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Anders Behring Breivik Court Transcript 2012-06-18 Live Report

Monday June 18 2012

Source: www.vg.no/nyheter/innenriks/22-juli/rettssaken/artikkel.php?artid=10058173

09:02 VG: - The court is set.

- [The last two appointed experts, Terje Tørrissen and Agnar Aspaas, provide personal information and submits insurance.]

9:08 Right Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - It is I who must begin and we have presented the experts and an outline of the proposal. We will switch to what we present. We have a small introduction, including the mandate, the actual observation, psychometrics, assessment, and finally the conclusion of the juridical psychiatric Commission and comments associated with it.

The court is aware that we were appointed 01/13/2012. We have written a supplementary declaration and the way we see there are two points we separately account for, in addition to what is written about the personality and the weighting of conflicting in SCID1 and 2

- So there has been clarification from the DRC, then, but it is known. We review the original statement first and has embedded additional statement in the proposal, and will elaborate in court matters related to the individual themes.

- When it comes to impartiality, I have never worked and Aspaas before, nor have we any relation to observanden, DRC or the other experts already. There has been a competence control, and were found to be competent. General and detailed in our privacy, this is a major cause of extensive information. We have obtained information from health care, Rosenqvist, Child Welfare and the National Center.

9:10 Right Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - We have read most of this, or we have read all that is in proximity to observanden. Then there are a lot of peripheral case information. We have got good help from the police to select the information. We have also obtained consent, the observanden exempts health care for confidentiality. We have also considered the examination of komparenten, but we come back to it under the proposal so that we can account for the assessments we have done.

- Overall, we will say that the case is very well lit with the testimony and the documents that we have a good basis for drawing our conclusions. This is so that when we have such a large workload, we must make a selection of what we take, but we have tried as best it has been possible to bring the material to respond to the mandate, but it's always like that it is not easy to please everyone. We have also taken up the call with the sound of observanden of how he was.

9:12 Right Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - ... we come back to, as an important part of the basis for our observation. We also have some additional comments. It was completed in three weeks. In the beginning it was so observanden not want to work with us, but then turned observanden after different rounds in the District Court of Appeal and the Supreme Court, so we started the talks 17.02.12.

- It will also return. So it is on page 11 point action versus observation time. We see that the observations immediately after the act can be more helpful than someone who is farther away. In many cases it is not as extensive documents and information as to this. The important thing to note is that there have been audio and video interviews all the way. Ever since the first 22 July. In addition, we have had access to what has emerged in court from the police and health services.

- We have not gone through all hours of DVD footage. It is 220 hours, but we started at the beginning and went through the important interviews, the first, so we have taken tea representative sample for it. Later, we will say something about how we rated this. 220 hours of video and lydhavhør is not necessary for us. We have had access to all documents in the winter, there are several details that have been important. As with the economy and his business. What we have not had access to where the conversations between observanden and Husby / Sørheim, so we must say something about what we're missing. But we come back to it.

9:15 Right Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - We have also had informal conversations when we entered the prison with the Head of Department G, which accounted for our activity on the Ila and Rosenqvist said something about the testimonials from history and that which emerged there. As previously mentioned, we consider clause (..) for the observation is important for our consideration. Health information is more present than the previous statement and we have had good access to it and we have reviewed all of these.

- Reminds the court that Gule has testified in court and said that the description of observanden is equal to the arrest to the present day. We also had testimony about politics, philosophy and psychiatry in court so that it complements the picture. The investigation had come very far since we began our work. Based on these points, we believe that we have reason to draw conclusions and answer the mandate and say nothing about it. Next point is customization.

9:17 Right Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - It's indisputable observanden that had media bans, and it was up to ... I do not remember exactly, but in the November-December once. After that, he had access to case documents and media. He has even said that he could respond strategically. It could imply that he is rational and adapts to the way most of us do. What we think is that he has not been able to modify their personality traits, which are more constantly present. The one we have seen is probably the one he has been.

- I have previously been built on 167 documents and DVD interviews that are also part of how we can follow developments regarding adaptation. So we see that the modification or adaptation, but we do not mean it is crucial. He political conviction are no different now than before. He has not changed its stance, except regarding the Knights Templar and a few other points, but we will get back to.

9:21 Right Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - Adaptation to custody with a high degree of structure - one could imagine that he had a psychotic disorder, and then you can imagine that the rigid structure that can he decompensated and become much worse. The other option that we use in acute psychiatry, shielding and may to some extent collective patients. You can have two outcomes here, but it presupposes that he considered pyskotisk something we have not done. Adaptation to the structure is what you see and suitable for dissocial personality disorder and that way you can say something about the same assessment where they decompensated and that gets better by having rigorous external moderation.

- But we do not draw any conclusion yet, but note that this can be viewed in several ways. The mandate is the same that was given to our colleagues. We regard it as documented, for the statement that Husby and gave Sørheim may possibly be necessary to repeat. Our mandate is identical with the current. Our starting point is that we are actively considering ideas and objections, that is, go through all the possibilities that exist, only that he can be without mental illness, and we'll look at what, and what he has. There is a differential diagnostic consideration.

- We have very much tried to consider all aspects of this case, also what has come out in court. It is essential that politics, religion and ideology should not be diagnoses, if they have their roots in the cultures or sub-cultures. It means not that there are sick people in these groups. One does not exclude the other. We believe that after the reviews have a good basis to come to a conclusion.

9:23 Right Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - So we have included the indictment to the court, but we do not need to document this further. Then I say something briefly about the documents, they have been sent electronically, which has been a great advantage. We have not needed to write or type of self. We have been given their own PC, with encrypted e-mail, in that there has been some speculation in this observation, as in the DRC. We also had phones that no one knew that we had so we could communicate with each other. It was the police who gave us these.

- It was the police who gave us that. And the police have been very helpful to refer to important information and reports of observanden. We have all documents available. I have already said what we have emphasized the case file and it will later appear in the proposal how we intend. When it comes to inquiries from others we have received quite a few from both - and without technical expertise. The experts have not gone into the discussions but declined courteously all inquiries.

- There have been examples of assessment tools that are not documented and diseases that are rare and many different things. The last point is 5.3, where there are two conditions: Road Traffic Act, and on page 32 and 33 are two small matters previously adjudicated. Then take Aspaas statement.

9:26 Right Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - Yes, and we have come to page 33, report from the Rice School. The think I have been documented before. [Judge Arntzen: It is at least mentioned.] It is discussed, yes. Maybe I should say a little more about it, then. It is a statement that says it has not been high absenteeism, high performance, an episode of a two-day suspension. It is also mentioned that he can defend himself intensely when he has done something wrong.

- I do not think, write the teacher, that he has a bad relationship with their peers. So I'm in Section 5.5. In case of a child welfare case. It is partially documented before, in two episodes of tagging. I quote briefly from the fourth line: "There is information from Majorstua police that he frequents a known tag environment. His mother is called to discuss this. (...) The boy has a more trivializing view of the message. "

- It appears that the child partnership with observanden and mother, and after a while interrupted observanden cooperation when he and his mother believed that the school had made other students know that observanden had contact with the child. The school thought it was observanden who had revealed that contact with the child, under the ethics teaching and the subject tagging was recorded. On the next page we refer to those from the child welfare and from the National Center for Child and adolescent psychiatry, I think it is well documented at least before the weekend where it was read so that we can move forward on that? [Aspaas get it confirmed]

- On page 36, case summaries from the clinic Bunes think I also have been documented. So we are on Clause 5.9 - police information about graffiti. There are two episodes, one from 02/16/94 at Skøyen bus stop and from 10/08/95 to graffiti on a street car in the Central Railway Station.

- And I read from politirapporte: Observanden was in possession of a nødhammer with metal tip, when he was arrested. Then there are violations of road traffic law, drink driving with a moped, and it is well described. The next point he has used the names and companies that he has had. Point seven is made by clinical examination Jørg Moland.

9:31 Right Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - [Judge Arntzen: - When it comes to the use of names. Is there any pattern? I see in emails, so he writes only under Anders Behring.] We have not seen any particular pattern that we have seen reason to stick with us. [The prosecutor Engh: - Looks like he is up to the impugned acts have used Anders Behring, not Breivik.] As for questioning by the defendant. This has been the key documents for us. WE have access to questioning from 22.7 to 23 January. We've also, as mentioned, been looking at the picture and sound recording, we have referred quite rich, especially from the first interview to a large extent by direct excerpts of documents. This has been reviewed very carefully by the police, and I did not intend to quote from it but just say that we have cited a lot, and then written a lot more minutes. The minutes are shorter, as there will be repetitions in themes.

- I jump to page 101, where we make an assessment of sound and images. That's the way that we have not taken the time to see and hear everything. We have seen and heard everything from 22 July and much of the interrogation of 9/8 and 10/8 to describe his movement on the work of time and put the DVD of the interview on Utøya. As we have seen parts and rewinded presented to make an impact on observanden change behavior along the way. I thought I'd document from the second paragraph.

- As a result, the hearing is conducted on Utøya immediately after arrest. The interrogation takes place in a house on the island throughout the evening and night. In the background one can hear sound from the helicopter carrying wounded and dead off the island. (...) At a time when the nation is stunned, conducting accused almost a convivial conversation (...), answer questions, but consistently avoiding to speak out on issues that involve other people.

- In some scenes he describes his political world view and how he even plays a role in it. The detailed explanation, and there is a bargaining situation where the police will know everything about any other terrorists. Accused submits a claim for PC. He confirmed to have carried out a bomb attack in Oslo and the shooting of Utøya.

- His statements about the fear that their own lives, appears to be understandable, because in the arrest situation could not be excluded that the police would fire shots. He is friendly and polite, the excitement that was reflected in the initial interrogations, seems to sound off. He appears never as sad or remorseful. He is cooperative and answer questions, but consistently refuses to answer questions about other people.

- This is for mentors and Personal rAs to have been involved in the Knights Templars, foundation meeting. His explanations can sometimes seem unnecessarily detailed and he lets himself be carried away and the digression, but can easily lead back to the topic. In some interrogation scenes he describes his political world view and his role in this. He appears with considerable discussion of the grandiose ideas of themselves and their political affiliations and maintains that the actions were necessary.

- Negotiations on benefits is a recurring theme, and the accused appears to be self-conscious and demanding. Reconstruction of Utøya, 13 august, also provides a remarkable impression.

- L handcuffed and harness wandering around the accused in the idyllic and friendly and says no sign of emotion, where and how he shot and killed those he came across. His appearance is apparently casual, but stands in marked contrast to the terrible events that occurred at the site a few weeks earlier. The impression that audio and video documentation of interviews give ... It corresponds to the status descriptions made by the prison health service and DPS Bærum at the same time.

9:39 Right Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - [Judge Arntzen: - Can you just say exactly what you mean by that sentence?] No, we are showing the hours during which the prison health care have examined him and given the status description. In the same period we have seen observanden on DVD recording and we recognize that they describe the status. It is not something that blows in our eyes of inequality. [Tørrissen: - I would note on page 50, in the first printing of the first interrogation, I will demonstrate from those who questioned him. "Persons charged testified before without any problems during the entire conversation. He appeared as clear and reflective. Persons charged with explaining all the time coherent and detailed. "

- [Tørrissen: - So it's just to emphasize that they have made an assessment of how he appeared during his arrest and first hearing so that there is evidence to the court. Otherwise, generally from the interrogations, it is just as detail-rich, which he has been in court, and there is not much of his political meanings which appear in the interview and he asked about everything from the planning phase and so on] So we are back on page 102 where we have discussed the manifest in item 9 The manifesto has been a source for us to know more about observandens views and to learn something about what is expressed in nationalist communities. I think of the articles contained and written by someone other than yourself observanden.

9:41 Right Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - We have not read the entire document. At the time we got the documents, there was a summary done by the police providing a resymmé. We have read parts of the original manifest. We have symmert something here, it is also explained in the court of Uppheim. I did not intend to present that summary here. [Judge Arntzen: - Aspass, read your book 3?] Not all, but we are familiar with the grand presentation of the Knights Templar, all in uniforms, rituals and these magnificent and grandiose things that are discussed in book three. This we know well.

- So if we can show here Uppheim testimony so we can move to 111, about the economy ... [Right Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: It is ... Economic conditions have been examined by a witness already, I do not remember the name right now. What for us has been important in relation to function and possible mental illness. We have a different assessment than the totals. 1, 2 or 3 millions does not mean much to us. When he went to Aftenposten early, so he bought and sold stocks with significant activity. It requires a bit, that you have hundreds of transactions.

9:43 Right Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - It has also been elucidated that activity was going on, as far as I remember was called until 2010, but with years as there was less activity than other years. It was an account he had created that showed a total loss of 340,000. As has been proven in court. In conversations around this presented a number disputans between what he says he made, which says more about his wish to appear.

Right Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - He has sales experience in various corporate and private firms. It is discussed on page 111 to 115 The court is aware observandens economy has been somewhat white, but less and less, he has earned. On page 111 is the equation numbers referenced his and it is known to the court from the testimony that there is less and less white income. But in 2002 and 2006 have been documented increasingly a black economy that is based on a business philosophy - which earlier claimed that anyone and everyone on the Oslo West could have evasion in business, and there has been a recurrent feature of him and he has moved on the other side of the law when it comes to business.

- And based on earnings, black, he has created accounts everywhere. To put into such a system and post it on pure black economy in other countries, requires kognetiv presence and that he gets into things. When it comes to his presentation to us when it comes to economics, there has been a tendency to inflate revenues. It tells us nothing more than self-exalted grandiositeten his. In the period 1998-2006, is no development of disease. He moves for themselves. It might as well be interpreted that he did not want to stay longer at the residence, and he spent much time on the sales of fake diplomas.

- He has a great capacity for work and can keep for a long time. Once he is interested in something, he does it entirely. It is also reflected in interviews, that is, how do, based for so long. It is also true that he can do two things. By writing the manifest and play games. Then he ran his business until he came to the point where he sat down to play, but it will come back to.

- Decision or trustee was not completed until 2008 after the bankruptcy that he had. When he had contact with the trustee, but that contact, it was not something that was striking in it, I have included an example in which he writes to the tax authorities with consistent content. There is nothing that makes you think that this is a person with psychosis. I do not know whether I shall demonstrate that letter contained on page 111 and 112 I can take the last sentences. "With full knowledge that the Tax Office would see the real income, I was sure that this amount is correct. The deviation is therefore my fault and I apologize for it. I should have double checked with previous employers to verify the amount. I will never make a similar mistake again. I apologize for this strongly. "

9:51 Right Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - It shows a bit about him and just after he goes running with extensive black economy that business so that his apology was probably not very deep. Most firms are proven in court. When it comes to credit card use it is intended to show that he recently applied for credit from different companies and there are many letters he has sent with information about themselves to get this access. It is in 2010 and 2011 shows the level of functioning that are better than one might think. 24/09/2009 as he writes, "hereby apply for kr. 25 000 in credit limit from Diners Club Norway. Hereby enclose pay slips for the last four months and bank statements confirming this. Encloses the repository list (capital of approx. 400 000). I can rest announce that I absolutely have no debt and has never defaulted receivables. Please contact us if further information is desired. "

- Allowing a total of 15-20 credit card companies (...) and self-produced pay slips during this period says nothing about function. Since 2006 he has fared financially, although he has lived at home. He has lived a good part of his mother, but has also paid her £ 3500 a month. He has a tendency to blow up dise amounts, but we will get back to. He has been based on norm-breaking behavior for many years, there may be a result of dyssosialt move. We will come back to.

- And we do not see it as ... we have proven in court that 3.7 million were in and out of account in any year. It corresponds to a large extent with what he has said before. It's not a grandiose delusion, even if he meets them with grandiose ideas. He shows a good writing style.

9:52 Right Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - There are 10.9 point that you have correspondence with a company - in 2010 - where he was ordering some stuff, and it is not as expected, and he will have this reversed. He threatens a lawyer, among other things, to get the delivery repealed. He is a bit more threatening in their letter writing at the time. But it is while he seeks credit card company for help and are friendly and polite.

- When it comes to travel, he had a fair amount of travel from 98 to 2010 with the main focus until 2005, and in 2009 and 2010. So one can say that it does not show how he was, but there's no reports that he has no exemption from there with trips including trip with friends. It is not for the exclusion of psychosis, but it is to look at the function level so we have not concluded anything at all, but we describe the functional level based on available documents.

9:54 Right Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - Yes. Then we are on page 115, Chapter 11 - The questioning of family. There are most of the interrogation of the mother. We have access to the minutes from six interviews, the first from 22.7 in the evening, and the last and sixth made 04.11. And I think that I documented a bit from.

- She described her son as wise, mature and sensible. He had decided opinions about things. He was a nice, warm guy, loves his mommy. He had many good friends and was a problem solver for others. Everything he did, he did 100%. She is puzzled that he could have done "something." They had a pleasant evening before, and there was nothing to put my finger on.

- As direct quote from the interviews .... "She had never been suspicious of him if anything. l at least not such an event like this. He was not the type. Why would he frame a government quarter? It was impossible to imagine a time. Why would he kill people Utøya? He was a farmer in Elverum. Now he has had it so good and been so excited. He had worked like a charm, was tired and happy. She said it could be possible. She did not understand it. "She describes other son as" calm, quiet, restrained ". He had a lot of good humor and humor. She had never witnessed aggression or anger.

- The interrogation comes into observandens professional life, and his mother mentioned that she had asked his son "if he should get a real life and not just have such odd jobs." She had also proposed to accompany him to the NAV for vocational guidance. She had reminded him of how good he had been and his good grades. She had been sorry for his vague career, and now had comrades passed him. She said that "there was something that hindered him." She had also spoken to him from time to time that he should find himself a lady, but he did not want to tie up and have children. The last time she had seen him as "a bundle of stress," and she thought it was because he had worked so much on the farm.

- So we are on the second interrogation, which took place on 8 september 2011. At this point, she read a lot about the case in the media. She confirmed to have known that his son wrote on a "history", but she knew nothing about the last part of the "Manifesto", which deals with terrorist acts, he had spent two years on the job, and he should have said that the book would be unprecedented in its kind and "Would be just as important as the Bible." When the book was finished, he went on the road and indicated that it was to promote the manuscript.

- She says it was a lot of mail to his son, sent to her address, especially in March and April of 2011. It was the most letters, but also packages. On his mother's questions he replied that it was equipment for the farm and to a project. He seemed resentful of the questions, and she had stopped asking. l basement and attic, he had saved various things, including drums and sacks / bags containing powder. l Since then, she thought that she was naive not to react to this.

9:57 Right Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - So we jump forward a little ... The last winter, his son have been slightly different, taking a little more to the right home, trained a lot and got great, tense muscles. He has been present, but he has been a different person. She thought it was related to "all the substances he had in him."

