<Audio Transcribe>

Gaurav Raheja

This is a toilets from all trains two flights to Public institutions. And I've been questioning you know how this can work better for us. So I think we in India do need a lot of innovation here, but I would add a word social innovation before I technological innovation to go forward. I think that's all from my side. But thanks, I'm happy to be here. Yeah.

Nived Samuel

Through the short period is that A lot of important is given to the package than the design itself. And amazingly, here I am happy to be Part of a community that actually respects. Things like accessibility and things that matter more than

George @eiLabs

Yeah, we have few people they mentioned that. Okay. They will some people who are into Old Age care homes, they said they will join a little late. But yeah, but I think they can also add a lot of value in what we are trying to achieve here. So, so one of the areas that we want to start with because we have such a diverse crowd here. One of the things that we want to start here in at the labs or and especially for this seminar. The high priority. I think I'm sorry. I'll just mute everybody and okay Yeah. Walker, the high priority areas in terms of accessibility of Bathrooms or restrooms for persons with disabilities and also for elderly like so that was the intent of putting the pole right in the beginning. Because we wanted to ensure that, okay, we are not missing out on very, very high priority items. Say for example, we know that The livelihood. I mean, accessibility in rural is very, very important where people are actually Starting to use restrooms, right, because after the swatch by the initiative, people have just started to use restaurants. So, so that is a good opportunity for us to make sure that, okay, it is accessible from the very beginning. So, that can be a very high priority area in terms of employment. In terms of travel because as we all know, I mean during travel, you need to access Restaurants and that could be one of the primary factor in design. So from that point of view, then other cases like kids with disabilities. Right. And I We get lot of Requirements primarily when a kid as actually moving from the move to the T teenage right so they wanted to do things independently, but they're not able to do it. The boy child doesn't want His mom to help them out. And so when I do have issues like that. So how a person with disability who is actually a kid or a teenager. Right. How they, what is their requirement and so variety of these problems are there. So I would like to just get a feel about What is the high priority items of our water. What we are planning to do is if there are high priority items. And if we don't get a chance to talk about it today. We just wanted to make sure that we are continuing The discussion on those topics on the coming Saturday software right on a very, very specific area of accessibility and very specific to the restrooms. So I would like to start the discussion. And also please note that, okay, if you are not able to put the point please make sure that you, you're just putting it in chat so that We are not missing out. I will just make sure that okay because I didn't want to If chat is disturbing everybody I just make sure that it is coming only to host, but I will make sure that it is shared with all of you at the end of the meeting. Yeah, so I and I think I will. I mean, I think so. But I think our audio is not connected

George @eiLabs

Oh, OK. OK, so maybe I will because she has been involved in the design of ICP which is one of the premier Institute for persons with disabilities. So, so, Donna. Could you please start with I mean to give an introduction about accessibility purposes visibility and especially for kids. What are the areas should be considered or water is that and how Accessibility for kids is as important In those schools and public spaces, just like it is important at homes. So could you just give an introduction to that?

Suparna

First thing I want to correct that I'm not the designer of ICP. Incidentally, I got a chance to get involved with ICP for some particular purpose some design issue with that is exactly how to do it. Shall we start with a school or a public place since you were discussing kids, let me start with a spoon. Now there is a tendency that in a school in our Clothes these schools are not one or two story high buildings. They're generally multi-storey like as I know the new South point campus, which is a multi-story building there is a school coming up CSE for their corporate social Responsibility, they're building us eight or nine story building what they have done that in each floor in each column law, there is 100 got The call it handy, but What I feel the primary important areas are the lobbies the corridors, the element of furniture in classrooms pilots restrooms, even the canteens and even in the indoor play area to I'm talking about inside the building because outside, it is comparatively easier to handle. Okay, now in National Building Code. Is clearly mentioned what should be the slope of the ramp, which would be the minimum or what should be the minimum size of the toilet. And what would be the corridor week but a lot of designing is involved because each building and each site is very, very different now today as we are talking about toilets. Why designing I have noticed certain things that International Building Code and other I'm referring to National Building Code since the links to spaces in India. It says that wheelchair takes five feet diameter to rotate, but personally I feel this is not sufficient. Now all moving chair users. They don't go to the toilet alone. Don't go to the toilet Allah very often they're assisted by someone. This is number one issue. So the space should be more. But what happens you know that Many a time the watch it is in the developer other financial He always has an issue with utilization of space. Now if say for instance National Building Code is saying that 1500 meter that is five feet diameter Space. We spaces will be enough for rotating wheelchair and as a designer I feel the space should be more it is very difficult to justify that point to the developer or promoter, find the owner, so to say they will They will want to justify Each square inches square millimeter Of the area they are building that is they're investing money in this is one of the issues. Another issue is no school, since I am talking about the school no school varies Range of what should I say there are kids there are adults. So the toilet should be designed according to the kids toilet should have lower height business the senior people stall, it will be have a base in height of the scene of different height and what I feel. There should be some amount of Flexibility, I was not exactly prepared. I could have shown you a picture so that a wheelchair user can go very, very close to the bases that facility must be provided. You see, there should be grab bars in the Toilets the door should be sliding doors so that both from inside as well as from outside. It is easily operable by the wheelchair users. Now we are only talking about wheelchair users, there are, you know, There are people with the visual impairment. So for them, we can use different textured material so that by touch. They can understand somebody who is not using a wheelchair but may be using developers or purchase. So these types of These types of what should I say variations should be taken into account while designing in any buildings pool building or fall, but I have seen something very recently in in a mall in Kolkata properly small that the handicap toilet was being used by the so called normal people. Okay, so there is no God as such. Maybe are handicapped person is waiting outside and the normal person with lot of toilets for them. They're using the handicap, these, these things may have it. There are some social issues also some issues also Okay. I Think I have made it clear, whatever happens in a school. Same thing can happen in an office. Also, so the flexibility in designing is the main thing. Okay. So, yeah. Do you see any other social issues, outside of Prioritization of the bathroom and you know, giving them the thing Just caused by basis. Things foods. I think the Issue. I have a friend whose son is autistic. The boys very talented, he can sing he paints beautifully. You write beautifully. But he has some sensory issues so From the payment side, there was a complaint to the head of the institution that This boy us and mixer. He doesn't know how to be a because he his reaction patterns is very, very different. So social awareness is very important. I think it is coming, but only to a certain cross section of people, it is coming just I can draw an analogy. See the Indians, go read 19 environment. We are supposed to be our mass. We are not supposed to speed, but people are doing that they're using a mask, like, you know, Nicholas and Once again, a particular cross section of the society, they are following the norms in proper way. And it is very difficult to identify the specific position. These very difficult to identify. But I cannot exactly say what percentage of people are following nonce, it applies everywhere. You see, and so far visibility is concerned, there is kind of a taboo. Also, I think. Because I think what we need is not sympathy. We need empathy, we should Try to stand in their shoes and try to understand this, and this trying is, I think, very good at the beginning.

George @eiLabs

Okay, so yeah man very good introduction, because now, one of the things that I'm that we are able to realize is that was cool. Maybe a good place to concentrate from the accessibility perspective because .Yeah, so it was cool as a place where a lot of diverse crowd can already is already there, like in terms of teachers, students. Yes, yes. Yeah, you people who are from, like, maybe three years to like 18 years so that itself is a very good place for us to make sure that okay that is accessible. Okay. Accessibility is being understood by people from a very young age, and they will become more aware about this kind of issues. So that seems to be a good place to start. And I think accessibility in Schools should be very high priority item that we should pick it up as a kind of action item actually leading schools and that to for all kinds of disabilities, right, because

George eiLabs Enable India

It's very different for persons with the wheelchair user’s crutches. Visual Impairment Yes. All sports must be inclusive Angela is there is some severe issue all schools must being inclusive. Yes.

George @eiLabs

Yes, yes. So, this I would think that okay school is one of the area that we should concentrate on. And I think we will go deep much deep into that. Is there any other area. Maybe I will go to not so not as an accessibility audit there. And they've been auditing. Lot of public spaces in Bangalore and even in other cities. So not a do you what do you think, okay, from your perspective, what is a very high priority thing that we should be addressing

Natya

Think it's the lack of awareness about what an accessible restroom means, I think what He brought up. About, you know, working with the government. And you know how it is misinterpreted what accessibility means i think that it is a big challenge and sort of connecting what, you know, Mr Burnett was talking about. Empathy versus sympathy. That is a very important element of building that sentence because we were just discussing yesterday about one of the accessible features and how they've Implemented so in our experience. Yeah. So one of the challenges we've seen. And so we work with Offices. We've worked with individuals are we worked with senior citizens, we worked with children with disabilities and their caregivers and looking at solutions from that point of view, we also worked with senior citizen homes and one of the challenges we see is how people interpret what is accessibility. Since we're talking about an accessible restroom here. I'll talk about specifically that even regionally when you go from Delhi to Calcutta to say, Bangalore also between the three different You know, parts of the country itself, there is a massive difference in how people perceive. What is accessibility, what is the standard of accessibility? That should be used or should not be used. And essentially how people feel and accessible restaurants should be key. It should have a grabber, and that's it. You place them in and that makes an accessible restroom. But that's not true. And, and I'm sure a lot of people in this call can sort of elaborate on that as well. And that is a very big challenge that The understanding of why the elements that have been put in place to make an accessible restroom are important and what does it really mean. Like I think if people understand something like that it would sort of help the implementation as well so

George eiLabs Enable India

Is it more like, kind of, I mean, are we focusing too much on measurements. Because most of the document or like guidelines document or compliance documents are mostly talking about measurements. Right, so is that an area where need where we need a lot of improvement.

