Interviewed August 17, 2020 by Kristin Aker Howell

Ms. Sudaria, superintendent of RCSD. Thank you joining…

1. What are your current most specific goals for the Ravenswood City School District?

The most immediate one that’s in the forefront is ensuring that we launch a successful first day of school via distance learning. We’ve had teams working throughout the summer work very hard in preparing, providing technology devices and communication out to families. And so we are working really hard on trying to build relationships with families that we would typically do during the first few weeks of school, virtually. And so we definitely want to make sure build the communication that we would usually do in person. So there’s the launch of school, but then we also just approved our strategic plan back in spring. In light of having to focus and pivot to distance learning we still have goals ensuring we provide the best instructional program. Ensuring we improve the teacher value proposition and provide competitive salaries. We also want to communicate our core values and ensure that all community partners and stakeholders are clearly informed about what our plan is and what we all need to uphold to ensure the success of the implementation of the strategic plan. So that is pretty lofty in mitigating through Covid. And I’d say the third priority right now is making some decisions and reevaluating policies that perpetuate oppression of black and brown children in our schools. To focus on culture, race and language to show that we are meeting the needs of all of our children and making sure that our program is relevant and applicable that we really try to do work that is anti-racist. So I am feeling anxious. This is going to keep us busy. I need to make sure we are informed and we communicated so that we know the playbook.

2. I didn’t have this question in there, but, other than a pandemic, what are some of the biggest barriers you have faced in reaching this goals? I read your strategic goals, obviously pandemic wasn’t in there. What are some things you are up against trying to accomplish those things like communication, competitive teachers salaries, all of those things you just mentioned.

I think looking at how to prioritize our spending. We’re a district that per student the amount of dollars per student you might think we’re doing fairly well, but if you take a look at those dollars, the majority of it, fifty percent of it, are restricted dollars. Unlike other Districts that are BasicAid, we have a specific way, we are told how to spend our dollars. So it limits us how to utilize that to provide competitive salaries for teachers. We are working closely with our foundation specifically to see if we can shift our money so that we have more unrestricted available, or we spend our restricted dollar’s in a way that is not picked up by our foundation so our foundation has more freedom to fill the the gaps where there is a need in the district. So that is a barrier. But we are looking at ways to raise additional funds and bring in more revenue with our facilities, how to use our facilities to bring in more revenue. Additional barriers are with distance learning, ensuring our families remain connected and stay in the game. We have to go ever and beyond just emailing and text messaging. We need to make sure we do some home visits. We need to make sure we provide safe learning spaces. Where families can have children be supervised during the day while they go off to work. And while we’re doing that we may as well facilitate the learning that’s going on as well. Along with restricted dollars its connecting and engaging families who with distance learning will still have problems with connecting. We have to pull out all the tricks to have our families engaged with us. We have to provide that professional development for teacher so they know how to best teach our students in this form of learning. This is all new for everybody. Some are picking up the new skills around the technology, the new programs that are made available its constantlythere new things being flashed before us and we want to be strategic and resourceful and we want to equip our people. And I would say I don’t want to go back to normal. I want to reach for better. Its an opportunity for us to do school to serve our kids, not have our kids fit into how we do school. I’m very excited about we been talking about what can we do differently and now we can look at blended learning flipped learning. What is working best for our students. Let’s explore what is actually working and maybe we hold on to that when students are able to come back onto campus.

I love that, that you are dreaming forward, really. This pandemic has knocked us all over and caused us to question everything. If you could, dream forward, far forward for your district what dreams, five, ten years forward would you have for the students in your district?