9:58 Right Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - She gives an account of growing up, we have taken in some other places. She confirms that he was arrested for tagging. On one occasion he was spotted by a neighbor when he climbed down a gutter to sneak out at night. She believes tagging ceased after he was caught by the police. Some years later, he showed her "piece" he had tagged in Oslo. She reviews elsewhere that his son complained that there was a lot of insects and "animals" in the house he rented on Rena, and she speculates that he may have had delirium and seen visions.

- So we are in fifth questioning, which is 22 September of 2011. She says that her son shortly before 22 July had complained that he was so ugly, and he considered to have veneers on the teeth. Although she thought that he looked perfectly normal. A little later, she indicates that she had noticed that his face was a little wider, and she understands that it has with steroid use to do.

9:59 Right Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - l interrogation are reviewed a letter his daughter wrote to her mother, possibly during the past year. A copy of the letter is attached to the hearing. The reason is that had talked with his brother on the phone about the compendium he was writing. His sister had responded to his brother's views, for example. that it should come to civil war in 80 years and that he wanted to fight against Islamic immigration and the takeover of Europe. He had also said that other activists who had tried this, had been killed.

- The letter states: "Anders is not going anywhere, Mom. He wants nothing in life except what he has done over the last few the years, plus what he doing now. When you gave him your phone after you and I had talked, he asked if he could call me later, because he was in the middle of a "discussion". I asked what kind of discussion, and he would not answer. When he called me back saying that he was doing a play. So apparently he runs with it still! This is not normal, you know, Mom! He is 30 years. There is no oppegaende people who are doing this food. "

- His sister thinks he is wasting his life with this project and said this to his brother, who had responded by hanging up. The mother had not seen the letter to mean that it should be about something dangerous, and she conceived her son remained a kind and nice boy.

10:01 Right Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - So I skip the rest. Recent interviews have special forensic psychiatric interest. It appears that the father was questioned, but the interrogation was not done. So we are on page 119, the questioning of sister. Where I refer a bit, I jump down to the fourth paragraph.

- Regarding the book he was writing, he began with this for 3-4 years ago. He always told her that he had various projects. They corresponded frequently online. She is naturally curious and have always been concerned that he is fine and will make something out of his life, so she asked a lot about what the projects consisted in. She never saw that there were some of the projects after 2006 and she nagged him about this, especially after she was never told anything about h va these projects were.

- The book as she understood him, concerned that Europe was taken over by Muslims and the history of Europe, but nothing more detailed. This was what it was in every time they talked. He talked about project 1, 2, 3, 4 and 5 She said that they talked about this maybe 3-4 times a year about his projects. It was during this period he started playing computer games. Prior to this he was a normal man.

- It was as if he fell into a "black hole" after he moved back home. He changed to another person. He told both her and his mother that he wanted to take a year off after having worked very hard for many years. He wanted to use the time to play games. After he had played for a while, remember that he said he had never been happier.

- She thought this strange to say for an adult who was intelligent and had good skills. She could not understand how someone with his ability to sit in a chair and play 24-7 and say that he was happy. She said he threw away his life after this went on for a long time with no end in sight.

- So I jump a few lines ... She was never afraid to express that he wasted his life with what he was doing. Friends developed at a point different from Anders in that they completed school, got a job and girlfriend. Her opinion was that Anders bit ashamed that he had not done it as good as them. He was perhaps too proud now to go back to school. She had the impression that Tommy wanted a career. l the time he worked she perceived him as happy, and it seemed like he did it very well. He never wanted to work for others, he would be their own leader.

- So I jump to the bottom of the page ... The witness says that he is smart, detail oriented, he decides something, he's determined, stubborn, articulating, easy to talk to, easy to deal with, he was always a person that was easy to have fun with.

- Anders less good side was that he always believed he was right. If he was wrong, he adapted the meaning he had to make it appear that he had been right. He could hear other's opinions, and often he was wrong, but he felt that his opinions were right after all. This was especially true topics such as politics, history, stock market, and like the topics he had studied much.

- (...) It does not differ from what is known elsewhere. Last paragraph, which still is a direct quote from the interview.

- "The witness is asked what she knew of an expert report which has been in the media. She answered that she was very surprised and she does not agree with the conclusion. If they just look at what he said right after he was arrested and what he has said to them, it may seem paranoid. However, the fact that he has lived a normal life during this planning, she sees not as paranoid. A separate this so well did she suggest that he could be a paranoid schizophrenic, but the witness admits that she is no expert in this area, so much sister ... Then there is the testimony of three siblings on his father's side. They met a few times ...

10:07 Right Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - The last time the witness saw Anders was 2 Christmas Day 2010, and it was a pleasant evening. Anders was the way he always has been, articulate, knowledgeable and it seemed like he reflected much. He knew much about history and religion.

10:08 Right Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - As a half-brother ... The witness said that the accused has been very interested in Islam and has almost had a kind of phobia against this. He must have some conspiracy theories, and he said he was for several years has written a book about the "Islamization and conspiracy theories there." The witness knows that the accused was sitting at home one or one and a half years and had no contact with other people, but suddenly he showed up again. The witness viewed the accused as "vain", points out that he once operated on the nose, unless there was something wrong with it, but only that it "was not good enough". There is also another of the same ...

- "Mentally speaking, the accused seemed reasonably balanced. Witness has not seen the accused has had mental problems of the kind, apart from playing problems and insulation 4-5 years World of Warcraft."

- In connection with Freemasonry, and witness statements to the police:

- So there is an interview with another relative, and it is about this with the Freemasons. "The witness told about Freemasonry and what it was all about. Both then and later realized testified that he (the accused) did not follow so much. He mixed together Freemasons, Templars and Crusaders to a blissful "mush" and did not understand what it was all about. "

- Persons charged has been on a "half" meeting in addition to the 3 shots and one member meeting. This was in March this year, and also when they met at Halvorsen's Tea Room. He was very concerned about the Knights Templar after which the witness stated that this was something completely different than Masonic words n. It seemed like it bounced off. In the case of detainee views on the Templars, he indicated that the Templars were to lead the fight against the multi-cultural. He did not elaborate further on this, and the witness was not interested. "

- So it's a bit of a woman who has been married to the defendant's father ... She has met the accused a few times to take a cup of coffee. They have talked about this and that and the witness believes that the accused was keen to impress. He liked to tell about their contact with the Masonic lodge, and how he would climb up the political machinery of power through their positions in the Progress Party. To witness sees it, the accused has always been keen to show his courage.

- It also included an interview from former stepfather, mother's boyfriend for a while. He has come up with general information about families. These are known, I did not intend to refer any more of it. Then we are on point 12 Shall we take a break until now or should we continue? [Judge Artnzen: - We are continuing to twenty past eleven.]

10:13 Right Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen - I may not be ready in ten minutes, but we'll take what we can see. "Cohabitation witness had said he might be a little strange or special. He had talked about disasters with a witness, and has said that last time she was on the farm, he said he was concerned in relation to Islam. He was otherwise told he had completed 3000 hours self-study in agronomy. "

- And this was a little before he moved on the farm when the lease was signed and a little afterwards. And then the document is questioned closest friend who has been here in court. He has described him "as one of my closest." On page 126:

10:15 Right Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - Then there are the observandens best friend. The witness explained that the accused was "normal" young people growing up and that he was the most social person witness knew. At the time, witnessed even more introverted. The witness explained that the SIM card to the person charged was quite crowded with contacts. Persons charged jumped high in the 3rd class and had convinced himself that he should start his own business. He had a large "GUC" According to Mark and not be part of the public. He thought that the best way to distinguish itself on the economy. . . Accused had a reputation that "no one should come and fuck with him."

- When asked if he was violent or ever was fought battles witness replied that this was a period before the witnesses were friends with him. He had earned a reputation as the "he's crazy, keep you away from him." Then comes the next ... l later, the last three years, accused started playing World of Warcraft. He isolated himself in the course of one year and he might witness met only twice during this year. They talked occasionally and the accused was completely engulfed by sitting and playing.

- He goes on about the problems ... This was the "eternal stubbornness" to defendant. That no matter what you said as the accused did not conviction. The witness explained that the accused did not think it was a sensible time to be in the military. He had a sense of duty that he should do it, but he delayed it again and again. He was the guardian of his mother, but a witness said that she did herself.

- So he told his friend about document.no and the like, and talk about mulitikulturalisme.

- So he tells of a quote he remembers: "Een man's action is worth more than a thousand who think." Over the past three years, the accused said this several times and that he recently "jammed in the track.'' He talked about Islam, immigration, he called it a democratic warfare h vor Muslims had more children than Europeans and that they in practice would be more. witness mentioned the number 2083. "

- "The witness was asked to describe the personality of the defendant. He described him as very, very stubborn. If there were a number of buddies who disagreed with the accused, he stood on his. The witness described the suspect as he basically was kind and considerate towards loved ones.

- The witness added that the accused never trodden people's toes, that he had had a high tolerance level for people. The witness was asked whether he had experienced some changes in personality or behavior of the accused to be the last time. He said the accused had changed in the years after he started playing, that he had distanced himself. Accused did not want a normal life or A4 life.

- Persons charged think it was a rat race all together. That one went out of town and would earn the most money. Witness thought that the accused was affected by this life growing up and that he found out that this was not so important. Persons charged never did things half-heartedly. He was very into things. He was very resourceful and clever on the internet.

10:19 Right Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - On the question of when the father of the accused had distanced himself responded testified that this was when the accused was a kid.

10:20 Right Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - As a point when it comes to the father, and when I do not know whether to be delayed, but it gets the right to take intensive actions. [Quoting from the report:] "My father had four children and no contact with any of these. (...)

- Persons charged was not a person who bore grudges. He saw the bright side of life until he fell to new thoughts.

- Witness had interpreted that the accused had isolated itself. This was not a proof that he was happy. Accused had always claimed that he had enjoyed the way it was. To witness he interpreted on the basis of his knowledge of the accused, he believed that the suspect isolated themselves to protect their loved ones. Not to drag them into it. The witness explained that the accused had not had any mood swings beyond the times when he's nest. This had been a few times, then he had taken a cure.

- Then there's another friend: The witness says that the accused boasted on his part. Among other things, when he traveled to Liberia, he said that this was to make money, not to meet the warlords. Before the accused isolated and moved home to his mother for 3-4 years ago, his ambitions to make money and start businesses. The witness describes the relationship between the accused and his sister, who labored, even if the accused would certainly say that they had a good relationship.

- It's ten o'clock in the half, taking a break or continue? [Arntzen: - Then we can take a break, and ten over half eleven.]

10:22 VG: - The court has to pause at 10:40

Agnar Aspaas and Terje Tørrissen has settled into the witness box again - six minutes before the court is after the break. Tørrissen will continue to recite excerpts from the interrogation of Breivik's friends.

VGTV instant - even during breaks. Now, just a reporter Siri Consulting attended the courtroom 250

As the right psychiatrist Synne Sørheim come back into the hall, she stops at the witness box to change a few phrases with Agnar Aspaas and Terje Tørrissen. Then she goes over to a dumb iron in the corner behind the prosecution counsel and assistance, where the players hang up their coats. Sørheim retrieve a shawl, which she tied around her neck. Several noted that it is cold here in the courtroom now.

All players are now in place, except dommerne.Bistandsadvokat Mette Yvonne Larsen just came back with two cups of coffee, one for himself and another colleague Frode Elgesem. Also Vibeke Hein Bæra have been out and brought a cup of coffee out in the cafeteria. Now Breivik was brought back into court - wearing handcuffs as usual.

10:43 VG: - The court is set.

10:46 Right Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - So it is questioned by a friend ... The visibility was very keen to make money. He founded several companies, but the witness does not know details. Then comes the information that the court is aware, the cutting of touch and movement. The witness testified further that the accused has always been very enterprising, and that when he first started, he gets things. The witness thought that the goal was to make money.

- Persons charged should have told the witness that he as a small boy used to put mustard in the anus in cats, and afflict them in this way. This thought the witness was sadistic and was provoked. Accused should always have been a "different" with strange opinions. He is an original screw, which has been active and had the ability to make money. He was also concerned for a period of strength training. He often skips the first hour in high school because he would rather work out. "Such was the accused, he could make provocative statements, often deviant in relation to women, political views. Examples of this are that he thought it would be a majority of immigrants in Norway within a year, and that today's political parties were not doing enough with this.

10:48 Right Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - So it's a new questioning of another friend page 130 It is a friend who has gone to school with him at Smedstad and Rice, and parallel first year in high school. They were good friends. Accused has always had a distinctive personality, according to the witness, but he has not understood that the accused acted in any special way when they were children. They were much together, and he was "like everyone else." So it is little known to the court, on the move back to the mother. The witness spoke last Wednesday accused the 20 071 1, and it was agreed that he and (name). would visit the accused on his farm this coming Tuesday, ie 26.07.2011. None of his friends had been on the farm of accused in the past. They had talked together quite normal, including the farming activities. Before that they had had contact in the beginning of May. Everything seemed normal, and it was a good atmosphere. Accused had been more social in the past year, and friends have had more frequent contact with him than in the previous 3-4 years.

10:48 Right Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - A bit about how he is ... l have also accused always appeared as a calculating and determined person who has always achieved what he wants with success, so when the accused said that he would become a farmer and that he was sure it would go well regarded testified that the accused should be able to even without that he had no experience before. The witness was convinced that the accused had put so well into this that he would have success in this area. "

- Interrogation of a female acquaintance and where is the last paragraph of the interrogation is resymmert. He has strange explanations for the choices he has made. It goes on the facts of what he has done or projects ekler like. Out of view. For example in connection with that he was in Europe and publish the book. She asked him where he would live and the like. It seemed that he had not planned anything. He's never any good answers to things. She also asked him why he was playing World of Warcraft. He said something that he had decided h vor long he would play that game and he would give up. You get sort of no real answers to anything.

- So, from an interview with the girlfriend of a friend of his. The witness has met the accused about. 6-7 times. She knows him as a very intelligent and articulate person. Although she thought that he was a bit strange as she liked him very much and thought he was nice. She perceived him to be very calm and controlled person. He was quiet and with it she says that he was thoughtful. She perceived him to be very comfortable and he always spoke with pleasant voice. He always seemed interested in the ones he talked to and asked them questions.

- Then we go to a friend who has a background from having gone to high school together in 1998. They shared the apartment at Majorstua with a few other comrades. Last time he spoke to the accused upon a time this winter. He was nice and normal. It was like talking to an old friend you have not talked to in a long time. Persons charged with trying to take the initiative to a group of friends were to meet, have a "reunion" so that ... No, as they had been once before. When they talked in the winter told the accused that he had taken a "steroids" and that it was completely harmless. If the accused says otherwise testified that he could behave like a Lotto millionaire, and he was very concerned about what everybody thought about him. He talked about the business end and the upper class. He wanted to be respected, successful and rich.

- Interrogation of a male friend, who has also been accused of high school. The visibility was not very interested in girls. He painted himself and spent a long time on hair and dress. He had strong opinions, was a little withdrawn and did not say much, but was perceived as a sympathetic, kind guy. The witness was told by others that he had been legal game and he just sat in his room and played World of Warcraft. In recent years, he was more patriotic oriented and interested in history, talked a lot about the Islamic influence of the West. Previously, he was more interested in business.

10:53 Right Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - It is also quoted from a woman who had children as a respite from 1981, there is a paragraph which may be on the side. We might not think it is appropriate to quote from that. It implies any person other than observanden.

- We go either to the girlfriend of another friend. He was very quiet at the party. It was he who made the drinks, and he was very pleasant and attentive. Later she met the accused was under a dinner. When he was very big. He trained and was concerned that he would put on, made no secret of his nest. april l 2011 helped the accused testified and his girlfriend to move. There were no witnesses reacted to then, other than that he was very concerned about their appearance. He was also supportive to her boyfriend and seemed like a very good friend.

- There is an interview with a colleague from diploma production. The witness believes that the accused had a good income from production. He has in its manifesto written about when he made his first million, and the witness believes that it stemmed from that entity. The visibility was very carefully in relation to the work to be done, and was concerned that things would look authentic. He also went on one occasion, probably in autumn 2003 to London to buy the paper for documents that were produced. As the witness knew that all payments going black, and did not feel comfortable with this

10:58 Right Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - Then comes a document, a witness NN, Freemason. It actually describes a little about the Masonic order, and so it is not necessary to refer from it. So the questioning of a person associated, it was thus that one should not mention other either, and it shows a correspondence with the witness here that the accused is seen as someone who writes well. He has an e-mail contact with him in February 2010, where he offers his Facebook contacts to spread the message. It is included here to demonstrate that there is an adequate representation of the message, which (...) He proposes to build a great Facebook account, so you can use this here, vedkomne refuse. He writes still document.no, "but so many of my comments have been censored, it depends how long I bother."

- Then there is a witness who discussed on a train ride with Breivik ... Persons charged with a lot of talk about "the danger of Islam." The witness had seen the discussion as quite "heavy". He made objections to defendant's view, pointed out that many people have been killed in the crusades and in the name of religion. He was also told that he had participated in the first demonstration against the Vietnam War in Los Angeles in 1964. "The debate had a philosophical character interspersed religion.Vitnet understood that the boy was clever and very well read, but well read in literature that the witness had not interest. The witness was also a feeling that he heard the witness had to say about "Jesus and the love and caring and stuff." He was like a little "retreat" in chat. When the train reached Elverum would get off the train. The boy, however, held him back by grabbing him. The witness could not get off the train.

- A neighbor of Rena says that he met the accused ... The witness had contact with the accused in June and July 2011 to buy grass on detainee property. The witness came to realize that the accused did not know about farming, and he regarded him as a romantic or dreams.

11:04 Right Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - That's what we have properly referred to the declaration from the witness interrogation of some acquaintances. And when we go on to obtain health information and komporenter. The first thing we have taken, is given by Sørheim and Husby. It is through reading, but we will still ask the Court to note the following. It is the last three paragraphs on page 138 and the first paragraph on page 139 We had thought that we should read up, because we have some of the materials that our colleagues have been applied. It's not that we have incorporated some of it. [Arntzen: - When you read the statement?]

- The statement we got from the police case information. [Aspaas: - we read the end of our conversations with observanden. Approximately 10 March or around there, when we discussed the declaration observanden. It was important for us not to read the statement until we had made independent assessments.] [Engh: - When was the observation completed?] [Aspaas: - 21.3, it was concluded.]

11:05 Right Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - Yes, did you mean the observation of Dikemark or our conversations? [The prosecutor Engh: - Now I thought Dikemark made on Ila] There were 20 or 21 March [Tørrissen: - 21 March as far as I remember. The talks were 14/3 and then we started to look at the first statement] [Tørrissen: - When we consider it as evidenced by the declaration. Then there are the next on page 143 and that's when prison services test at Ila]

11:07 Right Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - And here it will be referred to a statement from Dr. Rosenqvist, it's taken a ressyme of helseppplysningene. We should not read much from these, for it is documented in part to the testimony that has been made, but we note that he is rated by kompitent personnel, the last day we have had (...) There is generally no changes in how he is busy throughout the period. Mentioned in a shorter period is reduced spark of life and morale in August. He is not depressed, but adapts to the special rules he has been subject. [Arntzen: - Tørrissen, where did you read from now?] This is a general description of the document.