Natya

And I think as a starting point. It is pretty good. And see the measurements are basically standards. So, you know, you know, like Mr. Bernard brought up children right So, you know, accessible restaurants in schools, you're talking about people have different heights of different sizes across the country across the region using restaurants standards help people everyone access the same grab bar or You know support rail that has been put in place. That's what the measurement helps with. So whether it's a person with autism or whether it's A person on crutches. At the end of the day, everybody can use an accessible restaurant. That was the point of the measurements. But I think more than that. It's how its how people feel and accessible restroom is so in in Alex lead into for example when he went to Calcutta. One of the things was Gabby have a handicap bathroom. So what is a handicap bathroom is just a restroom with one grabber, and it was badly 900 by 1200 M. And that was an accessible restaurant. That doesn't make for an accessible restroom. So people's understanding is, you are one grab on to any restroom of any size that is an accessible restroom. And I think just going back to what I was talking about them in 1500 1500 me clearer space itself can sometimes be a challenge if they have a caregiver who's coming in and helping them sort of move around. But we're talking about just the basic standard that is in place that is your 2008 2200 that itself from a space point of view and from an understanding point of view, why do you even require that kind of space. I think that itself as an awareness is missing. And then of course, you know, then the other challenges build on it. So the lack of space in general the privatization of space during construction. A lot of our construction is quite old. One of the buildings are ordinary you talk about school buildings are you talking about public buildings public spaces all government offices. Even work spaces so unplanned is they have assigned a space for the restaurant, which is that particular size that accommodates a person with wheelchair comfortably in it's not going to be accessible but the understanding of accessibility is also important before you jump in there.

Natya

Just summarizing your three points. One is what the incentive of setting up an accessible restaurant is.

Shyam Suri @eiLabs

Could you just repeat the first one is the incentive or the check? Second is, you know, touch upon certain cost aspects, since you're auditing and the third one is, do you see What are your thoughts on transforming existing bathrooms. Right. What elements would one go act? Beyond space. I think spaces. The first thing which is obvious, but beyond space to transform existing bathroom so that you know at least we can get the thing rolling and not be limited to new setups. Yeah.

Natya

Yeah, so I think there are two categories of people when we talk about incentives. There are people who really desperately need that. And that goes you know across all the wonderful sections right from people with disabilities to entity and even within them that has A set of people who are aware and want to invest in themselves for their own safety and for their own empowerment And then there are people who are not aware or are still in denial or don't want to do it, and especially denial with a senior citizens and elderly is very high, so this is still a segment which has a higher incentive. The other incentive that isn't a is the requirement for compliance, so I think with the NBC you know 2016 mandate requirement and Lot of other changes before that itself. Also, there was a requirement, but unfortunately it wasn't detailed out exactly what should be there and an accessible restroom. Certain companies and other organizations around started going into creating accessible restrooms. Unfortunately, the understanding of it is extremely limited. So this is where the incentive has been either that I need to empower myself or I needed for my safety or because my family and I feel we should do it because it's, it's an important part of me living independently right or It's a compliance requirement. You know, and then of course there are organizations who are very actively, you know, sort of hiring people with disabilities and Therefore, also understand that this is an important piece that should be considered you know as basic access and therefore they do it. And there, there is no cookie more than simply So, but the compliance aspect. And then there are people who don't care, even if there is a compliance requirement, they will wait and say, Well, will I get a notice for something like this. If I'm not going to get a notice, why should I do it? It's not important. So that I think kind of sums up your incentive thing. With respect to the cost. Now, a lot of I think cost is a very big part of the incentive itself also And that basically, I think it's how people perceive the cost and that's something when we go around implementing as well. We see a general talent and this is what we trying to explain to our clients that It's not just for compliance that you're doing it, it's for. So, for example, a public space I come on you're trying to attract customers here. So a good part of your customers could also be people who need support and it's, it can be an accessible restroom, which uses inclusive design. It is meant to be used. Essentially it is accessible to everyone. It's not restricting the accessibility concept to just people with disabilities. I think it's how people perceive the cost of Well restrooms still are a lot more restricted when we talk about largest faces and a lot of integrations around the space we tell people a lot of these are economic integrations indirectly right so You're not just investing For the set person or say the two people you hired you're investing for everyone in your organization because that's how inclusive design itself works. You're supporting everybody else, whom at some point might need to use accessible facilities and not just that the standards, ensure that you are That they are you know the things that have been placed whatever heights our economic so everybody can use it and it doesn't matter, like what height has been placed on the stress on the other person is less so. So that's the cost part of it, the cost. The other part of the cost is it is high, like if you have to find this space, which is Which is that large, it's an it's a big challenge like sort of going back to your transformation question. Like a lot of existing offices don't have spaces, including five year old. Buildings as well. And I'm talking about, to a certain degree, corporate offices here, you know, a lot of other public spaces are probably you know because corporates try to follow the compliance to the letter, there isn't. To a large degree, they have spaces which are compliant. But if they haven't built on a certain code, which was before NBC 2016 it doesn't necessarily take into consideration. So, and A structural change like that is expensive. It's quite expensive.

Suparna

Easy. Actually, I do not know what I found in my area that there is competitively YouTube faith on the architects VP. Try to rely more on the documents they see more the year from other people. But had it had it been given to architect to solve the problems and keeping the cost factor aside architecturally and structurally to my belief almost everything is possible.

Natya

So in our experience, there are buildings where it is possible, where you just break down the wall and some of the clients. We work with. They don't really care about money as much as Making sure it is implemented well and correctly because they value the people That are part of that. You know office innovation organization. Yes, but largely aware the structural challenge arises, it's very hard to break it down. And I'm talking about architecture, because we work with architects on making sure a lot of these things are implemented as for listening. So I can tell you if it's a multi tenant building. It's very hard to break down a PWD restroom expanded, especially if it's an older building. Where, then, in such a case, you don't have a basic facilities like a men's and women's restroom also Becomes a basically show question on that matters. Okay, got it. So,

Shyam Suri @eiLabs

So, does it make sense to think about in the face of this constraint. Opportunities to innovate around ease of use by, you know, making things more compact so that you know the same effectiveness is produced at this, even if the space can't be increased under circumstances so

Suparna

Let me do this from the design stage, things are easier. But once the thing is built it becomes difficult and as mature were saying A lot of issues might crop up. So I have an idea that in DC. It is just a code. It is just a guideline. It should, if it is There in the bylaws local bylaws and municipal bylaws that the piece has to be done, things like that. Then I'm sure it will be implemented. Then once again it will be a social political issue.

George eiLabs Enable India

One point is because, I mean, that is, what are the basic theme which have to drive is the Dignity for people And what it means a water restroom means from a dignity point of view. Because we know that. Okay. So, which part it was one of the initiative, which is coming from an open defecation from your paper starting using the toilets. Right. And if a toilet cannot be used it as good as going back to the past. So can I request? I mean, I'm sure, which st remissions joined, could you please throw some light on that. And if anybody else also is interested, please. I mean especially users who are I mean wheelchair users and accessibility users know who would like to mention something on these areas, about what is, what is a toilet mean to them and how they have been Suffering, or what are the kinds of issues they are facing in the different aspects of life. We JC you're dead.

George @eiLabs

And from a dignity perspective what it means to be all of us. Right. I mean, it's not just a person with a disability, but when it comes to pursue the disability accessibility becomes the key. So from that aspect. What is that they really need and what is the main issues around that?

Veda

Yeah, so like, you know, before starting. So as we just said like, you know, I'm beta Belonging from Team Tara, which stands for team for accessibility and accommodation. So we work with persons with disabilities and elderly, especially So our objective is to facilitate independent living so we but we very much focus on personal space accessibility as we felt like, you know, Public Space accessibility something that people are taking up to like in over the past years, or in the coming days, but a personal space accessibility is something that gets neglected, so much so that is a domain. So as I mean bathroom accessibility is concert So what like access agents, we, we actually like, you know, strongly feel that, you know, we can't be the you know the expert consultants, you know that the needs and Requirements for persons with disabilities or no any users it completely comes from that person know, we can kind of say the know If you kind of install a ram or you kind of, you know, install some access to AIDS in your bathroom. It's going to make your home accessible. It's going to make your bathroom accessible. So the needs kind of varies from person to person. So we can totally Feel that you know it's an Intuit individualistic purse perspective and There are a few main or few essential things which we could kind of highlight here. When bathroom accessibility concern. So, as already you know people discussed about the patient space inside the bathroom. So like, you know, I don't want Too much on the measurement aspect. So I would like to kind of, you know, some up with a few Essential facilities that would kind of be helpful when a batch of accessibility is constant. So, like, you know, when this space is sufficient space has already been mentioned, like, you know, we kind of recently did a baby with the data and a resource sharing where we focus much on the Moodle aspect, like you know how to make rural Bathroom accessible with easily and you know readily available. A devices like, you know, for example. When bathroom like for a wheelchair user. The much concern would be like, you know, if, if it's a BJ user or a person with visual challenges. The first concern starts from, you know, reaching to the bathroom note. So the pathway and you know the road to the bathroom or the way to the bathroom is also something that, you know, it will forget Like you know when you go to a public space or no when you're out of your home like home is something that you normally get oriented to but when it comes to public spaces like identifying bathrooms is also something that, you know, gets very much difficult so signage is something like, you know, many forget, but apart from that. There are certain things which can, like, you know, for example, which can actually like enhanced accessibility to that place. For example, if you get a view. Consider a person with visual challenges like you know Navigation Drawer or something that you know the person can like touching you know walk towards the bathroom or, you know, you can even like Us then plan. So something so that you know the person who uses, you know, which will aid. The smart cane. You can like actually navigate from this side to that side so that you know he gets him or she gets an assessment assess he or she can assess like how wide is the part. So that is something that they can think that they can think of when

Veda

I. The bathroom is concerned, like, you know, an outside opening door with, you know, some facility to kind of independently, close it once they enter inside And, you know, sufficient space where while using whether it's an Indian toilet or a Western toilet some suitable provision for easy transfer to the toilet and, you know, and also Been Indian toilet is concerned. There's something which is quite a challenge for which was challenged persons is like identifying where to keep this food, you know, identifying where the squat whole is so you know ropes of that that can be like tied to the roof that directly points to the squat whole is something that they can think of. And, you know, slightly racing the foot. Foot base like you know for an Indian toilet that of basis like so that can be slightly race. So that know they can easily identify where to eat their food. So, something like that. And one more aspect is like a safe as safety element is concerned, some, you know, noise or Rejecting device like something like a simple bell or a horn, something that can be fixed on the floor based or dinner at an accessible height, so that in case They can immediately you know when, in case we need your help. They can immediately call on to someone that is something that can think of.

