.900

being a formal thing it won't take back

0:32:27.770,0:32:31.850

the effect that the term already has and

0:32:29.900,0:32:34.549

I think people will still keep using it

0:32:31.850,0:32:37.280

anyway and well I told you a bit about

0:32:34.549,0:32:39.080

it and we talked about formalization um

0:32:37.280,0:32:41.480

let me tell you where the process of

0:32:39.080,0:32:44.480

formalization is today now we talked

0:32:41.480,0:32:46.960

about the AWG Anthropocene working group

0:32:44.480,0:32:50.210

that are tasked with the job of

0:32:46.960,0:32:54.770

basically advising the ICS on this

0:32:50.210,0:32:56.630

decision so in May of 2019 the results

0:32:54.770,0:32:59.960

of a binding vote that was taken by the

0:32:56.630,0:33:01.990

members of the AWG were released they've

0:32:59.960,0:33:04.730

published the results of the vote

0:33:01.990,0:33:06.799

regarding two questions the first one

0:33:04.730,0:33:08.870

should the Anthropocene be treated as a

0:33:06.799,0:33:11.120

formal chrono stratigraphic unit or

0:33:08.870,0:33:13.490

basically should it be formalized and

0:33:11.120,0:33:15.710

well eighty-eight percent were in favor

0:33:13.490,0:33:18.049

it's pretty good formalizing the term

0:33:15.710,0:33:20.210

and the second question was basically

0:33:18.049,0:33:22.790

should the marker that signifies the

0:33:20.210,0:33:24.350

Anthropocene be one of those suggested

0:33:22.790,0:33:28.900

for the mid twentieth century

0:33:24.350,0:33:30.679

and again the answer is 88% in favor now

0:33:28.900,0:33:32.570

everybody's thinking that the most

0:33:30.679,0:33:35.299

probable marker for the start of the

0:33:32.570,0:33:36.080

improper scene is the nuclear byproducts

0:33:35.299,0:33:38.960

that I've mentioned

0:33:36.080,0:33:41.120

anyway the report which is you know

0:33:38.960,0:33:43.910

available on their website also mentions

0:33:41.120,0:33:46.250

the the Anthropocene working group is an

0:33:43.910,0:33:48.140

agreement that enough evidence has been

0:33:46.250,0:33:51.350

collected to set the Anthropocene apart

0:33:48.140,0:33:53.210

from other time periods they've also

0:33:51.350,0:33:55.220

agreed that the term has proven useful

0:33:53.210,0:33:57.140

and well today there are still

0:33:55.220,0:33:59.960

discussions regarding the importance of

0:33:57.140,0:34:01.400

formal geological term you know all in

0:33:59.960,0:34:03.110

all it seems that the Anthropocene

0:34:01.400,0:34:05.600

working group are approving of the

0:34:03.110,0:34:07.460

Anthropocene it's important to remember

0:34:05.600,0:34:09.619

that they'll pass their findings and

0:34:07.460,0:34:11.859

results to the ICS to make a formal

0:34:09.619,0:34:14.960

decision they don't have the final say

0:34:11.859,0:34:17.540

well here are a few personal thoughts to

0:34:14.960,0:34:19.040

kind of close with first I like the

0:34:17.540,0:34:21.350

Anthropocene and what it stands for I

0:34:19.040,0:34:24.109

think these are important subjects that

0:34:21.350,0:34:25.879

need to come up but despite that I can't

0:34:24.109,0:34:27.679

help but sometimes think that naming the

0:34:25.879,0:34:30.350

time period after ourselves you know

0:34:27.679,0:34:33.020

it's a bit self-important no one will

0:34:30.350,0:34:36.109

know or judge it or anything you know

0:34:33.020,0:34:37.909

it's only us here and I don't think it's

0:34:36.109,0:34:40.700

a good enough reason to be against the

0:34:37.909,0:34:43.100

term but it just feels weird I wanted to

0:34:40.700,0:34:45.020

mention that um I think that the fact

0:34:43.100,0:34:47.600

that people are already using the term

0:34:45.020,0:34:49.790

in scientific papers is a big factor in

0:34:47.600,0:34:51.919

the Anthropocene working groups decision

0:34:49.790,0:34:54.740

to support the formalization like I mean

0:34:51.919,0:34:56.929

if the term becomes just another word in

0:34:54.740,0:34:58.520

the scientific lexicon then it doesn't

0:34:56.929,0:35:01.010

really matter if it's formal or not you

0:34:58.520,0:35:04.670

know it might be just easier to go along

0:35:01.010,0:35:06.680

with it and one last thing um you know

0:35:04.670,0:35:09.260

the term is concerned with global

0:35:06.680,0:35:11.980

aspects of humanity's impact whatever

0:35:09.260,0:35:14.690

the answer to these questions may be

0:35:11.980,0:35:16.520

these issues cannot be handled locally

0:35:14.690,0:35:20.270

we can't face them in some parts of the

0:35:16.520,0:35:22.250

world it has to be bigger than that and

0:35:20.270,0:35:23.810

basically if you guys have any questions

0:35:22.250,0:35:26.210

if you guys want to discuss anything

0:35:23.810,0:35:28.400

further go for it

0:35:26.210,0:35:31.040

take dinosaurs for instance like I'm not

0:35:28.400,0:35:33.320

a dinosaur expert but Jonas was were

0:35:31.040,0:35:35.089

pretty dominant in the world right like

0:35:33.320,0:35:37.640

when they're around that was sort of

0:35:35.089,0:35:40.700

that were common right definitely

0:35:37.640,0:35:43.069

so the difference between what dinosaurs

0:35:40.700,0:35:46.069

were doing and what we're doing what why

0:35:43.069,0:35:49.460

is sort of like the production of carbon

0:35:46.069,0:35:51.950

and carbon emissions and all this stuff

0:35:49.460,0:35:54.559

with the water supply why is that seems

0:35:51.950,0:35:56.329

to be unnatural because we're sort of

0:35:54.559,0:35:58.130

dominating the world a moment but the

0:35:56.329,0:36:00.230

dinosaurs were sort of running the house

0:35:58.130,0:36:03.920

but what they were doing was all sort of

0:36:00.230,0:36:06.019

in line with nature like what sort of

0:36:03.920,0:36:08.539

how we sort of defining what's natural

0:36:06.019,0:36:09.920

what's unnatural I guess I guess being

0:36:08.539,0:36:11.990

at the top of the food chain doesn't

0:36:09.920,0:36:14.960

mean that you're not living in harmony

0:36:11.990,0:36:17.660

with your with your environment take

0:36:14.960,0:36:20.000

major predators from today and look at

0:36:17.660,0:36:22.609

their predatory habits like basically

0:36:20.000,0:36:25.099

they hunt and eat just kind of what they

0:36:22.609,0:36:27.680

need and if you look at it closely you

0:36:25.099,0:36:30.380

can see that they usually hunt and kill

0:36:27.680,0:36:33.740

like the sick or the old of each

0:36:30.380,0:36:35.569

population so basically while animals

0:36:33.740,0:36:37.010

are dying that's not the worst thing

0:36:35.569,0:36:39.200

that can happen you know that basically

0:36:37.010,0:36:42.259

also kind of strengthens the population

0:36:39.200,0:36:45.019

of the hunted which we don't do we kill

0:36:42.259,0:36:47.930

until everything is extinct like we have

0:36:45.019,0:36:50.390

basically evidence for people going out

0:36:47.930,0:36:52.819

and just hunting things to the point of

0:36:50.390,0:36:54.769

extinction and being proud of it that

0:36:52.819,0:36:56.750

doesn't happen in nature well here's a

0:36:54.769,0:36:58.490

thing right with with lions would you

0:36:56.750,0:37:00.769

say it would be adaptive for them not

0:36:58.490,0:37:03.470

just not to hunt everything of their

0:37:00.769,0:37:05.509

specie of their prey definitely because

0:37:03.470,0:37:07.309

obviously if they did that they probably

0:37:05.509,0:37:09.500

wouldn't be around so just by the fact

0:37:07.309,0:37:11.839

that they're around that would be good

0:37:09.500,0:37:15.230

indication that they know how to sort of

0:37:11.839,0:37:16.519

keep the prey going like keep their keep

0:37:15.230,0:37:19.279

the lifestyle that's how it was going

0:37:16.519,0:37:20.930

yeah exactly I think every every basic

0:37:19.279,0:37:22.759

ecology course will start with an

0:37:20.930,0:37:25.400

example of that and that what

0:37:22.759,0:37:27.589

constitutes its nature it hits a balance

0:37:25.400,0:37:30.890

you know that we're not hitting we're

0:37:27.589,0:37:33.289

not had I hit a balance but like we have

0:37:30.890,0:37:36.859

this weird sort of predicament now where

0:37:33.289,0:37:39.259

