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   Sexton looked unhappy. He decided to go in a little harder. `I'm going

   to be pretty blunt. So far you have admitted to the 008s but I think

   you are understating your knowledge and your experience when it comes

   to these sort of offences.' He caught himself. `Not offences. But your

   involvement in all of this ... I think you have got a little bit more

   ... I'm not saying you are lying, don't get me wrong, but you tend to

   be pulling yourself away from how far you were really into this. And

   how far everyone looked up to you.'


   There was the gauntlet, thrown down on the table. Anthrax picked it



   `They looked up to me? That was just a perception. To be honest, I

   don't know that much. I couldn't tell you anything about telephone

   exchanges or anything like that. In the past, I guess the reason they

   might look up to me in the sense of a leader is because I was doing

   this, as you are probably aware, quite a bit in the past, and

   subsequently built up a reputation. Since then I decided I wouldn't do

   it again.'


   `Since this?' Sexton was quick off the mark.


   `No. Before. I just said, "I don't want anything to do with this any

   more. It's just stupid". When I broke up with my girlfriend ... I just

   got dragged into it again. I'm not trying to say that I am any less

   responsible for any of this but I will say I didn't originate any of

   these 008s. They were all scanned by other people. But I made calls

   and admittedly I did a lot of stupid things.'


   But Sexton was like a dog with a bone.


   `I just felt that you were tending to ... I don't know if it's because

   your dad's here or ... I have read stuff that "Anthrax was a legend

   when it came to this, and he was a scanner, and he was the man to talk

   to about X.25, Tymnet, hacking, Unix. The whole kit and kaboodle".'


   Anthrax didn't take the bait. Cops always try that line. Play on a

   hacker's ego, get them to brag. It was so transparent.


   `It's not true,' he answered. `I know nothing about ... I can't

   program. I have an Amiga with one meg of memory. I have no formal

   background in computers whatsoever.'


   That part was definitely true. Everything was self-taught. Well,

   almost everything. He did take one programming class at uni, but he

   failed it. He went to the library to do extra research, used in his

   final project for the course. Most of his classmates wrote simple

   200-line programs with few functions; his ran to 500 lines and had

   lots of special functions. But the lecturer flunked him. She told him,

   `The functions in your program were not taught in this course'.


   Sexton asked Anthrax if he was into carding, which he denied

   emphatically. Then Sexton headed back into scanning. How much had

   Anthrax done? Had he given scanned numbers to other hackers? Anthrax

   was evasive, and both cops were getting impatient.


   `What I am trying to get at is that I believe that, through your

   scanning, you are helping other people break the law by promoting this

   sort of thing.' Sexton had shown his hand.