Den @eiLabs

Yeah, so I have two points to make here because Traveling to different states and lots of places I had seen certain issues in the part of. Number one, what the that total that Access to accessible bathroom is a big issue and one more big issue is there, which is Kind of floating because That's loading we find I, at least, I found that Is not act to the person with disabilities, especially as a ritual that I find floating very insecure because The floor is having marbles marble floors are very slippery even a drop of water can also catastrophic. So that is the most primary show for me because certain times are there when I'm washing hands. In the, in the washing machine and due to the height issue or due to their reaching issue, I cannot preach to them was racing sometimes so reaching the issue. The problem is that water spilled up because water is flying hand and then it's fallen for floor. So in that case after mean if there is someone who is coming in the toilet, including people who are using prosthetics as legs. They are also vendor partner to fold in the bathroom because of the grid that we get in the in the flowing, but that is something that I found problematic in hundred percent but rooms which are accessible because at the following. Is not at all. That died, I can see that it has to have some the floor. At times, yeah. Yeah, it can only be smooth. Smooth loads, but he's not true. That's not true. We cannot have sore throats because of the risk. Risk factor. This is a point that I wanted to make And also, Different accessible costumes has different heights of different heights of wash machines and Which is quite, quite a hindrance for me because I have a scoliosis, and having a scoliosis. I would like to have a washing machine in my, in my belly level. But in that case my belly level corporations are not available all of our residents that I go towards is my next level. So I cannot just kind of my, my hands are up. And then it's going to be. And we now weird posture that I have to wash my hands the promoter. The promoter is something that is also a problem area that is because The highest issue is there the because probably we cannot have. I don't know. We cannot have this kind of hijack just been in in wash receipts and promote self all etc. So these are the things that has kind of bothered me a lot because I knew that dollar person with disabilities were taller than me, would like to have the promoted a higher height. But me having a scoliosis, by which by default. My back is bent and that's why my legs are bent. Also, I cannot reach my floor with my legs. That is a problem area for me. Also, well, and these are the things that I feel very kind of important to Peter without important to innovate with and in Indian context or in world contacts also Though accessible bathrooms can be made a smart bathrooms, so that that extra bit of space. That is required that is monthly I just did because space to. Don't be an issue. Because even if I am having a caregiver and I'm my caregiver is helping me The space that is required would be kind of another feet extra in in both the sides. That's it. Not a huge not long, not, not a huge space is needed to have an acceptable outcome. It's only the smart designing that is needed, having a civil doctor smart designing and space management. That's it, because I've seen bathrooms in The continent in Europe, which are not at all big and our accessible bathrooms are, but they are quite accessible because they have they have kind of use the design part in a manner that into a small place. Also the promote the wash racing the bedding area can Be easily definitively separate and accessible. These are the points that I would like to make. Thank you.

George eiLabs Enable India

Then I think are two important points that you mentioned, I mean, and I think one of the areas is like products right i mean Better that you can we have to make maybe products which are smart and innovative may not, not necessarily may be smart, but make sure that, okay, there is a lot of product innovation that is required. In terms of automatic semi-automatic and whatnot. And another important area which you mentioned and also whether mentioned was to access to accessibility. Right. So, though we have corporate buildings that are fully accessible. I mean, from getting from the road to the entrance of the corporate office itself, maybe a challenge, right, because yeah

Den @eiLabs

Jokingly I say that in India. The basic criteria of accessibility is perhaps three steps before the lift.

George eiLabs Enable India

So this is a, I think I just wanted to hear from a professor on this because, see, the thing is, OK, we have accessible buildings accessible bathrooms, all those things. I know this is a slightly deviating from the main topic, but as we mentioned, access to public toilets is very important because access from the road is as important as that. Right, so how these infrastructures, the water, the areas in which Government or policies are happening from this friend.

Gaurav Raheja

On one side, joy, but on the other side. It's a concern. You know that I'm Reading and listening to all these discussions. You know, the first point that God, I wish to stay here for, you know, really spending like 1819 years Within field as well as in many spaces. You know what, I still feel is that this Conversation is missing in the Indian database. You know, accessibility is not a big difficulty, I would say to do but this conversation gets missed out. Now, of course, when you say policy, it's there. The 2016 actors there. But if you see the act you know it says that by in five years from the release of this at every building should be made accessible. Is that really the reality, perhaps not right then, then what worries me is what we could happen, up to 2021 we are just, they're just people Beyond us and you're still not you know even if you're talking percentage. We still don't have double digit percentage of infrastructure which is Great. So I think one of the bigger. And I think also site on this itself. You know, we are auditing. I don't wish to name the project, but Because I have to again pardon. We have to keep forgiving people for their ignorance, but I think you could spot somewhere. This is about the star rated hotel and talking about involve the premier airports in our country. Where we saw this order they created a room support and accessible room for a person with disability and quality and inclusive for them. But again, there were two steps to the restaurant as then says it's actually true. The restaurant was two steps up. He said, How do you expect that person to Buddha said well we don't expect that person to go there. We will serve the kingdom. First point of exclusion, I will see the second point here is, is the design that room with an accessible washroom because it's about space so that room could only have one bed, which means they expected that person to be alone without a caregiver. Now, who will talk about these things? It's, I think, you know, especially when it comes to washrooms India has its own set of challenges, but I think since we are collectively thinking about it, we should take this forward in a very, very Progressive and positive way that this subject of bullets needs to be taught it cannot be suppressed. I'm happy that was a prime minister that least brought it for the first time in India that it can be a subject of political movement. But I think it still needs to sink in deeper that it becomes a conversation of public debate, because unless it's talked about it will never get done. And I'm now going to talk about very, very small trivial things which are extremely critical because I think Equally suffered, and I can empathize with all the issues of people with disabilities. We've talked about space measurements. I will not go to those details to. I think that's a very, very critical area. And one small practicality in that is, you know, even before we talk about inside space which the door with the location of the lunch. Many times you will find the door which is given in the standard is 900 millimetres. But when you add our door frame to it. It takes away 150 millimetres away from it with actual door, but for the gets reduced by the door thickness you practically at 700 to 7pm right of that kind of criticality has to be seen. At the level of when you're planning. On the second point where it causes. How do you fix a latch? So, normally you fix a bolting system towards the top. And of course, and with feature or a person with low height or even an elderly with Extra to each problem. Amid height large this perhaps the best example, but it's not true that's happening everywhere. And forget about these things when it comes to public washrooms you find latches are missing, which is where the problem of privacy and safety comes into picture. And I'm always popular very small critical issues of service, of which the first is supply of water. You know, while I know Accessibility is about features, but this whole area of services and maintenance does not require a special treatment to be Part of our daily things if in India we could improve our services and management of mushrooms. How many lessons do you expect to find even a soap dish? And having so, so I think in India paper so is a very, very Indian solution. And I would suggest everyone To carry it all the time because we cannot expect that from a service number two is above water. I've seen multiple times, the water is two different issues when his mother used for body level pleasing and second is water when it kind of is used for boggling or some kind of your mouth using approach, especially, especially when you're traveling or even in here. So do we have access to water in and you have access to clean water. So that is a second service. And third, very, I think most critical services. The key leaders. So very talked about So maybe today when we're talking about technologies, maybe we have technologies upsell using we have sensor based vacuum days. All those things. But again, the question of affordability comes into the US and the forces, you know, in the Indian diaspora washrooms still mean multiple things. If I can cite an example of Japan, which really inspired me. Is the design of the bullet trains? Where it has two sets of toilets one, which is a which is a European washroom, which all of us are slowly graduating to as an example, but maybe not the best in terms of it, but Better in terms of access, but at the same time, they also have in the same bullet train Asians quite washroom, which also has been turned into access You know, because there is a cultural issue here. I know many elderly or 80 plus but still prefer to use Indians, but And perhaps in rural sectors and people actually literally are at floor level of mobility. Find it much better for them to rise on a European WCS to assume that you know one solutions will work for all, it doesn't. And to the extent further when we're talking slightly, you know, in a Higher level of inclusive society, I think, to have a big TV changing room as part of men's toilet will be a very important part of the future that you're looking at. So that men can have an equal share in the inclusion of social responsibilities and which is why you know all these things still connect us back to cultural groups, which is something I really wish to talk about And there are so many myths around accessibility here. Like, for example, many times I've seen including on Air Force or I don't wish to name them. Their foot tower rail as an example of a gravity. Now, you can imagine it can actually lead to an accident, instead of providing support and second is How do you, how are you expected to clean your hands after you wash them. Now, sometimes you'll find dryers located at a higher heights and in many cases, I will not. You will, as you are. Dr think we really need to look at all. It is a complete service model. Around which every little thing has to be done, but this cannot be done, you know, of course, just by merely you and I are discussing about it. I think it does need to become a centre for debate and has to be opened up first. And that's me at any moment. Even I talk about it in my classroom, etc. I find there is still a gap to discuss the domain of knowledge which perhaps Most of us, I would say, with not shy away. Otherwise, to talk about, and especially in the society that it's really a rights based issue which needs to become a part of our daily conversation. And on the last point that I'm talking about is about housing and I always say this example in India. Maybe it's also the world where we're really presenting penny wise and pound foolish example why I say to buy a 500 rupee product on Amazon, we do. We invest so much time to do a survey we invest so much time to understand the reviews of the products and then we spend those 500 or 5000 rupees to the guarantee of returning it in seven days. If I don't like It. What happens when you get built infrastructure in the built infrastructure you invest all the money before you get it. Suppose you buy a house you're spending like 70 lakh rupees and that's on loan. So your entire life savings are going, but when you get that building project. In your hands. You have no way to get that money back or Gary to the infrastructure sector needs to have very stringent laws, I believe. Of pay back guarantee mentors that will value investing an entire life savings do anything about once a pilot is wrongly built in many cases, I think in these past Four months I've seen at least three examples around me where people have slipped in their houses. By this to droplets of water and a broken their spines for many accidents also happen in toilet, of which we do not talk about Some motley call it has to be accessible. It also has to be Injury proof, can, can somebody stamped me on a toilet and say, you will never get an injury in this. So I've actually intervened in a project of housing multicore here. We are forced them to at least have one washroom for wider than the others because every the biggest myth in the decision makers, is that they are always going to be able bodied I would say if a decision maker is the Committee of decision makers. I wish this realization happens all there are more people with disabilities at the decision making, tables, I believe this problem to correct itself from the top down approach, because otherwise it's so memory and we are really finding the decision making. Where it goes wrong, it's not really always about the cost because cost also needs to be put in perspective. I prefer to use the word economic and also I prefer to use the concept of You know payback period. So if you look at it, I'm paying you in terms of convenience for 20 years of life that you will have a convenient use of certain things. You can calculate that. In terms of cost benefit ratio. So sometimes invest in a in a good car or in a good like those or something. But then you know that for 20 years, my life has some invest in washrooms at least I believe everybody grows old everybody at least small sick. At least, everybody gets a baby in their life, or at least everybody you maybe once in a while, might get injury. Also, you might play football. So then how do they manage the walking. And I remember I gave from my laptop. My students whose mother received the next lecture in the water could not enter into the Ocean. It's not only about, you know, wheelchair is one particular device. There are so many other simple devices. Where do you, where do you keep the sticks, as opposed to An elderly person walks into a washroom go to small details. Where does that person that's going to be keeps a stick on the floor is contaminated. With a lot of hygiene issues. Lot of other issues. And this, I think, is a huge area we have so much of data to be talked about and information to be shared. I think we can just keep going. But these are some perspective that I really find Can actually add to this methods of making things better. But yes, the initial discussion that I was listening to, I think, burn and others. That you know the checkpoint is not yet there, frankly speaking in India. While there are good intentions premiering we still do not have a professional checkpoint at the state of clearance of a project. I agree that that there is a millions of, you know, toilets that need to be retrofitted. But what about the millions that are being built right now. Can we at least stop them from being not accessible? And so it's a debate which we have to really bring it from The last pages of newspapers to the front pages, unless we start talking about it in a positive way. And again, not saying it's this is About bringing it in a positive way so that education can be revolved around it and education will be an invisible way of creating new demand. And with your demands, you can perhaps have more strength available to professionals because around the demand the market will always work. So that's how I