we don't have a balance to hit like we

0:37:36.859,0:37:41.210

could try to do as little as we can to

0:37:39.259,0:37:43.009

affect what nature would do without us

0:37:41.210,0:37:45.769

but obviously if we pulled out a nature

0:37:43.009,0:37:48.400

completely it would do something I hope

0:37:45.769,0:37:50.480

but say something that we need we need

0:37:48.400,0:37:52.940

metal or something like that

0:37:50.480,0:37:55.520

if we just grabbed all the metal in the

0:37:52.940,0:37:57.410

world hmm it just feels like the

0:37:55.520,0:37:59.150

consequences is just like meaningless

0:37:57.410,0:38:01.790

like we just do something else you know

0:37:59.150,0:38:03.410

like it doesn't it feels like we're

0:38:01.790,0:38:04.940

invincible at the moment now because

0:38:03.410,0:38:07.010

like if we destroy the earth we'll just

0:38:04.940,0:38:08.570

go destroy some other planet you know it

0:38:07.010,0:38:12.619

just stuff it feels like we're in this

0:38:08.570,0:38:15.230

weird phase of like we've just broken

0:38:12.619,0:38:17.420

free from this nature now it feels so

0:38:15.230,0:38:18.980

but yeah you know we hope we don't run

0:38:17.420,0:38:20.839

into a wall before we get off this

0:38:18.980,0:38:22.280

planet that's why we need a self climate

0:38:20.839,0:38:24.980

change because what happens if we don't

0:38:22.280,0:38:28.070

make it to Mars sir I think it's called

0:38:24.980,0:38:29.810

Fermi paradox yeah I think the Fermi

0:38:28.070,0:38:32.300

paradox is is talking about why we

0:38:29.810,0:38:34.369

haven't met other intelligent life yeah

0:38:32.300,0:38:37.400

but it kind of one of the explanation is

0:38:34.369,0:38:39.440

that every intelligent species every

0:38:37.400,0:38:41.480

other sort of civilizations is either

0:38:39.440,0:38:43.880

fallen asleep at the wheel or broken

0:38:41.480,0:38:45.500

themselves up by probably nuclear or

0:38:43.880,0:38:47.720

something like that yeah that there's

0:38:45.500,0:38:49.730

this barrier that you can't pass because

0:38:47.720,0:38:52.010

like every time you try to pass it to

0:38:49.730,0:38:54.200

you you either fall asleep or or just

0:38:52.010,0:38:56.089

kill yourself like when I think about

0:38:54.200,0:38:57.680

the Fermi paradox I've always thought

0:38:56.089,0:38:59.930

like why we don't see aliens or

0:38:57.680,0:39:02.329

something like that and like the answer

0:38:59.930,0:39:05.210

that I usually sort of give would be

0:39:02.329,0:39:07.220

just if like the chances of two

0:39:05.210,0:39:09.109

civilizations close to each other sort

0:39:07.220,0:39:12.829

of being the same stage of development

0:39:09.109,0:39:14.780

like say not ten million years apart in

0:39:12.829,0:39:17.569

their evolution like right bang on the

0:39:14.780,0:39:19.339

same decade then it would be possible

0:39:17.569,0:39:21.920

but the chances that happening are very

0:39:19.339,0:39:24.349

low what's more likely is that there's

0:39:21.920,0:39:26.210

been heaps of civilizations around us

0:39:24.349,0:39:28.490

for millions of years and now they use

0:39:26.210,0:39:30.290

nanotechnology they're all tiny like

0:39:28.490,0:39:31.760

that they're around us all the time we

0:39:30.290,0:39:33.260

just wouldn't ever be able to see them

0:39:31.760,0:39:36.430

because they're like they've got a

0:39:33.260,0:39:39.140

hundred million years of like just

0:39:36.430,0:39:42.109

intelligence above us so like maybe they

0:39:39.140,0:39:44.900

are around us but we we're like a blind

0:39:42.109,0:39:47.599

toddler looking for like people in the

0:39:44.900,0:39:49.010

dark you know we're just stupid but like

0:39:47.599,0:39:51.829

I never really thought about that

0:39:49.010,0:39:53.720

there's like it might be a limit to like

0:39:51.829,0:39:55.790

what you can get - yeah I find it very

0:39:53.720,0:39:59.630

interesting we were talking a little bit

0:39:55.790,0:40:03.020

around this in our episode about last

0:39:59.630,0:40:03.859

chance to see but I think we all agree

0:40:03.020,0:40:06.769

that then

0:40:03.859,0:40:09.859

number of species isn't that important

0:40:06.769,0:40:12.589

because if there's say fifty more types

0:40:09.859,0:40:15.049

of bats they're all still bats like the

0:40:12.589,0:40:17.809

way we classify or the way we classify

0:40:15.049,0:40:19.789

them essentially like if we find that

0:40:17.809,0:40:21.079

they're Viking no one wings bit bigger

0:40:19.789,0:40:23.299

than the other we'll call this the wrong

0:40:21.079,0:40:25.400

winged bat or something like what that

0:40:23.299,0:40:27.650

doesn't increase the diversity or

0:40:25.400,0:40:30.170

anything like that it's not it's not

0:40:27.650,0:40:32.029

that important right do we agree it's

0:40:30.170,0:40:35.599

it's not about the number it's about

0:40:32.029,0:40:37.880

what we lost you can take it as a point

0:40:35.599,0:40:40.759

of view of the big picture of creating a

0:40:37.880,0:40:43.039

sustainable lifestyle that will allow us

0:40:40.759,0:40:44.960

to pay attention to our surrounding and

0:40:43.039,0:40:47.269

because because like everything it's a

0:40:44.960,0:40:50.329

steep slope you start allowing yourself

0:40:47.269,0:40:52.489

to extinct this specie or another and

0:40:50.329,0:40:54.829

then you kind of let go and another

0:40:52.489,0:40:56.480

thing and until things get too out of

0:40:54.829,0:40:58.940

hand and then it's too late so like

0:40:56.480,0:41:01.630

there's the first benefit of just you

0:40:58.940,0:41:04.190

know having the discipline of creating a

0:41:01.630,0:41:06.259

sustainable lifestyle and that doesn't

0:41:04.190,0:41:09.109

take into attention any any specific

0:41:06.259,0:41:11.329

species so that's point number one I

0:41:09.109,0:41:14.150

think point number two is that as much

0:41:11.329,0:41:17.089

as we're smart and great and definitely

0:41:14.150,0:41:20.749

the dominant species on the planet we

0:41:17.089,0:41:23.109

can't create life out of nothing and we

0:41:20.749,0:41:27.589

have these specimens of things that

0:41:23.109,0:41:29.269

developed for millions of years and it's

0:41:27.589,0:41:31.519

like burning books like at the end of

0:41:29.269,0:41:33.319

the last chance to see that's pretty

0:41:31.519,0:41:35.809

much what the story also says that

0:41:33.319,0:41:39.410

you're kind of burning books with the

0:41:35.809,0:41:42.499

knowledge of the world at least it

0:41:39.410,0:41:45.950

doesn't matter if you if you lost 30% or

0:41:42.499,0:41:48.470

50% or 70% the number doesn't really

0:41:45.950,0:41:50.869

come into play here it's mostly about

0:41:48.470,0:41:52.970

the way that you live I feel like I

0:41:50.869,0:41:55.940

agree like when people say something

0:41:52.970,0:41:58.190

should be sustainable it's such like you

0:41:55.940,0:41:59.599

automatically just want to agree but I'm

0:41:58.190,0:42:02.059

just trying to like sort it out in my

0:41:59.599,0:42:04.489

head right well I'm trying to figure

0:42:02.059,0:42:07.400

that what the ultimate goal is like the

0:42:04.489,0:42:10.339

overreaching goal is so my goal would

0:42:07.400,0:42:12.349

basically be so everyone has sort of

0:42:10.339,0:42:15.259

like their own consciousness you'd say

0:42:12.349,0:42:17.690

like not we're not all dipping into the

0:42:15.259,0:42:18.950

same consciousness or everyone has their

0:42:17.690,0:42:20.690

sort of point of view right I'm not

0:42:18.950,0:42:22.460

sharing one with an on and I'm

0:42:20.690,0:42:24.080

experienced woman he's experiencing

0:42:22.460,0:42:28.280

right so everyone sort of has their own

0:42:24.080,0:42:32.050

unique one what I would say would be my

0:42:28.280,0:42:35.690

goal would be to maximize the amount of

0:42:32.050,0:42:37.850

consciousness which is good so like that

0:42:35.690,0:42:41.480

sounds very broad but like for instance

0:42:37.850,0:42:43.790

like I would say you don't want to have

0:42:41.480,0:42:46.640

a planet which is just full of like

0:42:43.790,0:42:47.840

chickens which just go into a meat