It’s, not necessarily a tough question, it hits home for me. Because I’ve always preface. Even when I started in 98, when I became a Principal. I’ve always said we need to have a school you would always bring your own children to. We got to a place at Costano where I had no qualms about sending my son to the school. And actually, we’ve had several staff do that. My goal for the Ravenswood City School District is that every educator would have no doubts about sending their child to any one of the four schools, whether it be one of the three elementary school, and then having no hesitation to send their children to our middle school. If we as educators feel that way, than any other new family that moves into Ravenswood or that’s been in Ravenswood and has not yet enrolled in Ravenswood would want to reconsider because of the program, but not necessarily because of the program, but its of how the students feel when they walk on the campus because of the adults on the campus. Thats the goal. I don’t want families to have to go to think of a Charter School because programs are not rigorous. Or when a family moves into East Palo Alto and doesn’t even consider the Ravenswood School District but just automatically applies for the Tinsley Program. I want them to consider Ravenswood. I want them to know Ravenswood because of what’s been publicized as being great. If they’re not even considering Ravenswood why is it not on their radar. As my first official year as a Superintendent why are new families not even aware of the District? A lot of them are already considering outside of the District. How to put our best foot forward. How to publicize the great work that’s happening here. And the cultural wealth that we have.

I like that you are focusing on the teachers. I like that you are focusing on having teachers bring their own kids there and I notice that you had competitive teachers salaries as one of your goals.

To have to work - when you become a teacher you want to reach the needs and address the needs of students. We can’t put our instructional program in a box. We constantly have to evolve. It takes a lot of work. Its very taxing. That innovative approach needs to compensated. Because you’re constantly growing as an educator. To respond to the climate - the diaspora of needs in the classroom. It takes a lot of will. Will and skill. And if you want that individual to have the will and the skill, I think they should be compensated for it. It would be a lot easier to find individuals to fill those vacancies when staff leave it not only fits their emotional - its something that - it’s the cherry on top - we can get a yes when we make that offer. It would help with recruiting and retaining.

So people can afford to live here.

The retention piece is the most important piece we have to address here.

You mentioned the Tinsley Settlement. You don’t want people to think about that before they consider Ravenswood. Anne Campbell mentioned she had families who were third generation Tinsley participants. How does it affect your district, other than your personal feelings that you want the students to want to come to Ravenswood?

We want families to want to come. I understand that the Raveswood School District has to make it very appealing. And I believe that families should have choices. But without knowledge and of what your choices are and without first hand knowledge and without having stepped foot on a campus and only hearing about - is very different than knowing by first hand. Every school has their weaknesses. I would have to say that if a black and brown child goes to Tinsley, their immediate needs may not be addressed, not will their be cultural sensitivity applied. I don’t know if I’m trying to be delicate around this conversation, I believe that families who have a choice or don’t have a choice aren’t knowledgeable.

Imagine what Ravenswood City School would look like if all the families in Ravenswood attended the Ravenswood City Schools? How enriching. It would be pretty powerful if our community were to stick together and support each other in the learning and development of our children in Ravenswood. But I do know Ravenswood has to do its part. Every school community is as strong as its school community. The entire school community. I will leave it right there.

Anne Campbell and I were discussing how passionately we feel about our small school districts because we make the connections with who we go to school with. We love the teachers who we spend our time with. That’s who matters to us and who we end up learning from.

For me, I really hope that families who choose Tinsley it is because they are concerned the concerned about the type of teaching they might get in Ravenswood, not neccesarily the type of children they would meet in Ravenswood. If that’s the case. Then Ravenswood has to do some tremendous work to improve the perception of the type of instruction our children receive because I’ve seen it first hand, the work of our educators. Its pretty impressive. There is areas of growth under every class there’s improvement. Theres employees that have to improve. Step on a campus. Ask to make an observation. To observe the instruction. If the decision is because of the instruction, great. If it’s because of the students, then that’s another thing.

I worry sometimes people make a school choice based on what they hear from other people, than, as you said, an actual visit.

We all have to do our part. I will take ownership of the work that needs to be done. But collectively if we all are involved we can accelerate the growth.

What would equity look like to you? (Portola Valley spends $24k per kid)

Here’s one of them. Let’s not have those dollars restricted. Let’s not penalize districts who have a specific enrollment but our attendance really affects the amount of money we receive. So we are penalized when some of our most vulnerable students are not able to make it to school. We do not get that funding just based on attendance. We understand we have to do that due diligence, get kids in school keep them engaged, keep them motivated but there are extenuating circumstances for some of our demographics that are very challenging for whatever reason. But were penalized whenever they can’t make it to class. But then we don’t get the funding we need to support students.

