If you would like to add a comment, please email TimpanogosCouncilPTA@gmail.com. We are open to posting comments representing both sides of the issue.
Orem resident and Adaptive PE teacher for Alpine School District:
"I am currently an Orem resident and parent of children who are/will be attending Orem schools. Growing up, I attended Bonneville, Orem Jr., and graduated from Timpanogos. I currently am an Adapted P.E. teacher (P,E, for students with disabilities) in Alpine School District for multiple schools in Orem. With all the talk about a possible Orem only school district, I have read the full feasibility study and watched all of the presentations/meetings. Initially I was strongly against any sort of a split but after hearing some concerns, I am open to learning and exploring the idea of a multi-city district. I have submitted many questions about an Orem only district and although some concerns were answered I still think what is best for our teachers and students would be to stay with ASD.
"My first concern is for our special needs population. Alpine is fantastic in offering so many quality services for our students. I am concerned about their continued access to Occupational, Physical Therapy, Speech, Adapted Physical Education, Vision, Deaf/Hard of Hearing, counselors, psychologists, etc. Technically these are all district/itinerant employees and it is unclear if all of us were included in this study or proposed budget. There is a suggestion about doing service agreements to contract with nearby districts but how much that would cost, or if they would agree is uncertain. Orem also does not currently have a school for severe students such as Dan Peterson, or a post high transition school such as ATEC. Both of these schools are crucial for so many individuals for their education and they would be hindered without access to them. Each special needs student does have an IEP and legally they receive what is on them, but those are redone at least every year and can be changed at that time. Each school district offers their services a little different and I would be concerned that many of these services would be lessened, altered, and possibly discontinued altogether.
"My next concern is about our electives and specialty programs. ASD offers Advanced learning classes and dual immersion. They also have a wide variety of special needs class environments (such as life skills, autism, mild/moderate, special school, behavioral, small class kindergarten, inclusion pre-school, special class pre-school etc). At the secondary level they offer many unique and trade school classes and opportunities such as a construction/house building class, car mechanics and many more. These types of classes are so beneficial to our students. Unfortunately, as funding decreases, they are often the first to be discontinued.
"Obviously, I cannot speak for everyone, but from the many schools I work at, most teachers wish to stay with ASD and will look to stay with them if there was a split. This would leave the new district hiring many brand-new teachers in an already teacher shortage.
"Although Alpine School district isn't perfect, I do believe they care and do the best they can for their students. I am proud to work for the district and know many outside our district who are impressed with what we offer. Teachers seek out to work for our district and I personally know many that have stated how much they appreciate Alpine compared to others they have worked in.
"There are many pros/cons of splitting and I encourage you to research multiple sources to be the most informed as we approach the upcoming ballet."
City Councilmember Jeffrey Lambson (remarks at Aug 2, 2022 city council meeting):
"Thank you for being here this evening. Thank you for reaching out and for sharing your concerns. I have read every email, text message and listened to every voice message. I have read a lot of the posts on social media, each being from concerned citizens. No matter which side you are on, thank you for taking time to share your thoughts and perspective. Thank you Mayor Young for your leadership and for learning of a concern and for doing something. Thank you Mr. Wankier and Dr McCarty for your work in putting this feasibility study together in a very short period of time. No matter what comes of this. I think that I have 2 new friends.
"I appreciate the messages saying that if I don’t vote a certain way, I will not be re-electable. This is not about reelection. This is an irreversible decision that will have ramifications for generations and decades to come.
"I want you to know that this decision has not come easily for me. I have wrestled back and forth. As I have listened and weighed the issues and concerns, I have felt very conflicted, sad and had heavy Feelings of contention, bitterness divisiveness. Perhaps you have felt these feelings to. If there is anyone who I have offended, I am sorry. I couldn’t put my finger on why I was feeling this way but then I realized we are talking about a divorce and not planning a wedding. I will come back to this in a moment.