11:08 Right Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - Rosenqvist has not documented the health information, so she gave a different explanation. So perhaps we should refer a couple of points.

- Observanden appears polite and accommodating in the conversation. Is not an expression of wanting to hurt themselves. The first consider ingesting went much on suicidality. 27.7, he was employed by the prison doctor (from the given hospital), we can quote a bit from ingesting consider: "He makes eye contact. He speaks eloquently Oslo dialect and phrases are related. There is no sign of incoherent language. In an indictment is not evidence of latency, ie delay.

- He gives a good formal contact. It felt no emotional connection. Mood is stable throughout the conversation. Mood seems somewhat excited, almost cheerful. He explains that he has carried out an operation. He uses military terms about what he has done and says that he is part of a network with the same attitude as he has. When asked if he hears voices that others can not hear the answer he was negative. It is as described above, no signs of it in terms of the conversation stops for him to be able to listen to the voices would say. Asked if he feels sadness or depression, he denies it. He says that he does feel at ease.

- He explained that the department has been told that he would take his life. He wonders how we got it from. He is fundamentally opposed suicide and will not do it. My assessment of the prisoner's mental condition is that he does not appear depressed. There appears no evidence of hallucinations in psychosis, in particular, he is not driven by inner voices. At my exam today I find no signs of depression or psychosis. The risk of suicide is considered to be low. "

- Then there are a number of points that are not quoted. It is very much on suicidality and he is considered to be suicidal for all calls.

- Appears oriented to time, place and person, but are not asked explicitly about this. Well dressed in polo shirt, good hygiene. Good formal contact, shaking hands, is polite and articulate. No emotional connection. Neutral to slightly improved mood, smiling and being a little more involved when he talks about his plans. Indicates no depressive thoughts or suicidal thoughts. He has plans for the present and the future because he wants to prepare for court proceedings and the judgment. When asked what he thinks will happen next after the judgment he replied: "Do not, take what comes." Rating: I can not find signs of depression or psychosis. I am considering the risk of suicide is low.

11:13 Right Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - Then comes the period when he set this life-spark in percent. A shorter period of a couple of weeks, he talks about this, among other things, 04/08/11 [Judge Heather: If we go back a little, it's the note from the doctor at the Ila, the prison doctor Haukeland. As far as I understand it is the same document as quoted in the report from Husby and Sørheim on page 70 So I'm sitting and are only partially overlap. Sitatetet theirs, does that work? The quotes are not identical, but ...] If it is edited? [Heather: - Yes, and if so, who has edited it.]

- [Judge Heather - I have not the document itself.] As I recall, it took us into his assessment in exstenso, but I wonder ... [Aspaas: - We could have shortened it to save space. I do not remember.] The assessment I believe to remember that I inserted in extenso. [Judge Lyng: - The reason I ask, I perceive that there is a coherent statement until he ends it on the next page. You have not omitted anything, but it is completely different in the corresponding quote from Husby / Sørheim. But who is left out something, I can not see.]

11:17 Right Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - I am writing his review quoted and usually I take when "in extenso" because the first assessment was important to include all his mental status present. [The prosecutor Engh: - What part of the statement is not found in the next?] [Heather Judge: - It says something about if we go to Hysby and Sørheim ... [Lyng referring and mumbling to himself] [Judge Arntzen: - When asked how he has it in the cell is not. Is it possible you have dropped something and forgot to put dot dot dot?] It is correct that I have taken passages from the entire conversation but emphasized the psychiatric status presented, the other I believe was known at least for yours truly. I have the transcript of records here.

- [Heather - I think you have answered it. I just wanted to establish whether this is a quote directly from the document. How you explain it now, there are some sections. But it is not easy, based on the punctuation, to see what is omitted.] I understand. [Heather: - When I have clarified that it is not.] That is correct. If there is a similar confusion, I have the overall record here, so then we can solve it.

- Apart from 8/16/11, on page 145, new supervision of a physician. "No changes, but some dissatisfaction with the restrictions he has. No change in health status. "Otherwise no reports of depressivitet or psychosis in the prison health service notes. It is more consistent and striking confidence in what they write. I do not think it is necessary to read several quotes, it is consistent and they perceive that observanden similar. Then there are specialist health services at the DPS Bærum. An assessment of the IPS. IPS has been in court and testified, and there is included a few reviews and I wonder if the only consideration is from 9.9.

- 09/09/11 The accused was examined by Dr. Arnhild IPS after referral from the prison doctor. Here are some considerations, the only thing I'm going to take are: Assessment / summary / action: 32-year-old man who has made bombing of the government quarter and the massacre of Utøya. I called in to assess suicidality and inpatient needs. He has no suicidal thoughts, does not appear depressed or anxiety affected in any way, does not cover, he has no previous suicidal attempts, and therefore considered suicide risk as low.

- There appears no signs of psychosis such that there is no reason to put him into psychiatry. Although he says that maybe it will be different according to the judgment with regard to suicidality, but he believes the probability is small since he has been prepared long for what might happen in the future, that he has trained himself to be alone among others He has a perspective on the relation decades. when his surgery will be recognized by many in society, which is enough to protect him in relation. suicidality. The political beliefs of his are extreme, but I consider them not reality bursting in the psychotic sense based on my knowledge of what is common ideas of the right extremist groups, Islam as the external enemy and most politicians and journalists as the internal enemy that must be fought to save the nation. He seems able to see that others will perceive his extreme attitudes.

- It seems that he thinks that his role in the development is important, but not that he is an essential person in the development, cf. statement that he sees himself as a foot soldier. He thinks it's okay that I come and talk to him once a week because he bored a lot and think it's nice to talk to people. In agreement with the health department I meet him weekly for some time ... Otherwise, there is general information.

- Otherwise, it describes what they have done, and it has Flikke explained in court. We go further and to page 153, and then I read some from a psychologist specialist Erik Johannessen, although he has explained this in court, this is more a statement.

- So I go ahead and page 153 .. Then I read a little bit from a psychologist specialist Erik Johannesen. The patient is awake, alert and oriented to time, place and situation. Good formal contact. Polite and well groomed. Limited metered and emotional contact. The patient exhibits a neutral mood, smiling at times and explains to him that this could be a defense mechanism. The patient smiles even at times when he understands that I'm looking for possible psychotic symptoms, eg. questioning of the patient's ideas about the mind reading or experience of voice hearing.

- It appears the call no evidence of positive psychotic symptoms in the drift of thought disorder or hallucinations, and the patient's delusions are difficult to assess whether the psychotic contingent or as a result of extreme ideological positions and / or anchored in severe personality pathology features. When it comes to the patient's thoughts that he has influenced the world's stock markets through its operation may be considered as a possible grandiose delusion. However, it is difficult for the U. H to determine that they are psychotic contingent as they can be consistent with the developmental disorder and / or pathological personality traits.

- The patient, at least apparently, also shows the ability to refine some of his performances also speaks to the patient currently have an active psychotic disorder. The patient appears rigid and stuck in his extreme political views and understandings, but show more flexibility and willingness to moderate their views as non-political topics discussed. Should the patient be suffering from a paranoid schizophrenic, it will then be an atypical variant U. H have no knowledge or academic qualifications to identify or investigate within the existing framework.

- The patient denies the conversation suicidal thoughts or plans when he is motivated, and focused on, to conduct the trial. He sees that much of what he wishes to present will be considered highly offensive, including To wear a uniform during the trial, but claims to have no desire to violate the victims or their families unnecessarily, but rather be presented with their political message.

11:26 Right Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - [Arntzen: - Can you explain "pathological personality traits." What refers to such a description?] If you have a personality disorder. Pathological means illness, failure or disruption. Otherwise, Johannessen reported on their investigations in a good way. It would be unnecessary to refer more from it. It was conducted a test called the MMPI II, it is also explained. It is regarded as little valid, because observanden replied strategic questions.

11:26 Right Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - And then I will only document of 160, the conclusion on the MMPI:

- The patient is in a situation where the need to present a good frontage is important. How conscious patient is in the role he has played and presents to the outside world, and whether he has a very low self-knowledge is still difficult to assess, and seems to vary depending on how the material can be threatening for the patient's elevated self-esteem. MMPI protocol provides no evidence that the patient has an active psychosis issues. Given the low validity considered MMPI protocol is not reliable. And the interpretation of the clinical scales is therefore considered inappropriate. "

- Then there are 14.5 points, assessment of Randi Rosenqvist. We have written a resymme of her three documents, there is nothing further to add beyond what Randi Rosenqvist himself said.

11:31 Right Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - [Tørrissen: - When we come to the compulsory observation, since taking over Aspaas] When we were appointed in January, I contacted the court to discuss this with compulsory observation. It turned out that it was already reasonable raised from other sources, I think it was aid lawyers. We supported it because we felt we had to use all available means to go through the broadest possible case there is a difference between calls and days of observation. Calls will be focused and structured, can sometimes seem provocative but an observation in a hospital-like environment will include daily interaction situations and unstructured random gatherings that will be different than a conversation. And we would also have the opportunity to how observanden reacted in the wake of calls for fatigue, anxiety or specific reactions. It gjleder the police interrogation that took place during that time.

- We had our last conversation in the observation unit on Ila. Then it was 3-4 staff present when we had our last calls to observanden. They were joined by what we asked for, including the last conversation in which he was forced ... it has been said that we grilled observanden on key assessment topics, including the Knights Templar. This has been reviewed thoroughly by Dikemark team, so I do not think our side needs to review it further. Is it okay if we scroll forward? During the meetings we signified our perceptions, we discussed our findings. It was only in the closing meeting that there was no transparency between us about what we saw.

11:32 Right Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - So when I jump to page 181, where we ... [Engh: - Prints from the health service from Ila, when did you get those?] [Aspaas: - We got the consent form 17.2, and did it very quickly after that. Asked the administration if the information could get to the next meeting. The same with Randi Rosenqvist, which we got later. DPS Bærum even later, for which it was written.]

11:36 Right Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - When we are at the bottom of page 181 Chapter 16 where we discuss the history, ideology and politics. The experts stressed that they have no special expertise when it comes to history, political ideologies and terrorism. It has, however, based on general knowledge, had to deal with these topics to respond to the mandate. Observanden have the police and the experts advocated a political ideology that is seen as highly aberrant and unacceptable by the Norwegian society. The ideology is further elaborated in his "compendium" or manifest.

- All political parties have made clear distance from his thoughts and attitudes, not to mention the actions he carried out 22.7. It is also well known from news sites and from the experts visited the existence of political subcultures that joins the extreme political ideas that observanden have advocated. "Gates of Vienna", "blaat.net" and "document.no" are examples of this, as we have seen and read in conjunction with the observation. Also dossier contains interviews with people who largely share observandens political views. l care he receives a steady stream of sympathy from mind traps. Examples are cited in discussions with the experts. Similarly, there are political and religious subcultures with attitudes that differ greatly from observandens attitudes, but who, like observanden, professing revolutionary and violent means to achieve through their mind. Norwegian ML-movement at 70 and 80 century is an example of a small political group that supported the "armed revolution".

- However, as we see it, no tradition of using psychiatric diagnoses in people with ties to extremist political groups, unless they also have other symptoms of a diagnosable mental disorder. 22. July issue has triggered the professionals in history and politics have written articles that illuminate observandens attitudes as expressed in his manifesto. Among other things, include Professor Øystein Sørensen University of Oslo, which we have read. The experts will follow with interest testimonies from relevant professionals who can shed light observandens ideologies and political views during the trial. At the same måtehar we have assumed that we have professionals description and analysis of nationalist ideologies and institutions in general, including subcultural forms of communication, using effects, uniforms, greetings, etc.

- When we are on our investigations of observable candidate. (...)

11:37 Right Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - [Judge Arntzen: - Tørrissen BRAZZY might come, but the letters are filed, whether there is voldsforherlighelse there?] I've read them on tape, so there is verifiable information.

Right Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - When we were appointed on 13 January was the situation that he did not want to talk to us and there was a legal process surrounding the appointment. We used the time to put us into documents, interrogation reports, mandate and witnesses, and family networks and information from his early years. So that when we came so far to the conversations we had that knowledge. Then turned the situation that came to a good agreement for the conversations that took place at Ila. There were so we got very convenient access to conversations that took place in a chat room in the same wing that has observanden cell.

- There he was brought into the handcuffs he wore all the time: He was sitting with my back against a window. We sat on the other incumbent of the table, and there were always two officers in the room. He was informed of our mission, which he knew well from before, from the previous experts. He gave the first interview with Tørrissen consent to the collection of health information. It was made a requirement of the observanden of sound recordings. It's something we had never done before, and nothing we know that colleagues have used.

11:41 Right Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - We had begun to discuss it himself, partly because we saw that there would be many calls and because it could become necessary documentation afterwards. We obtained digital recording equipment, and it was recorded the calls that were placed on a memory pen and picked up by the defenders. When we began our talks, the talks of konferanseart. We waited to discuss our clinical impression until we had formed each of our picture of him. We began to discuss our observations. What he says, this was strange, we must find out.

11:43 Right Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - Tørrissen had five calls alone and I have four alone. At the end of the period we had two joint calls. Altogether there were 37 hours that he has spoken to us. On page 183 it's taken a ananese ie background history or background information. It was obtained from observanden during our conversations and the character down, it is included here, but also taken in and run in with the other information in the case. I think most of what is in ananese chapter has been documented before, but I thought I would dokumentre from page 185 that observanden have told and that is evident elsewhere. Last section.

- L 5/6 class formed observanden along with several friends, a gang that called itself "Skøyen killers." They made "shako-weapons", I must admit that I do not know what it is ... They wore headbands, listened to hip hop music and glorified gangster rappers ideals and mentality, ie antiautoritære and negative attitudes. The gang was "sucks to others," appeared dominant and threatening, but not directly violent. He believes this environment laid the foundation for later gangs at school.

- At school, he was still residing in the hip-hop crowd, and there was to know the status of dangerous criminals Pakistanis, as members of the A-and B-team. He realized, however, eventually the environment he frequented in the implied risk of ending up with crime and substance abuse. It was thus that he eventually "embraced bourgeois values." He was expelled from the gang of 8 class, which he subsequently has been happy. After he had left the hip-hop community, he felt a former comrade, shall we say a friend, wrote disparagingly of him in the school yearbook, and this became an issue among some others. Observanden felt the need to restore his honor.

- He contacted his former comrade, friend 2, which acted as a sort of patron of the buddy 1 He asked two of his permission to "Christmas pig" buddy 1 2 said only that he wanted to make sure that this would be reciprocated, but changed his mind and said he would not put up the case. Observanden then sought out fellow 1 and beat him up, while a companion derived his friends. The attack should not have caused visible damage, and a friend observanden and 2 resumed their friendship. This will be the only case of violence observanden conducted prior to 22 July 2011.

11:47 Right Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - So we are on our specific conversations. Tørrissen began 17 February. He explains this later. My first conversation took place on 18 February. In conversations, it was so that I for my part, began relatively open and let the observant speak. He talked a lot and detail about several topics. Eventually I took more initiative to shed light on various topics and in the last conversations I was and we are more confrontational in key assessment points, especially that which deals with psychosis.

11:48 Right Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - In the first call was observanden keen to say with an exact time that we did not need to fear him, he had never been violent, over a window of three hours. He discussed this with the fact that there should be experts with expertise in political violence, men and a psychologist. [Engh: - That one of you should have been a psychologist?] Yes, that one of the experts should have been a psychologist. That it should have been appointed a psychologist rather than one of us. He preamble about the mental techniques had learned to cope with fear and control your emotions. As he has said a lot about before.

11:49 Right Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - He then tells about the mental techniques used by both militant Islam lard and nationalists, to repress emotions, especially fear, so you should be able to carry out violent actions. When using these techniques will affect the whole spectrum of emotions, and you are "avemosjonalisert." What we have heard before ...

- On the next page, on page 200 in the middle of the page, so we ask him about how he has it now. He said he felt it was better when he got access to media and movies. He receives many letters and even hate mail and declarations of support that he wanted to repent. Eventually he receives only the declarations of support from other countries. And he responds to the requests as far as he can.

- He tells of imprisonment appear in court, that he played a play and that his statements that he should make war cross with three swords and should be released, was not meant seriously. His radical utterances are aimed at a few, while most do not realize it. He compares himself with people like Mullah Krekar, who speaks to a small group when they are in court, "the shower". Observandens target its expressions are nationalists who he wants to influence to be "militant nationalists." "I am an opportunist and using the media." So he tells her background, which we have heard a lot about ...

11:51 Right Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - He indicates to have had much contact with friends in kindergarten and at school. He mentions particularly the friendship of the Pakistani-who "had an impact on my worldview. Norwegian men are feminized, passive and afraid of conflict, while minority youth are taught to be proud of their culture and religion. They are unlike the Norwegians sense of "alpha males", which also observanden have been attracted to, that he is not afraid to say what he stands for, although it is controversial. At school one is taught to not be proud of their ancestors, which is represented as farmers who raped maids, crusaders who oppressed Muslims, etc.-despised Norwegian values ??and culture. This triggered observandens interest in learning about Norwegian values ??and history, and led to his "culture embraced conservative values."

- Then he tells about this hip-hop community and Muslim friends. During the discussion of his background observanden says that there are two conditions that are particularly important to understanding his development, his attraction to the values ??that alpha males represent, as well as negative experiences with Muslim gangs. In response to negative encounters with Muslim communities, he joined the FPU in the 9th grade.

- Towards the end of the conversation, we took this up with his bodily health. We asked if he would go with the scanning of the brain and so on. He replies that he sees it as an insult and an insinuation that his ideological principles is due to a brain injury. He has never heard of that militant Islamists are subject to this type of examination. He compares the request for imaging with having to charge the same survey of Labour Party Members of Parliament to look for damage, since they have allowed the immigration of Muslims to the country. He adds that it was meant as a joke.

- So it's my next call 2/22/12. Observanden immediately take the word, want to add a bit from the previous discussion about the environment he frequented ii 5/6 grade. He takes up a lot about his background, which I did not think to much about here ... I take up some courses and asking him to talk about the youtube video and uniform. He continues on the titles. One asks for the title of "Justiciar Knight." He says that this is a title he has made, also a proposal on his part and that it is composed of the words "law man" and "knight", meaning "a knight who has the law on their side." He adds that there is a long tradition of revolutionary organizations, titles, and he mentions an example from the Red Army Brigade.