And Basic Aid Districts are not.

Correct. That is just one of many examples. There’s a lot fo ties to the funding that school who need it the most how it affects equity. Another piece is truly having programs prepare teachers for the diverse group of students that they teach. We need to be better prepared to explore how we deliver instruction to meet the need of students, Its not about making students fit into school its about making school fit the needs of students. And that’s been the most challenging piece. We have to teach students where they are, not have them conform to traditional school. Most schools are not set up to teach black and brown students. I’m excited about exploring how we deliver instruction - about how we talked about at the beginning here - but be prepared to have very difficult conversations where we have to address race. We have to address race and appropriate texts that are appropriate to our children and make some decisions at our site and constantly ask: is this the best decision for our students.

Did you have something else to add? I know you have a meeting soon.

I do believe in the possibilities. Ravenswood is prime to make some great gains. We’ve emphasized the ned to support our teachers in providing appropriate professional development reading math collaboration time amongst each other. Not only students responsibility to do their work but its our responsibility to respond to our students appropriately behavior, academic, social emotional, all of it. I’m proud of our support, the Ravenswood education foundation, our partners, they are ready to support this administration the teachers, the classified staff, the teachers, the families.

How is the best way to support you in your work online

Ravenswood Education Foundation online, they are in line with our strategic priorities.

interviewed twice. First in email, included here July 2020. Second time by phone in July 29 2020, audio linked here.

Kristin, Here are my initial responses to your questions. We can clarify/amplify when we talk on the 29th.

9. What would equity look like to you now ? Although I certainly understand the realities of local school districts, but I am in favor of an open enrollment policy for all schools if at all possible.

1. What was your role in the Tinsley Settlement? I was the Superintendent of the Palo Alto Unified School District from 1985 to 1989.

2. What, do you think, was the intent of the Tinsley class action case? Primarily, to provide a higher quality educational experience for children living in East Palo Alto.

3. What experiences with the Tinsley case stand out most to you in your memories? Three memories. First, the hesitancy of the Palo Alto Unified School District Board of Trustees(School Board) to engage in discussions/settlement that might lead to Ravenswood School District(East Palo Alto) students enrolling in Palo Alto schools; second, the leadership of Judge Lanham in reaching a settlement; and, third, the amount of time that the issue consumed for the administrative staffs of all districts involved.

4. The case took ten years to settle, how many of those years were you involved in the negotiations? Why did it take so long to settle? I was involved during the four years of my tenure as Superintendent of Schools in Palo Alto. Initially, the positions were very far apart and it simply took time to move away from these positions. Also, personnel (Board members, administrators, parents, etc.) changed or simply moved on to other positions or issues.

5. What, in your opinion, was the impact of Tinsley when it was first implemented? Were you an administrator when that happened? My memory is that there was very minimal impact when first implemented. There were just a few students from the Ravenswood School District who came to the Palo Alto schools. There was press coverage for those first students, then other issues took priority and public interest.

6. Has your opinion of the Tinsley Settlement changed over time? No. (Note: I have not been involved with schools in Santa Clara or San Mateo County since 1989, over 30 years!)

7. How long did you think the Districts involved might be under it? How did you think it might end? I thought the decision would probably be in effect permanently, unless challenged, and that much of the initial objections would fade.

8. What do you think is the impact of the Settlement now, looking back? I continue to think that it was the right solution and was a benefit to students.

Hope this helps. We'll talk on the 29th. Julian

Partial Transcription of interview from July 29, 2020

Thanks for making the time today I really really appreciate it.

Right.

We do have a mutual friend, Anne Campbell, which is really nice.

Sure, exactly. It was great to see the note from Anne. I haven’t seen her in a long time. Please give her my best if you see her. It’s nice to make that connection.

