Welcome to the 3 to 10 Project. Two white, cisgender males who have been friends for over 25 years, exploring race, gender, and education by talking through the intersection of our experiences with what we are reading, listening to, and thinking about.
And, most importantly, considering how to show up moving forward.
It’s a long-term commitment: three to ten years of anti-racist culture building.
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To learn more about the name of this podcast, check out Episode 7 and listen to this podcast with Resmaa Menakem. To be added to our maililng list or share your feedback and comments, please email us directly.
The 3 to 10 Project can be accessed directly from this site and on the following podcast platforms:
Season 2, Episode 9: What do our kids think about where we live?
Recorded 6/19/22, Published 8/4/22
Episode Summary: Building from last episode's conversation about where we live, Marc and Reed welcome their sons onto the podcast. Sam (15) and Chase (12) lay it all out, sharing their views about the role of education in fighting racism, homophobic language in schools, parental virtue signaling, intersectionality, and why Massachusetts isn't a place any kid would want to grow up. We get some powerful advice from Sam about how to be an ally to people of color, and Chase presents the case for why his community proves the existence of white privilege.
Please access the podcast through one of the platforms linked above.
Season 2, Episode 8: Does where we live matter?
Recorded 3/27/22, Published 6/2/22
Episode Summary: Our friend Jason joins us for a second time as we begin our discussion by reflecting on if and how we have been showing up -- including the role of mindfulness -- around colleagues of color. And then we explore whether where we live impacts our intentions to be anti-racist. Does it matter why we live where we live, and what does our address say about us?
Relevant links:
Nice White Parents, New York Times & Serial Productions
Please access the podcast through one of the platforms linked above.
Season 2, Episode 7: What should Anti-Racism look like for White Men?
Recorded 3/13/22, Published 3/24/22
Episode Summary: Finally -- another white guy on the podcast. What should anti-racist work look like for white men, anyway? We welcome our longtime friend Jason for a conversation about his own journey into anti-racism and how it connects to our own. Jason shares his experiences, as a Jersey kid now living in Georgia, and weighs in on the roles of discomfort and mindfulness in personal growth.
Relevant links:
Is it Time to Say R.I.P to "POC"? Code Switch podcast
Please access the podcast through one of the platforms linked above.
Season 2, Episode 6: What's up with Racial Affinity Groups?
Recorded 2/20/22, Published 3/9/22
Episode Summary: With news that a nearby school district had been challenged in a federal lawsuit to stop the practice of racial affinity groups, Marc and Reed consider why gathering by race might be an essential part of exploring our racial identity – but perhaps only if we’re willing to push into discomfort. Marc also presses Reed to develop a consistent practice of meditation as a tool towards working for social justice.
Relevant links:
Wellesley schools settle lawsuit, Boston.com
Mindful of Race: Transforming Racism from the Inside Out, Ruth King
Please access the podcast through one of the platforms linked above.
Season 2, Episode 5: Is Thinking Enough?
Recorded 1/30/22, Published 2/17/22
Episode Summary: Marc raises the questions of how "mental models" can both help and hinder understanding between people, often without them being aware. We then get personal, examining an email exchange between friends that helps us consider how intellectualizing issues of race and identity may serve as a barrier rather than an entry point to change.
Relevant links:
Schools That Learn, Peter Senge
Saving Classics From Identity Politics, The Atlantic
White Supremacy Culture, Kenneth Jones & Tema Okun
The came, they saw, they reckoned? Code Switch podcast
3 to 10 Project S2EP05.IsThinkingEnough1.30.22.mp3Season 2, Episode 4: What’s it like to be a teacher fighting for anti-racism?
Recorded 11/17 & 12/19, Published 1/6/22
Episode Summary: In the second half of our conversation with three middle school teachers, we hear how the experience of pushing for anti-racist work in a district has felt for them. We also discover that their barriers are not only racial -- gender plays a bigger role than we realized.
If you haven't already listened to Episode 3, we encourage you to check that out before diving into this one.
Relevant links: Scene on Radio, Season 3: Men
3 to 10 Project S2EP04.WhatsItLikeBeingATeacherFightingForAntiracism - 1:6:22.mp3Season 2, Episode 3: How can Teachers Start Discussions about Race?