George @eiLabs

Thank you so much, Professor. Yeah, I think. Yeah. So one of the areas I think that we want to go to, like, I mean, I find that okay products is becoming A thing. Then, once I got. Okay. Product. Is on digital products is becoming a very important thing. And we have like couple of people who have products and I just wanted them to showcase their products. Because it is very important that, okay, unless we make products. Okay. We will not use it or we will not be able to Distribute it right. But before that, I just want the patient man who is the CEO of Enable India in co-founder and so he has been very vocal about these kind of issues. Right. I mean, and the only example with the page mentioned, is how visually impaired, put the toothpaste. Or in the toothbrush. Right. So, that is the only example though he has access to so many other examples right he keeps talking about. So I want. I mean, before we talk to the to discuss a few products. That we have in terms of housing elderly housing and those kinds of products, right, I would like to get some thoughts from the patient but

Dipesh Sutariya

Yes. Thank you, George. And thank you, professors, and I think all of you such a powerful discussion quite energized and on that. But I think I had a few thoughts. In this case, but maybe since George you brought up my toothbrush story. I have to say that this story. But I'm definitely going to talk about the whole glasses thing, right. I think the whole AI labs. Why we started and on that. Yeah, so, so I think one of the things which we came up with. So I wear glasses. And So if you look at in about 13th or 14th century, I would have been visually impaired because I could not see and on but What happened there was a system solution. Called glasses so somebody came up with some glasses, where People could start seeing and an assistive solution started coming in and over the period of time we started seeing that there Was the whole Business of economics, which came Of Having opticians and all that coming up and all that. And today we talk about fashion statement in glasses and everything. So we want to have various kind of glasses. So what has happened is from a need to fashion statement. It's become actually mainstream, in some sense, so Am today. Nobody calls me visually impaired, because I can use an assistive solution which is now mainstream and a lot of people use. So with this thought my Always I think vision is if we can kind of get Even few solutions. In fact, you remove the disability from the picture. Many times, like the whole visual impairment, which is removed from mean that sense. So with that caught in mind. That was the whole vision and idea, saying that if we can get all of us together and different players together to work on. Solutions, which can get mainstream and get attention at different levels is very important. So with this thought in mind a specific Thought I wanted to share in today's session was two things. One is the experience as Enable India, we had and very true. Right. One of the experience we have seen is that multinational companies. We go and we say that You have accessible bathrooms. So obviously, they put their hand up and say, absolutely. So then we, I think one or two companies and I have seen this in more than two companies, they go and show me the FACILITIES PERSON go and show the accessible bathroom. And as soon as they open, we can see there is all sorts of things stored in there. Because they're using as a storage room. Yeah, like, oh, we didn't know. So it is used, there is a Something called accessible washroom, but it's now a storage room because We are storing things, nobody's using it. We didn't know and all that. So having said that, obviously, there is a whole issue of awareness and thinking beyond that. There was another Experience, which we Had when we put the person on VHS in a manufacturing company now. These guys. This was a very small manufacturing company. And obviously, they didn't have an accessible bathroom. So that's where basically one thing from that time has been running in my mind. Is that, can we have this modular accessible bathrooms, which can be either rented given because this company was very happy. He said the manufacturing headset that I'm happy to build it. But How do I build it. Now, how much time and all that and obviously later on I think they build up a very physical bathroom but important thing is there is going to be need In that case, but listening to today's conversation. I also was thinking that. Is there a modular bathroom or a very model bathroom. Let's say model accessible bathroom. If you kind of make and Kind of start telling the story about this model bathroom now model bathroom can be modular as well where people can kind of use it. Or just take it and install it in there are places or whatever possible. I think we talked about the rural areas or wherever. Obviously, when she kind of looked at larger volume that is economics will start playing a role, but looking at just the crowd today and in this session. I'm just saying that if we Put all the collective experience and say there is a model bathroom, which can be made. And ideally, it can be modular as well because then It can be showcased and it can be also leverage on trend or given as an additional thing to just place it and all that. If that is something like that with all the important points which we are talking about call it something. And for whatever better name my buddy or something. And I'm just kind of say that this is a model bathroom and we start talking about it. What will happen is not that model bathroom itself. But that topic. To your point, Professor that topic of discussion will start happening because people will start connecting with a very simple thought Because many times as a disability. One of the things my experiences that When we start talking people get can kind of understand and sympathize. But they're very soon get lost, with all the complications, which kept bringing brought in. To say, oh, this is also required that is also required that is and then you start losing people in the whole discussion. So I think the biggest thing and Required is how do we simplify the message and in this case the simplified. I'm just thinking, and there will be already something available or some thoughts. Of creating a model accessible bathroom and all of us talk about that visa V, what we are doing. So I think use that as a model, rather than anything, is what my thought. I just want to share

Shyam Suri

Essentially what we were what we were before defining what it is what we Trying to do is we are expecting that there will be different use cases, maybe some in Some in cities for home and some for public dialects. Right. So I want to kind of make sure that We identify the pain points at the highest level, and maybe hopefully overly this over the you know 2016 act dorms are connections to, you know, a space saving washbasin like what we are looking at our and create an ecosystem, not only You know we spoke about, you know, complaints being one thing, right. But how can you create awareness and incentive as two layers about this. Is what we're trying to do? So bottom line is complaints and, you know, the professor also spoke about awareness and cultural aspects. And then the third layer is the incentive. So if you take the basic You know topology of a bathroom, as indicated in the in the in the spec and then have some leeway for variances, but build an overlay of What a modern bathroom could be not only in terms of, you know, topology, but also in terms of tweaks that can potentially be done for A home versus a public bathroom versus a rural setup right and come up with some kind of a not only a reference setup, but also we have other people in the call here right also an ecosystem where people can get connected to, you know, just replacing their doors, like I just said. Are replacing their commodes are being able to get. I think she graduates. I mentioned contact list is going to become an issue now. Right, right. So, access to soaps. So essentially what we're trying to do, we'll probably have if the group here feels that you know this is a good topic we would like to continue it for a few weeks. Culminating in some kind of a reference setup, but we don't want to kind of jump to the conclusion, we want to kind of hear from people and then maybe The pitch, like what you say that that's definitely a at least a good outcome to shoot for. Right. And then we'll have some you know enough Tangible Things to kind of show both from an awareness perspective as well as an implementation perspective you want both right. Otherwise, it's not much of a change if things are not happening on the ground and for that. We do need the you know incentive ization the friction less change and the cultural aspects. So how to build on all three is, you know, something we need to kind of think through But that's a great point you summarized it as, you know, a single call that we can shoot for in my mind. I don't know. Others can kind of chime in, in terms of what they feel like what the patient mention

George @eiLabs

Yeah, and also maybe we have like 30 more minutes. Right now I want to more people to talk oneness speak on from Easy company and also by law from my life card so that I think they are the people who are actually going into these directions which all of us are talking to a large extent. So before that. Okay. We will find minutes we will have a conversation around this topic about this model toilet like a as simple as a kind of an awareness as a logo, whatever we say and then say that okay what is required there and how to I mean, and live in live in that two different different forms may be right. So yeah, so

Den @eiLabs

May I make a point. Yeah, okay, I can see who you're 34 people during today's discussion at this point of time so To take this topic for next few weeks at least two weeks, I feel this topic needs to be discussed. I know that Saturday mornings are difficult to join the meeting, but in spite of that, I would like to request you that for next two Saturdays, at least. If you can give your inputs and we can come to a concrete plan of action based on the ideas that Sharma and the page was discussing for module that bathroom or freely accessible accessible moderator bathroom or what what we mean by this mark dilates which would be Managed white space and equipment. Also, so if you can join for next two Saturdays, and then we can Have a point when we can plan an action that will be great. So it's my request our request from a large that, please join for next two weeks. The whole house. So that we can have some some tangibility from you guys. We can we can initially can explore for the society as a whole.

George eiLabs Enable India

Yeah, then one more point i mean i just i mean i am i can see supposed to be in the call. She's actually a startup that was working with that's working with persons with autism. And so already, she wants. She wants to discuss on a subject that is primarily on invisible disabilities and hidden disabilities. Right. Which is Which is one of the bigger areas. So we may have to push it, push that also in one of the Saturdays in between. But otherwise, okay, we can go ahead with this. As the mainstream for a Finger Lakes with specific points like so depending on your thoughts like we can discuss on a very like schools, how to make the schools accessible. To work on accessibility for accessibility. How to make this modular wash basins. So those kind of things. I think somebody wants to talk for some time and then mentioned about that, because see from that aspect and don't we are not talking because she works with autism and as today, then you are mentioning that somebody created a solution. Somebody had a solution. washroom solution for an ADHD person right So that so okay just give the mic to Sebastian right now. Yeah.