- You ask him why he used the title "Justiciar Knight" when he presented the 22 July, including whether it was wise of him to use a title that only he himself knew. He answered that it was an incorrect calculation. The idea was to promote what he has described in the compendium, in order to recruit and sell a message to potential sympathizers. But he realizes now that he should not have mentioned it.

- He stressed, however, that the individuals whom he has described in KT really exist, regardless of whether the police have managed to identify them or not. He should have used other words, KT introduction, said that it was about a few individuals who wanted to connect with KT's identity. This is to be associated with KT also meant a need to establish a distance to the National Socialists, when he disagrees with them in some areas. He reiterated that it was a tactical mistake to emphasize KT as strongly as he did while he was on the other hand, thinks that "all attention is good attention."

- We talk more about that topic ... So the next page. One asks him about it to put out over the rules of democracy, as he has done, what is the reason why he thinks he's entitled to it? He replies that he is a result of developments after the 2nd World War II. Actually, he would have carried out a coup with a couple hundred people, but it is not possible, because the PST would have discovered it.

- He looks at the Norwegian Board as illegitimate. 100% of the journalists supports cultural Marxism, therefore, Norway is not a democracy. He adds that he is not alone in viewing this in Norway and Western Europe. He mentions the actions carried out by nationalists in Norway and how these are due. conspiracy between politicians and the press is shut up in the media. One asks him what he meant by conspiracy, and he answered that conspiracy means cooperation.

- There is a resistance movement in Norway, he said. It is disorganized, composed of individuals, but is going to organize themselves in the long run, it is 100% sure. It is driven by the democratic threat. Then he mentions examples from other countries ... I jump to the next page ...

- He talks about prison meeting a short while ago, how there he played a role on behalf of a political movement. One asks him who he considers himself to be. He replies that he is a person of great integrity who want to save the country and his people. So does he square this with empathy and mentions as an example a Norwegian soldier who kills a Taliban soldier in Afghanistan, "the empathy or not."

- Similarly, one can question the American bombing of Japan in 1945, the loss of lives as a result of the bombing may have saved a much larger number of lives that would have been lost during a prolonged extension of the war. This is an example, he returns to often. But he adds that "Based on Norwegian values ??I uempatisk." Although he believes, however, that he has empathy, but that he suppresses it. He can get into the other's situation, but is he, and he sees himself as "Amazing sympathetic", which he believes that others can confirm.

- It is written draft of Ila, while I waited to be locked out at the earliest opportunity thereafter. My present status:

- Observanden appear neat and orderly, is alert and oriented in all qualities. Mood is neutral and without signs of emotionality. He is friendly and appears with considerable confidence. He takes all the time initiated the conversation and talk a lot and very detailed, but without showing signs of increased pressure speech. He may pursue a digression, but resumes the thread quickly. The language contains a number of foreign words that give the positions a technical character, especially when he discusses the question of violence and terrorist acts.

- He has a tendency to turn the conversation into a political rhetoric, which eventually turns out to be rather stereotyped. He is articulate and immediately gives the impression of having an ability level above average. He is calm and concentrated, can not stir up, does not fatigue. He often uses cent stamps to illustrate their points. Though he in many ways appear to adequately characterized the conversation of limited emotional contact.

12:02 Right Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - I am thinking in particular of being able to share a common experience with the victims in the case ... There appears no evidence of formal thought disorder in terms of latency, vagueness, tank tops, unusual associations or neologisms. He denies all forms of perceptual disturbances, and there appears no sign of reality shows flaws in the form of ideas of persecution, thought interference, unusual body sensations, psychotic ideas greatness or otherwise. When he pressed the ambiguities in its presentation, he shows no signs of being stressed or to decay, but respond rationally, provide detailed and clarifying information and trying to create relationships.

12:02 VG: - Arntzen Aspaas stop and think it fits well with a lunch break. The court therefore luncheon at 13:00.

1:01 p.m. VG: - The court is set.

1:03 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - We arrived at page 216 Elsevier on my third call. I did not intend to refer a lot from it. After an introduction in which observanden talked a lot about empathy, we went over to the actions complained of 22.7 and spent most of it. He talked long passages alone, with a few questions here and there.

1:05 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - explained what he was doing throughout the day and with flashbacks to what happened the last time from his rented house at Rena and had lived a kind of double life to friends. He protected himself against access there. Told this to crush pelletts. Where he points out that the Norwegian authorities have made it so difficult to make bombs, he was forced to perform a "shoot-based action."

- You ask about his presentation of the Knights Templar (KT), though it initially was exaggerated? He says it is a matter of a few individuals with a common vision and a desire to sell it. KT is a reference and the presentation of the compendium is a glossy picture. He compares with other organizations such as ETA, FARC, etc., which all have their ideological packages with effects, titles, etc. He also mentions Mullah Kre guy as an example, he sells an ideological package aimed at Kurds. There have been no new mental status. For it is exactly as before.

1:06 p.m. Judge Wenche Elizabeth Arntzen: - Aspaas, you can make any additional comments, that something happened to him. "It dawned on him that now was no turning back." Can you say something about what this means?

1:08 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - I took it that the idea had become more and more concrete for him and that by doing a physical step that Rena, he thought that it was much closer to a reality. Did you think if there was something supernatural? [Judge Arntzen: - If he reflected about having a choice and not?] Middle impression is that he has known he had a choice. He said he drove to the government building and that he was certain that he was able to turn all the way. But it has become stronger and stronger, it is my impression.

- I think that the "point of no return" was the last one hundred meters into the ministries. Then I jump to page 228 Conversation 3 March, at the time of the Criminal Procedure Act 167 so I took the conversation in the observation room where he had no handcuffs. The conversation took place at the dining table in the room.

1:12 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - At this stage observanden subject to observation by the Criminal Procedure Act § 167 The observation is carried out in a large room on the hillside, where observanden staying all day. Coffee were served and it was eating lunch in relation to the meeting. We visited various topics that I wanted to know more about Freemasonry, I was looking for is, is there any mystery that goes into the unreal and the close psychosis or psychotic? I asked him about humanistic values ??as part of Freemasonry. Then we built the story of the bombing in japen, how the 300,000 deaths caused millions of lives were saved. He suggested we have a humanistic approach, based on this.

- Back to the circumstances of the mother and that he was out at night. I asked him about the family and extradition in the compendium. He said he regretted some of this, and that it was based on guesswork. So we talked about cover his stories. One asks him about his cover-ups in preparation to 22 July action. He confirmed to have spent much time on cover-ups, considering if he were to be arrested by the police. Especially in periods where his activities involved a certain risk of being discovered, he thought much about whether he may be monitored. This was such at the time he acquired the equipment, weapons parts and chemicals. He did not rule out the possibility that customs authorities suspicious and alert PST. He also thought if the police could hack his computer at the time he wrote the compendium. If they had known the contents of the compendium, part 3, where the terrorist act described, this would be triggered monitoring, he believes. On one occasion in 2010 he checked his room and stalls in the mother's apartment, with respect to any surveillance cameras. He also had an experience 1:08. June 201 1, which left him wondering if he was undercover in the police.

- This happened on the way from Oslo to Rena. At this time he had switched off the car's daytime running lights due. testing of blue lights which he had acquired. On the road he saw a police car, and he thought it was strange that the police stopped him for driving without lights. A little later he saw a civilian wagon along the road. There were two men in front of the car, which had mounted three antennas. He thought that this could be a civilian police and that there were additional police officers on the farm, or if monitoring equipment had been installed there. When he arrived, the barn door open, and he thought that something was not right.

- He stopped the car and waited for 20 minutes, before he decided to enter. The house was empty, and he realized that it was the wind that had blown up the door. He struck down the idea of ??monitoring. He adds that "everyone has a healthy degree of paranoia", and this suspicion is essential to survive in life. He showed otherwise care in some situations. Among other things, he made the mobile phone at home when he span of Utøya few weeks before 22 .7., Considering whether the police followed the phone base stations.

- You ask him about his statement to expect torture after his arrest 22.7. He replies that he knows well that torture is not used in Norway, but he did nevertheless thought that someone in the police in this very special situation, to act irrationally when they saw what he had done. He also thought that it could be a small risk that Stoltenberg would push "to get something out of the bastard." Statements about torture was strategic, he says, an expression of "reverse psychology", an attempt to convey that he was tough and fearless, that "threats, torture and death do not scare me." Especially considering that the police would want to reveal the risk of attacks from other cells, it could be a small chance that they would deviate from the directives and use "alternative methods". To achieve dødsforakt by a seizure, was something he had planned in advance.

- We changed topics and asked him how he thinks it is to be observed by health professionals throughout the day. It's better than expected, he says. The professional level is higher, and professionals are more friendly and sociable than he had expected. It feels so problematic to be under observation, except that it goes a little beyond the possibilities of preparing for trial. But he will adapt.

- You ask him about how he envisions the future. He feels confident that the judge is going to regard him as a sane and that means he is sitting in solitary confinement for the foreseeable future. He will then spend the time to write political essays, three books on topics related to ideology, and to develop the compendium. He will also work to establish a European network of militant nationalists and "fight with the pen" for the conservative revolution and the culture war. He feels strongly motivated and excited to embark on writing for the trial.

- He does not think he's going to collapse, as such Randi Rosenqvist should have anticipated. He has sacrificed his freedom, and it was planned.

- It is made for a more normal setting, sitting around a table eating lunch and drinking coffee. It's a little more natural feel. Otherwise, it is the same as before. So there are two joint calls.

- Status is considered to be unchanged from before. Mood is neutral, he is friendly and polite, pouring coffee, sometimes jocular, without it being inappropriate. His explanations are detailed, but unless he loses the thread of conversation. He falls easily into a stereotyped political arguments, repeating phrases and examples he has used before.

1:18 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - 05.03, we have a conversation of nearly four hours. In this meeting, we were more confrontational, both about his stories, shares, economy. We talked more about radicalization, we have included in the presentation. Now I'm on page 233 He said very simply that he believes "militant nationalize" Now he says "we". More about the Knights Templar.

- He requested that the Knights Templar, if it is true that he has created a fiction. Observanden responds that his statements of principle can be understood in three ways: 1, as a delusion or fantasy world. 2, as a small point which he has blown up to impress and get to emerge as more important than it is in reality, or 3, that the pompous presentation actually votes.

- He confirmed later that it is option 2 is right, that he had an idea or suggestion that he blew up in the early interrogations. But this strategy proved to be unsuccessful, that he realizes now. Everything about the Knights Templars uniform, books, greetings, etc. must be understood as a base, a proposal by his side, which possibly could be further developed.

- When asked about the so-called "organizational meeting" in 2002, he says that this actually took place, but he admits that the starting point for the Knights Templar was "sad" and therefore he would connect the organization to a specific terrorist act.

- We pushed him a lot of this with the Knights Templar, and he will not comment so much concrete and will not mention others.

- What is important is to choose an identity and to fight for the cause. He compares the founding of the scouting movement, where he has been a member. The founder Baden Powel, designed on its own initiative, a standard for uniforms, awards, greetings, etc. There will be other competing proposals, but Powel won recognition for its proposals.

- You ask him about his uniform, if there was such a good idea to have this landscape with a view to possible interest by the police. He realizes that there was a risk associated with this.

1:21 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - The assessors ask him about his arrest on Utøya, if he really thought he would be killed after being arrested. He responded that his statement was because he would appear to be fearless. He also envisaged a lynching mood and could not completely ignore the fact that police officers would react emotionally and irrationally, or that the prime minister might have wanted to "arrange an accident."

- It describes the passivity he had the first few weeks after his arrest. I asked him about the detention meeting in February.

- Expert Aspa as return to prison meeting, discussed earlier in the conversation. Observanden confirms that he was nervous, felt that he was surrounded by people who hated him, including about 80 family members or victims, plus 30 journalists who have described him as "evil itself". He noticed their contempt through eyes and body language, as soon as he entered the hall. But he had on his "game-face" and emphasized across as confident and strong-willed. He felt he succeeded in conveying this impression. He was tired afterwards and thought about how he will manage 10 weeks in court. It will not be "sustainable" if he tries to act the same way as ... He must try to not use as much energy as the prison meeting.

- So a little back to the injuries he had caused. He thought it was about to end an even greater barbarism. He mentions this list he has mentioned in the law over violence in Norway since 1977. "7/22 is not unique, but fits into a right-wing tradition in Western Europe after the 2nd World War II. 7/22 differ only in terms of scope. "

- The experts leading the conversation into the personality traits, ask him about narcissism. He confirmed to have some similar features. However, he has been willing to sacrifice themselves, and it shows that he can not be a narcissist. He admits however that his "victim" will make him the hero of certain circles. It is reviewed each question from the SCID 11. It will Tørrissen into the future.

- The conversation turned on the observation by Husby / Sørheim. He believes that the experts tried to violate him, including in his discussion of the compendium, to see his reaction to this, but he could not provoke.

- You ask him again about the feelings associated with 22.7. He refers to what he has said earlier in the conversation, and he adds that the committee will understand this if they read the compendium.

1:25 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - Status is as before. He does not become irritated or excited when we push him and confrontational during questioning, and there are no signs of fragmentation of thinking.

- Last call was 14 March. There was also a common conversation. This observation had been going on for two weeks. At that time there had just been some TV coverage of the indictment was announced, and in the second section one asks about his reaction to the indictment.

- He answered that it was gruesome descriptions and "it is impossible not to be affected," but he had steeled himself. His answer is quite technical, and experts pushing him with regard to any emotional reactions. He responds when "I was sorry and had to relive the nightmare. I feel sorrow for the dead, "but that he had no emotional outbursts. When asked about the guilt he replied affirmatively, but said also that he has no regrets. Asked if he feels pride, he replied that in a way is wrong to talk about pride. He has a "dualistic view" on this. Proud to have completed an operation which he has worked for many years, but is upset that the action was necessary.

- He adds that it will happen again unless the government changes its policy. "It is sad." He had no discomfort in the form of anxiety, sleep problems, etc.. similar. after the indictment was announced ... And he adds that he has several years experience in suppressing emotions through meditation, which he still practices.

- We return to questions of deluded with "Knight Justice", he responds that he has done before. He says other militant organization; also use titles. We refer to the expertise we had read the report in full at the time.

- At the bottom of the page refer to the expert report by Husby / Sørheim Where he has suggested to have been told by a commander in London to "activate now". He acknowledges no such formulations. One asks him if he received any notice, or in the form of codes, to carry out attacks. He will neither confirm nor deny this, because he does not want the information leading to arrests.

- So we are quite specific. We ask him about his expectations of nationalist power in England and that this could result in him being released, also from Husby and Sørheim. He said that such statements are nonsense, but adds that one can not rule out the seizure of power from the right-wing regimes in some countries. The chance that he is ever released, however, considered "zero".

1:30 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - Then we go into other things .... As is to be regent in Norway under the name "Sigurd the crusader 2," as he should have spite against the experts Husby and Sørheim. He answered that such statements are fictional. But in the compendium, part 3, chapter "solutions for the future," he has written that the monarchy should be and that members of a future vokterråd may be appropriate as the new regent, but he did not mention himself in this context, "I have much blood on their hands. " But he has stated that he is a potential member of a peoples council.

- We ask about his thoughts on the deportation of Islamists and the "birth factories" to maintain the Norwegian population, if he really considers such proposals as feasible. He answered that the deportation of large scale has been carried out previously, both by Hitler and by Stalin. "Can we rule out that it could happen in the future?" He points out that other, eg. Geert Wilders in the Netherlands, has proposed deportation of Muslims.

- When it comes to "death factories", he has not spoken out so strongly, but points out that today in India, there are clinics where the surrogate mothers carrying the children of others.

- He does the alternative one of the five points on why he Husby and Sørheim can have him declared insane. So that the experts can be so affected by the events 22.7. that they can not comprehend that a man can do such a thing and therefore concludes that he was crazy.

- He assumes no utsagt that he has exceptional skills and that he had not been seen before 22 south July. He said he has lived a double life, but ran as normal externally. We turn again back to the Knights Templar. Now I'm on page 244, where he basically repeats what he has said before. In the second paragraph ...

- One asks about his previous statements to experts Husby and Sørheim that he should have been "exceptional skills" and be "brilliant". He acknowledges not, do not think he has been made special note of prior to 22 July. He has lived a double life, but has emerged as the ordinary public. He believes that before the 22 July would have been well described by his friends, but otherwise considered to be completely average.

- [Arntzen: - Do you have any comment purely methodical?] I realized that you were hesitant to take in ... [There are misunderstandings and Arntzen questions fall away.] [Engh: - There was enough in relation to IPS conversation with him.] I can comment on it anyway. We saw it necessary to comment on his statements that were referenced in an earlier statement to see how consistent he answered the questions. [Engh: - When you were told that the first two experts (...)]

1:37 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - We knew he had a conversation with IPS, but I do not remember how much we were aware of ... [Tørrissen cancel the] [Tørrissen: - It was I who referred and got documentation from helstjenesten and IPS. At exactly the point I can not remember now that we were aware of or has been placed on the statement, but was most concerned with how she looked at psychosis and other mental disorders. How they rated him. It may be something is not written down by the IPS said] Otherwise, we knew very well that through the first observation was challenged in interviews and at the end of November and December, when there had been a recurring theme.

- In the interviews, we have not referred so much from. [Engh: - The theory that they were revolusjonelt affected. It was just the statement I was wondering.] I can not remember what was up. We are at 244, second paragraph. A little on the observation that the foregik Dikemark.

- He answered that it is nice that there has been a welcome break and that he probably will come to miss the contact with people when the observation period is over. So we refer to a statement referred by staff 07 031 2 after a news program on TV about the indictment was announced the same day. Observanden should then have asked: "Will it lynsjestemning here now?" Observanden replies that he has not seen away from the emotional responses of the present health care providers, especially in connection with television shows on surviving and mutilated after 22 July. "I was a grip yourself." But he has not been afraid of being attacked. He also denied having felt vulnerable to hidden strategies, or "traps" from the medical staff.

- Not even to the experts, he felt something. One shows also referred to statements that he must have had thoughts that one of the staff were employed by the police. He denies having said this, but he has on one occasion asked "if I had thought that some of you were police - had you thought I was paranoid, then?" He says he knows that prison officers have gone through his trash and picked up shredded notes that are handed police. He has confirmed this and shows off a copy of the doc. 03,05,01,27 confirming that the shredded notes are handed over to police. I think it keeps me, and perhaps Tørrissen to take their calls.

1:40 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - As you know, I have had five conversations with him alone, and two joint talks with Aspaas. With these recordings, I think it has been beneficial because I can later see how the words fall out, how the mood has been, emotional outbursts. I have referred literally how a conversation may have elapsed. For small errors citations can have major consequences when one pays special attention to such a word. The aim has been to try to short hand down exactly how the conversation progressed.