Recorded 11/7/21, Published 12/16/21
Episode Summary: Marc and Reed turn the podcast over to three teachers who are working to engage with issues of race in their district, school, and classrooms. We hear what they've done to start conversations, support their students, and engage their colleagues in new ways of thinking. This episode is part one of their conversation.
Relevant links:
Just Mercy, Bryan Stevenson
Christian Cooper & Amy Cooper, New York Times
3 to 10 Project S2EP03.HowCanTeachersStartDiscussionsAboutRace - 12.16.21.mp3Season 2, Episode 2: Why are People Afraid to Talk about Race in Schools?
Recorded 9/25/21
Episode Summary: Marc and Reed think more conversations about race should be happening in schools but fear seems to be standing in the way. While we have empathy for teachers who may, rightfully, be feeling afraid and unprepared to champion racial justice, we also explore a few steps forward to make space for more conversations about race in classrooms and board meetings. Along the way, we consider the role of "moral panic" and availability bias.
Relevant links: The Folk Devil Made Me Do It, Code Switch podcast
3 to 10 Project S2EP02.WhyArePeopleAfraidToTalkAboutRace.9.25.21.mp3Season 2, Episode 1: Why are We Doing this Podcast?
Recorded 8/01/21
Episode Summary: Marc and Reed begin season two by discussing the value of this podcast -- as a routine and habit -- and how these discussions can help us better move justice work forward through personal accountability. Marc also makes his argument about why he needs to be on the move as we record.
Relevant links:
Ezra Klein Show: What Ibram X. Kendi on What Conservatives -- and Liberals -- Get Wrong About Antiracism, NYTimes Podcast
Ezra Klein Show: What's Really Behind the 1619 Backlash? An Interview With Nikole Hannah-Jones and Ta-Nehisi Coates, NYTimes Podcast
3 to 10 Project S2EP01.WhyAreWeDoing3to10.8.1.21.mp3Episode 17: Juneteenth
Recorded 6/20/21
Episode Summary: Days after Juneteenth was named a federal holiday, we discuss the paradox of a holiday celebrating the end of slavery at a time of deepening attacks on anti-racism in education. Marc and Reed share their own recent experiences with school committees, coded language, and the sudden rise of the term "Critical Race Theory." As we conclude the final episode of our first season, we also share a few reflections on the ground we have covered, and the possible road ahead.
Relevant links:
The Hypocrisy of Honoring Juneteenth While Condemning Critical Race Theory, HuffPost
3 to 10 Project Ep017.Juneteenth.6.20.21.mp3Episode 16: George Floyd - Accountability, not Justice
Recorded 4/25/21
Episode Summary: Marc and Reed process Derek Chauvin's guilty verdict for the murder of George Floyd, sharing an unexpected reaction. We also consider the role of the police in American society and whether this could be an inflection point in history.
Relevant links:
Policing in America, Throughline Podcast
The Riches of This Land, Jim Tankersley
Talking to Strangers, Malcolm Gladwell
3 to 10 Project Ep.16.GeorgeFloyd.4.25.21 - 5:5:21, 8.37 PM.mp3Episode 15: The Honorable Committee Member Marc Waxman
Recorded 4/10/21
Episode Summary: Marc got elected to serve on his local school committee. We discuss how that happened and what he hopes to accomplish in this role. And, among the questions we discuss are two that seem important: 1) How transparent should Marc be around his ideas of anti-racism? And, 2) Who should Marc be listening to and observing?
3 to 10 Project Ep.15.TheHonorableCommitteeMember.4.10.21.mp3Episode 14: Can White Folx Do Better?
Recorded 3/28/21
Episode Summary: Working from a blog post from Black Girl in Maine, we consider what change looks like for us. How can we lean into, rather than push away, more complicated feelings of discomfort? And, it occurs to us that the whole podcast might just be virtue signaling. Who are we really doing the work of racial consciousness building for?
