Hello Hello. I'm alright, how are you? I'm good thank you. I'm excited, I'm excited so shall we say welcome along to the English and maths both podcast. Episode One is a new exciting venture for me and Sammy. After weeks of thinking about how we can amplify English and math. Yeah, so let's start with formal introductions and I'm Sammy. I'm a math teacher, have a schools background, but moved into further education and so teach GCSE resets. Really, what about you, Hollie? So I'm Hollie Barnes. I work in Fe College for Background in ESOL. Also EFL, let's say and moved into EFI into teaching mainstream education. So orangey Sissy reset learners functional skills and that including our 16 to 19 learn as an adult. Oh yeah, we'll throw in as well that I currently work in adult education. I've done 16 to 19, but I'm currently in adult education, so I think we've got quite a bit of Fe covered between the two of us for English and maths, and so I'm excited for the pairing. Yes, it's good to be able to work together with English and maths because although we are two separate entities, were actually one, aren't we? You know most colleges were classified as one department. Yeah, and we talked at length before about the different ways of being in a central team. Being in vocational areas and all those sorts so we can bring all our thoughts and our discussions. And on those important issues of English and maths in further education as we go through this podcast. So every week we're hoping to have a guest on the podcast. We haven't got one this week, so we'll just get it going and starting. So I'm going to start with what we're going to start with when we do have guests. I'm going to ask you, Hollie, what's your most memorable lesson? Well, I think memorable can be both. It can be something that went really well or something that. At one maybe, let's say pear, shaped or not, as well as we thought, and I think for me, my most memorable lesson is being observed. Whilst each training and the learner getting up and walking out and no and no and the horror you know when you plan so much, don't you. When you're in an observation and you want everything to go to the minute by minute, and I think the horror when there's no just got up on what time you know everything was fine at the end it was all managed to the correct way book. Think there's a big pressure for us to perform, not just what we're doing every day, but almost above and beyond what we did in observation. So that added pressure really, really feel it, don't you when something doesn't go. To plan. I think that's interesting. I think that's interesting with the added pressure when you are being observed. I have always had an open door policy and said if you ever want to come in literally just walking, I won't ever do anything different, but I think it takes years of experience. I think to get to that point. And I think as well, like you know, it all depends on your own kind of mindset, doesn't know where you're coming from. You know he's never talked before. In in your straight into this, this could be a really pressured experience, but if you've had some experience with teaching or coaching or mentor in that, the pressure kind of eases off a bit. But I think that. You know, you know your practice, and you know what happens in your classroom and like you say as you go and you do start to realize that you're not doing anything different in the classroom. This is how its run and you want everyone to have that authentic experience and everyone has different ways to speak, and it's not a one size fits all approach. No, I mean something I always say is you kinda have to have a teaching personality. And personalities are always different, and if you can develop your teaching personality, it doesn't matter if someone comes and watches you, because if you can show that that's your teaching personality. Yeah, absolutely, and I think that you know we see it in staff rooms, don't we? At the different personalities that we have as individuals. But definitely teaching personalities. They shine through and through sharing resources and peer observations you can get and hone into those teacher personalities and and start to look at who's doing. You know what particular lesson where you can maybe work with them to put that into your teaching personality. I think that as part of the whole learning and teaching process as well. Yeah, there's certainly something in that magic of the staff room, and I know we wanted to talk about today about the big return that's happening, so we're recording this on the Friday. The big return begins on Monday. Are you very excited, Hollie? So we don't go back for another week, so I'm place occasionally and we have another week and I'm excited by that because I have another week online, I know there's a lot of you know negativity is some spaces around online learning, but there really is a positive community out there. Online learning, and I've I've really enjoyed the experience. You know, I was listening to Islas Podcast the other night and she was, you know, saying things that are really resonating with was starting to get into that process. Now we've been doing it for awhile and we're thinking about the lessons more and we were wanting to try and open up new experiences for learners, even more so. Now we've been doing it. Maybe here, but I think if I was going back on Monday I'd be really apprehensive because although the college is safe and you know, we've been completely reassured, there's still that kind of. Anxiety that that lies around it up. I can't pinpoint my finger on what it is. I was reading a tweet by Philippa Perry. So Grayson Perry's wife and brilliant person in their own right and she said it's just going to be a bit overwhelming when we start to see people again