"In Stephen R Covey’s book, the 7 Habits of Highly Effective People he shares an illustrative story to teach a principle. He is talking about business, about Producers… the workers who get things done, and the managers who oversee the work the producers are doing, and make sure they have everything they need to keep producing… and the leaders who climb to the top of the tallest tree, surveys the entire situation and sometimes have to yell “Wrong Jungle.” How do the busy producers and managers respond? “Shut up we are making progress.”
"I was talking with a good friend yesterday. He said something along the lines of you have started and ran a successful business. Sometimes you just have to take that leap of faith. We are talking about taking a leap of which I don’t have a lot of faith. Base jumpers before they jump make sure they have a parachute, are made aware of obstacles and know which the way wind is blowing. In my opinion, we are in the wrong jungle. And this is not the best time to jump. I am not aware of anyone that does not believe that there needs to be a split, even ASD feels that way. However, the current climate leads me to feel that this may not be the best time to do this. To take that “leap of faith.” There are Winds of recession, increasing inflation which makes the cost of everything more expensive. Just look at the cost of pretty much anything you have purchased lately. You probably received tax notice in the mail recently. Yes, that too. In an Orem only district, if there are any short falls… if a new district comes up short, the Orem taxpayers would be solely responsible for that shortage. There are too many unknowns and too much risk to put that on the Orem city taxpayers. We don’t have enough details, and as a community we don’t have enough unanimity to put this forward on a ballot. It would feel better if we knew there is a plan in place and what that plan entails, a better idea of what the risks would be…
"In my opinion, a better approach would be to work together, united not divided. Let’s take some time, work together and come together in a creating something amazing. Let’s start with a strong foundation of community. We have some of the very best and brightest “influentials” right here in Orem. Business, civic, educational and religious leaders that I know would come together for this cause.
"I am concerned about the cost of $80,000 - $100,000 to put this on the ballot. And if I am being honest with myself, and if I am doing what I said what I would do when I ran for this position, listen to the people, from what I am openly hearing and reading, this is not something most of the citizens want. I am concerned about the amount of money that will be spent. I am concerned about the emotional well-being of a city at large, I am concerned for the teacher’s concerned about the future of their careers. At this moment we are a divided city.
"This feels like a divorce instead of a growing family. When your children grow up and get married you work together, planning the wedding with both families, to make sure that the new couple will have a safe and wonderful start as they go off to start their own new family. This to me feels like a divorce. There is a lack of communication, love and concern for the best interest of the other party. Let’s bring this back together so that we can plan, not for a divorce, but the creation of something beautiful… planned out, working together on all sides and start this off in the right way, collaborating for what is best for all parties.
"I am asking today that we meet with, and work with ASD and begin planning a new district. It may not be right away but at least we can begin planning the creation of a new school district that can be strong, viable and the costs shared across a few municipalities instead of one lone city. Could Orem do it? Yes. At what cost? There are too many unknowns. Is this the safest, wisest way to proceed? I don’t think so. To me it makes more sense to work with ASD and involve other municipalities.
"I am calling on our elected representatives Sara Hacken and Ada Wilson, the leadership of Alpine School District, representatives from the Orem city council and staff, leader “influentials” and other interested neighboring cities to come together and start planning for a new district. A district that could be smaller, more responsive to our needs and concerns, united, and strong.
"From this study we have heard a lot about unsafe schools in Orem. Representatives Hacken and Wilson, will you please work with ASD to make these schools, Sharon and Windsor Elementary, a top priority for this next year’s budget, to get them retrofitted or whatever needs to happen so they are safe for our children?
"In closing from Arthur Brooks in his book Love Your Enemies… 'The important thing about contempt is that it is bad for us. Sometimes we don’t like people who disagree with us and we want to tell them they are idiots and social media makes it easy to do, and pundits get rich by doing it, and maybe it seems some of them deserve our contempt. But the important thing about contempt is that it is bad for us.'
"May we work through our disagreements without being disagreeable and come together as a community to find a solution, that we can all feel good about, knowing that we have had the time and opportunity to do the work and research that needs to be done."