0:42:46.640,0:42:49.490

grinder every day

0:42:47.840,0:42:51.740

you wouldn't want ten million because

0:42:49.490,0:42:54.020

their lives would be a wouldn't be a net

0:42:51.740,0:42:56.570

benefit it would be a net loss for them

0:42:54.020,0:42:58.610

right if you had the option you wouldn't

0:42:56.570,0:43:01.790

want to be a chicken right but say you

0:42:58.610,0:43:05.570

wanted like say you can live the life of

0:43:01.790,0:43:08.090

a ladybug and then you can step out

0:43:05.570,0:43:10.610

you're like talking to the universe and

0:43:08.090,0:43:12.770

it says would you like to be a ladybug

0:43:10.610,0:43:15.280

and you say yes like I would rather be a

0:43:12.770,0:43:19.010

ladybug than not exist then I would say

0:43:15.280,0:43:20.930

it would be good to have more of that so

0:43:19.010,0:43:23.450

essentially like to put it down to like

0:43:20.930,0:43:28.130

a simple calculus I would say would be

0:43:23.450,0:43:30.170

our moral duty to improve lives not just

0:43:28.130,0:43:32.300

not just the ones that aren't good of

0:43:30.170,0:43:34.010

course like lives that are already good

0:43:32.300,0:43:36.320

we should make better but also lives

0:43:34.010,0:43:38.510

that aren't good we should try to

0:43:36.320,0:43:40.280

improve them and if we can't then maybe

0:43:38.510,0:43:42.830

it would be theirs and there's a

0:43:40.280,0:43:45.860

argument to be made as to whether maybe

0:43:42.830,0:43:48.080

we should extinguish like a small sort

0:43:45.860,0:43:50.000

of branch of animal or something which

0:43:48.080,0:43:52.130

is gonna die anyway or something over a

0:43:50.000,0:43:54.230

longer period of time but like for me

0:43:52.130,0:43:56.720

the goal would just be to have the most

0:43:54.230,0:43:59.810

animals we could which is which are all

0:43:56.720,0:44:01.610

having like really great lives like just

0:43:59.810,0:44:02.900

if someone gave the option you'd say I'd

0:44:01.610,0:44:04.790

want to be every single one of those

0:44:02.900,0:44:06.710

animals I'd love to live any of those

0:44:04.790,0:44:08.330

lives that would be what you want which

0:44:06.710,0:44:11.060

is essentially what we do a humans at

0:44:08.330,0:44:12.890

the moment like will say like population

0:44:11.060,0:44:14.960

growth is great as long as we can feed

0:44:12.890,0:44:17.510

everyone environments having a good time

0:44:14.960,0:44:19.760

so they I'm just kind of expanding that

0:44:17.510,0:44:22.460

to everything although animals

0:44:19.760,0:44:24.320

essentially but not including plants not

0:44:22.460,0:44:27.890

including like dirt or anything like

0:44:24.320,0:44:29.450

that don't give a shit don't get you

0:44:27.890,0:44:31.369

know you don't get the dirt thing you

0:44:29.450,0:44:33.559

don't get the plant thing no

0:44:31.369,0:44:35.029

at all like I think plants and you know

0:44:33.559,0:44:37.190

the the things that live in dirt are

0:44:35.029,0:44:37.940

just as important well to me not

0:44:37.190,0:44:40.130

important

0:44:37.940,0:44:42.619

like if we could just get rid of all

0:44:40.130,0:44:44.839

plants but it would have no implicit

0:44:42.619,0:44:46.900

yeah but we can't we can't that's a

0:44:44.839,0:44:49.519

that's a thing we can't but hype

0:44:46.900,0:44:52.309

Authority experiment right so like you

0:44:49.519,0:44:57.170

have to just go with me on this we can

0:44:52.309,0:45:00.410

eradicate all plants and all topsoil all

0:44:57.170,0:45:04.700

that stuff all that stuff you love

0:45:00.410,0:45:06.740

but it has no effect on our conscious

0:45:04.700,0:45:08.440

experience so essentially like no one

0:45:06.740,0:45:12.499

gets happier but no one gets sadder

0:45:08.440,0:45:13.940

nothing is that okay like I'm not sure

0:45:12.499,0:45:16.039

of what you're going with with this

0:45:13.940,0:45:18.380

because I'm trying to sort out my it

0:45:16.039,0:45:20.720

feels like I'm trying to like shift you

0:45:18.380,0:45:22.970

but I'm really trying to like find out

0:45:20.720,0:45:26.029

where I am because like I'm thinking

0:45:22.970,0:45:27.589

like what we need to do is a spacey and

0:45:26.029,0:45:29.990

stuff like that you know but I think

0:45:27.589,0:45:32.779

with the ladybug I think the best life

0:45:29.990,0:45:34.880

for the ladybug would be a life that no

0:45:32.779,0:45:37.940

one would interfere with because it

0:45:34.880,0:45:40.430

evolved to live where it lives it has

0:45:37.940,0:45:45.019

all the tools to make the best out of

0:45:40.430,0:45:46.819

its specific situation so if we try to I

0:45:45.019,0:45:48.470

don't know like feed it or make it yeah

0:45:46.819,0:45:51.859

that's a good point I like that point

0:45:48.470,0:45:54.170

how about this argument evolution has

0:45:51.859,0:45:56.539

been playing a role since prokaryotes

0:45:54.170,0:45:59.359

right yeah so fit for instance like

0:45:56.539,0:46:02.450

evolution isn't suited to give you a

0:45:59.359,0:46:05.599

good time like evolution wasn't on a

0:46:02.450,0:46:09.789

path to Netflix just arose naturally

0:46:05.599,0:46:13.609

right Netflix is a survival adaptation

0:46:09.789,0:46:16.309

quit me on that but his here's the thing

0:46:13.609,0:46:19.640

right like all these animals that have

0:46:16.309,0:46:22.009

learned to survive over millions of

0:46:19.640,0:46:25.940

years like much longer than the drop in

0:46:22.009,0:46:27.410

the water that we are right then if we

0:46:25.940,0:46:28.970

interfere with that then we're

0:46:27.410,0:46:31.279

interfering with their way of life

0:46:28.970,0:46:36.680

essentially right and we're in the one

0:46:31.279,0:46:40.249

specie affecting a 7 million 999,999 it

0:46:36.680,0:46:43.069

feels like the one person who walks into

0:46:40.249,0:46:45.080

a party and just annoys everything like

0:46:43.069,0:46:47.540

just disturbs the mood

0:46:45.080,0:46:49.310

musics terrible everything right but I

0:46:47.540,0:46:51.590

actually kind of agree with that after

0:46:49.310,0:46:53.480

saying it but is there any argument

0:46:51.590,0:46:57.290

which you could say would which would be

0:46:53.480,0:46:59.930

humans have such a broad consciousness

0:46:57.290,0:47:02.720

like we can experience so much more than

0:46:59.930,0:47:05.240

some animals like I don't know how much

0:47:02.720,0:47:08.270

of a life of fish really has you know

0:47:05.240,0:47:10.580

like a fish can't experience like

0:47:08.270,0:47:12.440

podcasts they can't experience movies

0:47:10.580,0:47:14.060

and all this stuff like they might then

0:47:12.440,0:47:15.740

we know are they yeah that we know of

0:47:14.060,0:47:17.900

that's the thing because you can never

0:47:15.740,0:47:20.150

be 100% sure they could be doing wild

0:47:17.900,0:47:22.850

shit but there is some argument to say

0:47:20.150,0:47:24.530

well we are we are important like humans

0:47:22.850,0:47:26.750

are definitely important like because

0:47:24.530,0:47:30.350

without humans there's no monopoly

0:47:26.750,0:47:34.580

there's no like but there's no monopoly

0:47:30.350,0:47:38.270

you know I played I played a pretty good

0:47:34.580,0:47:41.210

match this afternoon some yeah yeah but

0:47:38.270,0:47:43.100

you got to admit this humans have some

0:47:41.210,0:47:45.320

important like we can't step away

0:47:43.100,0:47:48.380

completely we can't sort of fade into

0:47:45.320,0:47:51.650

the background it's just one it just

0:47:48.380,0:47:53.930

couldn't happen but to like it would

0:47:51.650,0:47:56.360

just be such a shame if we couldn't go

0:47:53.930,0:47:58.130

on and do interesting things that we

0:47:56.360,0:48:00.860

couldn't make art and all this stuff

0:47:58.130,0:48:02.960

like what's the ideal amount like do you

0:48:00.860,0:48:06.740

want to step back from like 90 percent

0:48:02.960,0:48:08.990

or do we want to like have our finger on

0:48:06.740,0:48:11.090

the pulse like what sort of analogy

0:48:08.990,0:48:13.250

would you draw well let me just say I'm

0:48:11.090,0:48:15.050

totally in humanities side I'm I don't