- Prior to the first call, it was in detention meeting on 6/2, and although it was an open meeting requested the parties if there were any objections that I would get there, and it did not arrive. There was a brief incarceration meeting where he performed his short speech, and it was over in 20-25 minutes. It was not possible to draw any conclusion based on the psychiatric.

1:42 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - When he got into this war with a cross and a few other things. He subsequently entered on to whom and why he said it. The 8.5 in 2012, ie in May, in the courtroom, I asked if it was possible to have a conversation with observanden. I asked if there were any objections to it. The reason I asked if it was that when it was gone a week, I began to question: How is it possible to sit this way in a serious trial, and not give any emotional expression? Is he in a bubble, it has changed in any way since we last talked to him? Is he in a psychosis?

- I got the call and it was going down in the basement and lasted for about 20 minutes, this went through we have some issues about how the case turned out for him, how it turned out when he came to Ila, and some how he handled the emotional spectrum . I met him down, all four defenders were present. And I took up the sound recorder. Status Present were completely unchanged from before. I have left this out as a separate note, there was more to go through and see.

- But I can obviously do. A remark to the sound recording. We reflected the resolve that and found out that this was a working method that we wanted and it would be internal. We did not want it to be appropriate than others for the defenders, observand and ourselves. This should not be made public at any time without any of the parties we had approved it. We regard it as an evidence to us for internal use. The first prison meeting was not much to say.

- Then we call it 17.02. And then it's so that when we begin, we had informed about the psychiatric examination. It is described in the first part of the document. I guess that when you ask for consent statement, one must form an opinion, one must have a consent competent person in front of him. There I spent some time on. Can I request a consent to collect health information? If the person is psychotic, one must make the ethical considerations, whether it is correct. I said I may well ask for consent there. I regard him as a complete agreement on. From page 191, it is the conversation referred.

Right Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - I have certainly not been any major guidelines for what topics we should discuss. But it was important when the conversation turned into the policy, then I had to go back to inquire about parts rinsing elucidate the psychometric testing. It takes time, and we have to go through everything so that we have discussed the very questions. In the first call I did not except to hand out a form to him, SEL 90, which runs on a separate symptom experienced pressure. It may be paranoiditet, depression and so on, He would just fill yourself to the next call.

- There is no indication of his subjective symptoms experienced pressure at the time. Then we discuss a little bit because he is interested to know if I've read the first report. There, we say that we have not because we wanted to provide us our own impressions before we began. But we said we were familiar with the conclusion and some parts. It was impossible to separate after the debate was completed. Otherwise, we have not expressed ourselves to the media at any point on the matter.

- We understrekr that we want to write a completely new report because we wanted to make our own document excerpts. In the beginning we thought that we could borrow a bit from the previous one, but found out that we did not want to do. This is perhaps where some of the differences come out, we picked our own. Maybe we have omitted things in our drøftning, because we do not want to take the mother's call directly, as we may be able to reference more from. He is very concerned about the report. But we said we have to discuss other things. We will come back to it.

- With Aspaas he asks if we have read the compendium, and it is a requirement that we have read the whole thing. At the time we sit on a giant summary of all case documents, and it had been impossible to get through everything. I told him that we had the opportunity to read through everything now, but that we could track over time. He wanted to have the premise that the talks would continue. He accepted it. Regardless of how one would look at it, he would come back to the previous conversation in these calls also.

- He opens as follows.

- "O" stands for observand and "S" stands for the expert. O opens as follows: "You have been with you that what appears in the tax authorities, that's absolutely not the real picture then .. I served 4 million but that it does not come out of the equation. You understand that? Q: I have only seen the tax papers. O: It says nothing .. I had a network of accounts. The police can give you an overview. The previous expert ... I explained to them thoroughly how I earned my first million when I was 24 and 4 million later. How it was put up. At the time I did not know whether the police would get an overview of it, so I did not say much about it. but it has been confirmed in retrospect that I served 4 million.

- S: It is a fact that you have had transactions on Nordnet and that there have been some major money to and from, but in the end it was a record loss of approx. 340.000, - O: It says still nothing. For that I had over a million in cash and I have had several million in cash. One can not ignore it. I used a debit card, which was linked to accounts in the Bahamas to withdraw money over several years, and all of these income accounts. I sold when these pyntediplomene and erstatningstranscriptene for several years. l this connection I also had 7 employees. It did not appear in the other report. But the police have a complete overview of this. And they can confirm it too. What was my plan, what was the outside was that it looked bad, but in reality, as I earned as 4 million.

- S: I relate in such a way that it is your version of it, and if the police can confirm that it is okay. And if they can not get it to be so. The experts will not prove or disprove it and say for example, say you earned are not 4 million ... O: That's what's interesting, because it is one of the main argument of the Husby and Sørheim, as they call it the grandiose delusions. They think that I believe that I have been very successful when it is not true. And they have said that it is not true. The biggest, he was the telemarketer. While police have confirmed it.

1:53 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - I do not know if I should read more, but this show really is and how the talks have taken place. It is typed out in detail. I had thought to read more, but I do not know if it is needed. [Arntzen: - No, I do not think. The time is ten to two, I hope to be finished with you today.] Yes, but we're going to some harder stuff that we're going to have to spend some time. [Arntzen: - Of course.]

1:54 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - Also, we at the bottom on page 195 So we at the bottom ... Psychiatry Standen have no experience of political violence motivated men and there is a big problem that they have not had this course. They do not know how militant nationalists think, or how militant Islamists think or for that matter militant Marxists think. Then he mentioned that he would like to have a psychologist appointed and he also mentions that he should have had Japanese or South Korean psychologists in the assessment with regard to the concept of honor. "Psychiatry has a big problem with religion and ideology, for there are many sick ideologies or extreme ideologies, many are not aware of it. And as Bushido code, which comes from Japan, how to manipulate the mind to achieve its resolve. "

1:57 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - The bushido code-has remained largely in conversation with us, as he perceived it (...) And I take up this with bushido many times during the conversation and eventually I go on Wikipedia on the internet to see what it is. It has its historical roots and there are many principles to be honored and all that, but he may have made their own version and interpretation of this. We may discuss it later. Then he talks about ideology and that such environments are characterized by attitudes. He will be returning to Gates of Wienna, documet.no and Blue, etc. Yes, it is also a briefing on pre-assessment with Dikemark, and he looked forward to the observation.

- He is interested in that we have long conversations, so that we soon will be finished with the investigation. My conversations lasted from 2.5 hours to 5.5 hours. It's very much. Enduring a long study is very demanding. Both for those who do and those who will respond. So we ask why he will not talk to us, he's afraid we'll write the same as the previous ones.

2:00 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - So it comes in on a little around the theme that he did not want to have conversations with us then. It is that he thought we were going to write exactly the same report. It was from the first call. When it comes to mental status present, I wrote it after I wrote this summary. It is not so easy to write resymme of 23-hour call. In so many hours there are a lot of information that can not be written down in the declaration. I began to write the states after the first meeting and there was no significant change, but you enter on multiple items.

- This is solely an editing purposes so I decided to write a complete psychiatric presence of all the team we had visited. It can be said is a weakness that you can not put it on paper with the same. But because we have documented it all on tape, I thought that it will go. Also going to call 20.02, and the same conditions as for me Aspaas, we sit on the visitors' and calls with the same security rules. On page 203, I take this up with MMPI, (...) and I will document the bottom of page 203 (...) This is typed:

- Observand: The only problem is that normally you get people allowed to prepare by making online simulations, in my case I have the chance, and when I am not on the same basis as others. When there is a universal test system, which can be learned up IOG prepare for, and I will also have an opportunity to do so, and if I get it so I can be part of a test.

- Expert: But it is true that one should not prepare for this. O: But everyone does you know, or most do, after the expert is trying to say that it is unusual, and the reason why people exercise is that they are competitive, but there are perhaps some idealists who do not. But I think that over half of them are competitive.

- Q: Who will be tested this way? O: As long as there is universal test, and most are preparing for, and I can not, we will not know it. My test will be compared with others and I will not. Media will be using this, if it leaked.

- S: Let's say you are in the normal range around 100 +. O: I think I is higher than that. I've taken a test before. It was an online test. Then I got 130 I prepared enough on it.

- When it comes to M R-examination and EEG examination observanden says the following: O: The reason is that you then suggesting that they have a brain injury. No matter what kind of politically motivated violent, then I believe that 1 00% would have refused. There is a tradition for it. And everyone would have perceived it as a gross insult. Then he says that Muslims and jihadists would not let themselves be test case.

- Then I ask: What did Husby and Sørheim about this then? Was it to exclude the disease? Coupled with the policy? He replies, Husby and Sørheim said you would look for any head injury, or that it would only exclude this, and they plugged it up to politics. They did not do that. But it's impossible to be interpreted differently, but they came with a requirement ...

2:04 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - He goes to the normal time and sleep well at night. His days are very routine. to, we review some of the things Aspaas have visited. Executions and torture ring. State of shock ... And it has ... And then there is one paragraph on 206:

2:05 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - I have to feel guilty that I did this with plan A. Q: What about the guilt o venfor family, others with more? O: No, I have no guilt towards what I do, but sometimes guilt, for example, when I had to fill anxiety. The guilt comes because I've said something stupid then. And he has a bad conscience above friends, whom he has ignored in this phase.

- So it's a bit of World of Warcraft ... The hero of his Richard the Lion Heart. He talks more about Bushido as a necessary part of implementing the action. I get into uniform, Aspaas have explained it, and I enter the awards.

- Some will say you have an unusually high self-esteem. Observanden confirm this. In order to understand it, one must be aware of terrorist organizations. AI-Qaeda make films to promote their view. It's just that I've made a video, a summary of the compendium of 1:02 minutes. You must be familiar with the Taliban, as I am inspired by, and I have copied them (movies, uniform).

2:07 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - I ask him some ideas of grandeur, regent and all that. He mentions Ata, cell leader from 9/11, and Timothy McVeigh, and saying he is on their level.

- The expert states that the 'here refers to empathy in the emotional spectrum of the individual, not about actions. Observanden answer: If I'm going to release me from politics, I am empathetic. I'm a sympathetic person, who care about those who are near me. I take care of others, and I think I can put myself in someone else's situation. Before you buy, then you have to be able to predict what might happen. He makes it with an example with his mother after it was completed with NN. I bought a dog to her and took her on a week's holiday in Malta, because I cared about her. I also had a good and close relationship with NN.

- As I continue with the policy and how he experienced Utøya ... Then comes this: Q: Have you changed the strategy? O: No, I have changed my angle. I need to change the presentation so that people can understand. I did not have access to the media and could not get the necessary correction. Then we come into the use of we. He says he has no trouble distinguishing the we and me.

2:11 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - Observanden shows off some of the letters he received, with declarations of support. He has big piles of declarations of support, hundreds of letters. He shows me a selection. The Swedish, German, Danish, French and Norwegian letters. Some of them I read on tape and printed. The core is that he makes declarations of love from 16 years old girls and letters of support from Swedish families. It is clear declarations of support to the ideology and the operation itself. The letter of unequivocal declarations of support, with the same political views as observanden. There are political cronies who have written. They use the same language and terminology like him. And some say they have been inspired by him and become more extreme, as a result of observandens actions.

2:12 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - A write about 2048, and then says observanden that he is perhaps more optimistic than him, because he is using 2083 as the year of the Muslims out of Europe. Observanden laugh a little when he says this. It is more like a dream than realism, but I hope that we get back Europe. He has also been courting letters and letters from the religious who want to convert him.

- [Judge Arntzen: - I think we take a short break when the call is finished.] It was here that the judge called for documentation. So I asked him to call in 20.02 to take with him a stack. So he did and showed an excerpt. Some of the letters are read onto tape. The core is that he makes declarations of love from 16 years old girls, from families in Sweden to support him. He gets a letter supporting his political views.

- I do not think we should say something more about it. [Arntzen: - When the court takes a break at half past three.]

About one minute is right. Now Breivik brought back to the dock.

2:35 p.m. Judge Wenche Elizabeth Arntzen: - Negotiations continue. Be so good Tørrissen.

2:38 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - We have talked at halftime about how much is necessary to refer on. The main purpose of the talks is to get the clinical impressions about the conversations that have been mentioned and if there are signs of mental illness. We will continue forward to what we have emphasized.

- The call from 02.03, psychometric testing during the talks, we will return to validity when we go through it. Then we have accounted for joint talks. We can go forward to page 245, and it is my present status psykatrisk. It gave an account of the talks and is provided at the end. It is a long psychiatric present in just over three pages.

2:40 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - Emotional contact is previously absent. There is a lot of stereotyping in the answers, but nuance and respond adequately. Intelligence-wise, we will return to later. He is in the normal range, there is no reason to believe that he is very very over or under. Emotion, affect, affective domain. There is nothing significant to point out. He is quiet and normal facial expression. It has been noted, eye movements in court, but it was not prominent in the talks.

- [Judge Arntzen: - Is there something about his smile that you have noticed that remarkable?] We have noticed that everyone else has done, he smiles at some places where it is not natural to smile, a little inadvekat. Observanden said that he smiles of something else, but to interpret something in that smile is something we find difficult to do. He has his motives and thoughts around this. Some major psychiatric interpretation I do not think I'll move on.

- When it comes to perceive things and hallucinosis, we do not find it. I can not delusions. What he explains, he does in an adequate way, I do not see that this is occurring, P-style rings, thoughtful performances, asosiasjonsforstyrrelser, even though you have to bring him back to the topic of conversation, is not that difficult to do. So it's not loose associations, which can be seen in the manic phase, or other (...). There is also no neologisms, that nydannnelser of words.

2:43 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - When it comes to negative symptoms as there are opportunities for effektmatthet, passive social withdrawal, lack of spotontanitet ... As I see it, so there is no trace here either. Personality wise, the design will come back to, but there is talk of a person with personality traits consistent with personality pathology in both the narcissistic and dissocial direction.

2:43 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - This, too, with a lack of empathy, we look at part of the personality-related design. Otherwise, he appears as a light krenkbar person. When we consider the talks as documented. Then it is over the additional calls.

- Then I switched to a chapter of testing observanden. It's part about it that makes it difficult to test a person who responds negatively to questions. And that means that we must have other ways to get around the problem. We have used a variety of instrument and SCID1 SCID2.

- The reason for this is that it gives us a systematic and makes us not omit anything from the talks, that we try to look at all aspects of this. I'll just find out ... when it comes to testing on page 249 and 250, I read not everything, but mention some points. 1) He answers strategic questions, which we knew from MMEI. 2) He believes he has no paranoid schizophrenia, but has made a political act of terrorism.

- He thinks he has consciously gone through a process to radicalize themselves and that in ten years, prepared for action. Observanden believe the political message is not his delusions. So the media ban lifted and he is the second report. He has been tested for personality disorders of Bærum DPS. It is considered that he was largely able to see through the tests, indicating good cognitive abilities.

2:49 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - And it creates room for many errors. (...) The reason we have used semi-structured interviews is turning all stones and gain an insight into all the possibilities to detect disease. The starting point is that we look at a observand as without mental illness. [Reports the Breivik forms filled out and that there have emerged signs that say he is mentally ill, with the exception of one case.] It was a form he can not see through and it was in the autism spectrum. I'll come back to later. The first autism was seen through the form completely and totally, then it gave zero validity in itself.

2:50 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - What we need to do is have a reverse strategy. Using all the possible known sources in the documents like family, friends, interviews and clinical examinations and the forced observation. A anne source of error we have discussed is what he says about avemosjonalisere through techniques and meditation. We know it goes to a certain extent, but the question is whether there is some underlying anyway. What they mean is that a person can have an empathy - that you look at this avemosjonalisering is that he gives us an explanation. There is a reason why he was seen as cold and chilly, but he is actually an empathic person.

- So if you take away this power emosjonaliseringen he will appear in his former self as an empathetic person. But we have to think through it, it is actually so that he has empathic abilities even without power emosjonaliseringen? If you have a basic empathy failure. We had to turn it over and use many approaches to check the statements regent, the Knights Templar, to check if it could be delusions. A person who undergoes such a situajson in a clinic or hospital may have a different starting point where you can answer honestly. In the situation we are now, it is important to be responding more strategically because it has implications if he were to answer honestly. In rettsspyskiatrisk context, it is not necessarily so that you get honest answers.

- There has been a huge time-consuming to do it this way. We have had to try so many opportunities to get answers. We must see that the validity of the test SCID-I is not tenable in itself, but combined with more tests, then we can say little, anyway. It is not in itself necessary to reach a conclusion. We think we finally have had enough clinical grounds, so that we can use the SCID-I as a guideline study. We report also included a number of criteria and the basis for the test, although some lapses because observanden here would like to appear differently in another situation.

2:55 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - SO there ar what I thought to say in general about the testing. We had briefly discussed this with the SCL-90-R. (He scored 0.08 for depression, 0.33 for paranoid and 0.29 of additional scales.) Observanden scored very low, he has neither subjective or objective symptoms pressure, such as sets, we consider the test as valid. So we go to SKID 1, spatial data are covered in the conversation, and we have actively asked observanden about previous statements. Asked him what he thinks and asked him to explain what he meant by that. It is perhaps not necessary to go into what's SKID. It is a semi-structured form.

2:56 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - I think I've mentioned most things. We can only say that the Commission has in newsletter number 18 that there is no need for SCID interview when you follow ICD 10 system. However, they ensure a complete and systematic review of all symptom groups. Then I think I should take from page 251, it is built up so that I have inserted the criteria under a section and on page 251 are the criteria needed to say something about a marked depressive period.

- Either a current or a past. Also, we have discussed in the section after the known information we have, and whether he may have had a depression? We can not see it. A breakpoint in 2006, can be interpreted as a negative withdrawal in the form of schizofrenisk Development. Withdrawal was a topic of concern, because he had locked his transaction at 850,000 dollars on a company in NY that was withdrawn from the exchange, and it could be a reason why he had so much liquid assets. Overall, we have not gotten out that he has had a clinical depression by a longer duration.

- Next, mania and hypomania. There, we had to discuss grandiose ideas as a symptom of mania, for example. We have also seen the Knights Templar and what he sees as its future role. We see no signs of bi-polar disorder, I see no reason to read the argument, really. This coincides to a great extent with the previous experts.

- We have also evaluated the symptoms caused by somatic health conditions or substance as the basis for the development of mental illness. We have also looked at anabolic steroids (...) He may have a withdrawal by 22.7, but it sounds off. Then we come to this with delusions, I have not quoted blåboka, but directly.

- And we have looked at some areas and then divided into the delusion selvhenføring that event or object or persons in their close circumference given a special or unusual meaning. How we have also taken into delusions of persecution, and a number of other grandiose, somatic, and other delusions such as delusions of being controlled, bizarre delusions, hallucination and auditory hallucination.