Subashree Krishnan

Thank you, George, and thanks everyone. It was very enriching experience to learn more about the challenges and I think the invisible disabilities also came up quite a few times today so happy to hear that. And what we would like to dwell on is a specific meeting around hidden disabilities and and there the district seed some thoughts in your mind. There are two sets of challenges. One, even the awareness is very less related to more visible disabilities but the challenges of, you know, quite similar. Okay, so we will You know, kind of dwell on that whenever George puts it on the agenda with respect to the topic of this meeting. I wanted to add one more challenge. You know, I have elderly parents whose mobility is challenged were not very steady. They're not exactly disabled but today the the walking steak or something like that. And I heard the discussion about the bathroom and one solution I or rather one challenge I face is that Most of the concepts around fixed spaces as in where they live, or where they work my challenges, whenever I travel with them. I would like to have a mobile solution. For example, I think the one of the most important things is the hand good upgrade the grab bar. So, I have tried a few suction devices exception based hand bars. And they they work, I would like to throw this you know issue out there. The challenge. I have had with that is the The suction device may not be very good. Like when my dad Christ to get support he really puts a lot of his weight on it, and sometimes they pop up. Right. So the bigger problem. I want to present is also let's also think about more viable solutions something people can pack in a bag and go For example, like a grab bar and also think about designing study solutions. Okay, so those are the two things I wanted to add to this meetings discussion.

Shyam Suri @eiLabs

Yes, getting that independence with them. Yes that's beautifully said I think that I don't have to extrapolate when my I travel with my dad and mom and then I can't go into the men's toilet Right. And it's a very anxious few minutes, and especially given call late. I don't know how the world will be tomorrow. I can't even ask an agenda indoor somebody else to help them out either so much, so much so many other considerations, these days.

George eiLabs Enable India

Yeah. So let me now give the we have like another 20 minutes more. So I will request by law to He joined a little late because, but I would want him to speak because I mean some of the challenges that we are discussing today. Okay. He was actually making some solutions. He is they are actually doing something called alive spaces for retirement homes and Beautiful product line for persons elderly and persons with disability and also lot of other recreational activities for persons with disabilities. So, by law, would you like to talk about what you are doing, from the Allied space.

Bala

Basically alive is an organization which which we started in 2015 we call ourself industrial solutions company. We were founded US itself with an objective of adding life he will be Mentioned Possible. We have a social enterprise model where the two types of activities and you also have a foundation which supports seniors in in various Is it So, The one is alive. Let's basis with where we are setting up a senior living community. The first one is coming up. We have a little card. It is one of the. We've been around for five years now so we one of the leading store specially for senior cap senior products. Home solutions is a very specific vertical which we run out of Toronto mentioned I where we we look at what what the topic which we are discussing today, the bathrooms and other areas where He is and And make interventions which makes the bathrooms and living rooms and staff so on safer. So this is very specifically, which we do for intervention mentioning Then we have a foundation which kind of which we have, through which we do some social interventions awareness and activities which which are typically in the rural areas in and around our Render mentioning so so this is what who we are. So a brief history. We started in 2015 then October we started home solution. So we are going around 500 homes solutions. Wherein we went in and retrofitted home homes with senior friendly products in an inner entrepreneur mentioned I we launched in 2016 So we have an hour for the seniors activities which we started in 2017 we launched our groundbreaking for our retirement community in 2018 and 19 be pretty busy and 20 S, you know, we plan to hand over and hopefully Once this code and everything else goes off, we should be able to handle the first retirement community project. So about false. So basically some statistics. I'm sure most of you must be familiar with this so 53% you have Indian artists about 60 suffer a major or minor phone every, every year, right, a small for A big for a small India. Or 30% of people fear of a fault. So the fear is that so typically as we grow world that one of the biggest things is the fear and the fear of fall is one of the biggest fears which comes to seniors. So the biggest element is the cost because of Indian the way Indian or it's a healthcare setup costs in any small fall when from 48,000 on a median to Linux. So typically pretty expensive. So I'm just sharing a small video and this is as fast looks to people with aging mission. So as you see, I'm I hope you can see it. So as and when the vision goes with the knowing. And for this one. There is a drop in the ritual ability to see that. See this pass. So this is actually one of the biggest issues, Barry. We thought we because, as in when the visual element and the other centers, go down, it causes a major impact in terms of How elder start using the space around them and their mobility becomes restricted which we have seen, which many of you have seen Mobility becomes rested. So they just get to stick in one room which causes lot of physical and mental trauma, which is which is really not good. So, so the best way to keep The seniors active is to make safe spaces around them safer and more secure and comfortable. And that's where we he come into play. So on statistics. I'm just speaking of some time to stick with. It's actually an international publication, but still Relevant so When we thought about this week we came up with a model called alive home solutions. So alive home solutions was a concept that Not one intervention will fit any particular Person's requirement. So we need to have custom requirements for individuals each each individual's requirement for a safe bathroom or a safe room will be different. So we came up with something called a live room solutions and just going to run a small video on that. So, this, this, this is typically what we do in alive from solutions. So what we do is we do an assessment, we found out. So because we have a huge range of products we come out with a standard, we can come up with solutions of the specific products which will suit a particular Tina for the particular requirement. So, so, and then we go and install it, our range of products include One is a folding grandma. Then we have a straight rubber. We have one third degree grabber L shaped trappers for washbasin then for closets. Then for then simply grabbers which are used in various other areas like walkways and stuff. So we are grabbers what we have done is we have those with the Rigid support. So typically, they have much better grip than your standard stainless steel and grab us. And it is also have an eye on sheet. So typically gives the life last longer. So we do so we do understand that each So we do understand each requirement, as I said earlier, maybe different to be also tried to customize and Provide the installation support as and when necessary. So the other area which you are discussing earlier is on slips right so you see the problem is most of our bathrooms have people try to make it as shiny as possible. A never understand the reason why. But it's kind of what say more polished than other areas and helps soSo, So so so what we have is a range of products which Is which are typically we going into an existing bathroom and make it more safer. These are we have a range of anti slip solutions. Which can be applied on existing flooring. So what we do is we go we go in and this is these are all da way also for people can do it on their own. So they can go in and apply it on flows which are which don't have that much grip and typically increase the grip in the floors by a significant factor. So, this we have a we have done this applications in many areas we have done it in Hotels because hotels, they requested many bathrooms have slippery they they requested that they've done it in hospitals. We have done it in individual homes we have done it in swimming pools. So basically, wherever there is a risk of A fall you to water spillage and the surface is pretty smooth, you can go ahead and install and apply this anti slip solution. Kind of gets the grip better so that it will have a Pretty good products which is going around. Now, so the other one which we have our a wide range of backup tapes. So these are small one, one and a half inch tapes, which can be stuck across Rooms a bathroom in front of bathroom doors or entrances or near the toilet. So the idea is to make sure Your entry and exit points are. And the key areas where you use have typically much more grip than what is required. So these tapes, we have Transparent tapes, because that one of the biggest challenges were which we have always seen is people want these products, but they wanted to be non intrusive, that is So the typical concept is I would like this in a bathroom but I don't want others to see that it is an obvious thing which is over there. So, which is a which is a kind of a Kind of doesn't actually work that way. So we have a range of products which are simple and easy to install, like this and these sleep tapes, which at least start preventing the false due to sleep pages which which actually happens pretty frequently This is This is a typical. What is a bathroom installation, which we do, we have a non slip rapper. We have a sidebar grab bar with the floor support for this one. Most, most elders have a problem with a nice nowadays. So what we have is a toilet seat razor, which kind of helps people to get easily on and off the toilet. And it gives a kind of three to five inch high rise to the existing products. The problem is, many pilots are pretty low. So for them for for people to go down and sit and then get back up. This is actually Pretty difficult. And then there are cases where the problem is the other way around. Where, where there is constipation. And so, so we have a toilet stool, which kind of racist floor hate a bit so that the So the person can typically sit like an Indian closet on invested closet. So kind of makes it Dual Purpose in a way and and helps them in In the ball movement, much better. So the these are these are our other range of products. We have an end of shirts with especially for seniors, which have micro magnets. So I just, I'm not sure whether he would be interested in the job, or I can still run a small Nobody. That is fine. I think we are, we are running short of time. So maybe Yeah, we have a range of shirts. We have an angel, where we have an angel of Personal emergency rescue buttons. Then we have a range of What is it pilot but bathroom accessories, which can be retro which can be fit and this mounted as and when required. So clearly we have a wide range of products we For specifically for seniors and

George @eiLabs

Okay. If you have any. Thank you. Bella. Yeah. Thank you. Paula and light for everybody's knowledge. Okay. I came to know about ally spaces to some of the users. And most of the users are like, I mean, comfortable in what they're doing. Right. So it's all very customized kind of solutions, but they have solutions which they are switching to very personal needs. Right. So, and one more thing. Okay. They invest a lot of time in Understanding. I think that that solution where you understand the problem about seniors to figure out where the fear of for can be understood and so make solutions towards that. So, before going into any questions I want to share one more thing, because Because one of the teams. I mean, they are like a group of volunteers from one of the companies. And they just came to us and said, Okay. Instead, along with doing. It's an actually automobile design company and they wanted to make a product for persons with disabilities. They just want to volunteer in terms of designed The manufacturing testing use cases, everything. So I have to request, we can't. I mean, to talk about your initiative and how, what is that you are doing I mean, because you are doing this above and I bow and over. You are a day job, right, because you have to invest a lot of time in this. So do you like to share about what you want to do and what kind of participation, who would you like to get from the people here. Say, Can you could hear me. Yeah, you guys can hear me. Yes, yes, yes, we got a little louder would be better.