Orem Parent and active Volunteer:
"The feasibility study did not provide any real information for people to look at. Every question about specific things such as if another school district would be willing to share services was even an option. No actual cost of anything was brought up. No ideas on how special needs kids will be helped. Regardless of anything else we do not have near enough information to even consider the split at this time. "
Orem parent of a special needs child:
I'm a special needs mom and I don't believe an Orem-only district is in the best interest of my son and kids like him. Here are a few of the concerns I have based on my research:
1. The feasibility study is predicated on the idea of special needs children being sent out of an Orem district for services outside of the community. (pgs. 235-236). I find the assertion that an Orem School District will build a strong community while simultaneously excluding my son unacceptable.
2. Services like the Dan Peterson School, ATEC, and the Giant Steps Autism Preschool are not included in the startup cost estimations projected in the feasibility study. This means they would not be replicated in the Orem School District without additional funding (i.e. tax increases). I find not having accurate financial figures when pitching this to Orem citizens highly problematic.
3. Once Orem District becomes the LEA (local education agency) for Orem students, it would be exclusively legally responsible for upholding FAPE and IDEA requirements of for the 1600+ Orem SPED students. Provo School District issued a press release that they would be highly unlikely to be able to offer resources through shared services agreements. Alpine will likely be in the same position based on how they currently work to stretch SPED resources. Where would that leave these vulnerable students? If they do find that they are able to extend support they will charge an Orem District more for those supports (as they should) yet we will have less say in those supports (no school board rep as we will be sending our kids to another district). That doesn't sound like an improvement. There is nothing in the feasibility study that makes me feel comfortable that those students would not experience massive disruptions to their services and supports.
4. I have spoken with several parents of SPED students in Jordan and Canyons School Districts about the experiences of their children during that split and it was universally a negative experience. The teachers and aides worked hard to make the best of a difficult situation but the resources were severely curtailed for many years. Hearing from those who have been through this experience, I don't feel comfortable leaping into an uncertain future when our current situation is serving my son well."
Orem teacher (resident of Vineyard):
"I feel like a pawn in this stupid game of theirs. I live in Vineyard. All of my children attend schools in Orem. I also teach at Orem elementary and have for 25 years. I will be leaving my school if they split and my children will have to attend different schools as well. The most frustrating part of it is that I have no vote or say in this decision that will completely change so much of my life."
Orem Parent & active Volunteer:
"I have lived in Orem for 11 years. I have 4 children in public schools in Orem ranging from high school to Elementary. Parental involvement has been huge for me. I helped in my children's classes weekly for many years as a volunteer. I have worked in the PTA and community councils for many years. My kids have benefitted greatly from the programs offered by the district such as the advanced learning lab and knowledge bowl for which I have been a parent volunteer. My kids have had Excellent teachers at their title one schools and I know that the district offers extra benefits to teachers.
"In my view, there is no way that an Orem-only district will be able to offer all of these great benefits to children and teachers without many years of growing pains. As the Alpine School district continues to grow, it may indeed be necessary to split. But we are not ready to vote on this because we haven’t explored all our options. What are other options for a split besides just an Orem-only district? What other options has the city council explored? What conversations has the city council had with Alpine school district about our concerns here in Orem and what can be done to address them?
"At this point, with a study that did not answer many questions, ignored many benefits and did not present a good variety of options for Orem (besides the Orem only district), putting the issue on the ballot will have people voting on an over-generalized, unproven ideology, posed as our only option. This could be detrimental to Orem.
"I believe in giving the citizens the right to vote. We voted for our representatives based on what they promised to do. And they were not transparent about their intentions to perform a feasibility study in their campaigns which blindsided many of us. They also have not taken the necessary steps to present us with some quality options to vote on.
"Finally, I think it is important to listen to the parents of children who currently attend public schools in Orem - especially those who are in the school frequently and seeing what goes on there every day."