I sure will. I don’t get to see her anymore but I do see her on Zoom every once in a while. Our hair is getting long, I’ll tell you that.

Oh my gosh, OK. You can tell her that mine is turning grey.

So is mine actually. Anne hasn’t turned grey believe it or not. I was one of her students so its not fair how that works.

Question: where were you when you were one of her students?

She was my…what was she at Abbott, an Assistant Principal? A Vice Principal? When I was a middle school student there.

She was the assistant principal there, I believe, yeah.

She actually helped me get re-tracked. It was really great. It changed my life. She really helped me out.

I was just trying to think, was Mr. Belforte, was he principal there at Abbott at that time? Is that right?

Yes! That’s right that’s who it was. I was trying to remember who it was and I couldn’t remember. Thank you.

2:00

John Belforte.

Yes, you’re right. I couldn’t remember. Of course she was the one I was talking to. She was helping me. I didn’t drag out a yearbook but that’s what it would have said. You’re definitely getting those memory cells going.

2:28

Yes, well, just one more little thing. That’s was the time, you probably don’t remember but the big issue was the declining enrollment. We were losing students because of the price of housing, which has continued of course, but you know it was very hard for young families to afford to live in San Mateo and so we were always looking at the issues of closing schools and that was always overshadowing everything. It was so different because California was used to opening and then the growth and everything and then suddenly you turn around and start closing schools. It was not a comfortable time during that period.

I don’t remember that. What I do remember, because my mom was active in PTA and I’m sure she was a complainer, she fought Proposition 13 with every being of her body. I have a picture of me with Wilson Riles, actually, when we went up to Sacramento. She also fought moving 6^th grade into Middle School. I remember her complaining about that. As a kid you just go along with your parent.

What elementary school did you go to? Did you go to Laurel?

I went to George Hall. We lived in San Mateo Village.

Those are real memories.

I wish my mom were still alive I’d ask her, I remember her fighting - this may have been a segregation battle - she fought having the kids from Laurel Village cross the freeway. Now that you mention it, I bet it was about closing schools. She was so upset about having kids cross the freeway to get to school.

Right.

You’re really bringing up memories.

(Laughs) The same. Yeah. It’s always an issue. And even crossing El Camino. That whole issue. Not a good time. Yeah.

Sorry to dredge up these terrible memories. It’s interesting how I looked at it as a kid. I remember hating Proposition 13. How, as an elementary school kid can you feel so passionately about that? It’s because your parent is so involved.

Right.

5:45

That’s funny. Good.

I wanted. I wanted to jump to the last question.

I was interested in your answer to question 9. What would equity look like to you now?

6:13

You understand the realities of local school districts but you now favor an open enrollment policy for all school districts if at all possible. What do you mean by that? Do you mean each school within it’s own district? Do you mean between districts? I’m so naive about this. I know Menlo Atherton did that in the last few years, to let the East Palo Alto kids come over there, with it was with some restrictions. Do you mean across Districts? Or do you mean open enrollment for each little school within that District?

6:55

Actually both. If it was a district like San Mateo, for example, that had a number of elementary schools, and again in the context of the majority of families, as you know, have both parents working. Just to go back in history, the reason, not the reason, but one of the advantages of what we call neighborhood schools is because it was kind of built on the assumption that there would be somebody at home all the time. There were neighborhoods that held together. Well, obviously that’s changed. So, my point was that since in many homes both parents are not there, it many ways it makes sense to have an open enrollment policy so that kids can go where it is perhaps more convenient for their parents than just staying in their local neighborhood school since both parents leave anyway. That’s kind of what I’m saying.

8:10

And there are a lot of individual situations where it may be better, again from the family’s standpoint, not neccessarily the District, but from a family’s standpoint that the children go to another school instead of their neighborhood school. That’s what I’m saying ideally from a parent’s perspective if Districts had literally an open enrollment arrangement, in many ways it may be more helpful for families. Particularly now where, as I said, as you know, both parents are working in most places. The whole idea of the neighborhood school part of it was based on the idea that somebody’s home all the time. It’s from from the 40s the 50s and the 60s. It kind of a neighborhood there wasn’t the transiency. There wasn’t electronic stuff or any of those things.The whole neighborhood school was geographically focused.That’s just not the case now. We tend to be more electronically focused than geographic.