in real life and we're gonna need to take it really slowly and just have 5 minutes outside the house to start with a built in 10 minutes and then 15 minutes. But I think there's something in there, isn't it? And I also saw a tweet from Devin White and he said as soon as hugs are allowed at how long is going to be too long. On that first hug as well. Yeah, we've forgotten how things work normally, haven't we? You know did was they normally 'cause this is a just a an evolved world that we're living in now? But like you know I was. I was staying with you think about how many things where you were in close contact with people or in close proximity and I was looking at birthday cards in the day and there was a thing on both of us saying you know we used to blow candles on the cake. Now you think about the water droplets on the cake and I was like Oh my God. You know I've got small children, so you learn not to eat birthday cake. You think, Oh yeah. I think as well, you know part of part of being at college is part of being in the hustle and bustle. You know. We talked about the other day things happen, the the inevitable happens. Sometimes fights do break out. That's that's the reality of it. Not all the time, but we were used to being busy corridors. And it's a very much revolving door in college. Is it? You know, there's different timetables. We've got different people and lots of courses. College these people from like 8:00 o'clock till 8:00 o'clock at night as well. Adult learners apprenticeship coming through. So it really is like there, a hub of social interaction and it's been really old going in, hasn't it? You know we've had one way systems. Again, everything is so safe but so so daunted when you see all this happening you know it's the stuff that you see in movies that we spoke about for last year. You know, we didn't expect to be living in there. No, and I think there's something in writing that the the social element of being in a further education college anywhere like you say early in the morning to late at night. There are safe spaces for anyone in education to come along and learn, and you could be walking down the corridor with a new to the UK migrant who's just arrived. He wants to know where the canteen is and you might strike up that friendship in that positive smile as you go down the corridor to the 16 year old that just started a new Carson is transferred and I miss all of that. So so so much that. Supported collectiveness yeah, and I think there's a you know if we think about the kind of buzzwords in education that are around at the minute this this theme of catch up is a light line above ahead, isn't it? And. And I think that for us in English or math we we know that our learners have to catch up. But we also know that our learners are already catching up. They're already playing catch up. In some cases, you know they didn't start with the best start of the, you know, maybe this year or the video with us for three years beginning, they're already, you know, demos a little bit behind, but it it? It's not talking about that catch up, it's about you know, picking up from where we left off. Where are we now where we go in and. I don't want to talk about the the loss that we've had because, you know, online learning has been happening learning this still happened, maybe not extent for some learners that we wanted it to happen, but it's still been happening and we've had to prioritize pastoral rolls and well being over education and that that had to be, especially how it's been. Yeah, I think it's really interesting what you say there. So some of our learners I re sitting for multiple Times Now. You know it's not just the first year of them resetting their English or maths qualification. So like you say they're already behind and it's always that right. Let's just draw a line under it. Let's see where we're at. What do we already know? What can we focus on in the time we've got where we gonna get the highest marks that are going to have the biggest impact farmers in that exam situation, which has led me to inevitably talking about exams? What? What are your thoughts about these? Optional mini exams that can be happening. I mean. It's it's scary, isn't it? You know there's a lot of talk in a sector, especially in math, and especially in in our sector, about how can we? How can we assess the learners? Well, how's it going to be done? You know, there's always this big great cloud of overhead door. Evidently pad, and you know my feeling is I. I don't wanna over assess my learners too much. You know, we're not going back to where it says it's not a business as usual approach. And like we said, you know what? If we are playing catch up and that's how they want to brand it, we have to remember that our learners are are then behind. So why would we assess them like normal? Why are we going to throw an example but then like it's a normal year? It's not a normal year, and whether that reflects progress. Is is a complete or the conversation to have? Isn't it? You know? What about you? How you feel about it, I I'm thinking if the math and first of all thinking about the learners and I'm thinking that social anxiety of going into an example now with extra restrictions on. I think I think that's gonna need some careful thought processes around about the well being of learners entering those spaces and invigilators and readers and scribes and all those extra things so that automatically switches me, offer for assessing them for the sake of assessing them because they have done a mock mine. Man came in and did a mock just before Christmas and I can predict what would happen at the end of the year, roughly based on that and the online assessments that we've done an am I did an online assessment this week and one of my colleagues