"Right in front of the closet, that opens into the trap into the basement," Gacy tells his lawyers, Sam Amirante and Bob Motta, on never-before-played tapes. "I opened up the trap, and I just threw him down there."
Motta gave the tapes to his son, Bob, on his 21st birthday. Now, the younger Motta, also a Chicago attorney, is turning them into a podcast, which paints a chilling picture of the killer and his attempts to manipulate even his own attorneys.
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"It's approximately 15-and-a-half hours of unedited, just completely graphic audio of Gacy," Bob Motta said. "He's had two-and-a-half months [since his arrest] to think about what to do about forming some kind of theory for defense in his own mind."
Bob Motta said that after first admitting everything to Amirante in December, Gacy begins to waffle, suggesting he doesn't remember most of the killings, that they may have been committed by others, or his own alter ego, "Jack Hanley."
"Yes, there's not one of them that didn't die ... that I'm aware of ... that didn't die through their own hand or their own wrongdoing," Gacy says. "If you want to say I tempted them, put them into temptation -- yes. Because understand this, everybody that ever came to my house, there was never a struggle and nobody was ever forced into my house."
Most of the conversations took place in Cook County Jail's Cermak Hospital, where Gacy was housed following his arrest. Bob Motta said that stopping short of describing most of the actual killings, Gacy would often "speculate" about how they might have happened with his own attorneys.
The problem, of course, was that Gacy had already given statements to not only Amirante, but also the Des Plaines Police. He even had drawn a detailed map of the crawl space, showing where the bodies were buried. But now he was changing his story for the very attorneys charged with formulating a defense.
"I wrestled him all the way into the front bedroom, and while I was wrestling with him, was when I got stabbed and that's what made me mad," the killer said of that first victim. "I think I stabbed him in the chest four or five times."
"Well, if you dig between the rafters, it's 2-by-12 rafters, you get almost another foot," Gacy responded. "You'd have to be on your knees, and you'd have to chop it with a spade, dig with your hands." 152ee80cbc
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