9:30

That’s what I meant by that. It may meet the needs of families better if you had a purely open enrollment system within a District.

9:52

It kind of opened my mind. So I was going with that. Some families commute very far. Some families commute an hour and a half each day or more to work each day. That kind of open enrollment would have to be done at a regional or state level almost. Then there are questions that have to be answered. Some schools would be overly impacted. For instance my school operates on a lottery with a waiting list.

Right. I think a lot of Districts do that. That’s right.

Of course with all the funding inequities, that brings up a lot.

10:57

Right the major shift in the funding now is really as you probably know between the majority of Districts who are still on the revenue limit. Using a revenue limit its still kind of state wide its much more equal that way because of the state wide revenue limit except in some districts, San Mateo is probably like that now. Do you you know …if I were to say Basic Aid District, do you know what I mean by that?

Yeah, Palo Alto, Menlo Park…some of the wealthier Districts, to be honest.

11:37

Right. They’re back on the regular property tax now. Their property tax is high enough that it exceeds the revenue limit so they’re allowed to continue to go with their property tax. Its interesting. Those districts that have that kind of high property tax they’re not necessarily interested in more students come in because it quote takes money from the kids who already live there. It doesn’t really, but they see it that way. So that’s another whole factor. That was not the case when the Tinsley situation was there. But it is now.

How were schools funded during the Tinsley Settlement?

12:30

We were still on the Revenue limit. We had just started the system basically we have now. That went into effect after the Serrano Priest decision. There were revenue limits. They weren’t all in effect. Do you know what I mean when I say revenue limits?

12:52

I should. Maybe you can explain it for me again.

It’s just the amount of money per student that the state allocates to school districts. And its I don’t know, $6,500 a student, and that money comes technically from the state to school districts and it’s called revenue limit. It’s a mixture of local property tax and state tax money that goes to make up that particular amount. If you said $6,500 per student then some of that is made up of local property taxes, some of that is made up of state sources, but its controlled by the state. That’s my point.

13:58

The whole point of it, going all the way back to Serrano Priest it’s a laudable point I agree, is to try to have basically equal funding for all students in the state. The theory - and I agree with it - is number one if public education in California is a state function - It is. It’s in the State constitution. - Then the state has the responsibility to insure there is a degree of equal funding for all students in the state. That is the outline of it.

That was the Serrano Priest Decision.

14:50

Exactly. Here’s a footnote. Serrano was John Serrano.I can’t remember yesterday but I can remember his name.

That’s great.

It was John Serrano. He was in the Los Angeles area. He was outside of Beverly Hills. He used Beverly Hills as an example. He didn’t live there, he lived in Linwood or somewhere, but he said, We don’t live in Beverly Hills, but the kids who live in Beverly Hills have so many more resources because the property tax in Beverly Hills is so much higher than it is in Linwood and so the Beverly Hills Schools have so much more to work with than we do. And his reasoning was that if public education is a state function, and it is, then the second point is the state has an obligation to have equal funding, you can’t have these discrepancies going on. He won. The California Supreme Court ruled in favor of him. That’s when the current funding system went into effect.

16:30

What it basically did was hold down what were called high wealth districts and pushed up low wealth districts through the fact that the state took over the funding. Does that make sense?

Yes.

16:50

There have been a lot of iterations in between buts basically that’s where we are now. We have these revenue limits in effect.

So that happened after Tinsley.

The point was that Palo Alto was a high wealth district. So that was one of the things in the mix. That’s why the so the Tinsley kids, their families, wanted them to come to Palo Alto.

Because it was better funded?

Yeah.

17:33

It was much better funded. Yeah.

The Serrano Priest decision didn’t really seem to turn that around.