said, don't you think it's unfair that they have done it online 'cause they could be cheating? I said, well, I said well. They could be brought to the best of my knowledge. They haven't have timed them and I actually used like a tracking program to give them the assessment. So it tells me if they stayed in shot the whole time so they've not wandered away or anything like that or someone's not coming to help them. And I was like I think I've been as robust as I can be and the timing is quite crucial, because if they're having to go away in Google something then it'll affect their times and they were all sort of around the same times when they came in. When they hit submit, so I was really happy with it and the mechanic time management. Yeah, but they could have written up the GCSE specification on the board and stuck it on the wall. I mean, if that's the way they were thinking. I've been passed awhile ago, maybe you know, I was like, well, that sounds genius for me. Actually, I think that shows great ingenuity and I think it would be applied in that creative approach to passing. You must assessment mattered that much. I'd be joyful. Well, I think I think for us with our learners and I have got some 16 to 19's in my class Now as well. It's heartbreaking, but they just really want to do well, and I'd I'd be very surprised if any of them chose to cheat because they know ultimately what the end result is going to be. And they're already so demoralised. I don't think they'd get any gratification from cheating either. No, and you know it. It's easier, easier said than done is. That is the typical teenage stereotype, approaching it in a teenager. Cheating exams, then not that they're not. That's not their intention is to cheat. Their intention is to pass right? So you know why would they have have been attending lessons again on my name is has been happening. Why would they have attended lessons and then feel the need to cheat? You know, I appreciate that. That maybe is there is very typical for what we've been thinking for. We've we have to give them some credit. You know we can't. We can't keep carving the age group with a brush. You know there's some fantastic young adults that we see day in, day out. You know, doing fantastic things in vocational and fantastic things in our subject area and some of them just. Have not been handed maybe a a great circumstance. Or you know, we see it very very much in English. Must out we were, you know they may be missed. The bus to the exam and that yeah or they were really on the day or an emergency happened and that's affected them where they are now. It's not a case of they've all failed flat out. That's not. That's not the environment that we working. Would be nice. It's something I argue all the time and actually argued it with my learners when they did their assessment. One of them turned around and my colleague was her ambitions of their greatness was was wonderful, but you know quite a few of them didn't come out anyway. Regret for some fairly confident if they didn't cheat as well on that front. But one of my students came and they went off failed again. And I said you didn't fail. You got a Grade 2. Anyway, no, I failed. I didn't get a grade for no. If you failed, you have got a you. You haven't failed, you just not got the grade you need for the next stage in your career. Yeah, and this is this is all part of the cultural process. You know. We spoke about this and spoke with other educators. The language we use is so important with these young adults that were working with is so important. And F college, the in particular mask is all about progression. You know, we don't expect you to come with. Nothing and end up with a four in the space of, you know, six weeks in a November reset scenario we expect from try and do your best and will help you get you know little incremental stages to get there. It's a yeah I don't know. He says it's a marathon not Sprint Hollie. And I use that staying in the classroom as well. It is it's step by step getting there. And when we go back ask step is to make sure that they're OK, but also we have to. We also are a part of changing the culture within English and Maths and trying to get that positive language within their where we're not surrounded them with a negative environment and talking about this unconscious bias that we have. You know my next door neighbour. They own their own company and they don't need it. We need to tackle down on those kind of things in order to support the learner journey to progress. And it starts with us. Everything starts with us and it starts with them. Yeah, completely and my all time favourite is well. My dad wasn't very good at English so that's why I can't do English, yeah? And we hear you know it does happen in vocational and work with a brilliant team leader and he brought this up and he said if they hear was in vocational sessions say. You know, I I wish it mass but just go just go get your attendance mark and I have asked him that fear. Graphic designer. They're gonna think. Well he did it. I can do that and that might be true but we we want the best for them and we want to try and add to this skill set and it has to be a collective approach. You know that we're saying it's it's a collective role in this learning journey together. So if we can start creating. Positive mindset, well growth mindset isn't it? You know we're not. Talk about his recent news saying it's not about building from scratch. It's about rebuilding the miles that they already have and getting them back to feeling positive about the subject area. Yeah, Yeah, 100 percent weight. I always say weather double glazing, salespeople of further education. They didn't come to buy Windows for moles, but they need Windows to build the house that they want to build.