0:48:13.250,0:48:17.660

think like you know that we're not

0:48:15.050,0:48:19.220

important or we're as important as any

0:48:17.660,0:48:21.290

other fish and you know we should

0:48:19.220,0:48:23.780

extinct ourselves before we extinct

0:48:21.290,0:48:25.940

everything else I think we should look

0:48:23.780,0:48:29.320

out for humanity you know look forward

0:48:25.940,0:48:33.440

and plan ahead to make the best world

0:48:29.320,0:48:35.270

for us as well so I'm not saying we

0:48:33.440,0:48:36.740

should stop existing I'm not saying we

0:48:35.270,0:48:39.200

should stop everything we're doing and

0:48:36.740,0:48:41.810

let nature sort itself out everyone's

0:48:39.200,0:48:44.690

going to want to keep living there the

0:48:41.810,0:48:46.550

best life but I think we have to change

0:48:44.690,0:48:49.340

the way we think we see the world we see

0:48:46.550,0:48:50.870

ourselves as a part of it you know to be

0:48:49.340,0:48:52.520

a part of it we're not above it you

0:48:50.870,0:48:54.950

think we just should think about our

0:48:52.520,0:48:56.960

effect on animals and they allow it's a

0:48:54.950,0:48:59.030

little bit more than what we are is that

0:48:56.960,0:49:01.720

an easy way to say my point is

0:48:59.030,0:49:04.970

we should keep looking out for our best

0:49:01.720,0:49:07.790

interests but we have to keep in mind

0:49:04.970,0:49:09.920

that we are also affecting everything

0:49:07.790,0:49:11.270

else around us you know which which

0:49:09.920,0:49:12.830

isn't a good thing I don't think we

0:49:11.270,0:49:15.320

should affect anything around us for the

0:49:12.830,0:49:18.190

better or for worst we should you know

0:49:15.320,0:49:21.110

do the best for us in a way that affects

0:49:18.190,0:49:24.260

the least amount of other external

0:49:21.110,0:49:26.840

factors which we can do like we can you

0:49:24.260,0:49:30.230

know provide energy for the world like

0:49:26.840,0:49:32.840

electricity using solar power which is

0:49:30.230,0:49:35.480

much less detriment to the world than

0:49:32.840,0:49:38.930

you know burning coal we can provide

0:49:35.480,0:49:41.990

food and everything maybe not today but

0:49:38.930,0:49:44.720

we can develop methods to provide food

0:49:41.990,0:49:47.120

that doesn't require habitats

0:49:44.720,0:49:49.730

degradation we could we maybe we

0:49:47.120,0:49:52.040

couldn't 200 years ago but things are

0:49:49.730,0:49:54.500

changing and what we know is changing

0:49:52.040,0:49:56.870

okay why I agree with you actually

0:49:54.500,0:49:58.430

everything up until you said we

0:49:56.870,0:50:01.670

shouldn't affect anything for the better

0:49:58.430,0:50:03.410

though like would there be some examples

0:50:01.670,0:50:06.020

where it might be beneficial for us to

0:50:03.410,0:50:08.060

serve change in ecological system I

0:50:06.020,0:50:10.370

don't know like I don't think so though

0:50:08.060,0:50:12.260

because all of these systems the rain

0:50:10.370,0:50:14.660

forests the coral reefs everything is

0:50:12.260,0:50:16.730

has developed without us actually 100%

0:50:14.660,0:50:18.800

agree when it comes to rainforests and

0:50:16.730,0:50:20.510

coral reefs but what about like how we

0:50:18.800,0:50:23.450

keep track of some animals in the wild

0:50:20.510,0:50:25.820

like so some animals are just naturally

0:50:23.450,0:50:29.180

like I would like to optimistically say

0:50:25.820,0:50:30.740

we have an erratic not every extinction

0:50:29.180,0:50:32.120

event is because of us

0:50:30.740,0:50:35.330

what happens if an animal was sort of

0:50:32.120,0:50:37.670

going extinct and we could find a way to

0:50:35.330,0:50:39.770

help them thrive what about maybe the

0:50:37.670,0:50:42.290

fact that it goes extinct is what's

0:50:39.770,0:50:44.240

right in nature you know it's it's what

0:50:42.290,0:50:46.550

keeps the balance in nature it's bigger

0:50:44.240,0:50:48.830

than that species you know that is very

0:50:46.550,0:50:52.160

Marcus Aurelius of you well my cucumber

0:50:48.830,0:50:55.190

I think another another interesting

0:50:52.160,0:50:57.110

question is if you do believe in some

0:50:55.190,0:51:00.860

like what you mentioned before about if

0:50:57.110,0:51:03.890

fish has consciousness or what is your

0:51:00.860,0:51:07.130

opinion about suffering and living

0:51:03.890,0:51:10.310

things that suffer like is it okay in

0:51:07.130,0:51:12.650

order to save pandas from being extinct

0:51:10.310,0:51:16.640

that you make their there

0:51:12.650,0:51:19.220

individual life miserable thing for me

0:51:16.640,0:51:22.910

it's a definite no you would let the

0:51:19.220,0:51:25.970

species be extinct in order to not make

0:51:22.910,0:51:28.670

an individual kinda suffer 100% it feels

0:51:25.970,0:51:33.590

like very you could get combative but

0:51:28.670,0:51:37.220

I'm feeling like 95 to 99% of this is

0:51:33.590,0:51:39.290

just bang on and the 1% where I disagree

0:51:37.220,0:51:41.360

I'm just trying to figure out like if

0:51:39.290,0:51:43.670

I'm confused or if there's like another

0:51:41.360,0:51:46.340

angle like because it's sort of for me

0:51:43.670,0:51:48.860

it bashes into ethics in a way which is

0:51:46.340,0:51:49.910

sort of interesting I'm just like have

0:51:48.860,0:51:53.660

you guys heard of the paperclip

0:51:49.910,0:51:56.780

Maximizer I'm not sure no no damn I have

0:51:53.660,0:51:59.450

to explain it now so basically there's

0:51:56.780,0:52:02.030

just there's this the robot essentially

0:51:59.450,0:52:04.310

which is just has one goal to maximize

0:52:02.030,0:52:06.710

paperclips so it's it's sort of like a

0:52:04.310,0:52:08.480

dystopian thing where we just build a

0:52:06.710,0:52:11.360

robot and we say hey can you create

0:52:08.480,0:52:13.430

paperclips so it's sort of like quite a

0:52:11.360,0:52:15.110

fun robot you know it just goes around

0:52:13.430,0:52:17.210

its business collects a bit of rubbish

0:52:15.110,0:52:20.180

and stuff that we're not using and stuff

0:52:17.210,0:52:22.190

and because it can convert atoms into

0:52:20.180,0:52:24.710

anything at once it can just create up

0:52:22.190,0:52:26.990

it takes a piece of paper and then it

0:52:24.710,0:52:29.870

just goes up it's now a medal and it

0:52:26.990,0:52:32.540

becomes a paperclip right but eventually

0:52:29.870,0:52:34.310

it sort of runs out of things that we're

0:52:32.540,0:52:36.140

not using so then it goes in this

0:52:34.310,0:52:37.940

MacBook that could make one thousand

0:52:36.140,0:52:39.440

three hundred paperclips let's just make

0:52:37.940,0:52:43.910

it and there you go where's my laptop

0:52:39.440,0:52:46.010

damn so so it keeps making laptops sorry

0:52:43.910,0:52:48.050

it keeps making paper clips at a laptops

0:52:46.010,0:52:49.850

and then suddenly like it runs out of

0:52:48.050,0:52:52.250

everything and all that's left is us so

0:52:49.850,0:52:54.440

it turns our bodies into paper lips we

0:52:52.250,0:52:58.220

just become paper clips so we sort of

0:52:54.440,0:53:01.310

regret what it has become and it's

0:52:58.220,0:53:03.080

literally just destroying like kids and

0:53:01.310,0:53:05.510

women and children and everything just

0:53:03.080,0:53:07.370

to create more paper clips for us but my

0:53:05.510,0:53:09.440

but that what the reason I bring it up

0:53:07.370,0:53:11.870

is because like I feel like a bit of a

0:53:09.440,0:53:14.060

paper clip Maximizer ns but I'm just a

0:53:11.870,0:53:16.520

consciousness Maximizer so all I want is

0:53:14.060,0:53:19.880

good consciousness because obviously you

0:53:16.520,0:53:22.070

can have a bad life so any good life to

0:53:19.880,0:53:24.920

me assists a net win and anything else

0:53:22.070,0:53:26.540

that comes behind it it just doesn't

0:53:24.920,0:53:28.940

concern me too much as long as

0:53:26.540,0:53:31.010

more people or more animals and they're

0:53:28.940,0:53:31.900

happy so that's why I don't really care

0:53:31.010,0:53:34.340

about plants

0:53:31.900,0:53:38.900

however there's like this second step