We came to know about compliance asTheir social, political, commerce and issues so easy would beDeveloping a solution to the product design andTrying to design a productThat will be, you know,That will helpThe beach a person to actually easily access and wash basin.So,We'll be speaking in detail about this.Product and later on for now.The thing is today's or aspirations are not accessible that hasBeen stated. So we are looking at a solution where washbasin could easily happen now.I just did that easily for a week 10%

George @eiLabs

Sorry, sorry. Can we all have some questions also for you. I made some questionnaire and you are looking for some kind of responses. Right. Okay. Right. So maybe I will send you to all of you. And this is like just one of the activities and we want to make sure that They are like spending a lot of time researching on this and want to make sure that they are able to contribute. Product to the society right so that we are also mentioned, ensuring that okay the finally the product they're making is going to be useful for people. So we want to make sure that enough research is done. So that part is also there. So I will share with all of you and please make sure that you and we will also have some detailed discussion on this specific topic. On like accessible wash basins that on the three main products like washbasin commode and shower so that also we want to discuss Both from the rural aspect and from the urban aspect. Right, so that discussion is also going to come. So During that time anyway. We are going to have a detailed discussion, but if you could give some basic thoughts we could go for a very more involved discussion in that now with the inputs from yours. So, so we are coming to the close of the session, we have just four minutes and So I have to give the climax partner, then he is okay though he talks about wheelchair, those kinds of things. He's a movie actor. He is movie was showcase Philly mommy showcased in Cannes Festival last year and I mean I don't have time to explain everything about him, but the climax part is also always our hero then. So Don now it's your call to take it to crush.

Den @eiLabs

Yeah, you're saying to me. So yeah, so the discussion that we had today was needed, and was enlightening and it is.All of us that we kind of make society which do not have to have any other modifications, if this thing can be universal. And today's discussion topic accessible washrooms accessible accessibility for all kinds of disabilities. Is something very important and close to my personality propose to me personally because Whenever we try to think of an accessible place. The last thing that comes in our mind is accessible toilet, because in a span of if I go to a restaurant restaurant for the lunchtime lunch hour, maybe for hardly for one, not one time out twice. I will go to the washroom, but That is a most important area that I'm going to use because that is a very private and prioritize area and without appropriate access for all kinds of disabilities like I'm not only talking about wheelchair users. I'm also talking about physical disabilities caused by a rotation then visual impairment and all kinds of disabilities. He shoe that can add can come up in an accessible toilet, which I see that accessible toilets are not accessible at all. Because of the floating because of the heights that are having the equipment's And in the hotels that I have traveled in doubt. The thing is that in the hotels, I cannot find that's the title. It's called access accessible. Even I have One too many, many conferences for a present the papers and many of the many of the places. Many of the hotels just provides extra speeds is a big, big toilet but bitterness and not accessible toilets. So we need to concentrate on smartness, we need to concentrate on design. We need to confront it on the architecture, we need to concentrate on the devices and we need to concentrate on mainly on the All these things can come when we concentrate on innovation. So innovate innovation is the word that has to be utilized in many forms in many ways so that People Live in a gallery in society. That's the whole objective of ours. So that would round up to fly without I don't have to ask for help because if I see steps. I'm a shameless person, by the way. And if I see steps in front of me I will call people's on the that particular place to SPF the steps because Why should I stop myself of going up when fault is not mine. So I would ask help from people I would, I'd be politely telling them that I have to climb this tree step. So please, helping I'm guiding you how to maintain the wheelchair balance. So yeah, that is one more risk that I face whenever I go out and I see three steps before the left So that was celebrated there. Whenever I go to a shopping mall, I see that dance door there, but the ranch are slippery and made of stones which is not at all accessible because every anyone can have a fall and Runs to be of hard surface of of of the services that are not really, not of Thrones, not a Polish So these are the things that has come in my mind. And since the time that I started working with your charm and the page and Ii Ii Ii lads. Did the thing that always has come in my mind that, why can't we have a Accessible accessible taking In in in in our surrounding. So what is an accessible accessible. Accessible things are which is A statement tried and approved by person with disabilities. Because the security part the slip that we have are due to our knowledge people disabilities that we can have maybe some people can live because of the art. The person while having hemiplegia hemiplegia the condition where You're one side is less powerful than other side So people having me pleasure can are prone to fall if that is a slip because they won't be able to kind of adjust their balance in other leg dude kind of straight away fall. So people who are visually impaired if some auditory description comes up that yeah that is There but smart pins are there but audited descriptions in the in the in the washrooms come up that If that is something called audit audit to the point where people can go and just press a button and understand the dimension of the bathroom, which are the places that they need to go. These are the things that I know these are things which are very difficult to make, but it can be make made and I know that these are the things which are expensive to make, make or create but once we create them. I'm absolutely sure that not only person with disabilities would use them, but regularly. It has been seen that when that is a I'm coming to an example. Now, when that is a ran under the staircase, it seems that people start to use tech not to use their case, rather than they used Rance For climbing up the five or six staircases that can be avoided. So this has been seen. So by this we can come to a conclusion that any kind of innovation, any kind of modification any content accessibility enhancement would be Come across as a universal designing and universal adaptation to be used by all sphere of society, maybe in the beginning, it would be costly, it would be expensive but gradually the cross note would come down when more innovation, more, more research would come up So for this we need to have a group of people dedicated people who can who can give a bit of their time voluntary really and design things for the overall benefit ofKind of 6 billion.

Social Entrepreneurship for CMRIT

CMRIT students who worked on the Assistive Technology projects heard the journey of an entrepreneur.

And also were exposed to the particulars about , what startups should focus on and the ecosystem that is available for them like incubators, funding , grants etc.

Solution Saturday _ Consolidation and Next Steps

Create themes and curate it a bit more upfront. Furthermore, categories agenda to run each meeting differently

1. Awareness Meeting --- Will have informational content, where the majority of time will be taken by a few speakers who come prepared.

2. Panel discussion -- define problems upfront to discuss and evolve thinking as well as solve. This will be more discussion-oriented.

3. Review and rehash -- Create regular summaries and regenerate interest as well take up future items and enclosed ones.

A Proposed Structure for Solution Saturday formats.

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Have a primary theme that revolves around continued focus & tangible outcomes - which is long-running (1-3 months) and sequential. Start with one field/topic/problem at a time. Make an impact and be able to roughly quantify the same. Intersperse with a secondary theme that reloves around open discussion, current affairs, panel discussion, guest speakers on special topics, etc.

We want Solution Saturday to be a platform where meetings are held on Saturday's so that:

1. Awareness of problems surface

2. The right "solvers" can participate to provide insights, structure and next steps to addressing problems (thereby creating solutions)

   1. (*) Once the problem statement and outcomes are clearly defined in these meetings, the subsequent action would be hand this off as an initiative to a core group of volunteers and NGOs to take up. The provision of resources and monitoring to this group has to come from the community at large, but this forum will do everything it can to enable this and make it successful.

   2. At the end of every quarter (or every six weeks) we can have a readout from each of these initiatives.

3. Best practices can be communicated

The regular attendees of the meeting decided that we will clearly separate the organizational aspects of the meeting from the charter and topics that are undertaken (the above three points).

• EILabs will continue to host and provide the forum for these meetings.

• The community should create and own the agenda. This will make it more vibrant and effective. Without this, EILabs will have to play a substitute role.

Primary Theme (3/4 Saturdays)

----------------------------------------

This will be run three out of four Saturdays (TBD) and will primarily provide for the continued thematic set of discussions that were requested during the feedback session. It was decided that we will keep the core theme of SS for the current run and experiment with it.

Review and Planning of Solution Saturday

Feedback received from Solution Saturday Attendees

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

Folks were in general very happy and appreciated the fact that such a forum is available to discuss important accessibility important issues. Many people especially liked the idea that there is a "voice" for every view and participants genuinely think about addressing problems and issues raised during the meeting.

There was also an appreciation for the diversity of topics to match the interests. AAC, learning, games, rural access to name a few.

Feedback from the community on things that could improve:

• Have a thematic approach. Create them and publish them upfront. (Referred to by multiple people)

• Send invites in WhatsApp

• Notification to be sent out at least by Tue/Wed. That is 3-4 days' notice. (Referred to by multiple people)

• Multilingual - at times speak in Hindi also

Send out meeting minutes or a pointer to the same after the meeting so that people who did not attend can get an idea

Current job scenario and Solutions to be Ready With.

Ms. Vinaya Chinnppa , Head of Employment ,,Enable India shared the job scenario during the covid times . And the kind of jobs that is available during this time.

Topic: Reaching to Visually Impaired in the Rural Areas

Reaching to Visually Impaired in the rural areas through communication channels is difficult due to access issues .
Even though , there are enough resources that can be shared, a trustworthy network is not available to reach out to the rural ecosystem.

Topic : Connecting Urban Supply to Rural demand , for online education for Visually Impaired students

Text Chat Summary:

Vishnu: Hello Everyoe This is Vishnu from Smileys. We are volunteer driven inclusive movement in Bangalore and Trivandrum. I am an ex employee of Enable India too.

Ima Antony: hi we used traditional games as recreational and for overall development of body, mind and values. we have taken it to many NGOs and their beneficiaries including special needs. now we have made videos teaching how anyone can use things available at home and draw and play these games. as of now, we can do it as train the trainer for spl need children then enable them to play at home. we have revived around 150 traditional games across cultures and will be documenting them in our youtube channel you are welcome to use them in addition to your course contents. we can help you appropriate games for appropriate age and ability.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC3xT63e9A-XTS4liwtHoBRQ

George @eiLabs: membership-india@bookshare.org

Adarsh Chhetry:

Adarsh Chhetry: I'm Adarsh Chhetry I'm student of political science university of Delhi with cerebral pasly

adarshchhetry94@gmail.com

question can a person with cerebral pasly with with spasticity join the book share platform? ANS : YES

Manju Sharma: Quite a few of our students have benefitted immensely from the regular workshops conducted by Bookshare and NAB extensively in this phase of lockdown.

Bindu_ Hyderabad:

l am Bindu from Hyderabad , founder of Lit By Humanity.

we work for visually impaired students and the services provided are:

Scribe Requirements, Audio Recordings , Visual Assistance , Visual Reading( Explaining Concepts)

Laxita Pandey: Hello, I am Laxita, our team is working towards making higher education more accessible for students with disabilities. we would like to connect with Faiyaz Attar, and Giridhar please

contact 9873279205

Discussion Summary

So we thought, okay, a marketing platform or a kind of dissemination plan form of your solutions is what is more important. And that's why we have solutions Saturday, a lab also has other projects which is only focused on in particular that direction.

Main thing about solution Saturday is if at all, we have any questions. We have make sure that okay you can the final problem resolved, and , your question for completely resolved and you are able to take the next step .

So one of the advantage we were seeing was looking because of online. I mean, the distance and geography is not a barrier and many schools and many organizations is working in urban area and working in the online.