17:44

Not quickly. It took time. I think if you looked at it over time you’d see that maybe up until 5 years ago the majority of the Districts in California were relatively equal. Then, as I said, literally recently with this escalation in home prices and land values it’s starting to be more discrepant now. Does that make since, what I’m saying?

18:22

I’ve been looking at the inequities and trying to figure out what is it that is creating these funding inequities? Is it the parent foundation in these Basic Aid Districts? What is it? And, I’m trying to ask as many people as I can, what they think could fix it. I don’t know. That’s why the idea of open enrollment is interesting to me. You obviously can’t have too many kids per classroom, I don’t know how you solve the funding. That’s way above my pay grade.

19:19

The underlying issue, it’s very much of an issue where you are, the Bay Area, I think they still call it Basic Aid District, your funding is still totally all local property tax then it’s just kind of an arithmetic deal then the more kids you have the the fewer dollars per student there is. Because you have a set amount of money, even though it’s a high amount. So the Basic Aid Districts want to restrict the number of students in their District for financial reasons. They would prefer from a financial stand point not to have inter-district transfers, not to have students from other districts come in because that means there’s technically less money for the students who live there. Do you see what I’m saying?

20:27

Now I do. So having a Basic Aid District is really a disincentive to integration.

20:35

Absolutely. Its a disincentive for any kind of non-residential student to come there.

I just understood that.

20:54

Understand, I’ve been retired for 2-3 years so I’m not right up current with the current funding situation. There’ve been some tweaks.

I think we’re still a Basic Aid District. I’ve heard that terms thrown around and it has made me gloss over, frankly, every time I hear it. Now that you’ve explained it so succinctly, I do understand. Thank you for taking the time.

21:30

Our last point. It was always a real dilemma. Because on the one hand you’re glad for basic Aid Districts because they’ve got a lot more money for kids so you don’t want to restrict that. On the other hand it does cause inequities across the board. It’s a real dilemma. It always has been. There’s no easy answer.

It seems to me the problems of inequity can’t be solved at the one District level.

Right.

It needs to be regional. Or statewide.

Right.

That was the whole idea, again, I know I”m repeating, of the Serrano Priest decision, of the revenue limit, was to solve this issue on a state-wide basis. To move the funding from locally to the state - which again 80 - 90% of the schools are funded that way - and solve this problem by having the set revenue limits. And, like I said, that system has worked. There are aberrations, like San Mateo, frankly Santa Clara, the Bay Area, Marin County’s probably the same way. The high expensive areas.

23:05

You think maybe just open enrollment in the Bay Area. How would you fix the funding in the Bay Area, then?

That’s the problem, then, I don’t have a solution.

(Both laugh.)

The ideal solution but it’s, you know, if you had enough money at the state level to raise other districts up to where the Bay Area Districts are then it would be a lot better, but that’s a huge amount of money from the state. Nobody’s come up with a good solution. Right now. So it’s tough. It’s hard.

Well, now that you know my childhood history, I would go back to Proposition 13. I would want to find out how much money it would cost to raise the other districts up to the Basic Aid Districts, then see what

That would be interesting.

Then see what we’ve lost in commercial property tax revenue from Prop 13.

That’s a good point. As you research this, you’ll see the example is always given is Beverly Hills is always compared to , I don’t remember the other district that’s always given in the Los Angeles area. Beverly Hills is always given as the example of a high wealth district and how kids there have so many more resources then kids in Compton for example. Actually, I do believe Compton is the one they used in Serrano Priest.

It would make sense. You could easily do it here with Palo Alto Unified and Ravenswood, I’m afraid.

Yeah. Absolutely.

Thank you for taking the time to help me figure out school funding in California.

25:40

I would say, I know I’ve said it a couple of times, the real hero to me was Judge Lanham. He just he wasn’t involved in schools or anything he was just a regular superior court judge and all the suddenly he deals with issue of school funding. He got so involved. I think he cleared his calendar of everything else. It became a real cause celeb for him to get this issue between Ravenswood East Palo Alto and Palo Alto settled. That’s one of my strong memories was how involved he got in it. And I know it wasn’t on his radar before that. And he really got into this issue. He was the real hero in this issue. Is he available? Is he still alive? Do you know?