0:53:34.340,0:53:41.900

where I agree that the ecology is so

0:53:38.900,0:53:44.510

important and understanding these

0:53:41.900,0:53:46.910

systems is so important and

0:53:44.510,0:53:49.670

understanding more so than just stepping

0:53:46.910,0:53:52.160

away but actually knowing what what an

0:53:49.670,0:53:53.960

input would actually output in these

0:53:52.160,0:53:56.690

systems like the water cycle in it and

0:53:53.960,0:53:59.270

everything that I think it's in our best

0:53:56.690,0:54:01.340

interest even if we are a pay-per-click

0:53:59.270,0:54:04.910

Maximizer of consciousness then it's in

0:54:01.340,0:54:07.820

our best interest to also be stewards of

0:54:04.910,0:54:09.850

the environment okay I just wanted to

0:54:07.820,0:54:13.310

say that you know as an ecology

0:54:09.850,0:54:15.530

environmental sciences student it it's

0:54:13.310,0:54:17.720

just amazing how far away we are from

0:54:15.530,0:54:20.180

really understanding these systems you

0:54:17.720,0:54:22.670

know you kind of start by thinking we

0:54:20.180,0:54:24.080

know so much we know all the basics we

0:54:22.670,0:54:26.570

just need to fill a few gaps and then

0:54:24.080,0:54:28.820

we're there but it's so much bigger than

0:54:26.570,0:54:31.190

us it's so much like I'm not saying that

0:54:28.820,0:54:33.560

we won't ever be able to understand them

0:54:31.190,0:54:35.570

but at the moment we're so far away from

0:54:33.560,0:54:37.640

really knowing what's going on out there

0:54:35.570,0:54:41.870

well here's another argument all right

0:54:37.640,0:54:44.150

yeah maybe my last one as much as I say

0:54:41.870,0:54:47.180

I want to increase all this good

0:54:44.150,0:54:49.880

consciousness right maybe it's Darwinian

0:54:47.180,0:54:54.470

to not think about that maybe it's

0:54:49.880,0:54:58.430

actually advantageous to the world to

0:54:54.470,0:55:01.790

actually care about plants like it might

0:54:58.430,0:55:03.530

actually be better for people to care

0:55:01.790,0:55:04.790

about plants because think about it a

0:55:03.530,0:55:07.210

hundred million years from now we might

0:55:04.790,0:55:09.890

not be around if we just want to say

0:55:07.210,0:55:11.900

make everyone fat and happy you know

0:55:09.890,0:55:14.630

maybe it is maybe it's better for us in

0:55:11.900,0:55:16.040

the long run maybe we can't see it but

0:55:14.630,0:55:19.070

maybe it's actually better if we care

0:55:16.040,0:55:21.680

about how much stuff there is in the

0:55:19.070,0:55:23.840

rainforest maybe it's just maybe it is

0:55:21.680,0:55:26.360

actually important for instance take

0:55:23.840,0:55:29.900

take some religions right religions who

0:55:26.360,0:55:32.600

don't eat pork right many many years ago

0:55:29.900,0:55:36.350

before there was like fridges and stuff

0:55:32.600,0:55:39.320

that was important like may it the the

0:55:36.350,0:55:40.410

reasoning for it might have been true

0:55:39.320,0:55:43.680

might not have been

0:55:40.410,0:55:47.550

but super important so they were playing

0:55:43.680,0:55:49.440

on the safe side and now they're doing

0:55:47.550,0:55:51.750

well because they actually avoided pork

0:55:49.440,0:55:54.270

you know it was actually it was actually

0:55:51.750,0:55:57.390

a survival adaption to not be eating

0:55:54.270,0:55:59.880

meat that could you know kill you what

0:55:57.390,0:56:03.390

happens if what happens if almost like

0:55:59.880,0:56:05.340

in a religious sense maybe where we need

0:56:03.390,0:56:08.850

to protect the environment almost as

0:56:05.340,0:56:11.610

like gospel and even though it doesn't

0:56:08.850,0:56:13.260

seem like we don't see the benefit of it

0:56:11.610,0:56:16.770

now maybe in five hundred million years

0:56:13.260,0:56:18.750

maybe will be something that saved us

0:56:16.770,0:56:20.790

and maybe in five hundred million years

0:56:18.750,0:56:23.640

we can say well you can eat pork again

0:56:20.790,0:56:25.500

guys you know we we we found

0:56:23.640,0:56:26.640

refrigerators created them and stuff but

0:56:25.500,0:56:29.340

maybe in five hundred million years

0:56:26.640,0:56:30.570

again we can we can say well you know do

0:56:29.340,0:56:32.490

what you want to the environment we got

0:56:30.570,0:56:33.840

a little controlled by AI and stuff so

0:56:32.490,0:56:35.400

whatever you do it would just be like we

0:56:33.840,0:56:36.810

all bounce back like a trampoline so

0:56:35.400,0:56:38.370

maybe this is something we need to do

0:56:36.810,0:56:39.770

maybe we need to play it on the safe

0:56:38.370,0:56:42.330

side I think it's an interesting

0:56:39.770,0:56:46.170

comparison because there's definitely a

0:56:42.330,0:56:48.510

place where where what we do now is

0:56:46.170,0:56:49.380

because we lack understanding

0:56:48.510,0:56:50.730

yeah well lack there at the

0:56:49.380,0:56:54.870

understanding and the technology to

0:56:50.730,0:56:56.760

prevent the worst sides of it I think I

0:56:54.870,0:56:59.220

read somewhere that that not eating pork

0:56:56.760,0:57:00.810

was very political at that time or

0:56:59.220,0:57:03.930

something like that but you know there's

0:57:00.810,0:57:07.140

a like there's a lot of duties I guess

0:57:03.930,0:57:09.210

in in Judaism regarding you have to wash

0:57:07.140,0:57:12.300

your hands before every meal that's like

0:57:09.210,0:57:14.100

something that went way way before and

0:57:12.300,0:57:17.010

there's like this whole ritual ritual

0:57:14.100,0:57:18.870

where you say this little prayer I think

0:57:17.010,0:57:20.310

or something like that and you know that

0:57:18.870,0:57:22.410

kind of makes a lot of sense just

0:57:20.310,0:57:24.630

imagine that you're living in a time

0:57:22.410,0:57:27.900

where the it's not even sure that you

0:57:24.630,0:57:30.510

have so but but you do wash your hands

0:57:27.900,0:57:32.430

before every meal and I think also after

0:57:30.510,0:57:34.410

going to the bathroom and that's really

0:57:32.430,0:57:37.500

beneficial they didn't understand why

0:57:34.410,0:57:39.300

but they saw it had good effects over

0:57:37.500,0:57:42.240

the community so it's something that

0:57:39.300,0:57:45.840

they took and and went on forward I

0:57:42.240,0:57:48.750

think it's probably will be the same

0:57:45.840,0:57:50.670

regarding our duties regarding the

0:57:48.750,0:57:53.410

ecosystem but but the main the main

0:57:50.670,0:57:56.530

differentiator here is that

0:57:53.410,0:57:58.990

it's for a much longer run because when

0:57:56.530,0:58:01.660

you wash your hands then the community

0:57:58.990,0:58:03.880

in in that lifetime can see that there's

0:58:01.660,0:58:09.060

less mortality over some certain

0:58:03.880,0:58:11.320

diseases or or some illness drop but

0:58:09.060,0:58:15.910

regarding the ecosystem it's kind of

0:58:11.320,0:58:17.560

like maintaining the maintaining

0:58:15.910,0:58:19.810

something that that's already existing

0:58:17.560,0:58:22.780

it's not creating something new and it's

0:58:19.810,0:58:25.510

not necessarily something that will your

0:58:22.780,0:58:28.270

children won't necessarily will

0:58:25.510,0:58:31.420

experience if you if you want to it but

0:58:28.270,0:58:34.450

even if we don't take this topic too

0:58:31.420,0:58:37.470

much we won't take it too much seriously

0:58:34.450,0:58:41.800

our children will probably still have

0:58:37.470,0:58:45.790

forests to go to but we will kind of

0:58:41.800,0:58:48.280

need to play this thing in the long run

0:58:45.790,0:58:51.070

and I think it's it's very interesting

0:58:48.280,0:58:55.540

because it's like a different stage of

0:58:51.070,0:58:57.220

our of our society maturity because as

0:58:55.540,0:58:59.620

you get more mature you need to start

0:58:57.220,0:59:01.690

thinking more ahead you know you as a

0:58:59.620,0:59:03.850

kid you just wanna eat candy right and

0:59:01.690,0:59:06.640

then as a mature person you understand

0:59:03.850,0:59:10.780

well I do I still want to eat just candy

0:59:06.640,0:59:13.360