Ajeesh Thomas:

Okay. The, the two people from the village area facing the network issue. This is own challenges we are facing in this training, but it is not that you know maybe 32 maybe 20% of people are putting but remaining 70 to 80% of a working knowledge is going well and what we are doing here.

We are recording the sessions daily and we are trying to upload into Google Drive and share the link up with a day in the group. So here after everything is it will reach to them and they can get. They can just download it and listen whenever they are free.

We were giving the training. Okay, how to use zoom first and how to attend the color. How to mute. How to unmute and how to raise the hand All those things we trained for two, three days.

Use this know the net. Most of the people as smartphone. Now maybe less amount of people on earth man's smartphone here that

Then the certain area network will be lagging and even for the trainer, there would be an issue. So such issues we face, but how to overcome that. That is what the challenge right now.

People are asking questions over the WhatsApp group. They are also we are not taking it up and we are claiming that our doubts. This is how we are doing it right now. It was good. But now, certain challenges as a

Yeah, yeah. So this is the last question, and I just wanted to know how I mean how many people have access to a punk band. Some devices supported with

Those format because with visual media. I think if it is converted to epoch, some other if you can put in some unique descriptions, even you could work offline as well. So that is maybe that is what I thought.

Giridhar , Mechanical Engineering Final Year Student

Yeah. So yeah, so after converting into THorium files. I mean, I basically gave my textbooks or conversion. If it is accessible, which is already available in Bookshare and I download those books in ebook fine and I whenever I click on the profile. I have set a default a tutorial so

Yeah. And again, it's the THorium . I can also read equations, both equations which running two pages, maybe some eight lines to mind lines with one particular equation. So, THorium is pretty helpful with that because you can go word by word in the formula as well. I suppose power.

Subscript super script or if it has more number of fractions in the numerator, denominator. So that is something which I found useful with the epub format.

One more problem which I had with my internet service because I'm in the final semester. And I have this subject operation research.

And it's something related to management and there's something called as network analysis on the part the network analysis, and that is something which I find a little difficult

Homiyar , Head , Book Share India

We have been focusing on creating accessible textbooks, not just an English medium but for all vernacular mediums.

So to supplement what additional saying bookshelf has created the complete syllabus in English medium, at least for now for the state of Kerala for all books from grades eight to 12 are Right now available on bookshop including books for maths and science and maths and science books was spatially encouraged by Ron coming from Kerala for

Harun who probably was one of the brightest students and then following her on there have been other students who were also started taking or science subjects in Kerala. So we appreciate that.

And to support this initiative of having access to science subjects bookshelf has taken up preparing all science books for not just Kerala, but we have done this for NCERT , Tamil nadu and Gujarath.

So if you have a request for a title. There are two ways of reaching us either you reach out to one of our partner organizations and we work with most leading organizations in all the States like sakshumathi and Enable India. So similarly, we have partners in all the major states.

Now if you reach out to them and say, I want this title. It is not found on bookshelves. So they will expedite that request to bookshelf. Or you could directly write to us using our membership ID.

Sayomdeb , Questions

Den: Is book share only limited to your empowerment, because we use impairment and person with a visual impairment and person with Dyslexia, because I'm a person with dyslexia also along with my disability other disabilities mental disabilities so Do kind of close it down for only person with a visual impairment or do you also give this particular thing with person with dyslexia.

Homiyar : So you missed one word, which I started bookstore is the largest online access will library for persons with disability is how I see Right. And the word disability includes not just the blind and visually impaired or the low vision but also people with learning disabilities like you with dyslexia and even more than that. We also include people with spasticity who cannot hold or turn a page of the book.

We also include people with automatic challenges like paralysis.

Cold or turn a page of the slow learners all these people at terminus print disabled. So all these people. If you have valid certificate,

You can definitely apply the same route to membership what bookshare required is a valid certificate of medical certificate from a medical practitioner or government hospital State Disability

Vidya , Wipro :

I wanted to respond to a Giridhar issues so concern. I mean I have to my mind. In fact, there are three solutions, but I think we'll have to explore the third one. So, you know, see earlier about, maybe, you know, when the zoom or WebEx or whatever, you know. So this was still not fully accessible. When I say accessible, not in terms of the accessibility for persons with visual disability but I mean to say that you know so that it was not as easy as it was available in the market 15 years ago I remember using this Facility by BSNL called dooravaani. I don't know whether that still exist. So it's a good idea to explore.

Secondly, I also have seen this, so I know. I mean, I myself have used this feature in Webex. You know, we again use WebEx. So the difference between zoom and Microsoft Teams, or Google Hangout versus WebEx is

WebEx has an audio mean a number which gives you a number to connect on audio. This thing right so that I think is something that one has to explore a little bit. And the beauty about that is that you don't need internet connection. And you just need a phone and you know there is a number given by the host. You just connect on audio and then, you know, at a time, whatever. Some 5070 so obviously WebEx has the maximum capacity of thousand people. So, you know, that is something that I we can

very beautifully leverage on.

on phone, WebEx. is extremely accessible or

Shanthala , Vividha Trust

Science for Visually Impaired School Students

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=g_DRfu8sSnI

One of the things that we wanted to try out is to just get our children to do experiments like anybody else in a like typical children do. So we just started off, we didn't think of what was existing or the technology required or anything. Science in our perspective is more about making children think so if you are able to make that possible then children will figure out if if anything is required to go further. So, so we started the exposure is the first thing that I think would make children thing. So we kept taking them around. Different places to kind of get different experiences understand how things work. So, and then getting them to do various crafts chores at home.

So all these things. Eventually, I mean that's what actually typical children. Do you know psychic children, they are doing all this or either doing it or they're seeing it. So they're getting all these inputs through that. Now this experience with children who are visually impaired impaired have to be brought to them so So once it wasn't please, they were ready to, you know, do experiments that were that were done by cited children in the classroom.

But, you know, still, there were a few modifications that we probably had to do with material. Sometimes, you know, with the light experiment. Sometimes we needed some kind of technology and all that.

But wherever required we we intervene and look at the, look for help for assistance outside. Otherwise, we just use whatever was available at home. So the one which you just saw, so was almost without any adaptations, you know, except that the child had to learn how to pour water on his own keep all the things in a tray so that the child knows where is what

You know simple adaptations like this would make the child, figure out things on his own. So this is an example. So there are

Few more experiments that we put it on our YouTube. So for everybody to see that it is possible to do science experiments in a regular classroom setup.

Bindu : Hyderabad

Working as an assistant professor of English. I'm from Hyderabad.

So I started my journey in 2015 working for visually impaired students. So recently we started an organization, we have almost 2000 volunteers joining us for audio recording So every day we record newspapers in the newspaper in order to succeed and also be fulfilled almost 300 prescribed requirements. So our goal or motor is to connect all the visually impaired students and fulfilling the requirements. So if there is any requirement.

Please approach us and also whatever audio recordings that we have done, I can share with y'all.

Imaculate , Ima Creations , Games

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL_98ouVEEVhCNBCO3VuV1c9tg3JXOxsD-

you know, fancy toys played with using seeds and stones and sticks at home and all that. Right. And moreover, that game is the feeling of, you know, belonging together Nass bonding. Plus, it actually improved our interpersonal skills, you know, observation.

We have taken this games to lot of special needs children we have taken it to her has used as very often and a lot of artists and children autism schools have used it even skip used us for Speech and Hearing lack children or, you know, I really would like to work with you on that 150 games that are definitely Most of them can be customized are, you know, are taken to Our games. By default, or like that. Right. They are for all ages and all the ability because in olden days, and our grandparents house we all used to play with, you know,

yelled at a younger kid kid who likes to run around and play kids who wants to just sit down and play alone as everybody we are involved and

I share the link of

The YouTube channel from already documented 40 plus games.

We have 150 games.

And the list is growing.

Date : 30^th May 2020

Time : 10 AM to 11.30 AM

Venue : Zoom

The agenda of the discussion was the figure out the channels by which Project Discovery can reach out to Innovation in Assistive Technology in the rural areas

Jeeja Ghosh from Kolkota shared about the CBR Network & Women with Disability Network

Ramya from Nimaya Robotics spoke about their initiatives in reaching out to rural area with a Screening Tool before Diagnostics. This is because , diagnosis of Autism in rural areas still needs more improvement before we get solutions to network . Currently they follow DSM Charts etc for the research

Sagar . Reaching out to Special Schools . Blind School at Bijapur is using different solution but even they dont realize that , it is innovation .

SOS Village are all over India . SOS Village in Bhopal is for special children and they are using various solutions . And they do painting ,

Sagar can reach out to Bijapur . Sagar can reach out to volunteers who may be able to volunteer .

Also reach out to Disability Rehabilitation Network to rech these places .

Jagrithi Yathra . Focus on Villages

Chandrashekar Reddy . from Orissa. Rural.

G CHANDRASEKHAR REDDY

founder of We Spark Foundation wespark.org.com@gmail.com , chandrasekhar8658@gmail.com , 7077411649 , 7008065701

Sabal Sahayog . Mostly from Jharkhand and Orissa . is an organization that needs to be reached out .

Few other key points that out in reaching out to rural areas,

• A very person centrist local initiatives may be required as many of the persons with disability may be confined to homes.

• Hand holding the users may be required if we have to get the video from rural areas . And it is also critical that , continuous engagement is present is

Date : 16^th May 2020

Time : 10 AM to 12.PM

Venue : Zoom

Venue : Project Discovery

The discussion of the day was primarily on Project Discovery . Project discovery is project conceived at eiLabs to crowd source videos of assistive solutions. The intent of the project is give an opportunity for users to showcase their unique solutions . Showcasing the solution in a common platform will help other users to understand the solutions

Dipesh gave an introduction of the project and later Den gave a brief idea of the details of the project implementation. Den briefed upon why this project has to a community project and also shared the various tasks that will require volunteers to execute . The discussion was then opened up to all the participants .

Few of the thoughts that came up during the discussion were .

1. A brief set of guidelines like length of video shall be defined

2. Project discovery should reach out to the rural populations and hence , even persons and organizations who are associated with pwd can upload the solutions .

3. Though this is run as a competition, the intent is to showcase the unique solutions . So figured out the need that , volunteers may be required from the different localities , if the PWD is not able to script and shoot a good video .

4. Barrier to submission shall be very low .

5. Ritika mentioned about a whatsapp message that can be forwarded to the groups that she is part of . And this was something everyone was expected to do to spread the message .