I will look him up after this. Did he have the case the whole time or did he just come on when you came in?

He had it the whole time. That’s my recollection.The other person there is Joe Simitian who was on the Palo Alto Board. I haven’t had any contact with him in 25 years.

He’s around I know that. I’ll see if I can get in contact with him.

Did you have any other thoughts or questions.

28:22

You have my responses there. It really dredged up some good memories. There were some difficult times but there were some good memories. I’d the the Palo Alto side from my perspective the interesting thing, again, this is just me, so don’t, you know, before the Tinsley settlement, Palo Alto is..probably now too, is an elitist district. A lot of connections with the university. They kind of see themselves, I think, they did then, as a high flying district. So the idea of having kids from across the tracks quote, if you will, go to school there was just not on their radar at all.

29:28

So to go through that whole issue. And yet the interesting thing to me, and again, this is just Julian, here we’re literally across El Camino from Stanford, of course very liberal voices coming from Stanford, about how important it is to have an integrated system. But not with my kids. That’s what was kind of saying because here you would literally have professors or people at Stanford who theoretically were saying we should have an equitable system and there shouldn’t be these discrepancies but don’t bring those kids from across 101 to my District. So there was some kind of differences that way it was interesting to me to see that pushed to the limit. Anyway. In restropect. Its fine.

30:41

I think we’re having those kind of discussions today still.

I’m sure.

About many things: Foothillls Park, people are asking that to open up. The school issue hasn’t come up yet, but any time it does there is heated discussion about students from East Palo Alto.

I’m sure.

There are comments online.

We didn’t have that.

We have that now. And it’s interesting to me to see how people don’t have basic knowledge. They think we can just cancel that program when its actually legal compliance.

31:50

Again, if you could they’re available either Judge Lanham or Joe Simitian.

You were negotiating for the Palo Alto side. Who was negotiating for the Ravenswood side? Who did you meet with? Do you remember?

No I don’t. And they could have had some changes going on. And I’m trying to remember who the county superintendent was, for san Mateo County. I think it was Russell Kent. I believe he was the county superintendent for San Mateo and I believe they were one of the players there.

Yes, I think were named on the suit and Santa Clara was too. Both counties were and 7=9 districts, Portola Valley

Menlo Park

Judge Lanham had his hands full.

He sure did. And of course each of those districts have boards and you’ve got trustees. You’ve got a lot of fingers in the pot. That’s why, again, I thought Lanham was the real hero.

I didn’t think about all the different people on the boards. I was thinking about theSuperintendents and the 170 claimants.

The Board members are publicly elected so they had to deal with this issue with their constituents.

You had to get the settlement approved by the board?

Right. The Palo Alto Board.

Do remember how many times you went to the Board?

34:34

I think, it wasn’t like there were different agreements that were brought. It was more like a continuing discussion and explaining what was happening. Fortunately, one of the Board members, Joe Simitian particularly, and a couple of the others, but anyway then when we brought the final settlement that’s when they agreed. It was more of a narrative. This is what’s happening. This is what’s happening. And then we brought the settlement.

So you’d give them updates.

Right

35:29

You’d take their temperature and give that feedback to the judge?

We would yes, it was a continual process.

That’s probably how the judge figured out how. There was probably a lot of back and forth.

Yes. Very much and again, it was not only just multiple districts but across counties it couldn’t have been much more complex in terms of jurisdictions.

I will see if I can find Judge Lanham .

I haven’t had any contact with him and its been 25 years since I’ve had any contact with any of the Board members. Did I mention Bob Calfee. He was a Board member in Palo Alto. He was also an Education Professor at Stanford. If you happen to come across him, his wife was a teacher in the district. That could be another person.

I will look him up. Thank you so much.

Ok Kristin. If I can help more let me know. If you contact any of those people, give them my best regards.