Relevant links:
Can White Folx Do Better? Black Girl in Maine
The Sum of Us, Heather McGhee
21-Day Racial Equity Habit Building Challenge, Food Solutions New England
3 to 10 Project Ep.14.CanWhiteFolxDoBetter.3.28.21.mp3Episode 13: Discomfort
Recorded 3/13/21
Episode Summary: We explore the concept of discomfort as a signifier of white fragility. Can being a white male in positions of leadership insulate you from feelings of discomfort? What are the implications of that? And, we consider how mindfulness might help us gain greater awareness of our own discomfort and, potentially, turn us towards action.
3 to 10 Project Ep.13.Discomfort.3.13.21.mp3Episode 12: I'm Not Here to Play Around and Feel Good
Recorded 2/27/21
With guest Gianna Cassetta
3 to 10 Project Ep.12.I'mNotHereToPlayAround.2.27.21.mp3Episode 11: You Can’t Have the Same People Changing the Systems They Spent Decades Setting Up
Recorded 1/24/21
3 to 10 Project.Ep.11.YouCan'tHaveTheSamePeople.2.24.21.mp3Episode 10: Life is Systemic
Recorded 12/20/20
Relevant links:
Sam Harris & John McWhorter - The new religion of anti-racism
The Dehumanizing Condescension of White Fragility, John McWhorter
On Being with Krista Tippet: Robin DiAngelo and Resmaa Menakem
3 to 10 Project.Ep10.Life Is Systemic.12.20.20.mp3Episode 9: 100K
Recorded 11/27/20
Relevant links:
Characteristics of White Supremacy Culture, Showing Up for Racial Justice
3 to 10 Project.Ep09.100K.11.27.20.mp3Episode 8: I Understand the Question, but I Don't Understand the Intent
Recorded 11/15/20
Relevant links:
3 to 10 Project.Ep08.IUnderstandTheQuestionIDon'tUnderstandTheIntent.11.15.20.mp3Episode 7: What Does "3 to 10" Mean?
Recorded 11/1/20
Relevant links:
10 Percent Happier with Dan Harris: Why We're All Suffering from Racial Trauma (Even White People) -- and How to Handle It, with Resmaa Menakem
On Being with Krista Tippett: Resmaa Menakem, ‘Notice the Rage; Notice the Silence’
On Being with Krista Tippett: Robin DiAngelo and Resmaa Menakem In Conversation
3 to 10 Project.Ep07.WhatDoes3to10Mean.11.1.20.mp3Episode 6: Liberation
Recorded 10/17/20
Relevant links:
Marc's original post, Why I don't believe in "Reform," seems to have been permantly deleted from the internet (could it be a conspiracy?) , but here's a tease...
Diane Ravitch's repsonse to Marc: A Letter from One Non-Believer to Another
Marc's Changing the System vs. Sytemic Change
Colin Kaepernick: The Demand for Abolition
3 to 10 Project.Ep06.Liberation.10.17.20.mp3Episode 5: Instead of Clamping Down, We Opened Up
Recorded 10/11/20
Relevant links:
Scene on Radio: The (High School) Mascot Wars
3 to 10 Project Ep.05.InsteadOfClamping Down.10:11:20.mp3Episode 4: Who Should Have the Right to Open Schools?
Recorded 9/27/20
Episode Summary: Marc and Reed discuss the idea of patriarchy and white privilege in the education system through the lens of their own efforts as educators, taking a critical eye to what they have done, what could have been done differently or better, and even ask the question if they should have been the ones to do the work that they did.
Relevant links:
3 to 10 Project Ep04.WhoShouldHaveTheRight.04.9.27.20.mp3Episode 3: Letter to Our Community
Recorded 9/17/20
Episode Summary: We begin with an examination of our identify privileges, particularly as men, and how we interact within our professional roles. We then explore our own reactions to an open letter from the charter school network Uncommon Schools, about the changes they are making in response to the national conversation about race. Given our connection to the president of Uncommon Schools, we consider how our own views on education have changed since we all first became teachers, back in 1994.
Relevant links:
A Letter to the Uncommon Schools Community, Julie Jackson
3 to 10 Project Ep.03.LetterToOurCommunity.9.17.20.mp33 to 10 Project.Ep02.National Anthem.9.3.20.mp3Episode 1: Two Paradigms
Recorded 8/28/20
Relevant links:
3 to 10 Project.Ep01.TwoParadigms.8.28.20.mp3