3:02 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - I allow myself not to go into the individual assessment here, we come back to how we have assessed the different symptoms. It is essentially the same reasons. [Arntzen: - In connection with the various delusions, it is their own abbreviations or quotes from the SCID-I (...)] There are only quotes. The same applies to the descriptions and what it takes to get fulfilled the criteria. We will argue psychotic disorders in the assessment chapter. In general, we found that we did not find such performances of any kind. So then we can move on to the 258

3:03 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - Eh ... Negative symptoms may be an expression of psychotic disorder. It describes the symptoms that katatonisk behavior, and there is no reason to believe he has had it. Then we come within the definition contained in the report: "With the weakness of the will mean reduced e VNE to initiate or maintain the targeted activities. To be clear pathological weakness will have to be extensive and prevent the person from carrying out several important activities. "There we have also considered the basis of the information is about the period. We discuss it.

- 2006-07, when it comes to gaming activity in a whole year, we believe that this is a voluntary activity and not a withdrawal. [The prosecutor Bejer Engh: - Can I ask clarifying questions? (Engh allowed by Arntzen to ask some short questions.) This is the negative symptoms as a sign of weakness of the will, this criteria to conclude on one way or the other here?] WE have had to consider paranoid schizophrenia. Negative symptoms are an important part of this.

- [The prosecutor Engh: - Especially this on purpose weakness] [Aspaas: - There are a number of negative symptoms. If it is present means that you can have problems with having some progress - to progress in life] [The prosecutor Engh: - Has it been claimed that he has it?] [Aspaas: - Yes, the weakness of the will can lead to withdrawal. That he does not take into something] It is well known that negative symptoms are described by Husby and Sørheim. That's not why we discuss it in itself, but it is a natural theme.

- It is completely natural. There are some other symptoms too negative, as the language of poverty that can also be present in schizophrenic, affektavflatning - no or few signs of emotional expression - which is about diskusjonenen emosjonalisering and empathy into failure. We have also discussed in the assessment chapter. On sdie 260, walk over to the criteria for schizophrenia. What we can briefly describe as F20 [and beyond], that serious psychotic disorders. (...) Then the SCID-I criteria for schoisofreni been included: paranoid type, type and Catatonic Disorganized type. Because other forms ekskuderes by itself.

3:08 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - We return to discuss this in the assessment chapter. It is clear we had to decide on F22-diagnse. It is an important differential diagnosis. One can imagine that the symptoms we saw was consistent with an F22, so it was one or more delusions as symptoms. And we also discussed in the assessment chapter. So there were several peculiar settings that we had to discuss with our colleagues.

- I do not think I'm going to say anything more about - these types of disorders are of forensic psychiatric significance. It can tell if you come under section 44 as psychotic in criminal law forstamd. We will argue in the assessment chapter on how we feel about that. So there are some problems with forensic psychiatric significance. Substance abuse, anxiety, and they have no forensic psychiatric care if they were to be present. We have not found it in observanden. Then we go on to page 264 there is described and PANS in that we did not find positive or negative symptoms, it is pointless to discuss it.

- Because it is a symptom score and he will naturally enough score very low on this here. But as the form and the system will get us to thinking. It may have a psychotic rank. Is it (...) and the Knights Templar really be grandiose delusions. I used it more as a checklist to argue for and against. Anything else can not say it. When I go to the script as I have done the same way. There has been no indication of possible suicidality. Could it be that there has been no depressivitet here anyway? SUICIDAL IDEATION has been considered to be low all the time and I do too, but I do not know if observant would have told us that, if he planned to do so. I suspect that he would not do it.

- GAF are discussed, and we do not need to score it, because it was difficult to use the scale at the time we examined him. There are major differences in how to score this, and actually it is a weak inter-rate reliability. Just under the hand we thought that he wrote, played and planned terrorist could place him low.

3:11 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - This type of work as observanden has done in terms of playing and plan terrorist qualify (...) Then you can choose to place him very high. He has made complex actions and planning. It gives little sense, so we have chosen to leave it out.

- Let's see. Also we come across to the next point as SCID-2 personality disorder. It's a point that, among other things, the Commission has pointed out that we must describe more carefully how we plan and if the general criteria are present. I refer first to the appendix on page 319, where the general criteria are included. The general criteria is a short version of the book of the law.

3:15 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - The specific criteria stated on page 313-318. I note that the criteria (...), that is, after then you have to sell it to the ICD-10 diagnosis. We put blåboka basis for diagnosis. We see no reason to use the green. We had to use the supplementary information, how he appears in court and how he stood up in conversation. That means he has a utsagt that is grandiose, we have listed a number of Examples are. When he says it, does he really grandiose. It is not just something he says. He appears, "I'm the best."

- The most success full militant commander since 2 World War II. It's not just saying it, but the way he says it. Wow! It was selvhenførende and grandisost, we think then. So we see the narcissistic traits. In the general criteria that the Directorate of Health, for their part, they will know how individetet behave in relation to those around him.

- Some of these conditions turned out early in the development of suffering (...). While others acquired later in life. Torgersen was on general criteria. Still ten months after the acts, there is some consistency in how you are as a person. Describes the personal change. One can imagine that he has a personal change. We only have information that is valid in the last few years. A change occurs in adulthood and does not have the same criteria as in the younger age.

3:19 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - We have, however, meant that this is not a personality change but the disorder. Personality changes may also be characterized by social isolation. Then one can see blåboka F.62 point 1, I have no page references here ... So when we continue on SCID-2 I have chosen in the presentation to add the general criteria for personality disorders that are reproduced on page 198-199 in blåboka used. We are asked to translate the DSM diagnosis of ICD-10. The Commission has desired that we should extend this with the general criteria and why he meets them.

- So, page 198-199 describes a part of this. A person who has a personlighetsforstyrrels (...) Personality disorder is considered as a disorder and disturbance, which provides both intra-personal difficulties and interpersonal problems, in interaction with others. Problems that communication can be poor.

- These features should be stable. For a person dissocial or narcissistic will rarely see it as a problem. Subjectively experienced, there is no discomfort. Paranoid and similar find it uncomfortable. Personality disorders can overlap. We all have personality traits, such as mild paranoid to some, so to classify things into the SCID-II is not easy.

- And usually it takes a long time before you can place any symptoms or ways to look at. So it may be that we have placed a feature of the interference that could fit in another section. That's the way it is and we must just be humble. We also have some modifications in our declaration. There were five that we thought maybe he had some more paranoid traits than we first thought of the observation.

3:23 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - So I come to the general according to ICD 10 and criterion A, which must be met to put a personality disorder diagnosis is clearly discordant attitudes and behavior that falls under several areas of emotion, attention, ways of thinking and ways of relating to others. Reviews from the Commission go on this course that we should have written more about it, it looks at the court now. So I have been based on the point and written briefly about Breivik. In the case of narcissistic, it is pervasive in many situations that he has a grandiose self-image confirmed by friends at an early age.

- He describes himself that he was the best in his class, he felt grandiose and thinks he is superior, he quit school through his business must be said to be discordant and not very flexible. He relates to others in a sovereign and devalurerende, which will make most of us pull back a little and think about his, but you will not often say anything. We have numerous examples of this. His best friends that we refer to in interviews earlier in the day, he had a GUC for å .. yeah I can not remember, we shall see, a GUC to become rich, he was very concerned with the successful economy, etc.

- [The prosecutor Engh. Wait a minute ... Now you do not read the report?] No. It is an addition, they have requested it - so then I have to elaborate on it. We believes that narcissism has been present from quite early on ... Yes ... Especially to friends, he has appeared as upåfallende and straightforward, but more pretentious and self-centered than many. Focus on him and her and not receptive to good advice. Stubborn, and so on.

3:26 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - Dyssosialitet. Avemosjonalisering in mind he describes it, is probably present in some degree. It is also described, but we believe that he has a basic empathy failure. There is more to describe that he is sympathetic more than empathetic. There is a definite difference between sympathy and empathy. One can well imagine the people who are empathetic and sympathetic, but a real insight into the problem is not present.

- He is mostly based on the business side of the law without reflecting further on this. Before 18 years of age is a period in life that is little known. He has small limits and did he want from an early age, it is from 13-14 years of age, I've done a check of contents, HCR-20, which will later refer to, and it confirms the possible psychopathic traits.

- Not sure. So there is a limit of 28 and observanden scores in the border area of ??17-20, then we say that it's possible moves. HCR-20 is discussed in the report, on page ... at point H7, psychopathy, it's just a general information. I'll get back to how he is. The divergent (...) is not limited to periods of mental illness. We think especially when it comes narsisime, this has persisted from early on. Dyssosialitet we see as weaker than his narcissist personality. We also believe there to be able to prove that his basic attitude (...) has been of such a nature that it can not be characterized as an Oslo-west behavior and evasion of such a description.

- It is, after all, quite a large amount of time that is systematically evaded. When the behavior criterion C, and it will be over a wide range of situations. With Breivik comes into view at the devaluation of people, even if they have more knowledge about the topics. As with Jørg Morland in court here. This he has done including the undersigned at Ila. He is stubborn and has been the case so long as he can remember.

- Also this should debut in children's and ungomstid and continue into adulthood. The point when he discusses Aspaas undergoing onset time, when we come to it, but generally we will say that he has had it since puberty, Enough to meet the criteria. The disorder leads to a significant personal suffering. Dyssosialitet and narcissism are not subjectively unpleasant for those who have it. It is not late enough in the process. It has not resulted in personal suffering for Breivik. This means a significant impact on victims, and it can clearly be proved here.

3:35 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - Section F. The disturbance is usually but not always associated with occupational and social functioning. It is known that he has worked since 2006, although he says he worked with the compendium. He indicates that the social since 2003 and 2004 have been aware. He has had problems in relation to social function. It is possible there has been a social failure, but you also see that he has retired and been more and more into their subject and thus prevented him from having a normal and adequate social contact. It is not only planned. He could get worse personality disorder later.

3:36 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - So we see that the basic criteria are met for peronslighetslidelsene. And how personality develops from childhood? We have no more material than others in this context. [Referring to SSBU report.] Do not have to mean sjevutvikling. We also fear of serious psykopatalogi. It is difficult, but I have yet written a bit about it and it is based on case documents. (...) Lack of boundaries. He could be out as long as he wanted. It has been mentioned as possible neglect. Child Welfare proposes to take over care. Ambiguous signals from adults, the absence of a safe father figure that he is bigger than others, sovereignty suggests that he has this as a personality and not as a personality change that will come later.

- And then it's important to be aware that if he has a personality disorder or two, it will not come under the points of law. It's really just to say that he has traits of this here. Many have speculated about this and written about it in the media, and it is sure to be debated for a long time, but we have chosen to stand by what we have arrived.

- [Aspaas: - We are not trying to explain why a person has committed these acts. We see this as outside our mandate.] There is nothing to waive, but when it comes to personality, it will not be under 56 C, completely sane. [Bejer Engh: - Does that mean that a person with a personality disorder, we have a completely adequate picture of what is happening around them?]

- No, it does not. [Aspaas: - Do not psychotic picture]. There are a number of personality disorders. Avoidant personality disorder, the unsafe and insecure. There we find no basis for that he has. [Tørrissen mentions several types of personality disorders and some descriptions of what they are]

- Narsisitisk assertiveness, (...) black white, anti-social is more, it does not have a short version of it and mixed. Then I go to the declaration and we have so far gone through page 266, paranoid personlighetsfortyrrelse. (...) We will make some comments. Diagnosikriterie for ICD-10, the first A-criteria, sensitive to rejection and failure. We have noted that he is very krenkbar (...) Three criteria must be met for him to be diagnosed with paranoid personality disorder.

- The next criterion is C, which is suspicious. That one gets a distorted perception of what is happening, and interpreters, perhaps initially friendly events as something hostile. So the question from the prosecutor is interpreted as a mockery, that an IQ test is abusive and the like.

3:42 p.m.Right Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - One can also discuss it in paranoid schizophrenia. G: Concerned conspiratorial events that affect the world or the person directly. Here is the conspiracy theory ideas you can score on. We believe that it is possibly present, but that we should not give him any new diagnosis in the right one. There is discussion and diagnosis is important. The narcissistic described on page 269, and it's a bit like that in a variety of interviewing observanden said about the relevance and should get. [Mentions Breivik, who describes himself.] And as we see it, he appears with the grandiose sense of self importance in many areas.

3:44 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - He can moderate themselves in certain situations, but it remains a significant grandiose ideas. What we have seen in the observation is that when we react so he modifies it, but half an hour later, the same can be grandiose expression, but he is self-conscious. Criteria number one in the DSM-4 criteria and is included on page 316 and 317 I see no reason to read the criteria when they are there. It depends to what extent we will go through each criterion to demonstrate this. There are some criteria that I can say he has scored positive.

- The impressive view, self-importance in many areas, (...), fantasies of unlimited fame, is somewhat weaker, but we consider it also to be met. We emphasize that this has been for long periods prior to 22 July. It appears also in the aftermath of the actions.

- Point 3 He is quick to say he likes to associate with intelligent people of high status and are less interested in people who can not so much. He can devalue people or groups, and also those with high skills presumably might have gaps in their education (you know you are not the terrorists, such as French, German and Japanese psychiatrists do). We assume that he has an underlying need to be admired, which is step 4

- Then there is the exploitation of others. One can see that he move back home, but he also has paid for itself. He does not seem like a very exploitative person. [Arntzen asked what criteria Tørrissen is on. He said that there are criteria 6] Then there is this with empathy, meditation technique, able to avemosjonalisere them. He thinks he is an empathetic person, but that he was using meditation techniques can avemosjonalisere them. He says he can empathize with the loss to the victim, because he himself has experienced losing his family by utførebden actual terrorist act. He is totally without emotional empathy, anger or other emotional expressions to those who are affected by the actions he has committed. This is going forward in police interrogations and interviews with the experts, not to mention the reconstruction of Utøya. He interprets it into a political kontekt, as we see it fulfilled.

- Then there is Section 7 He thinks he is an empathetic person, but that he was using meditation techniques can avemosjonalisere them. He says he can empathize with the loss to the victim, because he himself has experienced losing his family by utførebden actual terrorist act. He is totally without emotional empathy, anger or other emotional expressions to those who are affected by the actions he has committed. This is going forward in police interrogations and interviews with the experts, not to mention the reconstruction of Utøya. He interprets it into a political kontekt, as we see it fulfilled.

3:49 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - Faced with the action as it provided no emotional empathy or emotional expression. He also interprets this in a political context, the criterion 7 are met. This envy, criteria 8 have not we sure indication that is true. That he is consistently envious because the fellow has a degree is not someone we emphasize. However, we think arrogance is evident through the years. When we come to that criterion 9 for narcissistic personality disorder are met. Five is enough.

- If diagnosed with F-60 point section 8 When it comes to emotional unstable personality disorder, we have no ... [Arntzen: - When you gave him the diagnosis, then the methodology so that you look at the general criteria and so we use DCM to get it into this category?] It is not included, it is just a catch-all category. So it's not free float below 60 Section 8 [Explains diagnostic cups kategorinndeling pers.] Then we are left with the anti-social ...

3:51 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - In DCM-4 and SCID-II, there are many criteria that must be met in order that they are diagnosed. The behavioral criteria as a child and adult. They are not completely coincide with the ICD-10. They use phrases that are a little different. It's a little exercise to get through and get it to fit. [The prosecutor Holden: Judge, considering that we have been at 1.20 now. Could we maybe take a break?] [Arntzen Judge: Yes, when we take a break to 16.05.]

4:09 p.m. VG: - Negotiations continue.

4:12 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen - I'll try to be very brief, so we'll try to answer all the questions so that we can expand on that, but we must understand that this is not so easy to follow. We have reviewed the scoring and manual on the DCM. But I will shorten it down so we translate it to the ICD-10 diagnosis at once, so we drop it.

- One is the first criterion in antisocial behavior. The criterion has a number of violations early on deviant behavior and it is clear from tagging in itself should not be regarded dissocial behavior. What we argue about early development is that you put weak limits. Possible association is dissocial what he says of A - and B-team. He brags on himself that he is related to gangs and it is possible there are grandiose.

4:15 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - Idealization of offenses, child care, [Aspaas: - Sorry, we do not say that he has been there, but to know the status.] Possible abuse of animals, it is not verified. Difficulty with boundaries, outside of business lovrammer, all of his companies had a business outside the law. Compendium glorify violence. He is subsequently stable in that he could and should have done more. ICD 10, the criterion A. [Arntzen: - Tørrissen, this is on page 2002. Just so that we have it with us.] Excuse me, I'll take with me the numbers. Thank you.

- Criterion A is indifference to others' feelings. There is reason to believe that he has learned the manners and to relate to it. C is the inability to experience guilt. F is the rationalization of what has brought him into conflict with the norms that the community does not allow him to build bombs.

- When it comes to scoring scored him on manipulative behavior, smoothness, storhetoppplevelse of self-importance, possible empathy failure, lived partly on the mother in 2006, irresponsible behavior regarding finances [Tørrissen continues to list a number of points to.] Overall, the possible psychopathic traits. [Arntzen asked how the declaration Tørrissen is.] HCR-20 is discussed on page 280 and up to 284 It is therefore the risk of violence. As we see it, is also the criteria for dissocial personality disorders are met.

- And that concludes personality disorder diagnosis remains so when the two diagnoses F60.8 is narcissistic and F60.2 is dissocial. Then we move quickly across the autism disorder. His work has been talk that he may have Asperger's. Other developmental disorders have seen vetches basis to look at. But Asperger's been interesting to watch.

- Our colleagues have found that indiksjonen Asberger present and we have the same conclusion, but we will link a few comments on it. We have handed out some selvutfuyllignsskjema. (...) Apart from one, where he scorete 10 and 32 considered that one should proceed with the investigation. (...), These conditions may present in childhood and colleague Sørheim was on (...) one can see these traits in adulthood. A close race, you see it throughout life. What is special for these disorders is that language function and motor skills, boys have the most. (...) Environmental factors can influence.

4:21 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - Page 249 in the blue book describes the differences in interaction and social skills. We have seen that the defendant is repetitive and obsessive interests, and it's usually those who have this. But the mental age is often at a lower level. Main Criterion 1: Major problems in matters of reciprocal social interaction. Overall, the main criterion is not met. The Criterion 2: Mono Mane, narrow interests. He describes himself as a good analyst, while others, including PST, contests this claim. Thus, it is not certain that this is the main criterion is met, but the experts keep the option open and scored him on subterskelnivå.

- The Criterion 3: Dependence of routines. It's as far as we know, no one in Norway that has been subject to so many different security rules observanden, but he has adapted himself to it without problems. He has no trouble dealing with appointments. It is scored negatively on this criterion. The Criterion 4: Speech and language problems. Observanden have normal intonation and language, and he understands the humor, irony and underlying opinions. The criterion is not met.