by the way I just ate a lot of candy but

0:59:10.780,0:59:14.710

but like normal adults what they do is

0:59:13.360,0:59:17.320

they try not to eat so much candy

0:59:14.710,0:59:20.200

because they kind of they kind of see

0:59:17.320,0:59:22.240

ahead and they have foresight yeah and

0:59:20.200,0:59:24.940

you know that's that's pretty much

0:59:22.240,0:59:27.670

regarding everything but it's still you

0:59:24.940,0:59:29.320

know it's very individual driven yeah

0:59:27.670,0:59:31.210

and as a society we want to extinct

0:59:29.320,0:59:33.580

everything but now we have the foresight

0:59:31.210,0:59:37.810

to see how bad it would be yeah and also

0:59:33.580,0:59:39.370

we need to kind of think as a society I

0:59:37.810,0:59:41.170

think it's harder than it sounds

0:59:39.370,0:59:43.300

because like you're saying for ages

0:59:41.170,0:59:46.300

we've been thinking as a society we

0:59:43.300,0:59:50.560

created States we created you know

0:59:46.300,0:59:53.620

people and Nations but there's something

0:59:50.560,0:59:56.410

more global that that we need to kind of

0:59:53.620,0:59:59.410

take into account here and I think there

0:59:56.410,1:00:02.590

are you know sprouts of it there's all

0:59:59.410,1:00:05.350

the the ecological conventions that a

1:00:02.590,1:00:08.060

lot of countries join - there's the

1:00:05.350,1:00:12.240

Paris agreement I think that they you

1:00:08.060,1:00:14.610

just left or something and and again

1:00:12.240,1:00:18.690

that it kind of seems that we're going

1:00:14.610,1:00:21.930

in in in the right direction of kind of

1:00:18.690,1:00:24.750

finding their responsibility yeah I by

1:00:21.930,1:00:26.460

the way I'm not sure regarding the the

1:00:24.750,1:00:29.640

previous question no in order to

1:00:26.460,1:00:32.220

preserve a species maybe it is worth to

1:00:29.640,1:00:34.410

harm an individual happiness I think

1:00:32.220,1:00:37.740

there's also the example that you gave

1:00:34.410,1:00:39.470

with the paperclip Maximizer yeah that's

1:00:37.740,1:00:42.650

a cool one I never heard about it before

1:00:39.470,1:00:46.250

I think I kinda I kind of heard about it

1:00:42.650,1:00:49.020

as the concept of infinite repetition

1:00:46.250,1:00:51.120

like in order to kind of understand

1:00:49.020,1:00:53.220

something you need to to repeat it until

1:00:51.120,1:00:55.950

until infinity and see and see what you

1:00:53.220,1:00:59.220

think about it then but I think it's

1:00:55.950,1:01:01.860

just you know I read it at some book

1:00:59.220,1:01:03.630

that they say ah well look at the French

1:01:01.860,1:01:05.490

Revolution it's all very romantic

1:01:03.630,1:01:07.860

and everything but if you'll have if you

1:01:05.490,1:01:09.480

had to do it all the time then it's

1:01:07.860,1:01:12.270

pretty horrible it's not something that

1:01:09.480,1:01:16.580

is sustainable it's a bad thing but

1:01:12.270,1:01:19.560

that's kind of like reducing things to

1:01:16.580,1:01:21.300

to do very act and kind of forgetting

1:01:19.560,1:01:22.830

everything around it and and that I

1:01:21.300,1:01:25.860

think that's kind of the point here

1:01:22.830,1:01:28.080

because there are certain conditions

1:01:25.860,1:01:30.180

where where you need to kind of be

1:01:28.080,1:01:31.830

mature and look ahead and try to

1:01:30.180,1:01:33.690

understand what's the greater good here

1:01:31.830,1:01:36.570

and it doesn't necessarily means that

1:01:33.690,1:01:39.180

this is now that like this is this is

1:01:36.570,1:01:40.740

not the norm that you kind of repeat

1:01:39.180,1:01:43.110

until infinity

1:01:40.740,1:01:46.200

you won't make everyone suffer in order

1:01:43.110,1:01:48.750

to to save a specie but you may you may

1:01:46.200,1:01:51.510

want to keep that panda in a cage in

1:01:48.750,1:01:53.160

order to for its children to to be able

1:01:51.510,1:01:53.760

to go back to the wild yeah that's a

1:01:53.160,1:01:56.700

good point

1:01:53.760,1:02:02.280

it's sort of how I feel like this is the

1:01:56.700,1:02:03.600

SJW in me but I kind of feel like the

1:02:02.280,1:02:06.570

environment is how I feel about

1:02:03.600,1:02:08.490

companies so I really don't care about

1:02:06.570,1:02:10.740

companies because companies aren't

1:02:08.490,1:02:13.670

anyone no one needs a company but

1:02:10.740,1:02:17.100

companies are made up of people so like

1:02:13.670,1:02:18.840

there's employees there's CEOs the

1:02:17.100,1:02:21.100

customers and stuff so I want the

1:02:18.840,1:02:24.010

company to work as long as its function

1:02:21.100,1:02:25.900

two people right and if it's not then I

1:02:24.010,1:02:28.180

don't care about the company whereas

1:02:25.900,1:02:31.350

with the environment if the environment

1:02:28.180,1:02:33.910

and the ecology and the systems are

1:02:31.350,1:02:35.560

serving the animals then I want to

1:02:33.910,1:02:38.140

preserve it but if there's something

1:02:35.560,1:02:40.900

that's not going right then I think we

1:02:38.140,1:02:42.700

should interfere so it's really not the

1:02:40.900,1:02:44.590

environment that I'm too concerned with

1:02:42.700,1:02:47.410

it's just everyone in the environment

1:02:44.590,1:02:49.810

and I think right now we don't have the

1:02:47.410,1:02:53.260

wisdom to mess with it because whatever

1:02:49.810,1:02:55.600

we do seems to harm it yeah so maybe it

1:02:53.260,1:02:58.180

should be our collective wisdom that we

1:02:55.600,1:02:59.950

should study it for a million years and

1:02:58.180,1:03:03.310

then maybe we press a button you know I

1:02:59.950,1:03:05.140

agree but I think there's this III think

1:03:03.310,1:03:08.890

I disagree with something very specific

1:03:05.140,1:03:11.620

that nature or the environment is a

1:03:08.890,1:03:14.530

company but it's a company that you you

1:03:11.620,1:03:17.080

are working and will always work in your

1:03:14.530,1:03:18.340

part of that company there are all kind

1:03:17.080,1:03:20.770

of companies right there's Google

1:03:18.340,1:03:22.870

there's Amazon there's Apple and you

1:03:20.770,1:03:24.450

know to each its own like I don't really

1:03:22.870,1:03:27.580

care what what will happen to them

1:03:24.450,1:03:29.590

unless I work at that company or I have

1:03:27.580,1:03:31.540

stocks in that company and then I start

1:03:29.590,1:03:33.430

to really care about what's going on

1:03:31.540,1:03:35.080

there so you're saying we're all in the

1:03:33.430,1:03:38.830

same company in this situation we're not

1:03:35.080,1:03:40.840

individuals that live alongside the

1:03:38.830,1:03:42.790

environment where individuals within the

1:03:40.840,1:03:44.830

environment yeah that's a good point and

1:03:42.790,1:03:46.900

because of that you will always have to

1:03:44.830,1:03:49.900

care what's happening here and you know

1:03:46.900,1:03:51.910

it's not it's not like losing your job

1:03:49.900,1:03:55.180

and finding a new one

1:03:51.910,1:03:59.080

like I guess we can we can Wally this

1:03:55.180,1:04:02.050

thing and kind of move to to a spaceship

1:03:59.080,1:04:03.940

and and get all fat on on floating boat

1:04:02.050,1:04:07.120

on floating chairs yeah that sounds by

1:04:03.940,1:04:08.950

the way as I always say with people that

1:04:07.120,1:04:11.190

are smaller than me I agree with that

1:04:08.950,1:04:11.190

guy

1:04:11.350,1:04:16.800

but until then and even then we'll

1:04:13.810,1:04:19.090

probably we won't want to lose this job

1:04:16.800,1:04:21.370

you know one of the things that I always

1:04:19.090,1:04:24.670

liked about the sci-fi movies is that it

1:04:21.370,1:04:27.280

seems that no matter how how it seems

1:04:24.670,1:04:29.530

that the human race has kind of gone

1:04:27.280,1:04:32.830

everywhere to all parts of the galaxy

1:04:29.530,1:04:34.800

and beyond like the earth remains its

1:04:32.830,1:04:37.200

capital right it's it's

1:04:34.800,1:04:40.260

the home that everyone kind of always

1:04:37.200,1:04:43.440

talked about and and and mentioned as a

1:04:40.260,1:04:45.030