Where the essential parts where the bar in you know bits that people have to spend money on, but they don't really want to an it's an it's that collective approach with the vocational areas to help that mindset grow. I think one of my favourite examples of this was again with creative. Obviously I'm at a different college to you and this quite a few years ago and I had a learner who just refused to engage and I went up to the art studio and she was sat there quite happily drawing and I bought dinner. Adam, I think you should really come to math. I said no, I'm busy. This project is due in and I I'm in the I'm in the middle of it and I just can't stop and I said, well, that's that's really wonderful. I'm really pleased for you, but I need you to come to math please. And there they actually would turn around and he went. What do you mean you've not been going tomorrow? Instead of just not big accepting focused on this project and he went on, he said your project will mean nothing unless you have pride in the work that you put into yourself. Love it, get it on a quote.

Oh man, I just thought he was so brilliant it he didn't turn it into her. Why you not been going to math? You need to get some after it's gonna cost me paperwork I'm gonna have to do attendance tracking and he just went into listen you're out will mean nothing. Unless you start investing in yourself and I thought, yeah, he's just he's just got it. He's just he got it and from then him and I were like A tag team running around the college, rounding them up and. Went back to their English classes. You know a lot of a lot of what we do is is encouragement, isn't it? We, we, we have to be very real as well. And and honest conversations are a huge part of helping the learners with in English and math. And I think that we can always be more honest. You know, we have to be honest about where they are as much as we have to, you know, give feedback and make sure it's in a positive light which we still need to. We still need to be honest about how they can get to the next step, and that sometimes means having uncomfortable situations, but. Is better too. To have a realistic approach, then to have one that is.

Yeah, I think I'm one of the first things I'm going to have to do when I go back is just be honest with my learners about where they're learning currently. currently. 6 have those difficult conversations and say we've slipped and we might be at two. While we've done brilliant and we're two and a two plus, we call it. And you know, a lot of them are around that. To mark of my 16 to 19 cohort in my class Now, my adults probably should be pushing for plus 2A5 and a lot of them are just sort of coasting at 4:00, so they'll be some challenging conversations there, but. I am excited to get back and have these conversations and, you know, build a strong connection ready for us to get through these last few weeks. What what's your first thing you're going to do when you get back? Pork.

You know, we I, I don't want to go back into the classroom and be all guns blazing. Like, right? That's it, we're gonna cook you some questions or we're gonna pop up at work through all this and I don't. That's that's not what they need right now. It's not what I need right now to go back into, you know, we're just this apprehensive about teachers as they are about learning. You know we've been a passion for awhile so we were just going to talk and you know do what? Best for them and if that means we have to have those one to one conversations and pick up on learning, but it's maybe slipped online a bit and and utilized that great work that's been happening, then that's what we can do. But I think the first thing we're gonna do is we're gonna talk is it is a class in. And talk about these. Anxious scenarios that we're all in because, you know, nine times out of 10 everyones feel anxious. Especially, you know you see it with Mustangs Iety. Yeah, where they're all anxious and if we're all anxious together then actually doesn't exist because you know we're all connected in that moment. I think that that's important to talk about you. Yeah, I think I think we'll talk and we will welcome each other back. I'll probably crack some jokes 'cause I'm hilarious in the classroom and they love that. Will just settle back in and I want it to feel. I want to feel this easy as possible. I don't want it to be normal because that doesn't exist for me anymore. I don't want it to be natural because it's not natural to sit socially distance wearing a mask, sanitizing your hands. It's not. It is becoming natural, but it's still not natural behaviors to me. So I just want it to be easy for them and I'd love it if I was allowed to feed them in class. But I'm not gonna be so I'm gonna have to think of something creative instead. 'cause math always works better with sugar is what I say. I'm teaching. Definitely. I mean, we all work better sugar anyway. We should see it as teacher staffroom around Christmas time is there. Is the favorite absolutely? So we come to the end of our first podcast and we hope you really enjoyed listening to the English and Math. Both will be back next week with a fabulous guest and hoping to have another discussion about what life is like is in English and math tutor in further education. But thank you for listening. Thank you.