4:23 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - We have not quite got it to fill up. Then we have briefly discussed ADHD and Tourettes, but we did not find this. Overall, he has not Asperger's. WE have been proven in court that he has had a significantly greater activity than a year, he has held a leadership position, he has played up to 16 hours a day. He retired voluntary and playing WoW full time. It is a little odd is that he says it's a martyr judicial gift. It is common for people to slip into it and play more and more. He has played substantially more in 2008 than he entered.

4:25 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - Possibly the diagnosis F.63, gaming addiction. It is not something to focus on itself. He has a pattern that he was probably caught. He has a controlled addiction. I ended the game. Then we come across on violence risk. It is a structured form with 20 questions, but a maximum score of 40 It is made up of historical part, early maladjustment, personality disorder and villkårsbrudd. There is not much to find and the score is not particularly high. We shall conclude our colleagues did so with the risk assessment: Obersvanden at high risk for future violence.

- So that we ... We believe there is no basis to treat it further than to say it. He said that he wanted to do more, and had he been alone, we must assume that he had done more. When I am finished with the presentation. Aspaas assumes summary.

4:27 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - When we come to the summary. It is often where one starts a criminal case, but I think everything that has been in the summary mentioned before. The court has the same meaning? [Yes, it sounds fine. Then I think we scroll forward to our conclusion. We use the total information available, both documents, health information, our own investigations.

4:27 p.m.Right Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - Ratings below are based on the total information available, including documents, former forensic psychiatric statement, obtained health information, observation report from the Regional Security Department Dikemark, and the experts' own investigations, including the use of psychometric tests. I jump down to 21.2. Who we are considering him for diganosekriteriene. 21.3 is Rusutløste conditions. Observanden has stated that he has taken performance-enhancing drugs and anabolic steroids in the last three months before the impugned acts. He tilfreddstiller a diagnosis called F55.

- The nature of the case raises many such questions. Hallucinations are not a big issue.

- Delusions must be discussed in more detail. It is in observandens case several phenomena or observations that must be considered in terms of underlying psychotic functioning. Already Arrest 22 July, he gave the following remarkable statement: "We want to take power in Europe within 60 years." etc. Observanden In his lecture notes given disability description of the organization Knights Templar and its rank system, uniforms, awards and greetings. It is also described how he envisions a nationalist power and a number of measures, including the execution of multiculturalists and kulturmarxister, deportation, etc.

- L police investigation, there has been no finding that substantiates that the organization Knights Templar really exist, and observanden have been confronted with this. l later police interrogation and to experts Tørrissen and Aspaas, he has toned down its description. He acknowledges what he has written, but has stressed that his description of the organization is intended as a suggestion for a future organization and structure. These suggestions may be continued and developed by other

- About the lively and sensational statements in the compendium and during the early investigation, he later said that these statements were aimed at a select audience, namely the nationalists and militant nationalists. The aim should be to spread the political message as presented in the compendium, and to inspire and recruit followers to influence the direction of social development. The reactions that have emerged, and as observanden have had access to the media after the ban was lifted, has done that he has reconsidered his views on mediation and has settled on a less pompous line.

- To submit comments aimed at a select audience, reportedly observanden be a common form of strategy and rhetoric of the militant movement. This is to find, not just at the right extreme, but also in Marxist and Muslim groups, including AI-Qaeda, which in many ways is a model for observanden when it comes to strategy. Similarly observanden stated that his greeting with raised, clenched fist on the face imprisonment, as we have seen here in court, shall be such as to a request from sympathizers in the known militant tradition.

- We assume that the militant movement not infrequently develops a system of rank designations, uniforms, greetings. Despite this, the present description of the Knights Templar and of course the uniform that observanden has been made, described as eccentric, theatrical and grandiose. The fact that he will run has invented a future vision can not be understood as an expression of psychosis. How the experts see it, he has always known that the whole idea of ??the Knights Templar grew out of his own imagination.

- The political ideology, now I'm on the last paragraph, which observanden have advocated, both to the police / experts and in its manifesto, is perceived as very deviant and unacceptable by the Norwegian society and all political parties have taken far away from his thoughts and attitudes, not to mention the actions he carried out 22.7. However, it is well known from news sites and from the experts visited the existence of political subcultures that joins the extreme political ideas that observanden have advocated. During the detention he receives a steady stream of sympathy from mind traps. We therefore find no basis for perceiving observandens extreme and unrealistic political views and goals as the expression of psychotic thought processes.

- [The prosecutor Holden: - Just so we can prepare for utspørreing in the morning, add the assessors found that KT exist or is it a clean fanstasiprodukt] We assume that KT is not in the form observanden have described in the introduction, which a comprehensive and effective organization. We did not take intensive actions to whether there has been a core of a guttebokaktig stiftelesmøte or a pure idea that observant have found.

4:35 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - We emphasize that we do not have special skills when it comes to history, political science and policy, and looked forward to the testimony may shed further light on these fields during the main hearing. It also confirmed much of what we thought. Observanden have all the experts confirmed to have had thoughts of surveillance from the police, and at least two occasions he has made concrete measures and looking for surveillance equipment. He has also shown caution in that he has had cell phone at home when his reconnaissance in terms of operations, he has replaced hard drive often, and he has avoided logging onto websites that he plans to bring him in PST's spotlight.

- We assume that the police and PST has just tasked to monitor the extreme and potentially violent environments, with a view to preventing terrorist acts. We find it not surprising that observanden during several years of preparation for terrorist acts, have had thoughts about the potential surveillance or interest from the police. His deliberation and caution is regarded rather as an expression of normal caution and realistic considerations to be discovered.

- After arrest 22 July entered observanden fear of being killed and tortured by the police. Observanden has since given to know that he knows well that the Norwegian police do not carry out torture and murder. And in the current heated situation, he thought, however, that he could not quite ignore the irrational actions of the officials who were emotionally affected. His statements were intended to give the impression that he was fearless and confident.

- L the unique situation that has arisen since 22 July, police have assumed that there is a real risk that observanden can be killed, and those responsible have found it necessary to introduce special and costly security measures. As an example, it mentioned that it was not found safe and proper to carry out forensic psychiatric observation at the regional security department at Dikemark. It happened for fear that someone would damage observanden. It is unique in Norway.

- There is no doubt that observanden have had and have a high opinion of their own importance. Witness testimony also mentioned his concern with being successful and influential. His selvbestaltede titles, Knight Chief Justice, etc., indicate significant grandiose ideas. The same applies to the uniform he has made and the awards he has assigned himself. He talks not hidden the fact that his behavior has a certain degree of pomposity.

- It is also possible that he might be exaggerating its earnings in the years 2002 - 2006. But we have received confirmation numbers up to 3.6 million. Further investigation is in progress in this area. His assessment of their importance for the country and Western Europe's future is also overly glorious. The experts, however, find no reason to take his grandiose ideas for the benefit of certain incidence of psychosis. The described features can just as easily be interpreted as an expression of narcissistic needs and that he has drawn himself into an unrealistic dream of the future based on the totalitarian ideological and militant fanaticism.

- Corresponding forms of self suggestion is described in the literature. Previously, the term "pseudologia fantastica" used to describe conditions where a person with a theatrical personality traits, construct stories that make them significant. It does not say much about it in the Norwegian psychiatry books. The best description we found in the German "Psychiatrie, Schulte und Tolle": Hang the experience manifests itself by the incredible stories of major events and special accident. Not more than a fraction of the stories have really taken place. l presentation is fabulous events designed, and the repetition becomes increasingly dramatized depiction. The desired performances are so lively and suitable for self-affirmation of the personality, and finally so indispensable, that the hysterical think half of it myself.

4:41 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - It is characteristic that these types of stories dimmed when they are confronted with facts or objections. In psykosepasiente r will often see the opposite ... That when faced with uncertainties and improbabilities, so will their statements become increasingly vague and improbable, and patients can be when pressed, show signs of stress and mental decompensation. "Pseudologia fantastica" is not a separate diagnosis in the diagnostic systems, but the phenomenon may give rise to personality disorders.

- There are descriptions of the observanden has been particularly concerned about their appearance and have always had negative thoughts about this. Preoccupation with appearance caused such that he underwent plastic surgery to straighten the nose. It also stated that he has shown excessive caution with regard to infection, so he went through a period of masks indoors. These data show that observanden had diseases anxiety and a certain preoccupation with their appearance. In our opinion and judgment, however, these perceptions have no character of reality-breaking and therefore provides no basis to conclude the occurrence of psychotic ideas about body and health. When it comes to insect plague at Asta farm, put the experts assumed that it is likely that there may be a lot of insects in an old house in the country, and that these will appear when it is warm weather in spring.

4:43 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - So we are thinking of the disturbances: l discussions with the experts has been observanden verbose and has explained the extraordinarily detailed. He has had digressions and elaborate conditions on the side of the main theme, and he has been prone to fall into a stereotyped ideological rhetoric in which he has repeated earlier views and historical examples. The same is observed in the video recording of police interrogations. One finds, however, no reason to believe that there has been incidence of pathological assossiasjonsforstyrrelser. His digressions and detailed preoccupation does not preclude that he is eloquent and emphatic. It has not been difficult to bring him back to the topic. Also noted is that during very long interrogation does not show obvious signs of fatigue.

- At present thinking disturbances would be expected that the person under the long and sometimes confrontational conversations, shows increasing signs of cognitive fragmentation and illogical statements, accompanied by discomfort and uncertainty. This is not seen during the talks, the observation of Ila or video interviews.

- Observanden has both written and oral use some words that he himself, or possibly others, constructed, for example. Knight Chief Justice, nasjonaldarwinist and anarkomarxist. These are words that are composed of two existing words. The experts assume that this kind of formation of words is common in the Norwegian language. It is a recognized tool that makes the language alive and interesting. Well-known examples from the Norwegian public in recent years is "butter crisis" and "fixed ash" - words that have never been associated with psychosis. Norwegian Language Council recognizes this type of reorganization. If it turns out that the words are widely used, they are eventually included in the official dictionary.

- In 2011 the word composition "rosetog", which arose spontaneously in the days after 22 July, named the "year's reorganization." We believe the new regime that has used observandenflittig must be regarded as ordinary word breastfeeding positions and not as neologisms. With neologisms understood words that are completely unknown and incomprehensible to others. The experts have not found examples of this.

- On this basis, the committee found no reason to think that observanden have had the presence of formal thought disorder. The fact that he has implemented a technically and logistically demanding operation prior to and during the terrorist attacks, also speaks against the occurrence of severe thinking disturbances.

- So we are on the negative symptoms: It is well documented that observanden for long periods has withdrawn from friends. He has also spent much time alone in her room in her mother's apartment to play video games, especially in 2006 and 2007. About his withdrawal has observanden explained that he has spent time on preparing for terrorist attack and that he therefore had to relinquish part of their social life. However, he has kept in touch with friends right up until just before 22 July 2011. l the time he spent much of his time on video games, this happened in a way that as far as experts know, means that a significant part in a social interaction with a larger number of partners through online verbal communication, and for many hours at a time. Withdrawal, as seen in psychosis disease, is therefore, the experts' assessment, not proven. We can probably add that the game witness confirmed what we have been tracked through our network.

4:48 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - It is noted that observanden fell out of the workforce in 2006. Since then he has not been in paid work or studies. He has lived with his mother who has cared for food, washed clothes for him, etc. He paid £. 3,500 per. month for this. He has used the powers of computer games, respectively, writing and planning, procurement and manufacturing of equipment for terrorist attack. He has had to acquire new knowledge of weapons and explosives. He has always been well maintained and has not emerged as deviant to their friends.

- The mother has been worried that he has not been in the job that he has spent too much time on computer games, etc., not to mention that he used artificial stimuli in body-building purposes. And in retrospect, it is also easy to see that the mother's concern was well founded. But even if it is probable that observanden has long served on the side of the mainstream society, they find experts no reason to interpret this as a malfunction in the sense that one sees in severe psychotic disorders, but as conscious behavior based on his unique goals and activities.

- We must also add that what we have heard about the gaming activity, allows the deduction of gambling probably also have been present to a greater extent we knew when we wrote this.

- Observanden appears to be emotionally blunted when it comes to the fact that the suffering he has inflicted on others. He shows no remorse and would do the same thing over again. His acknowledgment of performing atrocities seem superficial and technically. He has shown quite adequate capacity to interact and communicate with experts and health professionals. His emotional avflatning not considered to be of the type seen in severe mental disorders, but understood as an expression of pathological personality traits. This is referred to other places in the declaration.

- So we are disturbed identity: Observanden to have the experts and the video interview shown no signs of having feelings of unreality or unclear identity experience. He often says "we" when he gives an account of their political and ideological attitudes. This is considered by the experts, who said that he speaks on behalf of minded, that he makes himself into a sort selvbestaltet spokesman for the extremist, militant right extreme environment, which is not specifically delineated.

- Whether he's coverage to represent a "We" can hardly be verified, but the committee finds that he has sympathizers in Norway and other countries. One finds no reason to believe that the use of the term "We" represents some type of identity disorder. About 22.7 terrorist attack. He has used terms such as "surreal." The assessors do not assess this as an expression of pathological unreality feeling or derealization, but as a plausible sense of the execution of a terrorist act, that few could have imagined the possibility of prior to 22 July 2011.

- Then we discuss the possibility of dissimulering. Maybe it's not necessary that I go into it? No. We can take it in the questions.

- I'm in the overall assessment of psychosis. And now I come into subsections. On page 301

- As stated above, the experts in the review of documents, video recordings of interviews, collected health data and own investigations are not proven safe occurrence of hallucinations, delusions or formal thought disorders in observanden. Not even three weeks of observation in the provisional institutions have provided premises suspected psychosis. The experts therefore find it highly unlikely that observanden has a psychotic disorder at the time of examination.

- We also discussed whether observanden may have had transient psychotic symptoms at the time of 22 July 2011. If at this time he would have had a schizophrenic disorder or a paranoid psychosis, it is unlikely that this would have on its own in the period to the committee's investigation in February and March this year. We look at the reading that we could use a less definitive wording. Unlikely, is more accurate. We see, therefore, exclude this possibility. The presence of a transient psychosis triggered by stress, anabolic steroids and tablets containing ephedrine, caffeine and aspirin is theoretically possible. One finds, however, with reference to the discussion of psychotic symptoms above is not likely that the symptoms of this has been present at the time of the impugned acts.

- They must be emphasized that the above assessment is based on clinical judgment, and experts note that other experts have come to different results in their exercise of discretion. And even though the undersigned has not found reason to regard as psychotic observanden, s ¨ we have to recognize that observandens actions and attitudes that deviate strongly from the prevailing opinions in society. Case exceptional nature means that the experts have to follow the main negotiations with particular attention given to whether it should be the new information or nuances.

- Mr. We do not come across any more in the main proceedings that have changed our opinion. VI seems fagvitner has reinforced our general knowledge or reinforced it.

- I think Tørrissen have undergone diagnostic criteria. Down to paranoid psychosis F22, it is probably the diagnostics we have spent the most time discussing and held open longer during our discussions. The level of function in people with this disorder may be completely or partially preserved. People with this disorder can take actions when violations directed against others. Observanden krenkbar is a person, and he's ready grandiose traits. He promote this political ideology in which part of the view that mainstream society has entered a kind of conspiracy that allows gradual Muslim domination in society. This justifies, according to him, extreme measures which terrorist actions.

- The experts are as set forth above, not rated his performance as the expression of psychotic thought processes, but that extreme political views, combined with the deliberate neglect of objections. The experts assume that there is an ideological subculture that share observandens ideological and political views. One finds, therefore, no basis for delusional disorder.

5:00 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - Where I refer to the Tørrissen has gone through. Is the court's opinion? [Arntzen: - Yes.] On page 305, I do not think it requires a thorough consideration. Everything points to the ability level well within the normal range. Other diagnoses, we have not found definitive evidence of other diagnoses. Tourette has been mentioned, we have found no sign of it. It is vanskleig to exclude signs of Tourette easy, but it does not have a forensic psychiatric significance. Asberger we have spent some energy, and partly from data from childhood and in this detail of his preoccupation. We have not found any basis for it. So we are answering the mandate, Section 22

5:00 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - We find no evidence that he has had psychotic symptoms before, during or after the actions. It is not likely that he has problems that qualify for it. Forced observation supports this.

5:02 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - We believe that at the time of action falls outside the conditions that more closely describes clause 65 C-states. If you still made school style in a mono-symptomatic disease, this could fall below 65 C, but there is no evidence in our opinion.

- [Arntzen: - Could you just repeat the last thing you said?] A so-called mono-symptomatic, or a narrow, delusional disorder in a narrow field, it will [Arntzen: - Is it the paranoid psychosis?] If it had occurred, then it will often fall below 56 c But we have not found it. [Holden: - For our preparations for tomorrow, what kind of delusion, you have added to the bottom of such an assessment?]

- It's all the conditions we have reviewed, and in particular those that apply Knights Templar. Especially if you will think that it exists. That this conspiracy idea, if it were a delusion, that would be it. But we mean that there is, to repeat, because it is part of a sub-culture.

5:06 p.m.Right Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - If there was a small complex, F22, it will probably fall below 65 C, but a little larger than 22 will be assessed against 44 [Aspaas: - There are paranoid psychosis that can fall under 44] [Holden: - It is the central basis for evaluation we are interested in.]

5:07 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - [Engh: - If we are the reason that the Knights Templar, was a delusion option would be 56 c] We have not discussed this broad, but in many cases it will be a narrow delusional disorder. If we conclude positively, it lapses. (...) It is therefore not appropriate to discuss the question of sanctions, since we have concluded negatively.

- The discussion of the forecast, the experts made the use of recognized instruments, V-10 risk and HCR-20, for the assessment of violence risk. It was not reviewed very thoroughly, but we maintain that there is a high risk of violent acts in the future. It is emphasized observandens extreme political views and that he still expresses that violence and terrorist acts are necessary to gain support for his political views. l addition, his personality structure to increase the risk of such violence. Reduced risk of violence requires a total change of mentality and that observanden distance themselves, both from the action he has been indicted and the associated violence appreciative ideology. This seems unrealistic today. The type of personality pathology that are proven are generally less accessible to therapy. Factors that worsen the prognosis of violence, will be in close contact with communities that recognize and support observandens political ideology and views on political violence.

5:08 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Terje Tørrissen: - We have not made a reservation, but we have seen this with border crossings. Border crossing between delusion and extreme political ideologies that recognize violence as a means.

5:09 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - When we are at the conclusion ... The experts are conducted for forensic psychiatric examination of Behring Anders Breivik, born 13.2.1979: 1. Observanden was not psychotic, unconscious or mentally retarded to a great extent, § 44, at the time of the impugned acts. 2. Observanden have a serious mental disorder with significantly impaired ability to realistic assessment of its relationship with the outside world, and he acted under a strong disturbance of consciousness at the time of the impugned acts. Observanden is not mentally retarded, § 56 c 3 Observanden was not psychotic at the time of the surveys. 4. Mandate Section 7 is deleted when the experts have concluded negative terms. states covered by the Penal Code § 44 5. There is a high risk of repeated violent action.