the cradle of humanity yeah it's it's

1:04:43.440,1:04:47.460

kind of like a special place and it

1:04:45.030,1:04:50.520

always will be you know even when we'll

1:04:47.460,1:04:53.610

find these solutions and I think it will

1:04:50.520,1:04:56.850

be a good call not to completely destroy

1:04:53.610,1:04:59.070

it let's play it on the safe side like

1:04:56.850,1:05:01.560

let's not destroy ourselves just just in

1:04:59.070,1:05:04.080

case well let me ask you guys would you

1:05:01.560,1:05:06.750

vote in favor of visualizing

1:05:04.080,1:05:08.520

Anthropocene then I would and the main

1:05:06.750,1:05:11.370

reason without understanding all the

1:05:08.520,1:05:13.500

geology behind it is that once you coin

1:05:11.370,1:05:16.500

the term then everything sort of

1:05:13.500,1:05:18.390

followers you know like it just it's

1:05:16.500,1:05:20.460

just one of those things like as soon as

1:05:18.390,1:05:22.620

they they were talking about quantum

1:05:20.460,1:05:24.480

gravity then all of a sudden all the

1:05:22.620,1:05:27.270

books come out about it you know so it's

1:05:24.480,1:05:28.680

it's one of those things where I think

1:05:27.270,1:05:30.210

sometimes you need a bit of branding

1:05:28.680,1:05:33.600

just to be able to kick-started my

1:05:30.210,1:05:36.600

initial tendency was was towards no

1:05:33.600,1:05:40.320

because like it's it's still really

1:05:36.600,1:05:44.280

early to say but I can agree with Peter

1:05:40.320,1:05:46.740

I think there's a specific benefit like

1:05:44.280,1:05:49.290

like actual benefit for these times to

1:05:46.740,1:05:52.320

kind of coin it and be able to reference

1:05:49.290,1:05:54.840

it you know for different topics I think

1:05:52.320,1:05:56.700

if we coin it too early and then we do

1:05:54.840,1:05:58.530

all this research and stuff and in a

1:05:56.700,1:06:00.300

million years later it's all thing no

1:05:58.530,1:06:03.300

one's gonna care anyway that we named it

1:06:00.300,1:06:05.310

like completely like but I think it will

1:06:03.300,1:06:07.410

do more huh more good than harm yeah

1:06:05.310,1:06:10.310

yeah and that's where I stand like I

1:06:07.410,1:06:13.890

said it seems a little bit so important

1:06:10.310,1:06:16.620

it's way early to call this age the

1:06:13.890,1:06:18.950

Anthropocene but yeah I think it has a

1:06:16.620,1:06:21.600

good effect to it and basically that's

1:06:18.950,1:06:23.760

that's what we need and also it's it's

1:06:21.600,1:06:25.290

being used today and and I see it a lot

1:06:23.760,1:06:27.750

in papers and every time I see it I

1:06:25.290,1:06:30.810

think they're they're using it and it's

1:06:27.750,1:06:33.570

effective it it does a trick why do you

1:06:30.810,1:06:35.730

think it's self-portraits or or is it

1:06:33.570,1:06:37.740

why is it bad because you know we're

1:06:35.730,1:06:40.620

kind of important important I think yeah

1:06:37.740,1:06:43.320

like I said it's just a minor thing it's

1:06:40.620,1:06:46.350

nothing against formalizing the term but

1:06:43.320,1:06:48.470

it's just funny to name like you know

1:06:46.350,1:06:51.650

the entire time

1:06:48.470,1:06:53.750

period after humanity you know like it's

1:06:51.650,1:06:56.150

like saying okay we've noticed that

1:06:53.750,1:06:59.359

we're destroying everything so let's

1:06:56.150,1:07:01.130

have a party in our name no it just

1:06:59.359,1:07:03.560

feels kind of funny I'm not saying it's

1:07:01.130,1:07:05.690

it's not a knock against the

1:07:03.560,1:07:07.430

Anthropocene you look at it actually cuz

1:07:05.690,1:07:09.230

like sometimes you could think about it

1:07:07.430,1:07:11.570

is like it's putting the blame solely on

1:07:09.230,1:07:13.340

us like it's not like the anthro I'm

1:07:11.570,1:07:20.119

those bloody baboon Essenes you know

1:07:13.340,1:07:22.940

like but but so yeah it's pretty the

1:07:20.119,1:07:24.710

blame so at us for that again if the

1:07:22.940,1:07:25.460

baboons made at the end throw up a scene

1:07:24.710,1:07:27.170

we'd be pissed

1:07:25.460,1:07:28.970

that'd be a shame yeah I can totally see

1:07:27.170,1:07:31.670

someone you know who doesn't really

1:07:28.970,1:07:34.060

understand the science thinking oh where

1:07:31.670,1:07:36.790

is this time period the humanity period

1:07:34.060,1:07:41.290

Anthropocene fucking-a we're number one

1:07:36.790,1:07:41.290

everything was shit into humans yeah

1:07:41.380,1:07:45.500

cool

1:07:42.920,1:07:47.480

so I think this has been our first

1:07:45.500,1:07:49.820

cyclist I don't know maybe we'll do more

1:07:47.480,1:07:53.210

I have one in plan I think Peter does as

1:07:49.820,1:07:55.160

well I have one Yin in in process and I

1:07:53.210,1:07:57.410

think it's a it's a fun format yeah

1:07:55.160,1:07:59.720

absolutely fantastic job and yeah really

1:07:57.410,1:08:01.220

thank you thank you so much actually

1:07:59.720,1:08:04.310

let me tell you where I like how I

1:08:01.220,1:08:06.770

started reading about this um last year

1:08:04.310,1:08:08.450

or maybe two years ago I needed

1:08:06.770,1:08:11.869

something to fill my time with you know

1:08:08.450,1:08:13.849

I like I was really enjoying when I was

1:08:11.869,1:08:15.650

in college like learning a lot of things

1:08:13.849,1:08:17.450

but I kind of felt like I wanted you

1:08:15.650,1:08:18.770

know choose what I'm learning you know

1:08:17.450,1:08:21.920

use my mind for something that

1:08:18.770,1:08:24.170

specifically interests me so back then I

1:08:21.920,1:08:26.359

started writing this blog where I like

1:08:24.170,1:08:27.830

each each blog post was basically an

1:08:26.359,1:08:30.529

article I chose something I was

1:08:27.830,1:08:32.239

interested in researched it until I felt

1:08:30.529,1:08:33.980

like I knew enough about it to explain

1:08:32.239,1:08:38.000

it and then I wrote about it like a

1:08:33.980,1:08:39.290

2,000 word article and when I started in

1:08:38.000,1:08:41.719

the master's degree when I started

1:08:39.290,1:08:43.310

University last year like I found that I

1:08:41.719,1:08:45.980

don't have enough time and enough

1:08:43.310,1:08:49.310

capacity in my mind to do both the the

1:08:45.980,1:08:51.469

thesis I'm working on and the blog so I

1:08:49.310,1:08:53.270

stopped doing it and the last article I

1:08:51.469,1:08:56.569

was working on was this the

1:08:53.270,1:08:58.219

intrapersonal like I was already in kind

1:08:56.569,1:08:59.600

of in the late stages of writing the

1:08:58.219,1:09:02.120

article you know I've done all the

1:08:59.600,1:09:06.170

research I've started writing everything

1:09:02.120,1:09:08.990

I then kind of stopped doing it so when

1:09:06.170,1:09:11.960

we talked about doing this side quests I

1:09:08.990,1:09:14.720

thought like I already have a subject

1:09:11.960,1:09:16.190

researched and like I I found it

1:09:14.720,1:09:18.680

extremely interesting back then and I

1:09:16.190,1:09:20.720

wanted to you know put it out there now

1:09:18.680,1:09:22.550

I have the chance you know now I it's

1:09:20.720,1:09:25.160

it's a bit of a moment of closure for me

1:09:22.550,1:09:26.720

and it's something I was sitting on for

1:09:25.160,1:09:27.500

a while now yeah really good thank you

1:09:26.720,1:09:29.570

guys for listening

1:09:27.500,1:09:31.970

yeah for sure I actually think that this

1:09:29.570,1:09:34.370

whole concept of side quests that could

1:09:31.970,1:09:36.230

be like a podcast of its own you know I

1:09:34.370,1:09:38.420

think it's super interesting to

1:09:36.230,1:09:40.580

everytime like like you did in the blog

1:09:38.420,1:09:42.440

and what you did now grab this topic

1:09:40.580,1:09:44.570

research the hell out of it and just

1:09:42.440,1:09:46.040

bring the the interesting facts and

1:09:44.570,1:09:47.690

create a discussion around it that's

1:09:46.040,1:09:50.120

that's really cool yeah I totally agree

1:09:47.690,1:09:54.830

totally you've you've set a high bar

1:09:50.120,1:09:57.320

oh no honestly like I'm now I'm working