6. Rajasi brought up the point that , videos that are uploaded shall be tagged so that it is easy for the people who are browsing the youtube channel for solutions . Also how to manage the repetition of solutions etc . Dipesh explained that , this will definitely be done as part of the larger eiLabs vision .

7. There was a questions from startups whether they can showcase products . The general response was , any solution can uploaded by anyone , if the video is showcasing , how the solution is useful for PWD. And it was requested that , startups should find volunteers to use the products as well as record the videos .

8. Subhash from Allegis suggested to have some kind of example videos so that people can understand what is the kind of videos we are expecting.

9. Den said . the guidelines are just to bring in some reference and we will make sure , eiLabs platform will be used to get volunteers to support the video creation .

10. Sagar brought an important point of giving credits all the stakeholders in the video creation .

11. Shyam brought up the point that , guidelines and criteria for evaluation shall be defined

12. Ritviik Rajan , who is a professional singer explained his solution, if he forget the lyrics during a music concert. A prompt from someone using a wireless earplug

13. Muthuraj from Mangalore shared about various solutions that was made for solving many of the covid physical distancing challenges. And it was suggested that , it can be uploaded to Project Discovery youtube channel , if they share the videos of those solutions .

Date : 9th May 2020

Time : 10 AM to 12.30 .PM

Venue : Zoom

The meeting started by giving an introduction to the idea of Project Discovery by Den and George . Project discovery is about soliciting videos of assistive solutions from users a) . to showcase their unique solution , b) to spread the solution ideas to a wider audience and c) a repository that will be available to

1. Divyashree : A person with Muscular dystrophy shared about her solution . She is using a walker and she also use an heigh adjustable chair while attending the training at Enable

2. Shanthala mentioned about categorizing the solution with respect to disability and also may be publish few specific challenge areas and solicit solutions . Maybe , have a particular challenge area in a week and also discuss that solution category in that week of Solution Saturday.

3. Iranna : shared his disability after meeting with an accident. Challenges were shared by Udit , Chethana as well and both of them had challenges with hand and legs on one side . It was discussed that Iranna , Chethana , Udit and Divya can form a team to understand solutions that can be used by persons with challenges in one side of the body. Dinesh will coordinate with that .

4. Brinda and Deepa brought up the point that single handed challenges are similar to persons who are predominantly left handed.

5. Den also brought up the point that , if we have a cluster of people who needs similar solutions , we will have better negotiation power with solution vendors .

6. Den also shared his thoughts on , how to make use of our connects to reach project Discovery to a larger user base .

Understanding Assistive Technology Solutions for Career prospects for persons with disabilities

We have invited experts and D&I heads from corporate to speak about the topic and also respond to participant queries.

Showcasing your solutions

eiLabs is pleased to inform you all that your participation on Solution Saturdays has given opportunities to many to come up and share their own stories, problem statements and solutions. Your exchanging ideas is giving others a new perspective that solutions cannot be static and it has to be shared amongst the community. Keeping this in our mind, on 25 April 2020 eiLabs brings a new topic of brainstorming where we will discuss the importance of Showcasing your solutions.

The solution that you are using can help another person in another corner of our country or world and your participation can provide many people with making their life easy.

\

Wellbeing, Leisure & Entertainment

discuss how we are trying to utilise the leisure time for unwinding and relaxation. Some of the speakers and facilitators who will join are experts in this area.

This topic has been chosen because it was realised that to keep ourselves busy we are extending our work hours and that is making us stressed in some way or other.

Augmentative and alternative communication. Challenges for mainstream applications .

Enable India works for livelihoods for persons with disabilities. It is a high time that we find out solutions to extend a branch to create opportunities for persons having complex communication needs, (using AAC). The idea of AAC users getting into economic activity is distant. In the contemporary world personal well-being and freedom is related to the professional workability of the person.

Points by Bhavna Botta

Sorry there seems to be some issue With the system initially I could see and hear you all but now I can’t hear too

1. On a positive note to start -yes schools and colleges are accepting Aac users but the catch is the scribes -to get scribes for AAc users is difficult particularly if you are doing the Nios as the scribes have to be grade 7 and 9 .

2. Colleges are better as scribes are adults and are more matured .

3. Now coming to work place -employment of aac user is almost next to impossible .

4. Because an AAc user needs a personal assistant-now this reasonable accommodation is beyond economic constraints in Indian society .companies just don't seem to be having money to pay personal assistants-there by the AAc user has to cough it up which is not economical too.

5. So AAc user is stuck at home .

Work from home, its elements and challenges for Persons with Disability.

We all are working from home and using various technologies to make our work easy. Let us get together and socialise the solutions currently been used and way it can be improved by finding other solutions. We are sure that we will be able to resolve the issues which may come up from this discussion on Saturday because experts on various fields are going to join us to help.

Date : 14^th March 2020

Time : 10 AM to 1.PM

Venue : Enable India , 473 , Adugodi Main Road, Bengaluru 560095

Organizations Participated :

Wipro, Easi, Enable India , Robert Bosch , St Josephs College , Nonspec, Allegis

Focus Area:

Identifying work place solutions for persons with physical disability who are aspiring for Software developer role.

Miniutes of Meeting :

The meeting started with the Introduction of the participants. The main Intent of the solution saturday was Identifying work place solutions for persons with physical disability who are aspiring for Software developer role.

The introduction was followed by the video that introduces eiLabs.

There were a total of 23 candidates of which 3 had 100% disability . The rest of them were less than 50%. Of the mild disability candidates there were two cases with progressive disability . One was a candidate with of RP , low vision and his vision is deteriorating and the other candidate had muscular dystrophy.

One of the key workplace assistive technology that came up during the discussion.
Single Hand typing . Many of the candidates would perform well , if they have a solution for typing . [Note that even speech recognition is also a solution for Single hand typing ]

As many of the candidates were mild physical disability , also discussed about the options for driving to overcome mobility challenges . The main challenge here seems to be lack of awareness about getting licenses and adapted vehicles.
https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x74ncmm
https://youtu.be/eRr-Z8uMn0U

There was one candidate with https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ichthyosis . In this case , social discrimination seems to be only challenge . The candidate does not have any disability . The candidate shared that there is another child in the same same village who has similar condition but her parents are not doing anything about it .

The entire group was divided into three groups and took up two of the problems from their group members itself to solve . All the candidates were taken through the workplace assessment for computer jobs . Another problem that was discussed was a girl who was born with no knees . She had gone through multiple surgeries and currently the challenge is to climb stair which is painful. Another important solution requirement is for Persons with unequal leg length .

Date : 7^th March 2020

Time : 10 AM to 1.PM

Venue : Enable India , 473 , Adugodi Main Road, Bengaluru 560095

Organizations Participated :

APD, CMSSS Hassan, Deepvision Tech.AI,DNA, Easi, Eblity, Enable India, Nimaya Robotics, Nonspec, Trestle Labs, Vislot Technologies

Focus Area:

Reflection on Solution Saturday

Miniutes of Meeting :

Dipesh started off the program by sharing the objective of the eiLabs to the gathering and how eiLabs shall be the catalyst to create an Assistive Technology community . EI Labs has already initiated work with engineers, Shristi School of Design and Bosch Labs. Dipesh shared his hopes for EI Labs to grow organically.

Assistive solutions is a topic most people are well aware of and therefore it becomes easy to connect with interested stakeholders. There was a brief discussion on lack of visual aids in the dawn of time, evolution of spectacles and stage of its development today to surgery and even a fashion statement. There is a great room for removal of disability through solutions. Questions like, “What color is my walking cane or hearing aid?” could also lead to creation of solutions.

The start of Solutions Saturday is the acceleration of EI Labs but the consistency of Solution Saturday meeting provides it velocity.

After Dipesh introductions about eiLabs , all the participants introduced themselves and also shared their major challenges and also expectation from the eiLabs

Den shared his story of disability and the need for assistive aids when he was growing up. It was only when his teachers were at UK that they came across Bigmac, a software that changed the way he lived his life.

Celebration of human spirit instills in us the need to find solutions and thereby enables individuals. This involves addition of one more mind into the sector.

It is planned that for the next meetings, the attendees note down challenges on the common white board and work towards finding solutions to each. This is to be repeated at regular intervals.

There was a detailed discussion on the need to work with persons with disabilities as that is where both problems and solutions stem from. Majority of people have no awareness on existing solutions and assistive aids. The idea of using social media to spread the word was brought up.

Sharing knowledge on para-sports. Dipesh’s coaching story because sports connect people and builds a social circle of a kind. Sports for persons with disabilities, possible collaboration with Decathlon, possible training/coaching plan. Importance of building skills and impact of games and activities on development of skills was also discussed.

Trestle Labs pondered upon new ways to interview people (closed office space vs tennis court interview) and the results the change may bring. A possible agile learning solutions for adults that recognizes speech (accent, vernacular, volume) and converts it to text. This could bring rise to an efficient remote meeting.

Discussed problems/questions:

· The question of how to make collective impact.

· VI mechanical engineers production site safety issue and design through coding

· Looking at current solution and working towards making it better

· Tech to convert sign language to text and vice versa

· Speech therapy app practice sessions app

· Using the app and having trial process

· Bus stop problem KSRTC: improving services and creating leaders within sub groups

· Need to document journeys

· Building awareness of disabilities, especially in rural areas

· Need for hospitals and to do the initial screening to identify disabilities and thereby early intervention.

· Collection of existing knowledge of the Assistive technologies

· Lack of connect of experts and those who need the experts

· Creation of portal to aggregate existing solutions and knowledge base.

The ratio of persons with disability and engineers in India is 1:10. An inspirational example of the growth of calipers was shared. The first set of calipers weighed about 5 kilograms and its heavy weight was the problem. A solution was arrived upon by using various base material and today, it weighs about 800 grams.

Assistive solutions may not necessarily be a matter of high tech or may not involve any tech at all. How does a person with visual impairment distinguish his toothbrush from others? He may tie an elastic band around the handle, or make a scratch at the bottom. When necessity is there, solutions come around. The focus should not be on the problem.

The possibility of a reverse jagurti mela where we learn from people and maybe arrive upon solutions was explored. Solutions Saturday could be compared to built platforms and arrived trains at the platform. The free flow of ideas in these meetings are the people who come into the trains. The content has to come organically.

Feedback and suggestions collected.