- When is the declaration reviewed. Also, it remains which is about the forensic commission. [Arntzen: - Will it take long?] It takes some time, only one additional statement (...). It takes an hour. [Arntzen: - I suppose we must have a break until five o'clock to half past five.]

5:29 p.m. VG: - Negotiations continue.

5:30 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - When we are on the applicable DRC: The first letter, 23 april is read out before the court, it is necessary to repeat this? [Aspaas not have to repeat.] Then I can explain the additional statement, in which we respond to four points.

- There is no doubt that observanden in talks with the experts, to some extent has responded strategically, ie, that he has adapted his statements to her that he at any time have seen their best interests. He said it himself. This applies in particular his description of the organization Knights Templar. In the early investigation, he gave a magnificent account of the alleged organization and their own position in it. From the questioning of 10/18/11, he has toned down the description. He has always maintained due to the ideas of Knights Templars goals and structure, but has stressed that the organization is being established and that many of his descriptions should be considered as suggestions for a future structure.

5:32 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - For conspiracy ideas about a kulturmarxistisk conspiracy, he has been fairly consistent. The same applies to his statements on the vigilance and suspicion of possible police surveillance. When it comes to personality traits, then, we recorded that he was the first time after arrest, spoke about their characteristics and performance in a grandiose way. Later he toned down the description, and maintained a more moderate presentation. When it comes to personality traits in general, he seems constantly on many points, having a desire to portray themselves in a lucky light. We have seen with this MMPI-2 testing.

5:33 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - Due to his tendency to produce strategic responses have therefore been obvious to the experts, that if one only had to assume the statements that have emerged in conversations, this would involve the risk of under diagnosis of mental disorders. There is extensive evidence from 22 July onwards, in the form of written minutes of interviews and audio and visual recordings. Moreover, is rich health information from the prison health care who have had contact with him since 7/26/11, DPS Bærum. We have had a fairly broad basis to assess him.

- On this basis have been considered his various statements about possible psychotic symptoms, as stated in the declaration. There is no doubt that it is right that allows assessment of the evidence in the case, including what should be the basis of explanations. The experts believe that it has been necessary to consider those of observandens statements that have a direct bearing on diagnosis. It is not possible to make an assessment of any delusions, without taking a position on a number of observandens statements, especially when it comes to suspicion, conspiracy ideas about the organization and the Knights Templar.

- We have therefore made use of the opportunity arising from the mandate paragraph 1, third paragraph, to consider the facts of the case. One sees, however, that this position on should have been pointed out more clearly than that suggested implicit in the declaration, and indistinct public regretted. Other parts of the world observandens thought, particularly his political thoughts, characterized by ideas of conspiracy of politicians, journalists, etc., and the necessity of a terror campaign to save the Norwegian and European culture, has been stable. It has not been necessary to weigh the old and new statements on these sites.

- The reviews outlined above of observandens various statements to police and experts, means doubtless some uncertainty. The committee found it essential that the assessment base was supplemented by observation in an institution of the Criminal Procedure Act, § 167, which we have looked at. Experience shows that it is unlikely that a psychotic patient is able to hide the psychotic symptoms for three weeks during the observation of a highly qualified, multidisciplinary psychiatric team. The result of observation considered such a robust complement to our own investigations, that one has not found reason to take an explicit modification of the question of psychosis.

- The reviews outlined above of observandens various statements to police and experts, means doubtless some uncertainty. The committee found it essential that the assessment base was supplemented by observation in an institution of the Criminal Procedure Act, § 167, which we have looked at. Experience shows that it is unlikely that a psychotic patient is able to hide the psychotic symptoms for three weeks during the observation of a highly qualified, multidisciplinary psychiatric team. The result of observation considered such a robust complement to our own investigations, that one has not found reason to take an explicit modification of the question of psychosis.

- It has been very special challenges. This is especially observandens extremist political attitudes and identification with an extreme subculture. We have discussed the uncertainties. It appears in this context, the Declaration page 296 page 302 One thinks in this context especially on reported testimony from experts on terrorism and the extreme-right. The experts can not rule out that such testimony could prove to contain information that allows you to adjust or refine the statements given in court when the time comes. That case we would have prepared a new tilleggserklærig. We have not done.

- The experts see the general criteria for personality disorder is not discussed well enough in the declaration. The Posters. As discussed both above and in the declaration, the observanden greatly wished to portray themselves in a favorable light, and he has responded in the negative a lot of questions about the pathological personality traits. In part, he has also answered the next question. He has not responded consistently negative about the factors that may cause suspicion of personality pathology.

- He has told of his childhood that he harassed and intimidated other children, that he did vandalism, and that he would sneak out at night without the mother's knowledge and that he idealized hip-hop culture's anti-social attitudes. This, he told himself. The data is largely confirmed by documents from the child welfare services. When it comes to adulthood, he has made no secret of having run a business based on the production of false documents, systematic and widespread tax fraud, and violations of the Accounting Act. His description of the questionable business practices consistent with witness testimony.

5:39 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - When he speaks of the impugned actions, he in no way deny the atrocities he has done, and he shows strongly divergent attitudes to violence and lack of compassion. And even if the impugned acts of violence have occurred within a very limited time, the result of long-term planning and preparation, 1-2 years or more. On this basis, the experts believe that there is coverage for the general criteria for personality disorders are present. Observanden since early teens, persistently demonstrated aberrant patterns of thinking, feelings and actions. He does not see this as deviant, but believe they are eligible to act as he has done across society's attitudes.

- He has not had any disease pressure, but it is not a mandatory requirement of subjective disorder criteria. The experts have concluded otherwise negatively about psychosis, and there is no known physical illness that could explain the symptoms. The experts therefore believe that his own information, which corresponds to one with the other information in the case, suggests that the general criteria for personality disorder is present. The experts see no validitetsproblemer with the mentioned information.

- When it comes to the various subcategories of personality disorders, as DRC has not challenged it, but we have not had suspected weak validity with respect to categories of avoidant, dependent, obsessive, schizotypal, schizoid, and emotionally unstable histrionisk personality. His own description of their functions do not differ particularly from those stated in witness statements or from observable behavior during the observation

- What is challenging for validity, the statements he has given to questions related to the paranoid and narcissistic personality disorder. It is believed he was to the report, because he perceives their attitudes as normal. Here we had to keep what he says against other information, including that which is stated in his manifesto. In this way it has been found criteria for narcissistic personality disorder met.

- The assessment of paranoid personality disorder, has been found only partially fulfilled the criteria. We discuss whether there may be a false negative. This refers in particular to whether his political conspiracy thinking should be considered as a true criterion for paranoiditet, or whether a greater extent be attributed to his identification with extreme subcultural political environments. It can also turn on the criteria for psychopathy. Now we can say that expert witnesses have said about these sub-cultures and conspiracy thinking. We feel that now is not pulling in particularly paranoid direction.

5:45 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - It has not been done, now that the main proceedings are finished. Dissocial personlighetfortyrrelses are discussed by Tørrissen, I will therefore continue to step 3, complete Arent information:

- The current case is unusually wide illuminated through the police investigation. This applies not only to the offenses, but also observandens background is mapped through a series of interrogations. Moreover, no information from the Child Welfare, National Center for Child and Youth Psychiatry, kindergarten and school. In addition to the questioning of family and friends who are referred to in the declaration, there are further interrogation, but that is not referenced, because these do not present new information. It has not come up with something new.

5:46 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - The most obvious source for the primary collection of information is complete Arent observandens mother, who has been in close contact with him for years. Mother is questioned by the police six times, totaling over 200 pages of interview summaries. She also interviewed experts Husby and Sørheim. So we have also had access to extensive information from her. It has been ascertained that she was in the early interrogations have provided a fairly standard description of observanden. Admittedly, she worried that he has not been in regular work, but she has otherwise described him as kind, considerate, a problem solver for friends, hard workers. The night before the impugned actions had a good time together, and there was nothing to put my finger on.

- Later, and especially to experts Husby and Sørheim, she meant that "he must be insane" and has described him as "totally beyond, and believed everything he said, joking." In this way one would anyway be facing conflicting information from the mother in case of a new interview. In light of this information, and information that she has serious health problems (which also has made that she is not required to appear in court), the experts refrained from asking her to attend the call.

- Of other family members, they have been little question that komparenter, when they had close contact with him in recent years. One friend has been particularly interesting. He has provided full information to the police, and the committee is aware that he is summoned as a witness during the trial. He has been tricky at times available. The experts have therefore refrained from contacting him.

- Although in principle it is desirable to have firsthand information about observandens background, the experts believe that the information exists in the case are sufficient to respond to the mandate.

- The assessors can confirm that there is a discrepancy between the observed social functioning and the emotional reactions that are seen during the review of the impugned acts. In everyday interaction, he seems trustworthy, friendly and polite, and it is considered completely normal cognitive functioning. He seems, however, superficial and non-binding, and are obviously keen to make a good impression. Only when the calls come in on his extreme political standpoint, he shows faslåste attitudes. When he speaks of the acts he is accused of and which he has acknowledged, he appears cynical, calculating and without real empathy and respect for other people's integrity.

- We have interpreted these observations as an expression of his personality that are discussed above. If his lack of empathy would be an expression of autism spectrum or psychotic disorder, one would expect that he is far less would be able to act as upåfallende in terms of social interaction, as we have seen during the observation.

- Point 5, in terms of structure under custody, impact on diagnostic evaluation.

- It is clear that observandens life in the custody has been characterized by very strict security measures, and prison rules have no doubt the character of the structure. At the same time the structure has been broken at times, especially of long police interrogation. Custody time has otherwise represented isolation from the outside world for almost five months. Although the external structure has been rigorous, the isolation caused him a lot of time has been without a structure located in social interaction. During three weeks of observation in sykehusprovisorium conditions were completely different. He was here to move freely within the observation unit, where life was loosely organized, with the exception of meals and lock on the cell at night, and had social contact throughout the day with 3-4 people at a time. clinical practice we see that psychotic patients can profit from the structure found in hospital wards. In prison, however, where the structure is preserved and less supportive, we often see that people are threatened psychosis exacerbation of symptoms, while people with personality disorders often can adapt easily.

5:51 p.m.Right Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - observandens case has not seen certain changes in his behavior, even if the external conditions have been highly variable, due to a change of custody to the ordinary observation of the Criminal Procedure Act § 167 The experts will not put too much emphasis on this, but would note that he seems to have withstood both custody under a very strict regime and prolonged isolation. These forces are not an assumption psychotic illness.

- We find reasons to emphasize that the current observand appears as a special case. The actions he is accused of and the avstumpethet he refers to the murder and terrorist acts he admits to having committed, makes him different from all the experts before seen in psychiatric practice. In this way, he challenges the current classification and understanding of models, especially when it comes to the border between the increase of touch with reality and political fanaticism associated with mass murder and aggravated reckless attitudes. Thus, also challenged the boundaries between law and psychiatry. We do not hide that this represents the general uncertainties of the forensic psychiatric assessment.

- As we have mentioned this because we expect experts who will highlight some areas in more detail. And we've got ... Might do about it.

5:53 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - It is also read in court right? And it triggered the correspondence and the letter of 31 of May. It's pretty far. In this context, it is enough to refer to two paragraphs on page 2

5:55 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - The Commission's letter number three of the 31 of May. We may be able to jump to an account of it. (...) But it would be appropriate if the Commission had had the same level of precision in the first part. The first concerns general criteria, which the Commission can not see that it is explained well enough for.

- The Commission cites comments from the blue edition. This category includes a variety of conditions, which tend to persist. It relates to (...) Some of these conditions and behavior patterns show up early in the development of the individual as both constitutional factors, while others are acquired later.

5:58 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - This was also Torgersen looked at. Studdert is not a requirement, as we see it, that personality disorders should be fully developers in childhood. I repeat: to sneak out and do vandalism at night, which triggered the police and criminal, drink driving with a moped, and he has been a member of a gang that hurt others. He has indicated that he idealized anti-social attitudes.

- He refers to this krenkbarhet school friend who had referred him negatively in the school yearbook. And this krenkbarheten has arrived here in court when he testified about the sometimes minor confrontations with Muslims. I will briefly on what can not be referred now.

- [Quote from SSBU Report] The information is so unspecific that we have not added it to the ground when we have our conclusion. The first and perhaps most obvious is that this situation has been based (...) Some of the descriptions are things that do that today might initiate a Asberger-assessment. It was not a common diagnosis in the 1980s. (...)

- We refer to things that can cause problems with having interpersonal relationships. descriptions of behavior problems in adolescence would not given specific diagnosis at the time. It is not done with teenagers either. But you can find cover. Many will achieve normal behavior. But when we recognize certain traits as an adult, they can be sub-criteria. But not all are adequate, and that requires several criteria.

6:04 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - In case observandens rule-breaking behavior was present even in adulthood. I repeat this brief concerning the Commission's review of the statement. I am thinking particularly of food his business. Violation of Accounting has triggered the police that were dropped due to capacity. He has found it justified to act outside the law on the basis of political hold niger. Malt was time that this ytopen attitudes may be present on Oslo's west side. As we see it, this is more than a little evasion. The whole business has been based on falsification of documents followed by laundering.

- Today we see that dissocial acts may come to expression in adulthood. (...) Tendency to violate others' feelings and rights are more complex. We know he can act supportive and helpful. This is in stark contrast to the violence, he acknowledges. We know from the text book by Ulrik Malt that people with antisocial personality disorder may be considered charming in different situations.

- The general pathological features are reviewed ... We find it difficult to see that he has shown clearly divergent patterns throughout adult life. A theme has been that personality disorders can not be diagnosed on the basis of the traits he has shown in a short time. We agree that one can not. But we do not regard terrorist acts as an isolated phenomenon, but as a continuation of stable attitudes.

- We can not explain these attitudes on the basis of only the political ideas that support policy and condemn terrorist acts. There is reason to recall that diagnoses describing the diagnostic system is not reality. They are in constant change and describes the knowledge we have today, we must establish that the diagnostic system does not capture all the suffering. We find no diagnosis as follows observanden from thought to action. We must have magemål that psychiatrists.

- It is not our mandate in court. The Court has elaborated Melle what was the meaning of the sentence I quoted. He sought an alternative diagnosis that can explain the observant described personality changes. We were not able to read such a questioning on the basis of the Commission wrote, but the answer is that the alternative to a personlighetsforsyrrelse was that he had no diagnosis at all.

- We fully agree that the described changes of withdrawal, etc. But we think it can be explained with the fact that he was planning a terrorist act, not that it was necessarily a personality change. We have discussed the most serious diagnoses first. Including psychosis and with withdrawal. We have found no reason to repeat the discussion, the discussion after we did this with pathology.

6:11 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - So it was this that we have not used all the known information. Thus, information from the mother, especially if changes in 2006 and 2010. In a letter tenth Commission emphasizes that it is the withdrawal they are looking for and criticizes the mother's explanation is omitted. We believe that the mother's claim is referred to the police statement. Mother's statement to the Husby / Sørheim referred. We have also referred friends and acquaintances. Observanden himself has confirmed the social withdrawal and said that he moved back home and spent most of the time playing computer games.

6:12 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - We have discussed in our treatment of negative symptoms, pages 258-259, this tilbaktekningen. As we have mentioned, we have found that the phenomenon is consistent with schizefren withdrawal. We have found that he actually had a sort of social life through their game world. We have also discussed the withdrawal by assessing the chapter page 299 We have looked at it as voluntary, but now we have probably also, to a greater extent than before, involve an element of gambling, although we can not determine that all criteria for pathological gambling are fulfilled.

- So we believe therefore that there is no reason to claim that mother's statements are omitted, and we have referred to this as well as the declaration. We just have not found that the withdrawal meets enough in the criteria. We have therefore not be given so much from her either. It could have done, but there is a balance of how much we are going to write. We can not see that we have omitted discussion of the withdrawal from the report.

6:14 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - Massive questions, especially about developing psychosis and depression. In light of the testimony we have discussed during the negotiations on observanden in 2006 may have been easier depressive symptoms. In general, depression may be expressed by the loss of joy, energy, disturbed sleep, appetite, thoughts. But we have heard here in court about the social aspects of gaming and the need for the initiative. Observandens behavior has been described as upåfallende. He showed enthusiasm for the game.

- These oppsyngingene we believe strengthens our assessment of a schizophrenic tendency can not explain the withdrawal, and we can not exclude that it indicates more easily depressive symptoms. There will be no rettspykiatrisk importance. In court, we are also criticized by the Commission to emphasize observandens understated presentation. We are not quite agree in. We have referred to the statements he made in the early stages, before he began to moderate. Later, during incarceration meeting in February, appeared observanden again grandiose and spoke about the expected imminent release. We have discussed how this policy shall be construed, if they are not tough statement is an expression of negative thought processes, or as an expression of extreme political views.

- Police who have testified in court have mentioned another possible motive. That he would scare them to obtain benefits. It belongs to a specification. There is only one point where we have taken a position on the truth of what he says. It is early, he said of the Knights Templar. That they were big and powerful. Now he has toned it down and say they are small, something the police have been unable to verify. We have not decided, and do not need, to decide whether it is a loosely organized group, a one-time phenomenon or a boy's club. Or if it's a fantasy he has developed on its own hand. So we do not decide, beyond that it does not match with the first version.

- There are many other topics which he has provided information that does not coincide completely. For example, the economy, but it has not been significant for us if he served three, four or five million. What has been important is that he had an income of a certain size. It is essential to respond to the mandate. Police also had little confidence in his actions, such as Liberia. But for us it has been important to consider what was the purpose of the trip.

Then the court adjourned for the day and judge Arntzen stated that tomorrow will start with questions from players to Tørrissen and Aspaas. Follow responses directly on VGTV: direkte.vg.no/studio/rettssak-dag-39

6:22 p.m. Law Psychiatrist Agnar Aspaas: - The last point raised by the Commission are other factors that have emerged in court. Here in the court, we believe that the mental status of the main thing is as we have seen him in February and March. He is probably more influenced by the gravity here, than the loose tone of the coffee cup on Ila. He has demonstrated a self-righteous and påsåelig style and he attributes Husby and Sørheim malicious intent. He believes himself ridiculed and have a thinking that "those who are against me will hurt me." (...) Fagvitner from history, politics and (...) have enhanced our lekmannnsskjønn up against psychosis and extremism. This indicates that he has been more hooked on the former, cf play history and his own statements as it came out in this diary-like notes from a PC.

- Play The witness also confirmed our view of the game world as a social arena. [Judge Arntzen: Many thanks for the report, both of them. When is the right day, and we start with questions in the morning.]