1:09:54.830,1:09:59.510

on another one which won't be half as

1:09:57.320,1:10:03.170

deep like the next one I'm doing is

1:09:59.510,1:10:06.290

about a video game so it's it's going in

1:10:03.170,1:10:08.210

a different direction altogether so how

1:10:06.290,1:10:11.600

how frequent are we gonna are we gonna

1:10:08.210,1:10:13.490

do this well the way I see it I'm I'm

1:10:11.600,1:10:15.710

enjoying working on it in the background

1:10:13.490,1:10:17.810

like I've worked on this the

1:10:15.710,1:10:21.050

anthropocene one I gave it like 30

1:10:17.810,1:10:23.390

minutes a day it's for the last month or

1:10:21.050,1:10:25.610

so and that's you know after I've done

1:10:23.390,1:10:27.830

all the research and everything so like

1:10:25.610,1:10:30.200

for the next one I think I'm gonna I

1:10:27.830,1:10:32.870

don't read about it to 20 30 40 minutes

1:10:30.200,1:10:34.550

a day and when it's done I'll tell you

1:10:32.870,1:10:36.620

guys and we'll record the episode yeah

1:10:34.550,1:10:39.560

cool I think I think yeah if Peter got

1:10:36.620,1:10:41.660

one ready and we can also go haven't got

1:10:39.560,1:10:43.640

one ready I'm planning it now I've

1:10:41.660,1:10:46.910

switched my topic a little bit something

1:10:43.640,1:10:49.130

a bit more lighter but I am I'm just

1:10:46.910,1:10:51.700

trying to work out how I'm gonna put it

1:10:49.130,1:10:54.080

together both with the technology and

1:10:51.700,1:10:56.150

how I'm gonna split up the segments a

1:10:54.080,1:10:59.000

little bit but it this is this was

1:10:56.150,1:11:00.890

really one to model on yeah yeah and the

1:10:59.000,1:11:02.270

way I said if we do one every few months

1:11:00.890,1:11:04.700

that'll be perfect

1:11:02.270,1:11:06.470

yeah every like couple of three four

1:11:04.700,1:11:10.700

months I don't know I think I also have

1:11:06.470,1:11:13.310

one that's about 70% ready I did it at

1:11:10.700,1:11:15.000

my and my job like a lecture about

1:11:13.310,1:11:16.800

encryptions yeah

1:11:15.000,1:11:19.140

oh that's really cool I'm trying to make

1:11:16.800,1:11:20.790

2020 the year of sort of learning a

1:11:19.140,1:11:23.370

little bit more about tech so that's why

1:11:20.790,1:11:26.460

I went on that rant about Google and all

1:11:23.370,1:11:28.530

this stuff so I'll be very interested in

1:11:26.460,1:11:30.780

that encryption yeah I'll look into it

1:11:28.530,1:11:38.310

maybe I can bring it sooner than later

1:11:30.780,1:11:40.950

awesome Asura kill in our next episode

1:11:38.310,1:11:43.350

we're going to be watching the TV series

1:11:40.950,1:11:46.530

Firefly and the accompanying feature

1:11:43.350,1:11:48.690

film serenity it's the first TV show

1:11:46.530,1:11:50.880

that we're going to be discussing on

1:11:48.690,1:11:52.710

this podcast which is pretty cool

1:11:50.880,1:11:55.650

I think that this is a very highly

1:11:52.710,1:11:57.570

regarded thing amongst you know the

1:11:55.650,1:11:59.580

geeks it's a cult following Jeff yeah

1:11:57.570,1:12:02.130

definitely it was created by Joss Whedon

1:11:59.580,1:12:04.200

who well he also did Buffy the Vampire

1:12:02.130,1:12:06.690

Slayer he did dr. Horrible's sing-along

1:12:04.200,1:12:08.820

blog he worked with Marvel and some

1:12:06.690,1:12:11.610

comics if I'm not mistaken he did the

1:12:08.820,1:12:15.480

first two Avengers movies he did the

1:12:11.610,1:12:17.640

Avengers in 2012 and in 2015 2015 didn't

1:12:15.480,1:12:19.470

get amazing reviews but I think most

1:12:17.640,1:12:21.360

people will agree that the first

1:12:19.470,1:12:23.550

Avengers might be one of the best films

1:12:21.360,1:12:25.830

in the franchise so that's that's

1:12:23.550,1:12:28.700

definitely how I heard of him I think he

1:12:25.830,1:12:30.870

also worked on the Justice League movie

1:12:28.700,1:12:32.850

controversial but yeah there's a bit of

1:12:30.870,1:12:35.340

a disagreement about how much he worked

1:12:32.850,1:12:38.040

on it they say 20 percent but people

1:12:35.340,1:12:40.320

think he did a bit more but yeah that's

1:12:38.040,1:12:43.410

interesting at that discussion for

1:12:40.320,1:12:45.660

another time yeah anyway the main

1:12:43.410,1:12:48.450

characters in Firefly are played by

1:12:45.660,1:12:49.800

Nathan Fillion Gina Torres Alan Tudyk

1:12:48.450,1:12:52.140

and Morena Baccarin

1:12:49.800,1:12:54.630

which is you know it's it's a bunch of

1:12:52.140,1:12:57.360

like familiar faces and and like very

1:12:54.630,1:13:00.750

endearing people very very fun actors

1:12:57.360,1:13:04.380

and the TV series had one season of 14

1:13:00.750,1:13:06.480

episodes I think it ran in 2002 at that

1:13:04.380,1:13:08.880

point it got cancelled it was kind of

1:13:06.480,1:13:10.890

left with a few unfinished plot lines so

1:13:08.880,1:13:13.740

they then made the movie serenity that

1:13:10.890,1:13:15.360

came out in 2005 which is supposed to

1:13:13.740,1:13:17.190

kind of close the story and close

1:13:15.360,1:13:19.020

everything up that's good I didn't know

1:13:17.190,1:13:19.470

that I did the movie but that's really

1:13:19.020,1:13:22.410

cool

1:13:19.470,1:13:24.420

and well a few years back I had you know

1:13:22.410,1:13:26.550

quite a few friends who just adored

1:13:24.420,1:13:28.590

Firefly and serenity and like they never

1:13:26.550,1:13:28.920

stopped talking about it so you know we

1:13:28.590,1:13:30.810

had

1:13:28.920,1:13:33.179

is kind of a slumber party kind of thing

1:13:30.810,1:13:34.260

that we watched most of the TV show I

1:13:33.179,1:13:36.360

think we watch like eight or nine

1:13:34.260,1:13:39.000

episodes and you know I remember it was

1:13:36.360,1:13:41.190

kind of fun and different but like I was

1:13:39.000,1:13:42.840

wasn't paying too much attention to it

1:13:41.190,1:13:44.850

you know I had a bunch of friends around

1:13:42.840,1:13:47.190

me and everyone was talking and eating

1:13:44.850,1:13:49.710

pizza and stuff and then I watched the

1:13:47.190,1:13:51.300

rest on my own like I don't remember too

1:13:49.710,1:13:52.050

much from it you know I wasn't too much

1:13:51.300,1:13:54.150

into it

1:13:52.050,1:13:55.350

and anyway since then my girlfriend and

1:13:54.150,1:13:57.630

I have been talking about watching the

1:13:55.350,1:13:59.840

movie serenity but I don't really

1:13:57.630,1:14:02.010

remember anything from the show so

1:13:59.840,1:14:05.130

here's an opportunity to watch it again

1:14:02.010,1:14:07.469

pay some attention to it and well enjoy

1:14:05.130,1:14:08.610

the whole thing cool cannot wait yeah I

1:14:07.469,1:14:10.800

think it's gonna be fun

1:14:08.610,1:14:12.900

so thank you Peter and thank you Mario

1:14:10.800,1:14:15.000

for staying true to our goal and thank

1:14:12.900,1:14:17.940

you the listeners at home for helping us

1:14:15.000,1:14:19.500

along the latest stage of our quest we

1:14:17.940,1:14:21.900

hope that you join us again next episode

1:14:19.500,1:14:24.520

and we'll talk to you soon bye bye so

1:14:21.900,1:14:30.009

yeah see ya

1:14:24.520,1:14:30.009

[Music]

1:14:32.040,1:14:37.600

hi I'm Jenny the host of it's murder up

1:14:35.200,1:14:39.580

north you're curious about the murderous

1:14:37.600,1:14:40.540

north of England this podcast is

1:14:39.580,1:14:43.270

definitely for you

1:14:40.540,1:14:45.250

I've lived in various parts of the life

1:14:43.270,1:14:47.650

of England I went to college in the

1:14:45.250,1:14:50.110

shadow saddle with more when Myra

1:14:47.650,1:14:52.690

Hindley and Ian Brady very Thor's five

1:14:50.110,1:14:54.520

innocent children I've worked in the

1:14:52.690,1:14:56.680

City of Leeds where the Yorkshire Ripper

1:14:54.520,1:14:59.590

targeted his victims in the nineteen

1:14:56.680,1:15:02.230

seventies knowing how geographically

1:14:59.590,1:15:05.440

close I've been to these crimes many

1:15:02.230,1:15:09.190

curious and that curiosity became this

1:15:05.440,1:15:13.590

podcast however my main hope is to help

1:15:09.190,1:15:13.590

you see the person not victim